235 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryzaki]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Truth be told I just want more dialogue options dang it. And I know its just a pipe dream but it would be great if the game felt completely different depending on being a male or a female.

And truth be told I wouldn't mind different classes and abilities due to gender (of course then you get QQ'ing about why can't MShep do this! Or why can't FemShep do this! Which would get annoying quickly). Or heck different companions! (I think Star Ocean 2 spoiled me on that font). And even different endings and different events!

Of course BW doesn't have infinite resources so that's pretty much a pipe dream.

I agree - more dialogue would be nice, the amount of non-combat solutions to problems in ME2 was rather small. The class/gender differences are probably not gonna happen, but if they added more dialogue solutions to problems, I honestly wouldn't mind getting stuck with the same classes. But getting the walk back would be a nice start. I honestly thought there was going to be more scenes like the one we had with Harkin in ME1 where he acts totally differently if it's a femShep than a maleShep.

Le sigh. Can only hope that now that they've gotten the combat to a point they like, that they actually spend time on these other things in ME3.

Yeah. You'd think Shep of all people would be able to talk more people out of stupidly charging him/her than Shep does.

Ugh. Harkin. (lulzy enough there is a version really similar to the female one with a male Shepard fully VO'd and everything).

Me too. We can have conversations that don't turn into info dumps would be nice.

And no more of this "calibrations" and "the priiiize" nonsense would be nice to. <_<

[Fraevar]

Ryzaki wrote...

Yeah. You'd think Shep of all people would be able to talk more people out of stupidly charging him/her than Shep does.

Ugh. Harkin. (lulzy enough there is a version really similar to the female one with a male Shepard fully VO'd and everything).

Me too. We can have conversations that don't turn into info dumps would be nice.

And no more of this "calibrations" and "the priiiize" nonsense would be nice to. <_<

Lol. Priiiiiiiiize. I finally got around to pondering just what the writers were thinking when writing the romances. Because even if your femShep is a good-natured person who wants to help people, if you decide she likes Jacob, she suddenly turns into a total Man Eater. With Garrus it's Friend-Who-Wants-To-Be-More and with Thane there's some actual tenderness on Shep's part.

How exactly were we supposed to know what the deal was going in? <_<

[Ryzaki]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Yeah. You'd think Shep of all people would be able to talk more people out of stupidly charging him/her than Shep does.

Ugh. Harkin. (lulzy enough there is a version really similar to the female one with a male Shepard fully VO'd and everything).

Me too. We can have conversations that don't turn into info dumps would be nice.

And no more of this "calibrations" and "the priiiize" nonsense would be nice to. <_<

Lol. Priiiiiiiiize. I finally got around to pondering just what the writers were thinking when writing the romances. Because even if your femShep is a good-natured person who wants to help people, if you decide she likes Jacob, she suddenly turns into a total Man Eater. With Garrus it's Friend-Who-Wants-To-Be-More and with Thane there's some actual tenderness on Shep's part.

How exactly were we supposed to know what the deal was going in? <_<

XD. Good grief the first time I heard FemShep go "Hey Jacob." in that skeezy sounding voice I cringed and went: "...please don't do that again." when she did I was pretty much done. I pretty much went "oh heck no." 

That...was just horrible. Its not even poor Jacob (Though the priiize is pretty terribad on its own) but the combination just made me gag.

And yeah it does rankle a little at the rampant personality shifting.

I guess we're supposedly to be physic.

One of the drawbacks of a voiced PC I suppose.

Though MShep's romances didn't jar me as much.

[Fraevar]

Ryzaki wrote...

XD. Good grief the first time I heard FemShep go "Hey Jacob." in that skeezy sounding voice I cringed and went: "...please don't do that again." when she did I was pretty much done. I pretty much went "oh heck no." 

That...was just horrible. Its not even poor Jacob (Though the priiize is pretty terribad on its own) but the combination just made me gag.

And yeah it does rankle a little at the rampant personality shifting.

I guess we're supposedly to be physic.

One of the drawbacks of a voiced PC I suppose.

Though MShep's romances didn't jar me as much.

Oddly enough, if she was wearing the dress during those scenes, then I could suddenly see it making sense to talk like that, because hey - only one thing on her mind. But hearing her say them when she's standing there in full dress uniform was just like Apparently there's a rumour going around that they actually did have Hale do the lines without all the suggestion...DLC pack, please!

Jacob would actually be a pretty cool character if there weren't so many places where he's either trying to stand up to (fight off) the Man Eater, or spouting Generic-TV-Black-Guy-Line #1138. His VO is better than that, dammit! Same goes for Hale.

As for the dudeShep romances - Miranda's was alright, except for that: "Who said anything about love? I'm just trying to get you into bed" where, if Miranda was in-character there, she'd have gotten up and punched Shep's lights out.

Tali's is the one I'm going for in my playthrough - always liked her and there's some actual background stuff there, which gives the relationship some depth, methinks. Same can be said for femShep and Garrus - it might be based on calculations (har har har), but at least there's prior history.

Modifié par Delerius_Jedi, 13 mai 2010 - 08:49 .

[Ryzaki]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

Oddly enough, if she was wearing the dress during those scenes, then I could suddenly see it making sense to talk like that, because hey - only one thing on her mind. But hearing her say them when she's standing there in full dress uniform was just like Apparently there's a rumour going around that they actually did have Hale do the lines without all the suggestion...DLC pack, please!

Jacob would actually be a pretty cool character if there weren't so many places where he's either trying to stand up to (fight off) the Man Eater, or spouting Generic-TV-Black-Guy-Line #1138. His VO is better than that, dammit! Same goes for Hale.

As for the dudeShep romances - Miranda's was alright, except for that: "Who said anything about love? I'm just trying to get you into bed" where, if Miranda was in-character there, she'd have gotten up and punched Shep's lights out.

Tali's is the one I'm going for in my playthrough - always liked her and there's some actual background stuff there, which gives the relationship some depth, methinks. Same can be said for femShep and Garrus - it might be based on calculations (har har har), but at least there's prior history.

True it was unprofessional. Say what? She said the lines without the skeezy voice! Why BioWare why?!? *weeps* Who on earth thought those lines were good? 

Poor Jacob. All this flak for being suchh a generic, boring character. Heck they should have at least made him an interesting pirate. And yeah Hale can do flirty pretty well (or at least she did while playing Naomi. Which is why I'm surprised she dropped the ball so badly).

Yeah that line made me arch a brow. And Miranda beating the mess out of Shep would have been awesome.

I found the Tali romance to actually be the best one. That said I like sweet, innocent, first time romances so that probably explains my Tali preference.

Calibrations indeed. And bad romance music. XD Poor Garrus is so awkward its adorable.

[Fraevar]

Ryzaki wrote...


True it was unprofessional. Say what? She said the lines without the skeezy voice! Why BioWare why?!? *weeps* Who on earth thought those lines were good? 

Poor Jacob. All this flak for being suchh a generic, boring character. Heck they should have at least made him an interesting pirate. And yeah Hale can do flirty pretty well (or at least she did while playing Naomi. Which is why I'm surprised she dropped the ball so badly).

Yeah that line made me arch a brow. And Miranda beating the mess out of Shep would have been awesome.

I found the Tali romance to actually be the best one. That said I like sweet, innocent, first time romances so that probably explains my Tali preference.

Calibrations indeed. And bad romance music. XD Poor Garrus is so awkward its adorable.

Aye, in MGS4, Hale managed both flirty, suggestive and all out seductive-vampire-queen(played him for the sucker, didn't she?) all without the skeezy bit. I guess BioWare wanted skeezy over-the-top.

That being said, there's also moments in ME2 where she does nail it - Thane's scene was one of the better ones, methinks. Anywhoo, think we're getting away from the point slightly - yes, it would be extremely nice if femShep could be a tad more distinctive in ME3 and perhaps not undergo the Radical Personality Change depending on the romance interests? And maybe get a few women on the writing team?

Oh, the Tali romance was my favorite, if nothing else because it was one of the few moments in the game where Mark Meer got to put some actual emotion into maleShep.

[TMZuk]

TheTWF wrote...

I am totally against  making femShep more "feminine".

She's a soldier, not a supermodel.

None of the female soldiers I've met, (two) would sit with their legs parted in a dress, like Femshep does. It looks horrible. I don't want a supermodel. I want animations that looks as a female tough cookie, instead of a transvestite. I'm aware that the Kasumi dlc was not available when the game was released, so it was not -quite- as horrid, but still. It is a cheap way to cut costs.

Think: Linda Hamilton in Terminator two, Sigourney Weaver in Aliens or  Dina Meyer in Starship Troopers. All these actresses plays tough, no nonsense females, yet they don't move like men.

Anyway... a patch? Please? I don't know how hard it is to code, but really, it would be so very welcome!

[Ryzaki]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...
Aye, in MGS4, Hale managed both flirty, suggestive and all out seductive-vampire-queen(played him for the sucker, didn't she?) all without the skeezy bit. I guess BioWare wanted skeezy over-the-top.

That being said, there's also moments in ME2 where she does nail it - Thane's scene was one of the better ones, methinks. Anywhoo, think we're getting away from the point slightly - yes, it would be extremely nice if femShep could be a tad more distinctive in ME3 and perhaps not undergo the Radical Personality Change depending on the romance interests? And maybe get a few women on the writing team?

Oh, the Tali romance was my favorite, if nothing else because it was one of the few moments in the game where Mark Meer got to put some actual emotion into maleShep.

Poor Otacon. Every single LI or personal close to him for him in the game ends up dead (or dying) Snake should have ran when he had the chance. And poor Sunny she's next. I don't know why. It sounds horrible.

XD Yeah moving animations that fit her skeleton would be nice and yeah the RPC is annoying even if it is amusing. And yes more women on the writing team is a must. If only to read some of the lines and listen to the way FemShep speaks to some of the LIs.

Yeah it was <3.

And I say this as someone who hates Tali.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 mai 2010 - 04:08 .

[Tazzmission]

male shepard needs more hairstyles and for female shep she needs the same. i would also like to pitch armor desighnes and tattoos for both genders. also create our own insignia piece of armor

[Fraevar]

Ryzaki wrote...

Poor Otacon. Every single LI or personal close to him for him in the game ends up dead (or dying) Snake should have ran when he had the chance. And poor Sunny she's next. I don't know why. It sounds horrible.

XD Yeah moving animations that fit her skeleton would be nice and yeah the RPC is annoying even if it is amusing. And yes more women on the writing team is a must. If only to read some of the lines and listen to the way FemShep speaks to some of the LIs.

Yeah it was <3.

And I say this as someone who hates Tali.

To avoid completely derailing the topic, I'll just say that Kojima pulling that particular stunt *yet again* was extremely annoying. That and because Naomi's reason for not making it to the end was seemingly: "Oh no, I can't live with the shame!!!" Do like Otacon and deal with it, is it cuz she's a woman or what? <_< Ruin a perfectly good pairing there.

As for femShep, I think I've exhausted my bulletpoints right now. It's really just a question of hoping BioWare takes some of this into consideration

[Ryzaki]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...

To avoid completely derailing the topic, I'll just say that Kojima pulling that particular stunt *yet again* was extremely annoying. That and because Naomi's reason for not making it to the end was seemingly: "Oh no, I can't live with the shame!!!" Do like Otacon and deal with it, is it cuz she's a woman or what? <_< Ruin a perfectly good pairing there.

As for femShep, I think I've exhausted my bulletpoints right now. It's really just a question of hoping BioWare takes some of this into consideration

Truth. I couldn't help but facepalm at that scene. Frankly I made myself feel better by pretending she can't live without Vamp. (Bad excuse but still...)

And honestly the way Snake and Otacon treat poor Sunny. The girl is pratically raising herself. How can you not know how to cook eggs Otacon? It's not rocket science!

Yeah hopefully since they won't have to revamp the entire combat system for ME3 they can work on things like proper animations. (I was just playing KOTOR and Carth started doing this freaky head bop. It was disturbing as all heck and threw me right into uncanny valley. LOL graphic hiccups).

[Fraevar]

Ryzaki wrote...

Truth. I couldn't help but facepalm at that scene. Frankly I made myself feel better by pretending she can't live without Vamp. (Bad excuse but still...)

And honestly the way Snake and Otacon treat poor Sunny. The girl is pratically raising herself. How can you not know how to cook eggs Otacon? It's not rocket science!

Yeah hopefully since they won't have to revamp the entire combat system for ME3 they can work on things like proper animations. (I was just playing KOTOR and Carth started doing this freaky head bop. It was disturbing as all heck and threw me right into uncanny valley. LOL graphic hiccups). 

The worst bit is probably her retro-actively telling Otacon that it was all real...so why's it not worth living for, Doc? <_<

Lol, oh yes - the only thing worse than that are the Carth Teeth at the end. Btw, did you notice the Exorcist Headturn™ in ME2? There's places where the target tracking means that some characters walking away from the camera will literally turn their heads 180 degrees to look back at you.

Modifié par Delerius_Jedi, 13 mai 2010 - 06:49 .

[Ryzaki]

Delerius_Jedi wrote...
The worst bit is probably her retro-actively telling Otacon that it was all real...so why's it not worth living for, Doc? <_<

Lol, oh yes - the only thing worse than that are the Carth Teeth at the end. Btw, did you notice the Exorcist Headturn™ in ME2? There's places where the target tracking means that some characters walking away from the camera will literally turn their heads 180 degrees to look back at you.

And Otacon's practically blubbering and she's all "I have to!" And the little robot jumping around wildly. She just took poor Otacon's heart and shot it to pieces. (Heck and right after that his BFF tells him he has about a year to live (or was it more? I don't even think Snake had a year).

Unless Kojima is in the back going "The power of the plot compels you!"

I actually could picture him doing that holding the game script. He seems nerdy enough to do something like that.

Carth teeth? I must have missed this.

That is creepy. *wonders if someone made a video with that while playing creepy music*

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 mai 2010 - 08:19 .

[Onyx Jaguar]

That sequence didn't make any sense anyway. Both her and VVVVV dying did not make sense given the situation. Especially her, made zero sense. VVVVV was only wounded, what NNNNNNN gave both of them would not have done that. It made no sense. And then the game was over

[MsKlaussen]

Ryzaki wrote...
Oh noes. I don't fit into predefined gender sterotypes. Whatever shall I do? <_<

Also: Nice on the whole butch lesbian sterotype. Really. I'm so impressed by your superior knowledge of the female mind. You obviously know enough to speak for all females in the world! What is your secret? 

Edit: Guess this makes me a lesbian. Because apparently me liking baggy jeans, big belts and my uncle's loose clothing as well as liking fighting with guys, cursing, rolling around in mud, joining in spitting contests, arm wrestling (and losing) making stupid bets, watching football (even though it bores me), watching basketball (which I actually enjoy) and playing said sports with men makes me a butch lesbian. Even though I've been attracted to men all my life and only appreciate females on a purely asethic level.

Hm...you somehow know more about me than myself and everyone in my life? 

What is your secret?!?

Edit: Hm...who knows I might not be a woman at all. With your superior knowledge of every woman's on earth mind I obviously must be a man.

All this time? And I never knew?!?

I think you've completely misread my intentions. I actually want her animations to return to what they were in ME1. (Except for the dancing. The dancing was always terribad. Maybe not so much as ME2 but still pretty terribad.)

Also: What is wrong exactly with femshep being weaker in some ways than MShep? Why do people get so angry about that? It is realistic. I'm not saying that FemShep should be weaker than MShep just because she goes back to the way she was in ME1 but it is realistic. I'd expect FemShep to be more persuasive and able to trick males more easily as well. And for Male Shep to be slightly more intimidating (though MaleShep could stand to be a bit bigger) and for FemShep to be easier to talk to.

Also: As much as I exaggerated the feminity you exaggerated the gender differences. I have no intention of making FemShep a limp wristed bratty girl who can't tell the difference between similar guns and cries out for help whenever she gets in trouble. That's not making her slightly weaker than Male Shep that's making her pathetic.

However FemShep's punch will not have as much power as MaleShep's would. (Granted I doubt it matters seeing how X would go down anyways). Among other differences. As it is FemShep is just Male Shep with boobs. Whoopdeedo.

There's nothing wrong with acknowledging the differences and strengths and weakenesses of both genders. :mellow:Isn't this whole thread about that? But of course when it isn't in your favor all of a sudden its insulting and exaggerations.

Edit: Also you guys have made me see the light. I officially want FemShepard more feminine. :innocent: And it wouldn't really hurt to have some nice revealing casual outfits. The dress from Kasumi's outfit is fine but FemShep doesn't really work it like Miranda could.

Though I draw the line of stripper armor. I have some standards.

...

...

Maybe if there was decent boob physics and FemShep had some bigger boobs....

...

....

And a better face creator wouldn't hurt.



Disclaimer: The above post is filled with snark and sarcasm.

Except for the last bit.

I'm not going to address every line of this rant individually. It's beginning to border on the ridiculous and I can't get more heavily invested in it than I already have. Suffice it to say that I've got three brothers, spent all my time growing up with them, played football to the limits of my ability with them, can't stand to spend much time with my sister and her catty whiny friends, etc. etc. Two of the three of them plus my dad are career military. I am somewhat familiar with growing up surrounded by guys, and the best and worst of male mannerisms. But thanks for the eye-opening revelations about it all the same.

We are all influenced by what we've been surrounded with but said influence cannot truly supercede or erase what we were created as unless we allow it. If you want to sit there trying to tell me you're defined by how you wear your pants, and chew your food, that's your perogative. I'll reserve the right to continue believing that we are what we're born as, with all the pluses and minuses of same, and what we "want" to do and act like kicks in somewhere after that point.

If I'm misreading your intentions, whose fault is that? If you truly don't have a problem with Bioware being asked to return FemShep's animations to those in ME1 if they're not going to recreate them using a female model then we're good; why are you still throwing your food? Why are you accusing me of exaggeration when "uber feminine" came out of your mouth? If you don't like the way you've taught me to treat your views than teach me differently.

As to the rest? I never said I had a problem with the two characters being realistic in the terms you laid out (strength, speed, etc.). My problem is with people who act like that demand is justified by the fact that only FemShep's capabilities are currently unrealistic. Sorry but that's poppycock. I don't care how much stronger a man is than a woman he'll never be strong enough to take a rocket in the face and not go down, so let's not even operate on the assumption that realism was job 1 until FemShep arrived.

That's it. That's all - very simple requests. As sarcasm laced tirades are about as useful, constructive, and impressive to me as a 55 gallon drum of rubber cat sh-, I'll leave it to you to either reply as if you've understood what I've said, or to reply  to what you need me to be saying so you can be queen of board standup and impress what looks to be a sizable group of fans. Either way we're still good - from my end of it anyways.

[Ryzaki]

MsKlaussen wrote...

*snipped for brevity*
I'd not go down, so let's not even operate on the assumption that realism was job 1 until FemShep arrived.

That's it. That's all - very simple requests. As sarcasm laced tirades are about as useful, constructive, and impressive to me as a 55 gallon drum of rubber cat sh-, I'll leave it to you to either reply as if you've understood what I've said, or to reply  to what you need me to be saying so you can be queen of board standup and impress what looks to be a sizable group of fans. Either way we're still good - from my end of it anyways.

You know what how about instead of opening your mouth and painting people you know nothing about with your own paintbrush of experiences we just leave it be. I'm going to ignore your little tirade as well.

Suffice to say we both agree that FemShep should have animations that fit her skeleton and don't cause ridculous clipping issues and the wide gaping legs.

Can we agree on that? 

Also there was nothing constructive, impressive or classy or heck "ladylike" about your whole "women who act like men are doing it for attention or butch lesbians!" remark. FYI:  Not usually smart to accuse someone of a rant when you're the one who started it off.<_<

Edit: Forget it I'm going to be the mature one here and let it go. It doesn't even matter.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 mai 2010 - 10:04 .

[Ziggy]

It's not so much that femsheps walk is bad, but that they didn't make one for her. They made what they thought was a good maleshep walk and then reused the animation for femshep. It's like femshep is just an afterthought.

[Kya]

I agree. I often find myself wishing she wouldn't be so... outright butch in a cheap way, the walking being the most prominent example. A pet peeve of mine is the whole shoulder stretching. It's probably overdone for the male Shepard, too, but it's just too much and too often for my FemShep.



I would wish for more subtle femininity in ME 3. But I won't hold my breath, as FemShep is just a variant of MaleShep, a concession made to those who prefer playing female characters. (Even though 'female character' ideally means more than just a female body.)

[Chuvvy]

The only problem I have with the walk is that it's so slow. Seriously you walk like 1 mph. Admittedly that's only about 2, 2 1/2 mph slower that normal but still. I also wish you didn't jog like a half retarded adult baby.

Modifié par Slidell505, 15 mai 2010 - 08:14 .

[Foune]

What the **** is wrong with FShephards walk? She's a warrior, not Paris Hilton. It feels to me that players wants to build up some barriers between the genders, a female without a sexy walk is a transvestite is the impression I get from what you think, it's really frustrating.

[Sawp]

during Kasumi's DLC. , I laughed a little when i saw my femshep wearing a formal wear and walking like if she was wearing her armor. It wasn't pretty, but at least it was logic.

i agree with Vladiostroke. Shepard is a SOLDIER, not a MODEL.

[Peppard]

Vladiostroke wrote...

What the **** is wrong with FShephards walk? She's a warrior, not Paris Hilton. It feels to me that players wants to build up some barriers between the genders, a female without a sexy walk is a transvestite is the impression I get from what you think, it's really frustrating.

So you think her walk  should be a recycled animation from Male Shep? 

I think if BW feels that giving FemShep different clothes than Male Shep is a detail that their gamers want to see (and not just the dress, but the other casual ones are different too), then why is a walk  or dancing animation any less important a fluffy detail ?  They don't have to undercut her presence as a b.a. space soldier, but they can find a way to make femshep not simply be a re-skin of male shep in every respect.

Just give her a  new way to walk  and a better dance animation...they can find some middle ground between turning her into  barbie in space versus male shep recycled.

Modifié par Peppard, 15 mai 2010 - 05:51 .

[DarthRomance]

damn femshep is an attention-<bleep>.

[Foune]

I do still fail to see what's wrong with her walking, yes her animation is like male Shephards which I don't see is particularily genderized. Tho I agree that the running animation with the dress looks silly, but I think the dress looks silly aswell. I don't see any problem other than that, I like her walk and I love there is no femenine barriers around her that she has to restrict herself too.

[Kya]

It has been stated before that being a soldier doesn't necessarily require to carry oneself like a man. -___- Asari are also soldiers and they don't act or move like men, either. (And yes, I know they're not supposed to be 'female', but essentially and for all it's worth they are.)



I'm not saying it all should be fundamentally changed or "barbied-up". Just some subtle changes and differences from male-Shep wold be nice. A nod to her different gender and different constitution.



Samara also has an out-of-place looking animation when she walks around while talking to Shepard in Starboard Observation. It just looks wrong. In the cutscenes on Illium her moves look much better and more dignified than the, well, macho-swagger she has aboard the Normandy.