334 réponses à ce sujet

[Awesome Helmet]

i never spammed singularity in ME1. i used ALL my abilties. every one of them equally as much, thanks to not being limited by global cooldowns. in ME2 i spam singularity because it is by far the best biotic ability in this game. the whole reason to play an adept is to have armor/shield/barrier penetrating singularity. i spam singularity, like an infiltrator spams cloak and a soldier spams adrenalin rush. if your not spamming singularity with your adept, you probably shouldnt be playing an adept. this is something i think you would agree with since your whole basis of playing a biotic, is warp explosions.



respecing means nothing to me. ofcorse knowing whats going to happen and respecing your character for a specific mission is going to make your character better. its just too bad nobody knows that untill they play through the game once or twice. so whats your point?



ymir mechs are the only enemy you face that make you spam one abiltiy? thats BS. find me an adept video that doesnt show them just spamming singularity or warp. good luck.



my adept in ME1 could CC that collosis. so i was shooting it while it was floting in the air, or held in stasis. that means i was playing an adept. does that work in ME2? hell no, not even close. im shirukening that son of a **** untill i see red, then i use a throw on it just because finally i can. what a stupid way to play an adept.



holy ****. again with the easier difficulty settings! do you just see "blah blah blah" when your reading or what?



im done. good luck with your soldier/adept.

[Roxlimn]

Eh... ...so ME1 was better because you're forced to use various abilities, not because they were any good, but because they were available anyway? Lame.

And no, I don't, in fact, spam singularities. I like playing Warp Explosions, but AS I'VE REPEATED MENTIONED, I use PULL to set that off, not Singularity.

You're assuming that the basis and optimal play for ANY class is spamming one ability, which is why that is what you conclude. You are starting from the conclusion, and reinterpreting everything to fit your conclusion, even going to far as to misread the very facts that are before your eyes.

Why shouldn't I be playing Adept if I don't spam Singularity? I like Adept just fine, thanks. No other class combines Throw, Pull, and Warp, quite aside from Singularity.

As for videos, they are already UP. In IFF, Average Gatsby uses Throw a LOT. He also uses Singularity and Warp, of course, but it is by no means a spam fest of those. If anything, IFF mission is a Throw spam.

Finally, the reason I keep advocating a lower difficulty is because you want to win the game easily.  You want to be "overpowered," as YOU put it.  Lowering the difficulty setting will allow you to do just that and everything you ask for - CCing most enemies right off the bat and what not.  Your turn.  Why don't you want to even try Veteran?  Straight answer, no back-questions, no rationales.  No, "that's not the point."  What is it about Veteran difficulty that puts you off?

Modifié par Roxlimn, 24 février 2010 - 03:42 .

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

Roxlimn wrote...

 Grumpy Old Wizard:

Funny thing.  I'm better now at Adept than I was when I was doing Hardcore.  The Adept, as it turns out, doesn't actually need squadmates.  Noticed it playing on Insanity.  

Please show videos of you parking your squadmates at the start of a level and using only your adept (no squad mates powers) to clear the levels.

Oh, no bonus powers because those are not adept powers and don't shoot your gun since you have claimed adepts don't need guns either.

Say, about 3 videos in different and dissimilar areas. Maybe one could be Tali's loyalty mission, that is not a long mission. Then you could prove your statements that adepts don't need guns or squad mates (or bonuse powers.)

Oh yeah, on insanity, of course.

Modifié par Grumpy Old Wizard, 24 février 2010 - 04:03 .

[mnrqz]

Or.... you could just cheat?



Makes the Adept an unstoppable monstrocity of death.



Not really... but it's still a lot more fun than actually just playing it legitly.



A+X before you hit the elite version of any talent.

[Awesome Helmet]

Roxlimn wrote...

Eh... ...so ME1 was better because you're forced to use various abilities, not because they were any good, but because they were available anyway? Lame.

And no, I don't, in fact, spam singularities. I like playing Warp Explosions, but AS I'VE REPEATED MENTIONED, I use PULL to set that off, not Singularity.

You're assuming that the basis and optimal play for ANY class is spamming one ability, which is why that is what you conclude. You are starting from the conclusion, and reinterpreting everything to fit your conclusion, even going to far as to misread the very facts that are before your eyes.

Why shouldn't I be playing Adept if I don't spam Singularity? I like Adept just fine, thanks. No other class combines Throw, Pull, and Warp, quite aside from Singularity.

As for videos, they are already UP. In IFF, Average Gatsby uses Throw a LOT. He also uses Singularity and Warp, of course, but it is by no means a spam fest of those. If anything, IFF mission is a Throw spam.

Finally, the reason I keep advocating a lower difficulty is because you want to win the game easily.  You want to be "overpowered," as YOU put it.  Lowering the difficulty setting will allow you to do just that and everything you ask for - CCing most enemies right off the bat and what not.  Your turn.  Why don't you want to even try Veteran?  Straight answer, no back-questions, no rationales.  No, "that's not the point."  What is it about Veteran difficulty that puts you off?

are you 6 years old?

[Roxlimn]

Grumpy Old Wizard:



Never said that you don't need ANY of guns, bonus power, or squadmates. I have only ever said that you don't need squadmates, obviously because you can use either guns or bonus power to compensate. Don't need guns because you can use squadmates or bonus power to compensate. Don't need bonus power because you can use guns or squadmates to compensate.



None of them are strictly necessary, but you will need at least one such option to deal with Shields.



Obviously.



Awesome Helmet



No.

[Roxlimn]

Look here, Awesome Helmet. You are clearly getting offended and it's getting in the way of the conversation. I do not mean to offend you. I do not want to offend you. When I ask you why you don't want to play at the setting that contains the elements you say you want, it's a very honest question. Why are you so fixated on Insanity? Insanity isn't the only setting for the game, and it's not the only way to enjoy the game.



I can say that in Mass Effect 2, I love throwing opponents about with abandon using biotics - and I would be partially right in that I can do that. Because I CAN do that. On Veteran and Normal. That does not make me a lesser player. It does not make my experience less valid. I enjoyed the game. That is all that matters, is it not?



Furthermore, we have videos of various players (not just Average Gatsby), clearing using powers to profit, not just Singularity. Not just Warp. In fact, I asked Gatsby to feature Throw because I liked that power, and he obliged on the IFF video, even though he really does prefer Singularity for it. If you watch the video, you can clearly see Throw being used over and over to fantastic effect.



rumination888 has a video on this very thread showing the potent combination of Pull and Warp. That is not Warp Spam, since you are combining Warp with Pull, using both at least equally. One Warp for every Pull, at least. In fact, some Pulls you can just shoot to death.



ME2 biotics are not the same as they were before. I totally agree with you on that. I believe it is better because it obliges you to use your powers in specific ways - it is harder to use, and that makes it more fun. And if you like it easier? Well, you can always turn down the setting.



In fact, I'm disappointed in Soldier in ME2 because it is too easy. The game play does not materially change from Normal to Hardcore to Insanity. You think that this is good. I think that this is bad. My rationale for this is that if the gameplay doesn't change anyway, then what is the point of having a different setting to begin with? Just play it on the one setting!



I can and have referred you to videos showing exactly what I am talking about. If you want, I can refer you to particular time signatures on particular videos for more precise reference. I'll even post the link. How about it?

[SmilingMirror]

Guys, its really not that difficult to strip everyone barriers...
Crowd Control is easily possible if that how you want to play it.

Besides, if your doing a rush playthrough with only powers doesn't adept have the power % bonuses?
Thus adept clears quicker.

All classes have their place.
and i'm the only one here that realizes that soldier is way over hyped in this thread. it could have 300% damage bonus and its 50% health damage mitagation could apply to its shields as well, and it STILL wouldn't be the quickest or the best at surviving.

Modifié par SmilingMirror, 24 février 2010 - 10:19 .

[rumination888]

SmilingMirror wrote...

Guys, its really not that difficult to strip everyone barriers...
Crowd Control is easily possible if that how you want to play it.

Besides, if your doing a rush playthrough with only powers doesn't adept have the power % bonuses?
Thus adept clears quicker.

All classes have their place.
and i'm the only one here that realizes that soldier is way over hyped in this thread. it could have 300% damage bonus and its 50% health damage mitagation could apply to its shields as well, and it STILL wouldn't be the quickest or the best at surviving.

Sentinels have equal or better(if they choose) passive bonuses than the Adept. They can also take down synthetics quickly which allows them to fill their bonus power slot with squad ammo instead of Energy Drain(Miranda + Samara combination is ridiculously powerful if you have access to squad ammo). For the numerous times when using a gun is more effective, a Sentinel can completely refill their shields, allowing them to fire for longer periods at a time(the Sentinel is as effective with a gun as the Soldier, Infiltrator, and Vanguard if played right).

And if a Soldier had 300% damage bonus and -50% damage taken to shields, they would, infact, be the quickest clearers and best survivor in the game. Soldiers have a bad rep on these forums for being an "easy" class. Any idiot can play a Soldier well, but a good player can take it much, much further.

[Graunt]

rumination888 wrote...
For the numerous times when using a gun is more effective, a Sentinel can completely refill their shields, allowing them to fire for longer periods at a time(the Sentinel is as effective with a gun as the Soldier, Infiltrator, and Vanguard if played right).

At the cost of doing less damage for the ammo and time spent. They have no passive weapon modifiers and being able to take more hits doesn't really mean much if your squadmates are dying more because enemies are up for longer periods.  They simply do not have the same "must die now" power that a Soldier, Infiltrator and Vanguard have and even an Engineer is better at staying alive and keeping the squad alive.  

Although, something has to be said for the melee attack I suppose if you want to go that far with it, and a Sentinel can probably melee attack better than anyone else, unless it's also somehow affected by weapon passive boosters.

Modifié par Graunt, 24 février 2010 - 01:20 .

[TekFanX]

With a friend I think I found the solution why there is such a discussion about biotic- and weapon-balance.



The reason is: The biotics are extremeley powerfull and well balanced on the advanced difficulties starting from Veteran, getting more powerfull in the balance as the difficulty get's higher.



On normal(my first playthrough) weapons just are power-houses, compared to biotics. There's nearly not a hint of balancing for the two dmg-dealer-groups. You're nearly more effective as a sentinel, if you just use weapons on normal.



It didn't occur to me, since I imported an ME2-Char into my higher difficulty-games. This char started at lvl30, the enemies where balanced to the level but not to the lacking biotic-upgrades.

Therefore I stood in cover for most times, lacking the 50%-dmg+ and 20%-cooldown the upgrades gave me.

The lacking damage-upgrades also impacted on the tech-armor/power-armor, since it's cooldown-bonus was more often gone than I imagine a new playthrough would have implicated.



This isn't that much of an impact for soldiers, who just put their high-level-ammo-skill out.

The weapon-upgrades don't matter that much then, except the smaller clips and lower accuracy on rapid-fire-weapons.

I'm going to start a real insanity-run with an imported ME1-character with level5 as soon as I finish my current playthrough.

[Br0th3rGr1mm]

So now you actualy have to THINK about the tactics you use to take on a specific enemy? Man that sucks....

[TekFanX]

Br0th3rGr1mm wrote...

So now you actualy have to THINK about the tactics you use to take on a specific enemy? Man that sucks....

If that is an answer to my post, you totally misunderstood it.

Start a playthrough on insanity with a char imported from ME1(lvl5) and then start a playthrough with a char imported from ME2(lvl30) and see the difference.

If you meant the first post of this topic, nevermind.

[mundus66]

Graunt wrote...

rumination888 wrote...
For the numerous times when using a gun is more effective, a Sentinel can completely refill their shields, allowing them to fire for longer periods at a time(the Sentinel is as effective with a gun as the Soldier, Infiltrator, and Vanguard if played right).

At the cost of doing less damage for the ammo and time spent. They have no passive weapon modifiers and being able to take more hits doesn't really mean much if your squadmates are dying more because enemies are up for longer periods.  They simply do not have the same "must die now" power that a Soldier, Infiltrator and Vanguard have and even an Engineer is better at staying alive and keeping the squad alive.  

Although, something has to be said for the melee attack I suppose if you want to go that far with it, and a Sentinel can probably melee attack better than anyone else, unless it's also somehow affected by weapon passive boosters.

A sentinel that knows what he is doing got best survivability in the game, then we have infiltrator a distant second, sentinel is light years ahead of engineer in terms of survivability...

[incinerator950]

Sentinel has Survivability but has less Offensive ability then a Soldier or Infiltrator, and yes Vanguard.

[rumination888]

Graunt wrote...

At the cost of doing less damage for the ammo and time spent. They have no passive weapon modifiers and being able to take more hits doesn't really mean much if your squadmates are dying more because enemies are up for longer periods.  They simply do not have the same "must die now" power that a Soldier, Infiltrator and Vanguard have and even an Engineer is better at staying alive and keeping the squad alive.  

Although, something has to be said for the melee attack I suppose if you want to go that far with it, and a Sentinel can probably melee attack better than anyone else, unless it's also somehow affected by weapon passive boosters.

Wern't you the one that thinks Miranda's +15% damage passive is overrated? Because thats the same damage bonus the Soldier and Infiltrator gets.

Keeping squadmates alive is easy. Play aggressive and don't bunch up with them and they'll rarely die.

[SmilingMirror]

rumination888 wrote...

Graunt wrote...

At the cost of doing less damage for the ammo and time spent. They have no passive weapon modifiers and being able to take more hits doesn't really mean much if your squadmates are dying more because enemies are up for longer periods.  They simply do not have the same "must die now" power that a Soldier, Infiltrator and Vanguard have and even an Engineer is better at staying alive and keeping the squad alive.  

Although, something has to be said for the melee attack I suppose if you want to go that far with it, and a Sentinel can probably melee attack better than anyone else, unless it's also somehow affected by weapon passive boosters.

Wern't you the one that thinks Miranda's +15% damage passive is overrated? Because thats the same damage bonus the Soldier and Infiltrator gets.

Keeping squadmates alive is easy. Play aggressive and don't bunch up with them and they'll rarely die.

That kid is in denial, just ignore him. During the end game, its not hard to take off shields or health bars at all. Warp blows off the shields, and SMG blows whats left (yes, an SMG with squad ammo that is). or, you blow off their skills and combine slam with warp to kill everyone around that guy.

[Sabresandiego]

Biotics are somewhat ****ty unless you use your squads biotics to create combos. Then biotics are insanely powerful. Instant Warp explosions anyone?

[mundus66]

Sabresandiego wrote...

Biotics are somewhat ****ty unless you use your squads biotics to create combos. Then biotics are insanely powerful. Instant Warp explosions anyone?

Which is why i usually roll with Thane and Miranda if i play vanguard or adept, since i got pull myself.

[Awesome Helmet]

Roxlimn wrote...

Look here, Awesome Helmet. You are clearly getting offended and it's getting in the way of the conversation. I do not mean to offend you. I do not want to offend you. When I ask you why you don't want to play at the setting that contains the elements you say you want, it's a very honest question. Why are you so fixated on Insanity? Insanity isn't the only setting for the game, and it's not the only way to enjoy the game.

I can say that in Mass Effect 2, I love throwing opponents about with abandon using biotics - and I would be partially right in that I can do that. Because I CAN do that. On Veteran and Normal. That does not make me a lesser player. It does not make my experience less valid. I enjoyed the game. That is all that matters, is it not?

Furthermore, we have videos of various players (not just Average Gatsby), clearing using powers to profit, not just Singularity. Not just Warp. In fact, I asked Gatsby to feature Throw because I liked that power, and he obliged on the IFF video, even though he really does prefer Singularity for it. If you watch the video, you can clearly see Throw being used over and over to fantastic effect.

rumination888 has a video on this very thread showing the potent combination of Pull and Warp. That is not Warp Spam, since you are combining Warp with Pull, using both at least equally. One Warp for every Pull, at least. In fact, some Pulls you can just shoot to death.

ME2 biotics are not the same as they were before. I totally agree with you on that. I believe it is better because it obliges you to use your powers in specific ways - it is harder to use, and that makes it more fun. And if you like it easier? Well, you can always turn down the setting.

In fact, I'm disappointed in Soldier in ME2 because it is too easy. The game play does not materially change from Normal to Hardcore to Insanity. You think that this is good. I think that this is bad. My rationale for this is that if the gameplay doesn't change anyway, then what is the point of having a different setting to begin with? Just play it on the one setting!

I can and have referred you to videos showing exactly what I am talking about. If you want, I can refer you to particular time signatures on particular videos for more precise reference. I'll even post the link. How about it?

i dont know what your talking about. i dont play on insanity. i feel like abroken record here. difficulty setting means squat. enemy protection shows up more often, but its the same exact concept. you still cant use biotics untill an enemy is striped of all defenses. again, i dont want to kill things faste...................**** it. your a moron.

[baller7345]

Awesome Helmet wrote...

i dont know what your talking about. i dont play on insanity. i feel like abroken record here. difficulty setting means squat. enemy protection shows up more often, but its the same exact concept. you still cant use biotics untill an enemy is striped of all defenses. again, i dont want to kill things faste...................**** it. your a moron.

Just wondering but what difficulty are you playing on?

[VirtualAlex]

I can't believe this is still going on. It's not hard to strip defenses. 90% of encounters have some dork with only shields. It takes 1 overload, or 3 seconds of gunfire to strip those shields. Then you warp explode that guy and the explosion strips the defenses of the people around. They are now at your mercy.



I am TOYING around with most encounters. Just pulling and pushing, and singularity-ing and pulling and pushing and just giggling about the bodies flying around.



What are you even crying about?

[Awesome Helmet]

wwaaahhhhhhhh. boohoo.



there. now you can say im crying.



anyways.....i play on harcore i think or veteran. not really sure.



shooting 50% of the time, and adepting 50% of the time isnt a problem? does the soldier shoot enemies defenses to play as a soldeir? does the engineer shoot 50% of the time in order to play as an engineer?



i dont care about killing speeds. im not into mass effect because my class can kill things faster then another class. i loved(past tense) mass effect because of what i could do with biotics. any class in ME1 wasnt limited by the fact that they werent a different class. now an adept cant shoot as well as a soldier, and cant use biotics as well as a so called "adept." i just dont see how its ok that in order to play as an adept(or an engineer who wants to use AI hacking, or cryo freeze), i have to strip ALL enemy defenses.



ive said i accepted it, but i just dont like the aftertaste.



my problem isnt just biotics not working the majority of the time. its global cooldowns, tech/biotic shared cooldowns, not enough wrex, not enough alien boobage and so on.



ME2 is just not ME1. thats a fact. who wants to buy ME2 from me? 15 bucks.

[themaxzero]

Can we get this thread locked? Started bad and has gotten worse, I'm not sure what it's actually purpose is except to a whine.

Modifié par themaxzero, 25 février 2010 - 03:27 .

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

Rather than crying because some people don't share your opinions you could just move on to a thread where everyone agrees with you.