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[fightright2]

Is it just me? Am I alone in being really bothered that while romancing Alistair he and Wynne were flirting.
Really, it came off like she was flirting with him and he being surprised by her unabashed directness, seemed to flirt a bit back.

I can see where that would come up if I wasn't in a romance with him but even after he gave me the rose?

I think this gave me some reason to favor Zevran over him.

Zevran doesn't really flirt with Wynne but just uses sexual humor to deflect her scrutiny over his ethics.

And in the case with Lelianna he really seems sincere in interest of the chantry life or the willing abstinence of someone.

I don't know. Did anyone else really get a little disconcerted when/if  that happened?

[soignee]

I just thought it was lulsy, and was done tongue in cheek. Don't take it so seriosuly; I can almost imagine Wynne giving your Warden a sly wink as she's doing it, and Alistair playing along for the laughs.

*edit* I assume you're talking about RTO? That's where Wynne gets her flirt on, anyway.

Modifié par soignee, 20 février 2010 - 07:02 .

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Alot of people have. Trust me, you ain't the only one. Though Alistair seemed a bit nervous and taken aback, it certainly didn't sound like flirting. he comes off more as flirting with Morrigan. Remember, he did bluntly tell her she was an old lady when you enter ostagar. Especially considering she's sort of an adopted granny...and yech.



The thing that most people found disturbing what where it was triggered. Pretty weird, seeing how you're about to go build a pyre for the dead king, and Wynne decides to brag about bedding young men....

[Reaverwind]

Just how did you miss the Abominable Wynne thread?  Slide over there for some good old Wynne-bashing.

[ejoslin]

Maybe it's because I'm so used to romancing Zevran, but party banter flirting never bothers me! Because, yes, his flirting is done for reasons other than what it appears (all flirting, not just Wynne). But Alistair didn't strike me as actually biting as much as just being polite to a batty old woman who until that moment was trying to be his grandma.

Modifié par ejoslin, 20 février 2010 - 07:10 .

[Sabriana]

Tongue in cheek? At Ostagar? Giving the Warden a wink? At Ostagar? About to take care of Cailan? Sorry, no disrespect intended, but that flirtation is seriously sick.

[soignee]

Sabriana wrote...

Tongue in cheek? At Ostagar? Giving the Warden a wink? At Ostagar? About to take care of Cailan? Sorry, no disrespect intended, but that flirtation is seriously sick.

Not heard of gallows humour, then. Try doing a really shizen-covered job that sees the very worse in humanity everyday and then get back to me; the human mind is odd in the way it creates defence mechanisms against certain situations. Not saying it's a good thing, mind; it's why PTSD exists, and usally when there's a quiet moment everything will catch up and kick you in the fork. But. Sometimes you need something to distract so you to keep going.

Also, time passes funkily in the game, so Cailan's pyre scene > "ooh young man!" speech, could have been a greater stretch of time then the seconds it took to zone back into the area.

[Sabriana]

No, gallows humor does not apply here. Her actions are immature, poorly thought out, and completely inappropriate. A snot-nosed teenager might do this, and might be forgiven for it, but not a so called 'wise' mage.

A really shizzened job? I have one of those. I deal with things that will and do burn out my colleagues on a regular basis. PTSD? That's one issue I also deal with on a regular basis as well. What Wynne does is just flat out wrong and very, very disturbing. She might think of spending some time in my office in RL.

You have your opinion, and I have mine. Her actions are inexcusable to me. This is not some run in the mill encounter, this is Ostagar.

[Chasseresse]

A lot of people were/are disturbed by the "flirting" in RTO between W and A. It's been said though that perhaps some of the dialogue there (ie the flirting) was just stuck in as a sound filler and wasn't written specifically for the zone (unlike the pyre, mourning dialogues). That perhaps, if the same dialogue took place in the middle of the Brecilian Forest or somewhere random, it wouldn't have seemed so offensive. Either way, whether the exchange was supposed to be where it was or added later as fluff, it was poor judgement IMO to put it where it was. I've said this before, even if it had been Oghren saying something typical for him or Zev going into one of his more colorful stories, that was no place for any sort of overt sexy talk out of anyone.



Even those traumatized who make up for it by humor *usually* know when to shut up or save a certain topic for a later time.

[fightright2]

The thing is, Alistair may indeed regard Wynne as an adopted grandma type. But Wynne seems to ignore it to some degree and spin it to a flirtation on his part. I think that's why he's taken aback over it. It's kind of sickening to see how someone seen in a grandma light twist the affection and high regard to boost her own self-righteous ego as being a target of sexual desire. She lays it out there that though there is an age gap she is still also willing to participate if he so chooses to because she has done it once before.

Stinky move on her part, I say.

[ejoslin]

I didn't get the impression she was saying it only happened *once* before . . .

[Sabriana]

Agreed, Chasseresse and Fightright. I don't own RtO but I saw the 'talk' on YouTube. Although Alistair is only a friend to my PCgirls, they would most likely flinch as well. I can't zoom into Alistair (obviously) but he comes off as being totally baffled and surprised (in a bad way).

[EnchantedEyes1]

I don't own RtO yet either but sounds disturbing. I've been holding off on watching videos to avoid spoilers but I'm now off to see what this is all about...

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Yes, I played through it and that's exactly how it comes off. Like i said, when you enter RTO, Alistair responds to Wynne saying "I feel so old" by saying "Well, you are old." Wynne didn't appreciate that and told him he had a smart mouth. Alistair probably felt bad, since he likes Wynne, so later, he apologizes to Wynne by politely complimenting her saying she doesn't look old. Then Wynne fires off.



Alistair's reaction is indeed...baffled, with a blank look like he's thinking "uuuh...am I like hearing this from my dear adopted granny, or did I just hit my head..." I think I have a save right before then, so I can go back and take screen shots if anyone wants, of the conversation...



if that was Wynne's way of getting back for him calling her old, it was pretty disturbing, all things considered.

[fightright2]

Funny, it's Alistair that Wynne and Morrigan chooses to flirt with. Albeit, Morrigan does it as a way to tease him because of his inexperience with the opposite sex.

Wynne does it out of her own ego for his adoration.



We all understand that Zevran from the get go finds the Warden very attractive despite whether the Warden is in a romance with Alistair because how would Zevran know of them anyways?



And Zevran mentions Wynne may find someone he knows to her liking since this friend of his likes older women. He, himself is not interested in Wynne herself,and thuse I think to some degree that may have bothered her to be regarded as old and may give reason further to throw out there that she is still appealing to younger men and therefore defines her to be classified as equally as hot to those younger than her.

Now, I'm wondering if that's the reason why she didn't like my character being with Alistair in the first place. She likes being both roles of being a wise sage to be held in high regard. And be held as a hottie.

It's funny out of the options you try to be courteous to say that she aged rather well. And now looking I think she may have actually taken it to her head. lol

[Reaverwind]

fightright2 wrote...


Now, I'm wondering if that's the reason why she didn't like my character being with Alistair in the first place. She likes being both roles of being a wise sage to be held in high regard. And be held as a hottie.
 

Yikes. That's like having a jealous mom moving in on the men in your life.

[ejoslin]

fightright2 wrote...

Funny, it's Alistair that Wynne and Morrigan chooses to flirt with. Albeit, Morrigan does it as a way to tease him because of his inexperience with the opposite sex.
Wynne does it out of her own ego for his adoration.

We all understand that Zevran from the get go finds the Warden very attractive despite whether the Warden is in a romance with Alistair because how would Zevran know of them anyways?

And Zevran mentions Wynne may find someone he knows to her liking since this friend of his likes older women. He, himself is not interested in Wynne herself,and thuse I think to some degree that may have bothered her to be regarded as old and may give reason further to throw out there that she is still appealing to younger men and therefore defines her to be classified as equally as hot to those younger than her.
Now, I'm wondering if that's the reason why she didn't like my character being with Alistair in the first place. She likes being both roles of being a wise sage to be held in high regard. And be held as a hottie.
It's funny out of the options you try to be courteous to say that she aged rather well. And now looking I think she may have actually taken it to her head. lol

*grin* What I meant was that while Zevran may appear to be flirting with the female companions on the surface, he has reasons other than trying to get them into bed.  With Wynne, it's to make her uncomfortable, with Morrigan, it's a bet, with Leliana, he's poking holes in the pure image she is trying to project.

I haven't really seen Morrigan flirting with Alistair.  Is that in a male play through?  I see her flirting with Sten a lot, though.

Edit: But YES, Wynne flirting with Alistair is inappropriate no matter what.  I can't believe there's even an argument about that!  It should have been beneath her dignity, especially regarding the way she reacts to Zevran talking about her magical bosoms.  

Second edit: Further proof that I shouldn't read forums and talk to my kids at the same time.  Nothing to see here . . . moving on now . . .

Modifié par ejoslin, 20 février 2010 - 09:47 .

[Sabriana]

Zevran is special to all my PC girls, precisely because of what you are saying , fightright.

Good call on Wynne, I salute you, fightright

[Addai]

Even if it did trigger in the Brecilian Forest, my PC and especially the one romancing Alistair (you know, the one Wynne had just tried to convince ought to dump A. for the sake of the darkspawn) would still have had the same WTF?!? horrified look on her face. I suppose the rationale is to lighten Wynne up a bit and give her a "past," but I thought they did that much more appropriately and charmingly by having her talk shop with Oghren about ale, and also appropriately and movingly when discussing her son with Alistair. Now, just... ewww...

Modifié par Addai67, 20 février 2010 - 09:13 .

[Creature 1]

fightright2 wrote...
Now, I'm wondering if that's the reason why she didn't like my character being with Alistair in the first place. She likes being both roles of being a wise sage to be held in high regard. And be held as a hottie.

That does help explain the rationale for the magical bosom. 

[Maria Caliban]

They gave Wynne a different writer in Return to Ostigar, who obviously didn't know the character. Simple as that.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 20 février 2010 - 09:40 .

[Rhinna]

The way Wynne comes off as a self-righteous priss throughout most of the game who questions YOUR morality, it just seems SO ooc for her to then brag about bedding young men, AND putting the moves on Alistair.

Then again, I would love to see her try that on Zevran if he is in a romance with your PC *chortles* The banter would probably be some of the best in game LOL

Modifié par Rhinna, 20 février 2010 - 09:43 .

[Gold Dragon]

Heh. You want Laughs? Try watching how Zevran Flirts with SHALE, of all people.... especially when Zev is in a romance with the PC.... Alistair and Wynne are nothing compared to that....



And when my Female Noblewoman heard Alistair and Wynne do that, she just shrugged it off. THe more embarrasing (to her, as RP) was when Oghren was teasing Alistair about bedding the PC (She hid her face behind the Helm of the Deep)

[Herr Uhl]

*wades through Wynne-hater crowd* Man, you're all over the forums these days.

I didn't see it as that out of character, and not as a serious flirting attempt (nothing to do with ego), she is simply messing with him, like the "swaying hips" and "birds and bees" convos. She plays indignant at him saying that she is an old granny, and then runs with it as he tries to repair it. The timing is bad, but the convo itself is not that jarring.

The "wise old mage" is not something she calls herself, it's what you imposed on her due to her being old. You must have met waaay different elderlies than I've done, if that is good or bad I leave to posterity to decide. And somebody that doesn't like to be messed with that messes with others, that is a completely new and never before witnessed phenomenon *looks at Morrigan*.

Edit: Though I do admit it was kind of bothering due to the timing.

Modifié par Herr Uhl, 20 février 2010 - 09:57 .

[Cazlee]

I was bothered more by Alistair being rude to Wynne, and Wynne being overly confrontational and argumentative instead of having something wise or comforting to say like her normal self. It's like they became two different people in RTO.

Edit: This makes sense.

Maria Caliban wrote...
They gave Wynne a different writer in Return to Ostigar, who obviously didn't know the character. Simple as that.

But Alistair was off too. He was calling Wynne old in RTO and he never does that in the DA:O banter. He always tells her that she's not old. He is charming and kind to her, not once is he rude or blunt. 

Modifié par Cazlee, 20 février 2010 - 10:18 .