127 réponses à ce sujet

[Raygereio]

The Angry One wrote...
Thing is it's a stupid speculation. Shep of all people should know that the Collectors aren't threatening Earth.

How is it stupid? At that point we have no real idea of the size and capabillities of the collectors; for all Shep (or more specifically his crew as it's one of them that utters the 'They're going to target Eath' line) know they could have an eniter fleet of humongous ships that may loose in a one-on-one fight with the Normandy II - who's made of experimental and cutting edge tech - but who will be more then a match for ships that use older technology (which will be pretty much the majority of the fleet).

Modifié par Raygereio, 21 février 2010 - 12:16 .

[screwoffreg]

The Angry One wrote...

screwoffreg wrote...

Well, Sovereign only needed to survive long enough to open the Relay.  Presumably, thousands of its brothers would have jumped in and turned the tide.  I imagine a human reaper, constantly on the move, surrounded by Geth Heretic and Collector allies would be able to face most any threat but a concentrated fleet effort.

It would still be a tremendously bad idea to face a Council homeworld head on. The Council for all their stupidity would have to respond to that with full force.
There might be heavy casualties but the Collectors/Reaper wouldn't be walking away from that one.

Also bear in mind the human reaper was probably, like Sovereign, being built for some other purpose than "head on charge" and to find some other door into the Galaxy.

The most obvious purpose is a replacement for Sovereign. Harbinger controls the Collectors but can't indoctrinate, without that there's no way to manipulate allies and no way to open the way for the others.
Now with that gone they're going to take the long way and hope for the best.

It seems you and I basically agree .

With that most Reaper servants in the Galaxy now dead (Collectors) or lessened (Geth Heretics), I wouldn't be surprised if Bioware went with a Babylon 5 route and have a Council race infiltrated and have been working for the Reapers the whole time.  Maybe even humanity?

[SuperVaderMan]

Mooner911 wrote...

Did anyone notice the armada of Reapers surfing towards The Milky Way in the final scenes of ME2?
Or have I missed the point of this thread completely?

I think you missed it.

[The Angry One]

Raygereio wrote...

How is it stupid? At that point we have no real idea of the size and capabillities of the collectors; for all Shep (or more specifically his crew as it's one of them that utters the 'They're going to target Eath' line) know they could have an eniter fleet of humongous ships that may loose in a one-on-one fight with the Normandy II - who's made of experimental and cutting edge tech - but who will be more then a match for ships that use older technology (which will be pretty much the majority of the fleet).

Even the old Normandy had a main gun that could drill right through the hull of an unshielded Sovereign and out the other end.
And again I mention the defense towers on Horizon that the Collector cruiser had to flee from.
Now think what an Alliance dreadnought could do.

[JrayM16]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Ulicus wrote...

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

And to think they bigged the collectors up as the "greatest threat ever faced".

Not really.

TIM: Humanity is facing the greatest threat of our brief existence.
Shepard: The Reapers.

Really.

That comment is irrelevent. In ME2s marketing build up, they tried to present the villains of ME2 (the collectors) as an even greater threat than the first game. Like many things in ME2 when it comes to playing, it doesnt match up.

You dont at any point in ME2 face any actual real reapers. Its just collectors and a stupid Terminator wannabe "human reaper larvae". I wouldnt have a problem if this was highlighted before that the major, and more dangerous threat of the first game takes a backseat role, but like I said, it wasnt.

The hostility from that reply is burning my eyes out.

Also, once the game's out, I niew marketing as irrelevent.

[Raygereio]

The Angry One wrote...

Even the old Normandy had a main gun that could drill right through the hull of an unshielded Sovereign and out the other end.
And again I mention the defense towers on Horizon that the Collector cruiser had to flee from.
Now think what an Alliance dreadnought could do.

Exactly! Unshielded. Up until the point Shepard killed RoboSaren - which somehow turned Sovereign's shields off - the Alliance fleet didn't do anything but ****** it off (it's possible Sovereign's shields may have started to give under the Alliance's barrage, but we so no evidence of that).
The same is most likely true for the collector vessel on Horizon; there's no reason to assume it had it's shields up while landed and we have no idea how long it takes for it to raise them.

Also, the main gun on the Collector vessel ripped through the old Normandy like a hot knife through butter. Asuming the weaponry on a Alliance dreadnaught is a threat to a prepared Collector vessel, if the latter manages to get the first shot in the battle is most likely allready over.

Note; I haven't yet seen how the unupgraded Normady fights the Collector vessel in the endgame, so I have no comment on that.

Modifié par Raygereio, 21 février 2010 - 12:49 .

[The Angry One]

Raygereio wrote...

Exactly! Unshielded. Up until the point Shepard killed RoboSaren - which somehow turned Sovereign's shields off - the allience fleet didn't do anything but ****** it off..
The same is most likely true for the collector vessel on Horizon; there's no reason to assume it had it's shields up while landed and we have no idea how long it takes for it to raise them.

We're not talking about a Reaper here though.
Also the Collector cruiser on Horizon *was* shielded, you clearly see the guns hitting the cruiser's barriers.
After some bombardment the shields fail and the guns strike the hull, that's when the ship is forced to lift off.

Modifié par The Angry One, 21 février 2010 - 12:48 .

[Raygereio]

The Angry One wrote...
We're not talking about a Reaper here though.
Also the Collector cruiser on Horizon *was* shielded, you clearly see the guns hitting the cruiser's barriers.
After some bombardment the shields fail and the guns strike the hull, that's when the ship is forced to lift off.

Erm, you brought Sovereign up, so...

Anyway, about the Collector ship; I honestly don't remember that. However, if that's true then I concede your point. If a couple of planetary defence towers manage to do that to it in such a short amount of time, it's shields are kinda pathetic.

Modifié par Raygereio, 21 février 2010 - 12:55 .

[The Angry One]

Raygereio wrote...

Erm, you brought Sovereign up, so...

I mean with regards to beating the collector ship.
As in, Normandy SR 1 had the firepower to hull an unshielded Reaper.
An unshielded Reaper is probably still tougher than a shielded Collector given that their shields don't seem to be worth crap.

Anyway, about the Collector ship; I honestly don't remember that. However, if that's true then I concede your point. If a couple of planetary defense towers manage to do that to it in such a shot amount of time, it's defenses are pathetic.

Yeah I figure these things aren't really built to withstand punishment, they're more like glorified cargo ships.
They have devastating weapons but bad defenses, this also explains why they seem to have run after killing the original Normandy without collecting the survivors.

[adam_grif]

I mean with regards to beating the collector ship.
As in, Normandy SR 1 had the firepower to hull an unshielded Reaper.
An unshielded Reaper is probably still tougher than a shielded Collector given that their shields don't seem to be worth crap.

Not quite, it's more like this:

1.1.       The GARDIAN turrets depleted the shielding on the collector vessel in a short space of time.
1.2.       The GARDIAN turrets are less powerful than a typical starship mounted gun.
1.     The Collector's kinetic barriers can be overcome without unusual difficulty.
2.1.        Sovereign's hull was destroyed with frigate mounted weapons.
2.2.        Collector hulls are not stronger than reaper hulls.
2.     The Collector's hull can be destroyed without unusual difficulty.

C: Collector ships are not unusually powerful, The alliance should have no difficulty taking them out.

Modifié par adam_grif, 21 février 2010 - 01:28 .

[GreyWolf83]

Raygereio wrote...

Note; I haven't yet seen how the unupgraded Normady fights the Collector vessel in the endgame, so I have no comment on that.

{Warning: Massive spoiler detected] This is what happens.

If that's what happens to an un-upgraded Normandy after an attack by a single Collector ship and a few laserbeam-weilding drones, I can only imagine what devistation an entire fleet of those things, along with a combined assault of heretical Geth (if you didn't tell Legion to use the virus to re-write their programing) and Reaper ships, might cause if/when it comes down to a full-scale invasion and/or all-out war.

[adam_grif]

Right, a cruiser and a complement of drones on their home turf gets wasted by a single factory spec'd frigate and your conclusion is that a fleet of collector ships would be a huge problem?



The idea is that they would need to assault Earth to finish the reaper. The Heretical geth are being battered by the Alliance already and reduced to a very small number. The only way they would be a threat was if you didn't do Legion's loyalty mission and the "true geth" joined them because of it.



So we have:



- No reapers

- Collector ships

- Small number of geth ships



vs



- Systems Alliance military

- Turian military

- Asari military

- Salarian military



If it would be so trivial for the collectors to build a fleet of ships, then why didn't they attack with Sovereign at the Citadel? Wouldn't a fleet of superships be useful? Remember, the only objective was to re-open the Citadel, everything else was secondary.



Either the Collectors aren't very formidable militarily, or the Reapers are stupid.

[Nigawatts]

I think it was an assumption based on the idea that the Collectors meant to fill every pod in the ship. Which is dumb...but w/e.

[The Angry One]

GreyWolf83 wrote...

Raygereio wrote...

Note; I haven't yet seen how the unupgraded Normady fights the Collector vessel in the endgame, so I have no comment on that.

{Warning: Massive spoiler detected] This is what happens.

If that's what happens to an un-upgraded Normandy after an attack by a single Collector ship and a few laserbeam-weilding drones, I can only imagine what devistation an entire fleet of those things, along with a combined assault of heretical Geth (if you didn't tell Legion to use the virus to re-write their programing) and Reaper ships, might cause if/when it comes down to a full-scale invasion and/or all-out war.

Um.. even the unupgraded Normandy smashed the Collector cruiser so I don't really see your point there.

Also how appropriate for Sheploo to be overseeing that run of pure fail... yes I do kick people when they're down. *kick, kick*

[GreyWolf83]

Edit: Accidentally posted before completion. Didn't see this until too late. see below for complete post.


http://www.google.com/favicon.icohttp://www.babylon.com/favicon.ico

Modifié par GreyWolf83, 21 février 2010 - 03:12 .

[InvaderErl]

The Angry One wrote...

Also how appropriate for Sheploo to be overseeing that run of pure fail... yes I do kick people when they're down. *kick, kick*

Did MaleShep do something to you when you were a child?

[The Angry One]

InvaderErl wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Also how appropriate for Sheploo to be overseeing that run of pure fail... yes I do kick people when they're down. *kick, kick*

Did MaleShep do something to you when you were a child?

Eh? I got nothing against ManShep.
It's Sheploo I'm against.

And yes, Sheploo ran over my kitten.

[Randy1012]

fusilero1 wrote...

Earth might not be as well defended as Arcturus Prime. They come in, block communications in the system and kidnap as many as they can before hauling away before the Arcturus Prime fleet arrives.

You have to go through Arcturus to get to Sol.

[trigger2kill1]

Ya and they have a time machine too and they land on 12/21/12.



OP if you believe that they have just one collection ship then well I guess you don't have to much faith in bioware.

[InvaderErl]

The Angry One wrote...

InvaderErl wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Also how appropriate for Sheploo to be overseeing that run of pure fail... yes I do kick people when they're down. *kick, kick*

Did MaleShep do something to you when you were a child?

Eh? I got nothing against ManShep.
It's Sheploo I'm against.

And yes, Sheploo ran over my kitten.

Oh.. Well then...

Anyone have an appropiate lolcat?

[The Angry One]

trigger2kill1 wrote...

Ya and they have a time machine too and they land on 12/21/12.

OP if you believe that they have just one collection ship then well I guess you don't have to much faith in bioware.

Okay let's say they have 100 Collector cruisers.
So what? 1 cruiser can be schooled by a minor colony defense setup. 1 cruiser can be trashed by a single frigate.
They're not doing anything vs. a Council fleet, or even a lone Alliance fleet.

[adam_grif]

Sheploo is the only shep in my mind. I always cringe at the awful custom sheps I see online.

[The Angry One]

adam_grif wrote...

Sheploo is the only shep in my mind. I always cringe at the awful custom sheps I see online.

Pssh, there are bad Sheps and there are good Sheps.
If you think my Shep is bad, you're entitled to your <wrong> opinion, but there are good ones, both male and female.

Sheploo on the other hand is clearly the devil.

[InvaderErl]

He has indeed asked me to sell me his soul on numerous occasions.

[Shepard needs a Vacation]

it was just a stupid line that shouldn't of been in the game