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[medlish]

When she gets out of the trouble with the Shadow Broker I think everything will be cake slices again.

[Trishann]

Some people have to see the approaching storm for themselves. We can't point it out, we can't hold their hand all the time, we can't even take them to bed and drive the darkness away. All we can sometimes do is offer help and wait for them to reach out.



Liara went from horny teenager to a young adult. Bioware put complexity into the character, and while I wish she was in my cabin right now instead of Bunny Chambers, I've come to the bitter realization that the current Liara is a prodigal making of my Renegade Shepard.

[stealthisaccount101]

She's turning into her mother, which I think you're supposed to pick up on when she directly mirrors her mother's, "Have you ever faced an Asari commando unit," line from the first game. No idea where they're going to go with it, but I guess it could be interesting. I'm going to hold off on final judgment until the comic series finishes.

Modifié par stealthisaccount101, 21 février 2010 - 09:35 .

[Pauravi]

I liked her at first, and although I wouldn't say that I like her new personality, I think that it is an interesting and realistic character development considering what she has been through. She has had to harden up in order to deal with the things that have happened, and I think it may be possible in ME3 that the PC may be a make-or-break element in terms of the direction she goes. Either she ends up taking down the Shadow Broker and takes his place, becoming ruthless and cold, or the PC can rescue her from herself and bring her out of her all-consuming obsession for revenge.

[Malanek]

Nightwriter wrote...
I approve of the new direction of her character but it didn't seem genuine.

I really don't know what I mean by that.

I agree that it was a good direction to take the character. Her character had to develop and this made her more interesting. But the presentation wasn't that good. I just think the dialogue needed to be re-written especially giving Shepard more options to say "what the hell happened to you?". Then needed to see more hints as to what Liara was actually feeling. It was actually Shephards dialogue rather than Liara's that I had the problem with.

[Pauravi]

Forwen wrote...

my point that she couldn't possibly respec so quickly and effectively, gaining such influence and standing, still stands.

I don't think it does.
She certainly wouldn't be the first person to make a stratospheric rise to power, and given how effecting the events of the last couple years were for her, she has a lot of motivation to do so.  It is amazing the sort of strides that a highly motivated and intelligent person can make.  Two years is a pretty good amount of time, especially for someone who has expertise in digging up information, as Liara does.

[Ulicus]

stealthisaccount101 wrote...

She's turning into her mother, which I think you're supposed to pick up on when she directly mirrors her mother's, "Have you ever faced an Asari commando unit," line from the first game. No idea where they're going to go with it, but I guess it could be interesting. I'm going to hold off on final judgment until the comic series finishes.

The echo of her mother's line, as well as the voice she used to deliver it, was an act. It's made pretty clear. Benezia wasn't evil, either. She was indoctrinated. Liara's certainly a darker character - and the game certainly foreshadows the possibility of an even darker turn - but I'd read more into what she's like talking to Shepard than what she's like when putting on a performance for the human on the vid screen.

Pauravi wrote...

Forwen wrote...

my point that she couldn't possibly respec so quickly and effectively, gaining such influence and standing, still stands.

I don't think it does.
She
certainly wouldn't be the first person to make a stratospheric rise to
power, and given how effecting the events of the last couple years were
for her, she has a lot of motivation to do so.  It is amazing the sort
of strides that a highly motivated and intelligent person can make. 
Two years is a pretty good amount of time, especially for someone who
has expertise in digging up information, as Liara does.

Additionally,
we don't know how she got set up, yet. It may well be that her
information network was inherited from an agent high up in the shadow broker's heirarchy, or something, which would give her a very good leg-up.

Modifié par Ulicus, 21 février 2010 - 09:56 .

[Pauravi]

Malanek999 wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...
I approve of the new direction of her character but it didn't seem genuine.

I really don't know what I mean by that.

I agree that it was a good direction to take the character. Her character had to develop and this made her more interesting. But the presentation wasn't that good. I just think the dialogue needed to be re-written especially giving Shepard more options to say "what the hell happened to you?". Then needed to see more hints as to what Liara was actually feeling. It was actually Shephards dialogue rather than Liara's that I had the problem with.

I would agree with that.

You can tell Liara that you don't like her new attitude, but it comes across as angry rather than concerned.  You can tell her that she has become cold, or that she is acting like her mother, which is a good start, but there is no way to tell her, "Hey, I'm worried about you, you've got to stop this obsession".  You aren't going to overcome two years of stewing anger in a few minutes, obviously, but I wish there were a way to at least let her know my feelings.

I did like the sort of "hidden" dialogue option where she tells you what happened after your death; for just a few lines she seems to become the old Liara again, worried about whether Shepard still likes her, but then puts her walls back up.

[Cutlass Jack]

stealthisaccount101 wrote...

She's turning into her mother, which I think you're supposed to pick up on when she directly mirrors her mother's, "Have you ever faced an Asari commando unit," line from the first game. No idea where they're going to go with it, but I guess it could be interesting. I'm going to hold off on final judgment until the comic series finishes.

I hope she doesnt turn into her mother. She had that disturbing goatee...well she also had that chest so I guess it all works out.

[Pauravi]

DarkNova50 wrote...

And therein lies another of my problems.

I got that speech from Liara during my first playthrough. Thing is, she saw, just like everybody else, the kind of **** Cerberus was up to in ME1. Experimenting with Rachni, enslaving Thorian Creepers, all sorts of delightfully nightmarish experiments being conducted...and then she gives Shepard's body over to them.

Given how she was always the voice of morality in ME1 (at least the way that I saw it), this just helped further cement in my mind that she was not at all the same person. At least, that's how I took the whole situation.

Yes she was the voice of morality, but she was also very close to Shepard.  I mean, did you miss the part where you would have been turned into a Reaper Smoothie if she hadn't done what she did?  It was the ONLY way she would ever be able to see you again, and the alternative is to allow the Collectors to have them for whatever their sinister purposes were.  I don't see the decision she made as less moral than allowing Cerberus to use you, and the fact that she had the chance to bring you back to life is also a powerful motivator.  Even then she is worried that you'll be mad at her for letting Cerberus bring you back to life.  She was obviously conflicted about it, so I don't really think it was out of character for her.

[Ultra Prism]

Liara was most anticipated moment in ME2...though it was toooooo short.... I hope the devs are going to give us something after the redemption comics ... please dev give us something

[Schneidend]

I loved ME2 Liara. I feel her current (slight) Renegade leanings were directly influenced not only by what she's been through, but the example of my Shepard's actions in the first game. She was already a bit ruthless (just listen to some of the things she says on missions and before/after combat), but she was also inexperienced and somewhat naive, and that allowed her to become somewhat misguided and focus on the wrong goals in Shepard's absence. Her character is developing, and as cool as it would have been to have her on the team, she's had two years to choose her path. Shepard can't convince everybody to abandon their goals. Hell, the only reason recruiting Garrus and Tali is believable is because Garrus' responsibilities were all betrayed and murdered and Tali didn't really have anything more important going on besides the Haestrom mission.

[Pauravi]

gmartin40 wrote...

I hated ME2 Liara. She can fall off a cliff for all I care. Should have stayed with Ash like my first thought told me to do.

Pfft, Ash treats you worse than Liara did.
Ash would have just left you to rot.  She would have buried you herself rather than let Cerberus have you to bring you back to life.  She doesn't even seem particularly happy that you're alive.  Liara at least lets you know that she still cares about you and is concerned about what you think of her.

Man, you guys are very unforgiving and harsh on the girl that is responsible for you even being alive.  I'd have figured that people would be more grateful for that.  You'd really rather be dead than alive by the hand of Cerberus?

[Pauravi]

Ultra Prism wrote...

Liara was most anticipated moment in ME2...though it was toooooo short.... I hope the devs are going to give us something after the redemption comics ... please dev give us something

She will have a big role in ME3, make no mistake.

[Nozybidaj]

Anyone else recognizing a lot of the folks in thread saying "Yeah I liked it, was great" are also the same faces you seeing trolling Liara related threads and antagonizing Liara fans in other threads? Coincidence? Probably not.

[Pauravi]

gmartin40 wrote...

Pauravi wrote...

gmartin40 wrote...

I hated ME2 Liara. She can fall off a cliff for all I care. Should have stayed with Ash like my first thought told me to do.

Pfft, Ash treats you worse than Liara did.
Ash would have just left you to rot.  She would have buried you herself rather than let Cerberus have you to bring you back to life.  She doesn't even seem particularly happy that you're alive.  Liara at least lets you know that she still cares about you and is concerned about what you think of her.

Man, you guys are very unforgiving and harsh on the girl that is responsible for you even being alive.  I'd have figured that people would be more grateful for that.  You'd really rather be dead than alive by the hand of Cerberus?

I would rather be dead.

So you'd rather allow the Reapers to win and destroy all galactic life than to accept help from Cerberus until such a time that it is convenient to rip them off?  Wow, great moral stand there.  Maybe for your game you can just say that Liara allowed the Collectors to have you.  Just play the intro and skip the rest of the game and ME3, that way you can have the outcome you want.

[IRMcGhee]

jojon2se wrote...

Come on. In all likelyhood she is supposed to be unconvincing and awkward.

She hasn't become a bad copy of benezia, just a bad copycat -- her flustering at Shepard's overhearing the "have you ever faced..." delivery is hilarious.

Not saying she hasn't become somewhat hardened, but she certainly appears to be half-bluffing herself through the whole ordeal.

That's exactly what I thought. I thought it was even more obvious when she was explaining how Cerberus got your body that she wasn't much different from before.

[Frotality]

Nozybidaj wrote...

Anyone else recognizing a lot of the folks in thread saying "Yeah I liked it, was great" are also the same faces you seeing trolling Liara related threads and antagonizing Liara fans in other threads? Coincidence? Probably not.

a very imoprtant observation to consider...

[Pauravi]

Nozybidaj wrote...

Anyone else recognizing a lot of the folks in thread saying "Yeah I liked it, was great" are also the same faces you seeing trolling Liara related threads and antagonizing Liara fans in other threads?

No, I didn't notice that.
I liked her turn in ME2 -- or at least I thought it was interesting and realistic -- and I liked Liara in ME1.  She has been my only romance in ME1 so far (I may do Ash sometime in the future), and I liked her innocent demeanor.  I've never antagonized Liara fans or trolled a Liara thread.

However... I also think that if she didn't undergo any change or conflict throughout the series that she would end up being a very flat and uninteresting character.  I'm not saying that I like her new personality better, but I think that it is a good character development.

[Schneidend]

gmartin40 wrote...

I wouldn't care because I'm not living anymore.

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -Edmund Burke