121 réponses à ce sujet

[Varenus Luckmann]

Gaddmeister wrote...
Is it really that bad? Sure, the game gets a little more linear, but it's not such a big deal. At least, I don't think so.

Tali: "We get to kill her at some point, right?"
Legion: "Organics resist attempts at incarceration."

Modifié par Varenus Luckmann, 22 février 2010 - 09:48 .

[PMorgan18]

They had different plans for how the story would go.  But during the development they changed to what we see it now.

[ydaraishy]

Something doesn't add up. The only point you get Legion is on the derelict Reaper to get the IFF, and this is just before endgame. So, unless the IFF installation in previous revisions didn't push you towards endgame (and punish you for taking your time after the Collector kidnap), or you wouldn't have been able to recruit and use Legion in those early stages as well anyway.

[Nautica773]

Pity the game wasn't designed for PC then ported to console. Course, if it were, I doubt we'd even have the Gears of War type of gameplay we have now. But, no point in crying over something that's not going to change now.

[FFLB]

You don't have to save your crew. You have the good of the galaxy to think about!

[TheLostGenius]

Would have been nice to have your squad choices be that open ended. Actually I think I would have prefered the option to recruit anyone at any phase of the game.

[Varenus Luckmann]

ydaraishy wrote...
Something doesn't add up. The only point you get Legion is on the derelict Reaper to get the IFF, and this is just before endgame. So, unless the IFF installation in previous revisions didn't push you towards endgame (and punish you for taking your time after the Collector kidnap), or you wouldn't have been able to recruit and use Legion in those early stages as well anyway.

As has been said, much of the storyline was broken up into specific segments to accommodate the inherent limitations of the X360. Presumably, Legion was intended to have his own recruitment mission, too.

Legion has comments on all major missions as far as I'm aware. The recruitment missions I know if is Garrus', Mordin's, Tali's, Thane's, and Jack's. Several which there is simply no way for him to participate in, even if you tried.

Modifié par Varenus Luckmann, 22 février 2010 - 09:45 .

[Varenus Luckmann]

Lawgunner wrote...

Besides freedom's progress which you have to use Miranda and Jacob for, you have five missions to do(Mordin, Garrusl, Jack, Grunt, Horizon). After those five and where 360 players swap discs, you have seventeen missions(11 loyalty missions, three recruits, collector ship, IFF, suicide mission). So here is what you do. After horizon, go get your favorite squadmate and you will be able to take them on sixteen different missons. So stop crying just because you can't see their dialogue for five missions.

Wow. You're a tool.

[Xeyska]

I know that Thane and Legion have a lot of dialogue on Jack's recruitment mission (I did it myself not too long ago).

Modifié par Xeyska, 22 février 2010 - 09:48 .

[Tasker]

BeyondFX wrote...

360 players need to swap after horizon

That's a cop out excuse though, they could have easily done with ME2 what Turn 10 did with Forza 3 and have the second disk install to the hard disk then run the game using the first.

[Pauravi]

Ecael wrote...

Varenus Luckmann wrote...
Ah. So it's the consolers fault. Figures that the PC gets shafted due to limitations on inherently inferior platforms. Again.

To be fair, the game was designed for the console. If it were designed for the PC, there's a good chance that the PC version would have kept the ability to recruit anyone you wanted at any time.

I don't think it was designed for one or the other, I think it was designed for both.
However, I don't believe that they would want to make the actual plot or content of the game different between them.  PCs often get different control setups and interfaces, but they wouldn't have just the PC version be able to get all the dossiers at once.  It would have been perfectly feasible to do so, and in fact it clearly was like that at some point, but it got changed.  It was clearly not any limitation of the PC that changed their plans, so the only logical conclusion is that it was changed to fit the 360, and then they changed the PC version so that the 360 players weren't missing out on official content.

[HTTP 404]

Varenus Luckmann wrote...

Through using the savegame editor, I decided to run some tests after hearing that Tali had dialogue in Mordin's recruitment mission. After running Mordin's and Garrus' recruitment missions with a number of characters that cannot possibly participate in them under normal circumstances (Legion, Tali, Thane, Samara) it turns out that.. well.. they all act as if being there was the most natural thing ever. Thane even have (a) comment(s) when you first meet Aria on Omega, and discuss Archangel.

As someone that has been annoyed by having to trudge through worthless recruitment missions to get to the "good stuff" on occassion, such as having to do ALL the initial recruitment missions before I can get Tali or Thane, I find this incredibly annoying. Especially annoying is the realization that Legion, the absolutely last squadmember you can recruit and just narrowly squeeze his loyalty mission in, if you want to avoid your entire crew turning into Reaper-Chow, have dialogue in virtually every mission, wheter he actually can participate in them under normal circumstances or not.

This leads me to believe that the decision to "cut up" the recruitment and create a tier-base story (Initial Mission, Recruitment phase, Intermediate Mission, Recruitmen Phase, End missions) came extremely late in development and just feel horribly, horribly arbitrary to me. Why not have each "step" in the story trigger after a set amount of missions, regardless wheter they are recruitment missions or how many you have recruited? Why "force" a showdown (unless you like Reaper-Chow) so soon after getting Legion?

Things like these really annoy me, because it feels so forced, so arbitrary and.. just for complete lack of a better word.. bad.

This will annoy me every time I play ME2 now. "Wow, I wonder what Thane would've said on this mission, if I could actually recruit him before it". "Would Legion have some input on this?".

Sometimes I really wonder what they were smoking. 

Its like complaining that a movie didnt include all the scenes when it came out, happens all the time!  Ever seen deleted scenes on a dvd?  I have, no big deal.

[Varenus Luckmann]

It would've been infinately better if you got the Horizon mission after two recruitments, and Legion was recruited on Horizon, after which all other dossiers unlocked.

Legion: "There is a high statistical probability of death by gunshot. A punch to the face is also likely."

Modifié par Varenus Luckmann, 22 février 2010 - 10:05 .

[stealthisaccount101]

Varenus Luckmann wrote...

Rip504 wrote...
It is because of the 2 discs and I agree to the ppl who have mentioned this.As it stands right now You swap discs to recruit Tali,Thane,Samara,and Legion.Illuim is only on disc 2.Then the final swap is before Endgame.2 times you need to swap disc.If you were able to recruit anyone at anytime ppl would have complained about how many times they had to swap disc.It would have slowed down gameplay and the overall experince would have been "not so clean".*Rumors* if you are playing on disc 1 anytime you wanted to go to Illium,Tuchanka,Tali,Thane,missions you would have had to switch disc,which be more then twice for most people.

Well, that explains it. I had no idea X360 people had to switch their discs and I'm sure they'd come crying if they had to change discs a couple of times on their precious "superior gaming platforms olololol".

Now at least I know where to point the finger when things get cut.

Dude, you're kind of a douche. Lol.

[Gaddmeister]

Orkboy wrote...

BeyondFX wrote...

360 players need to swap after horizon

That's a cop out excuse though, they could have easily done with ME2 what Turn 10 did with Forza 3 and have the second disk install to the hard disk then run the game using the first.

Only the 360 demands that all games be playable without hdd installation. Perhaps that is the problem. The second disc for Forza 3 is optional, but the second ME2 disc isn't.

[FredegarKadere]

I imagine this is because of a design decision to change the flow of game play later in development. VA is often done early in a game/movie design and on most occasions the different actors never hear, see, or interact with their fellow actors.

This is an unfortunate design change. One of the few issues I have had with ME2 in comparison to ME1 is the absence of banter/life/interaction with your squad as you engage in missions or randomly walk around. At some points the interaction is there, but for my chosen squad (Tali/Garrus/Legion) I usually have only silence. I was amazed at how much interaction my chosen squad really had in the game after looking at YouTube Videos of people who had modified the game to allow squad members on missions that in a normal playthrough can not occur. It is a shame to miss out on all that.

[GenericPlayer2]

It seems like the recorded stuff and then changed the order of things. Maybe they felt by giving 2 ME1 team mates in the first 4 recruitment missions was too much.



Don't know if anyone has done it, but its kinda cool to recruit Grunt before Mordin. His reaction to the plague corpse burning is "Anyone hungry? No?"

[grayfox4000]

They reward people for hacking the game with hidden easter eggs with all the characters. Its fun to have tali and legion in the very beginning.

[FredegarKadere]

..stating that the reason the game flows the way it does because of having to be broken into two discs on the XBOX 360 is a silly idea. Both discs have all data pertaining to Squad members, Powers, Abilities, the underlying combat/physics mechanics, etc. The differences between the discs are the level/mission layouts, the textures for those areas, and that is probably about it..

The fact that recruitment is the way it is isn't a technical limitation imposed by being for a console, but because of a story design decision.

[jtav]

I suspect that the real reason is to keep from crashing the game if someone found a glitch that would allow them to recruit a squaddie earlier than they were "supposed" to.

[The Angry One]

This is basically the dark age for PC gaming, few games are PC centric these days. Most are built around the limitations of consoles.



Perhaps things will change someday.

[Varenus Luckmann]

grayfox4000 wrote...
They reward people for hacking the game with hidden easter eggs with all the characters. Its fun to have tali and legion in the very beginning.

People act like it's one or two lines of dialogue, but it's not. All characters are fully integrated into every recruitment mission in the game:

The issue with cheating the characters in, though, is that the game suddenly makes absolutely no sense. If it was just possible to unlock the dossiers in advance, then at least it'd be possible to do the recruitment missions in the right order.

Legion would still be shafted, though.

Modifié par Varenus Luckmann, 22 février 2010 - 10:28 .