33 réponses à ce sujet

[SkullandBonesmember]

[AshedMan]

Touchy subject. It might be too far into the government/politics realm for this forum. I can only see the conversation turning that way.

[SkullandBonesmember]

AshedMan wrote...

Touchy subject. It might be too far into the government/politics realm for this forum. I can only see the conversation turning that way.

Wouldn't surprise me. Most people don't even want to take a look at some very logical questions, questions that even survivors and victim's family members ask, and just dismiss "twoofers" by default.

[SaY4cT]

I gave him the base

[Baracuda6977]

the 9/11 conspiracy can only be proven true, not false as its concept is the government controlls everything to make it look like it looks like its doing things so how would you know what you see and hear is real and not fabricated to make it look fabricated so that you have doubts about its fabrication? get my point?

[SkullandBonesmember]

Baracuda6977 wrote...

the 9/11 conspiracy can only be proven true, not false as its concept is the government controlls everything to make it look like it looks like its doing things so how would you know what you see and hear is real and not fabricated to make it look fabricated so that you have doubts about its fabrication? get my point?

Nope. Because the evidence doesn't match the official report. And Martin Sheen is a hero.

[SargeantRenegade]

My take on this? I feel that it's somewhat pointless to dig into it at this stage. Suppose it was a coverup, or maybe it was a real terrorist attack. What good would finger-pointing do now?



The guilty parties will have got what they wanted from the event already. I'm content to put 9/11 down as a horrific incident costing too many lives, take the lessons learned from it and move forward.

[ModProp]

Can't we just accept it as a tragedy and move on? I hear enough about the 9/11 conspiracies in my city, and it was nine years ago. It happened, it's done. The government can say what they will, and people can say what they will. It's petty and pointless.

[DragonDefender]

There are a few things that dont make sense, but just like any other tragedy of that magnitude there will always be some sort of doubt to the depth of our governments knowldge/involvment in such events.

[Sa Seba]

Well, if it is a cover up and it comes out, the US is in big trouble. Not so much from the outside but from the inside.



/takes out popcorn

[DragonDefender]

Lulz, I wont pretend to know either way. I say just accept the tragedy for what it is remember those we lost and find a way to minimize our exposure to this risk if at all possible agian.

[SkullandBonesmember]

DragonDefender wrote...

Lulz, I wont pretend to know either way. I say just accept the tragedy for what it is remember those we lost and find a way to minimize our exposure to this risk if at all possible agian.

But that's the thing. If it WAS the government, and nobody holds them accountable, they'll do it again. Those like me for the most part are constantly ridiculed because we dare question our world leaders. There was a guy(not the only one) who worked in the buildings saying he heard an explosion from the basement 6 seconds prior to the first plane hitting the tower. When he proceeded to share his story with CBS I believe it was, they edited what he said to make it sound like he was talking about the plane. Now why the hell would anybody with journalistic integrity do such a thing? Why would anybody who questions the official story, regardless of how credible they are, be mocked with questiosns like "did Elvis fly the plane"? If the questions that the families and survivors are asking continue to be ignored, there's nothing stopping the government if they truly did orchestrate 9/11 from doing it again. Some even think there could be an assassination attempt on Obama soon and it will be blamed on a "birther" or "truther".

[Jae Onasi]

Martin Sheen forgets that NO American politician can ever keep his/her mouth shut, so it would be impossible for the gov't to do this.

This is my take on it:

Was the Death Star Attack an Inside Job? (along with the rest of the site)

[flem1]

OP is a disgusting and deluded fool. The lock can't come fast enough.

[AntiChri5]

I loved South Parks take on this

[AntiChri5]

flem1 wrote...

OP is a disgusting and deluded fool. The lock can't come fast enough.

Nice counterpoint to the OP's long detailed arguments.

[SkullandBonesmember]

Jae Onasi wrote...

Martin Sheen forgets that NO American politician can ever keep his/her mouth shut, so it would be impossible for the gov't to do this.
This is my take on it:
Was the Death Star Attack an Inside Job? (along with the rest of the site)

Ahhhh, the irrational belief that with 9/11 being a self inflicted wound, somebody would have talked by now. Well, the Manhattan Project involved over 130000 people involved and even Vice President Truman didn't learn about it until he became President. In 1957 the US provoked and actively participated in a civil war in Indonesia that resulted in 40000 deaths. This illegal war was kept secret until 1995.
http://markcurtis.wo...onesia-1957-59/

How about some inconvenient facts that those debunking sites never acknowledge, or if they do, brush it off as "coincidence".

1)The government lied about the air quality of Ground Zero telling the public it was safe to breathe.
2)Prescott Bush financed Hitler.
3)Larry Silverstein claimed he gave the order to "pull it". Now he wants us to believe when he said "pull it" he meant get the firefighters away from WTC7. Now when the hell was the last you, or somebody you have overheard, refer to fellow human beings, and not just one human being, but multiple, PLURAL humans, as "it"?
4)Airline pilots with decades of experience saying there is no way Hani Hanjour could have successfully acomplished the maneuvers that the official report claims he did and what hit the towers were military drones? Are they all "insane"?
5)Operation Northwoods and Operation Mongoose
http://www.voltairen...ticle30117.html

6)60 passengers can't defend themselves against less than 10 terrorists?
7)Why did Bin Laden, if "so proud of his monsterous deed" deny any involvement and the FBI doesn't list 9/11 as one of his crimes and when pressed on this, say there's no hard evidence against him?
http://archives.cnn....nial/index.html
8)Why was the WTC privatized just before its destruction?
9)Evidence that survives the plane crash in Shanksville. Not too absurd at all. Oh, except for the fact it was in prestine condition. http://www.vaed.usco...on/PA00111.html
10)
11)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01nj0rbWVA0
Rosie was verbally abused for speaking out against 9/11 and fired. Lou Dobbs was verbally abused for speaking out about Obama not allowing the public to know what doctor delivered him and what hospital he was born at, and 'lo and behold, Lou Dobbs is fired. And he doesn't help he spoke about the New World Order often either.
12)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh0zidBf6PE
Was Norman Mineta "lying" for ***** and giggles or insane" because it's either that or he's telling the truth. There's no in between for thinking he saw Cheney "snap his neck around saying OF COURSE THE ORDERS STILL STAND, HAVE YOU HEARD ANYTHING TO THE CONTRARY?".
13)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3uFvOiTNz4
http://video.google....15767687186956# 16:58-19:44
Just 2 examples of first responders and workers talking about explosions before the planes struck and or explosion damage way below the point of impact of the plane.
14)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kG4yGICFsi8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8pvU1iyT3c
And on a lighter note, how to destroy a twoofer and Bush admitting responsibility.

[Seagloom]

Gotta agree with AntiChri5 on South Park's take. It was a hilarious episode.

As far as the topic of a cover-up itself is concerned, I'm not convinced. Putting aside everything else, I have to first believe the US government is both frequently competent and capable of hiding a secret. Considering how many scandals became public knowledge under the last administration, I can't accept something of 9/11's magnitude would ever be covered up successfully. Sooner or later someone would leak the truth, and that it hasn't happened yet after nearly a decade tells me there's no truth to leak.

Modifié par Seagloom, 23 février 2010 - 12:40 .

[Godak]

Question: If we wanted an excuse to invade Iraq and Afghanistan, wouldn't it have been easier for the CIA to make stuff up? Oh, right. They did.

[AntiChri5]

The idea that George W Shrub could pull this off without a hitch......i dont buy it. Im surprised the man could dress himself.

[darkshadow136]

Although I never like George W. Bush or any Politician for that matter. I have to say not only is he not intelligent enough to pull something like planning 9/11. But it also would have hurt him more than helped him since he is one of the rich. Taking down the Towers was a major helper in crippling our Economy, and as far as population control killing over 4,000 plus innocents is not a big number in the grand sceme of things if you are talking numbers in population.



If I was going to put forth a statement that would slam Bush but also all other Politicians it would be that the USA is now nothing more than a present day version of the Roman Empire in many ways. Much like the cause of the originals downfall the Senate and Congress of this Empire is greedy and corrupt like the Romans became. They are putting forth their own needs and desires over the good of the country.



The Roman Empire was the first Democracy, and it is quite ironic that our own country is falling prey to the same downfall that fell the Roman Empire. For those that want to point fingers it's not just one party or one man to blame it is all of them, since in these days for any politician to go up the ladder high enough to make any changes they end up corrupting their own-selves to get there.

[DarthCaine]

I also don't buy the official 9/11 story, but then again I'm not American so I don't give a damn

[AntiChri5]

Maviarab wrote...

I would say the majority of intelligent people do not believe it.

And AntiChri5......Bush...whats it got to do with him. The President doesnt run America...or are you really that naive?

I ask, whats the single biggest and most effective tool for keeping a countries population in order?

He would have been involved somewhere, or at the very least known about it. That may not be enough for anyone else to mess it up but lets not forget who this is.

Mind controll drugs in the water supply. That or religion.

I suspect the two may be related.

[Jae Onasi]

[quote]SkullandBonesmember wrote...


Ahhhh, the irrational belief that with 9/11 being a self inflicted wound, somebody would have talked by now. Well, the Manhattan Project involved over 130000 people involved and even Vice President Truman didn't learn about it until he became President. In 1957 the US provoked and actively participated in a civil war in Indonesia that resulted in 40000 deaths. This illegal war was kept secret until 1995.
http://markcurtis.wo...onesia-1957-59/ [/quote]
Yes, and the army supposedly kept secrets about deaths at Grenada, but I knew about it because a distant family member passed on info to the rest of the family that he'd processed the death paperwork.


[quote]
1)The government lied about the air quality of Ground Zero telling the public it was safe to breathe.[/quote]
Right, and anyone with half a brain could look at the air and know that it wasn't safe. I know a guy who actually worked search and rescue at Ground Zero. A lot of them wore masks because they knew it wasn't safe.
[quote]
2)Prescott Bush financed Hitler.[/quote]What does this have to do with 9/11?

[quote]3)Larry Silverstein claimed he gave the order to "pull it". Now he wants us to believe when he said "pull it" he meant get the firefighters away from WTC7. Now when the hell was the last you, or somebody you have overheard, refer to fellow human beings, and not just one human being, but multiple, PLURAL humans, as "it"?[/quote]
"It" could easily mean 'the rescue mission'. Also, have you NEVER made a mistake speaking, especially during a crisis? I'm in emergency situations a LOT, and people misspeak all the time. That's one of the reasons why I have people repeat things several times, to make sure that the panic they're experiencing hasn't shut down their thinking, which happens a LOT. And before you say 'he's a professional', guess what? We professionals get panicked, too. Just because we can surf the adrenaline wave better than most doesn't mean we don't wipe out now and then.

[quote]4)Airline pilots with decades of experience saying there is no way Hani Hanjour could have successfully acomplished the maneuvers that the official report claims he did and what hit the towers were military drones? Are they all "insane"?[/quote]
Hanjour had a commercial pilot's license. Obviously someone thought he had the skill at flying big planes in order to issue it to him. You don't get a commercial license without thousands of hours of flying time. Also, the WTC were BIG buildings. Not too hard to miss.

[quote]5)Operation Northwoods and Operation Mongoose
http://www.voltairen...ticle30117.html[/quote]Irrelevent to the discussion.
[quote]
[/quote]Ah, the infamous Barrett, who has tried to pass off a number of things as 'truth' when they are not.

[quote]6)60 passengers can't defend themselves against less than 10 terrorists?[/quote]They're armed, you're not. The passengers were also told that they (the terrorists) had bombs. What are you going to do? Keep in mind the mindset at the time was to let the terrorists do whatever they want when hijacking and cooperate absolutely, because they would use you as bargaining chips. The thought that they were about to get flown into the WTC was not on their minds. It wasn't until the passengers on Flight 93 learned from cell phone calls that 3 other hijacked planes had been flown into buildings that they realized this wasn't the typical hijacking effort, and they did then fight back.
[quote]

7)Why did Bin Laden, if "so proud of his monsterous deed" deny any involvement and the FBI doesn't list 9/11 as one of his crimes and when pressed on this, say there's no hard evidence against him?
http://archives.cnn....nial/index.html[/quote]
Your 2003 article is out of date. Bin Laden admitted to the attacks in 2004, and Khalid Sheikh Mohammed admitted to orchestrating the attack in 2007
[quote]8)Why was the WTC privatized just before its destruction?[/quote]
Because it's prime real estate, it would get NYC a lot more in taxes, and NYC was having money problems at the time?
[quote]
9)Evidence that survives the plane crash in Shanksville. Not too absurd at all. Oh, except for the fact it was in prestine condition. [/quote]Is there some reason why this is impossible? We found stuff that survived the Columbia explosion, and the shuttle broke apart at a much higher altitude.
[quote]10)[/quote]And is there some reason why this is significant? Keep in mind that things like fireworks get transported in trucks all the time, and it was extremely difficult to get information in and out of NYC and DC the first few days. It took me 3 days to get through the phone lines to find out if my Aunt and Uncle were OK. The media got some things wrong in reporting just because they didn't have all the info. Also, there's no reason for me to believe that the youtube has not been doctored in some way.

[quote]11)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01nj0rbWVA0
Rosie was verbally abused for speaking out against 9/11 and fired. Lou Dobbs was verbally abused for speaking out about Obama not allowing the public to know what doctor delivered him and what hospital he was born at, and 'lo and behold, Lou Dobbs is fired. And he doesn't help he spoke about the New World Order often either.[/quote]I'm supposed to believe a youtube video by someone who doesn't even know that apostrophes denote possession and not plurality? Right. Find me something legitimate, please.

[quote]12)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh0zidBf6PE
Was Norman Mineta "lying" for ***** and giggles or insane" because it's either that or he's telling the truth. There's no in between for thinking he saw Cheney "snap his neck around saying OF COURSE THE ORDERS STILL STAND, HAVE YOU HEARD ANYTHING TO THE CONTRARY?".[/quote]Mineta also said the fighters were '10 minutes away' and that at the same time, Flight 77 was only 10 miles away from the Pentagon. Since planes fly Really Fast, there was no way for the fighters to intercept Flight 77 in time to prevent the crash. In addition, the youtube video takes apart the C-span video and injects its own commentary in. Again, it's not possible to know what's been done to this video. The C-span video by itself would be far better documentation.
[quote]13)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3uFvOiTNz4
http://video.google....15767687186956# 16:58-19:44
Just 2 examples of first responders and workers talking about explosions before the planes struck and or explosion damage way below the point of impact of the plane.[/quote] Right. I'm supposed to believe youtube stuff. There were 2 large planes, fully loaded with fuel, crashing into the buildings. Isn't it possible that this MIGHT have caused some major structural damage that affected the foundation enough for it to make SOME kind of noise? Furthermore, stuff was falling OFF the buildings onto the ground below. Don't you think that made a little bit of noise, too?