121 réponses à ce sujet

[Collider]

Timmibal wrote...
Did anyone else feel like the romance was too easy in ME2?

Romances were never hard to begin with. Unless you think rotating the right thumb stick to the paragon option is hard.

[spacehamsterZH]

It's all well and good that RPG characters don't have to be asexual robots anymore, but reading these forums I sometimes get the feeling that as soon as this is introduced as a gameplay element, it overshadows everything else for some people. I like it fine as a bit of added spice to give depth and believability to things, but I'm mainly here to kill bad guys and save the galaxy, k thx. With all the five thousand page Tali drool threads here, I sometimes worry that if Bioware listen to their fans too much, they'll turn ME3 into a space dating simulator occasionally interrupted by combat.

[OneBadAssMother]

Aye, I made a post about it last page - not for Bioware to go overboard with it, nor for Bioware to shy away from tasteful artistry cause because of some BS news channel.



I do not know whether to take the Tali drool threads seriously however, spacehamster, is it really THAT bad in those fan groups? =/

[spacehamsterZH]

OneBadAssMother wrote...

I do not know whether to take the Tali drool threads seriously however, spacehamster, is it really THAT bad in those fan groups? =/

I don't know, and I have no intention of finding out. *cough*

[OneBadAssMother]

LOL!!!

[R0cket Surge0n]

ivan.inverse wrote...

Was the other thread shut down?

Anyway, bring back teh sidebewb pl0x. knthx.

I demand Tali sideboob in ME3!

[Grizzly46]

spacehamsterZH wrote...

It's all well and good that RPG characters don't have to be asexual robots anymore, but reading these forums I sometimes get the feeling that as soon as this is introduced as a gameplay element, it overshadows everything else for some people. I like it fine as a bit of added spice to give depth and believability to things, but I'm mainly here to kill bad guys and save the galaxy, k thx. With all the five thousand page Tali drool threads here, I sometimes worry that if Bioware listen to their fans too much, they'll turn ME3 into a space dating simulator occasionally interrupted by combat.

QFT. I got a lot of flak for speaking my mind against a romance pack (when there are alot of other things that could be improved and implemented) but nevermind that. As a sidenote, I'd like to add that the only game which has had a romance worth pursuing and worth the effort, was Baldurs Gate II. It was hard to land the girl of your choice, it took a lot of time and their personalities were much better defined and developed than in ME (especially ME1).

R0cket Surge0n wrote...
I demand Tali sideboob in ME3!

Just for you:

[Mass_Effect1-3_4_LIFE]

spacehamsterZH wrote...

It's all well and good that RPG characters don't have to be asexual robots anymore, but reading these forums I sometimes get the feeling that as soon as this is introduced as a gameplay element, it overshadows everything else for some people. I like it fine as a bit of added spice to give depth and believability to things, but I'm mainly here to kill bad guys and save the galaxy, k thx. With all the five thousand page Tali drool threads here, I sometimes worry that if Bioware listen to their fans too much, they'll turn ME3 into a space dating simulator occasionally interrupted by combat.

if it was an RPG and tali is in it, i wouldnt mind ;D i hope Tali is a squadmate in mE3:innocent:

[sw33ts]

SkullandBonesmember wrote...

Actually, Stanley himself admits it:

Mr. Woo posted:

The last five pages (at least) are full of bickering, personal
attacks, and politics. This topic gets a brief moratorium until people
can learn to a) debate like civil, mature individuals, and not feed
the trolls.

As always, I'm available for questions and concerns, but come on,
people. You seemed to have a great community and discussion going on in
here, supporting each other, bringing up some good points. And you let
one person with an opposing view destroy the thread? Take a breather,
then let me know when y'all think you can start a new thread without
the hate against haters. Thank you.

Hey, that looks like the Same-Sex Romance comment from the Woomesiter.  Interesting.

[RyrineaNara]

OneBadAssMother wrote...

The serious idiocy and misrepresentation and lies of the Fox News report was extremely shocking. Have you folks seen it? I've never seen such BS in the media in my life until this.



If anything, 100% of people who played Mass Effect, KNEW THE TRUTH. Even Cooper Lawrence herself retracked her misinformed views, however that didn't stop fans from rating her book 1/5 stars on Amazon. Nonetheless... in the end. This world is f--king BS.

What do you expect? It is Fox new after all they love telling lies .


Yeah, I want teastfuly done  sex scenes nothing too grapic. For me, I thought that ME1 handly the scenes were very well done. I

Modifié par RyrineaNara, 22 mars 2010 - 01:30 .

[SimonTheFrog]

sw33ts wrote...

SkullandBonesmember wrote...

Actually, Stanley himself admits it:

Mr. Woo posted:

The last five pages (at least) are full of bickering, personal
attacks, and politics. This topic gets a brief moratorium until people
can learn to a) debate like civil, mature individuals, and not feed
the trolls.

As always, I'm available for questions and concerns, but come on,
people. You seemed to have a great community and discussion going on in
here, supporting each other, bringing up some good points. And you let
one person with an opposing view destroy the thread? Take a breather,
then let me know when y'all think you can start a new thread without
the hate against haters. Thank you.

Hey, that looks like the Same-Sex Romance comment from the Woomesiter.  Interesting.

It is, word for word. At least iirc

[Tazzmission]

:sigh: even though i think its pointless to show nudity in a simulated game but if its to make the romance scene believable and realistic im for it. if bioware wants to go down that route just go back to the me1 romance because it wont get a lot of controversy. a butt shots 1 thing but boobs is a whole nother story.

[Darkstar87uk]

No way clothed intercourse is so much hotter.

[SOULdi3r]

i liked the more innocent style that Bioware took with ME2, meaningless sex is dumb and i only romanced Tali in ME2 because of the change (and quite a shock from kelly though, was not expecting that)

[LightagainstBlight]

Murmillos wrote...

This thread is off to a great start...

The large point about the subject, even with the mention of nudity and sex, is not the requirement of what most people wanted, but that the the accumulation of your ME2 LI just ends in such a unsatisfactory and in some cases, in a creepy way.

For ME2 being "emotionally engaging" and being all about connecting with your squad mates, then how come ME2 basically runs and screams away from and ignores the the subject - turning the whole "situation" into a creepy joke.

We don't need side tittes, we don't want a "digital simulated sex scene".. what we do want is something that gives and rewards a positive connection between two people in a meaning full and tasteful way.

ME1 did it right, then got gun shy over one little news report, and now EA has forced Bioware to treat the subject of a "sexual-relationship" much like the a 14 year old would envision the thought of their own parents having sex. Cheesy, creepy and non existent.

I agree.
I think ME1 was done correctly and tastefully (romanced Ashley) and, it was not so different than if I had been watching a movie (maybe even done better than some movies).
Not sure I understand what the huge uproar was about ME1 as you can go to a PG-13 or R movie and see way more "softporn". ME1 was rated "mature" after all. How unfortunate that people don't read before buying. Also, if you don't want to see a love scene, don't pursue a love interest.
If people really want to be upset, try watching "Barbarella", which is rated G, where there is nudity about 75% of the movie with sex, drugs and violence throughout it. That's just one example.

[Tazzmission]

LightagainstBlight wrote...

Murmillos wrote...

This thread is off to a great start...

The large point about the subject, even with the mention of nudity and sex, is not the requirement of what most people wanted, but that the the accumulation of your ME2 LI just ends in such a unsatisfactory and in some cases, in a creepy way.

For ME2 being "emotionally engaging" and being all about connecting with your squad mates, then how come ME2 basically runs and screams away from and ignores the the subject - turning the whole "situation" into a creepy joke.

We don't need side tittes, we don't want a "digital simulated sex scene".. what we do want is something that gives and rewards a positive connection between two people in a meaning full and tasteful way.

ME1 did it right, then got gun shy over one little news report, and now EA has forced Bioware to treat the subject of a "sexual-relationship" much like the a 14 year old would envision the thought of their own parents having sex. Cheesy, creepy and non existent.

I agree.
I think ME1 was done correctly and tastefully (romanced Ashley) and, it was not so different than if I had been watching a movie (maybe even done better than some movies).
Not sure I understand what the huge uproar was about ME1 as you can go to a PG-13 or R movie and see way more "softporn". ME1 was rated "mature" after all. How unfortunate that people don't read before buying. Also, if you don't want to see a love scene, don't pursue a love interest.
If people really want to be upset, try watching "Barbarella", which is rated G, where there is nudity about 75% of the movie with sex, drugs and violence throughout it. That's just one example.

the uproar steamed from religious groups and they even admited on tv the game was rated m but still was  in a **** mode. if the scene showed the genital area than id agree with them but  all it was was an ass shot thats all and the sadest truth is if it was a naked male  in that scene i dont think any of those groups would cry and moan and im just being honest here

[LightagainstBlight]

Tazzmission wrote...

LightagainstBlight wrote...

Murmillos wrote...

This thread is off to a great start...

The large point about the subject, even with the mention of nudity and sex, is not the requirement of what most people wanted, but that the the accumulation of your ME2 LI just ends in such a unsatisfactory and in some cases, in a creepy way.

For ME2 being "emotionally engaging" and being all about connecting with your squad mates, then how come ME2 basically runs and screams away from and ignores the the subject - turning the whole "situation" into a creepy joke.

We don't need side tittes, we don't want a "digital simulated sex scene".. what we do want is something that gives and rewards a positive connection between two people in a meaning full and tasteful way.

ME1 did it right, then got gun shy over one little news report, and now EA has forced Bioware to treat the subject of a "sexual-relationship" much like the a 14 year old would envision the thought of their own parents having sex. Cheesy, creepy and non existent.

I agree.
I think ME1 was done correctly and tastefully (romanced Ashley) and, it was not so different than if I had been watching a movie (maybe even done better than some movies).
Not sure I understand what the huge uproar was about ME1 as you can go to a PG-13 or R movie and see way more "softporn". ME1 was rated "mature" after all. How unfortunate that people don't read before buying. Also, if you don't want to see a love scene, don't pursue a love interest.
If people really want to be upset, try watching "Barbarella", which is rated G, where there is nudity about 75% of the movie with sex, drugs and violence throughout it. That's just one example.

the uproar steamed from religious groups and they even admited on tv the game was rated m but still was  in a **** mode. if the scene showed the genital area than id agree with them but  all it was was an ass shot thats all and the sadest truth is if it was a naked male  in that scene i dont think any of those groups would cry and moan and im just being honest here

Just watched the Fox "News" segment and just could do nothing but shake my head. How can any intelligent person make an argument about a topic they, clearly stated, knew nothing about. Ignorance is clearly not bliss.

[LightagainstBlight]

Collider wrote...

Timmibal wrote...
Did anyone else feel like the romance was too easy in ME2?

Romances were never hard to begin with. Unless you think rotating the right thumb stick to the paragon option is hard.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think I understand about the ease of romancing in ME2. It's not about just click on some lines or "rotating the right thumb stick" (if you are playing Xbox). In comparison to other other games (ie. BG II, ME1 and DA:O) it was very easy to move the LI to the end point. It was 3 or 4 lines of dialog and you were there. You didn't have to work up to it or have a tough choice once you decided who you wanted.
I did find it very easy in that aspect.

[Collider]

LightagainstBlight wrote...

Collider wrote...

Timmibal wrote...
Did anyone else feel like the romance was too easy in ME2?

Romances were never hard to begin with. Unless you think rotating the right thumb stick to the paragon option is hard.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think I understand about the ease of romancing in ME2. It's not about just click on some lines or "rotating the right thumb stick" (if you are playing Xbox). In comparison to other other games (ie. BG II, ME1 and DA:O) it was very easy to move the LI to the end point. It was 3 or 4 lines of dialog and you were there. You didn't have to work up to it or have a tough choice once you decided who you wanted.
I did find it very easy in that aspect.

It quite literally rotating the right thumb stick to paragon options, or moving your mouse to paragon options. There is no trick to it, and you don't need to think about it. ME2 simply gave us an easier way to leave relationships, but at it's core, ME1 and ME2 relationships are choosing the paragon option. There's no tricky manuevering and a combination of paragon/neutral/renegade. Just paragon.

[LightagainstBlight]

To me it made sense to chose paragon if you wanted to move the relationship forward. I mean, really, do you think someone is going to want to be with you if you are an a** to them? Either way, the way the relationship progression is in ME2 was a bit easy no matter how you slice it.

Modifié par LightagainstBlight, 22 mars 2010 - 04:17 .

[Collider]

LightagainstBlight wrote...

To me it made sense to chose paragon if you wanted to move the relationship forward. I mean, really, do you think someone is going to want to be with you if you are an a** to them? Either way, the way the relationship progression is in ME2 was a bit easy no matter how you slice it.

Some people like it if you're assertive and opinionated. Someone can like someone else saying "That criminal needs to get a bullet in the face" or "people are so hard on criminals," for example. I agree that ME2 romances are easy but so are ME1 romances. It basically amounts as we said to choosing the paragon option all the time.

[Timmibal]

It quite literally rotating the right thumb stick to paragon options, or moving your mouse to paragon options.

But it wasn't always the case. For instance. If you had 'started' a relationship with, lets say Miranda for the sake of argument (Since her loyalty mission USUALLY comes first and I think loyalty's a prerequesite to open the LI dialog paths), and then went down to talk to Tali/Jack later, when they 'Hit on' you, the only way to achieve Paragon points and not get her 'pissed off' at you (all dialogue closed, yet somehow not affecting loyalty, go figure) was to pick (get this), the RENEGADE option, which usually read something like 'Not Interested'.



I picked this with Tali, expecting her to get her cute little heart broken, but instead Shep just gently friend-zones her without embarassing her. Ditto Jack.



Whereas if you pick the nicer-looking neutral options, you get the crazy 'OMGUSAIDULOVEDME!' reaction, at which point you have to 'break up' with her, and you get the pissed off I'm not talking to you no more reaction forever afterwards.

Romances were never hard to begin with.

No, but ME1 didn't throw them at you so blatantly. As I said, it seemed like they were using the LIs as a selling point in ME2 rather than a story feature, and it sort of made a bollocks of the whole thing.



Plus, a love triangle is much easier to code and script than a love quad or pent-angle which is what you were faced with in ME2. Why make every character boneable? Especially Garrus and Thane, who should have absolutely NO interest in human shep on a romantic level, and Tali, who, as adorable as she is, not only has the immunity thing but a completely different protein structure which risks being poisoned by fluid transfer from a human. (If I understood Mordrin's ramblings correctly.)



Tying this back into the topic. It sort of demonstrates how stuff can just drop into jarring disharmony when sex/romance/nudity is used as a selling point rather than being a driving device for the plot.

[Collider]

Timmibal wrote...
No, but ME1 didn't throw them at you so blatantly.

Doesn't matter. Choose the paragon option every time and you'll get the romance. In fact, with Ashley at least, it's hard not to get in a relationship with her if you choose the paragon options. Eventually you get locked in even without expressing obvious romantic interest.

As I said, it seemed like they were using the LIs as a selling point in ME2 rather than a story feature, and it sort of made a bollocks of the whole thing.

Especially Garrus and Thane, who should have absolutely NO interest in human shep on a romantic level,

Maybe because female players wanted Garrus? Maybe because Bioware wanted to make a malien romance interest for female players from the ground up? These are their characters, not yours. Turians and Drell are both humanoid, and both Garrus and Thane have expressed interest in the females of their species, so why would it be a stretch for them to like femshep?

and Tali, who, as adorable as she is, not only has the immunity thing but a completely different protein structure which risks being poisoned by fluid transfer from a human. (If I understood Mordrin's ramblings correctly.

Actually, Mordin doesn't talk about fluid transfer about Tali IIRC. He talks about that with Garrus, but not Tali. about tali, he tells Shepard and Tali to self sterilize, that's about it.

So far as her being a romance interest to begin with
a) fans wanted it.
It's bioware's character.
c) She makes a point about it being dangerous anyway.

[Grizzly46]

Timmibal wrote...

It quite literally rotating the right thumb stick to paragon options, or moving your mouse to paragon options.

But it wasn't always the case. For instance. If you had 'started' a relationship with, lets say Miranda for the sake of argument (Since her loyalty mission USUALLY comes first and I think loyalty's a prerequesite to open the LI dialog paths), and then went down to talk to Tali/Jack later, when they 'Hit on' you, the only way to achieve Paragon points and not get her 'pissed off' at you (all dialogue closed, yet somehow not affecting loyalty, go figure) was to pick (get this), the RENEGADE option, which usually read something like 'Not Interested'.

I picked this with Tali, expecting her to get her cute little heart broken, but instead Shep just gently friend-zones her without embarassing her. Ditto Jack.

Whereas if you pick the nicer-looking neutral options, you get the crazy 'OMGUSAIDULOVEDME!' reaction, at which point you have to 'break up' with her, and you get the pissed off I'm not talking to you no more reaction forever afterwards.

Which was in itself quite odd, but it I'd say thats only a testament to how clumsy the entire system is. Apart from that: Fully agree with every single word.

Romances were never hard to begin with.

No, but ME1 didn't throw them at you so blatantly. As I said, it seemed like they were using the LIs as a selling point in ME2 rather than a story feature, and it sort of made a bollocks of the whole thing.

Sorry, but, 'didn't throw them at you'? After two chats with Liara she asks if there is something going on between you. The  Ashley romance is admittedly better (even if I never personally liked her), but also clumsily done - during one chat with her she brings up her grandfather and his role oion Shanxi - and she ends it with the question of if you are still interested. What? How did that come into the picture? Have I ever earlier given any signs of having been interested? Nope. But of the three replies given, not one allows you to say 'hell no, I'm not interested in a loser's grand daughter'.

Which sucks.

Plus, a love triangle is much easier to code and script than a love quad or pent-angle which is what you were faced with in ME2. Why make every character boneable? Especially Garrus and Thane, who should have absolutely NO interest in human shep on a romantic level, and Tali, who, as adorable as she is, not only has the immunity thing but a completely different protein structure which risks being poisoned by fluid transfer from a human. (If I understood Mordrin's ramblings correctly.)

Absolutely. The reason humans might find asari attractive is because of their very human features - body shape and facial structure that is. Both turians and quarians are clearly differently built than humans and therefore, should not be attractive to each other. But on the other hand there are real life people who are turned on by horses...

Tying this back into the topic. It sort of demonstrates how stuff can just drop into jarring disharmony when sex/romance/nudity is used as a selling point rather than being a driving device for the plot.

Eloquently put, thank you. Try drop that in one of all the millions of romance threads though...