226 réponses à ce sujet

[T-Kay]

BellaStrega wrote...

All Dead wrote...

T-Kay wrote...
Especially in ME2 the female Shepard is stuck with ugly aliens and a black dude. I'm no racist, but that doesn't work for me.

Of course you're not.

I know,right? "I'm no racist, but I'm about to say something racist anyway!"

you're right every man and woman on the planet wants to bed a black man. And if not that, any alien will suffice.

Modifié par T-Kay, 27 février 2010 - 12:59 .

[BattleMageMarian]

I'm femle and almost always play male characters; been playing RPGs for years. I've read somewhere on this board about some males preferring to look at female characters and I suppose the same works for me.

Anyway I very much enjoy Mark Meers Shepard and from what I've heard of the female VA, would enjoy a female version if I were so inclined. They both seem to do a good job

[superimposed]

Llandaryn wrote...

T-Kay wrote...

 Especially in ME2 the female Shepard is stuck with ugly aliens and a black dude. I'm no racist, but that doesn't work for me. I tend to go for the female - female relationship.

Fortunately, Bioware catered to the overwhelming support most women gamers showed for alien romances for femSheps in ME2, as opposed to what males playing femSheps wanted, which was lesbian sex scenes.

^ This ^

For me, I like 'open romance' where every LI is available to the main character irrespective of gender (and in some cases race/origin). I think different characteristics should make some LI's harder than others, and some should close off according to, say alignment, but not simply to gender.

[superimposed]

Llandaryn wrote...

T-Kay wrote...

 Especially in ME2 the female Shepard is stuck with ugly aliens and a black dude. I'm no racist, but that doesn't work for me. I tend to go for the female - female relationship.

Fortunately, Bioware catered to the overwhelming support most women gamers showed for alien romances for femSheps in ME2, as opposed to what males playing femSheps wanted, which was lesbian sex scenes.

^ This ^

For me, I like 'open romance' where every LI is available to the main character irrespective of gender (and in some cases race/origin). I think different characteristics should make some LI's harder than others, and some should close off according to, say alignment, but not simply to gender.

[Urazz]

Honestly, I think Meer is better at being the badass/renegade options than Hale. Hale sounds better at being paragon. Meer improved in being paragon in ME2 as well but still isn't that good at it.

Honestly, I think it's a matter of who makes the better default voice for customization characters.  Meer doesn't do that well in my opinion and I always see his voice going to the default male Shepard (probably due to the fact that they market the default male shepard and I'm used to associating meer's voice with him).  Hale's voice also works better for the various custom females made.

Modifié par Urazz, 27 février 2010 - 02:22 .

[Cyberfrog81]

I like both, and I'm not going to choose. In some scenes I think Meer's acting is better, in other scenes Hale's. It's not a problem, it's just how it's going to be.



Many people bring up custom characters (often male Shepards) not working for them. You might just need a bit more time to adjust. I know I takes a few missions for me.

[BellaStrega]

Man, not worth it.

Modifié par BellaStrega, 27 février 2010 - 03:07 .

[Maria13]

I'm female and I play a femshep. I like Jennifer's drawl just fine.

[mxw10000]

At first, I thought that Hale's VO work was much better. But after playing as a male Shep, I think that Mark's VO has improved greatly since ME1. I didn't really care much for the female shep vo in the first game, but has greatly improved with the second game.

I think that most of the difference in opinion for male vs female in this game stems from the differnt crew interactions that you can have, and not so much for the vo work itself.



Just my op tho.

[RighteousRage]

I could probably deliver lines more naturally while taking a dump than Jennifer Hale in a soundbooth, but I suppose it's not too bad

[BellaStrega]

RighteousRage wrote...

I could probably deliver lines more naturally while taking a dump than Jennifer Hale in a soundbooth, but I suppose it's not too bad

No, not really.

[RighteousRage]

BellaStrega wrote...

RighteousRage wrote...

I could probably deliver lines more naturally while taking a dump than Jennifer Hale in a soundbooth, but I suppose it's not too bad

No, not really.

These are video game and cartoon characters, Bella

[LiquidGrape]

RighteousRage wrote...

BellaStrega wrote...

RighteousRage wrote...

I could probably deliver lines more naturally while taking a dump than Jennifer Hale in a soundbooth, but I suppose it's not too bad

No, not really.

These are video game and cartoon characters, Bella

And it take some real range for a voice actor to infuse such credibility into that wide a range of characters.
I honestly cannot even begin to comprehend the critique aimed at her work in the series.

Modifié par LiquidGrape, 27 février 2010 - 03:24 .

[Llandaryn]

T-Kay wrote...

BellaStrega wrote...

All Dead wrote...

T-Kay wrote...
Especially in ME2 the female Shepard is stuck with ugly aliens and a black dude. I'm no racist, but that doesn't work for me.

Of course you're not.

I know,right? "I'm no racist, but I'm about to say something racist anyway!"

you're right every man and woman on the planet wants to bed a black man. And if not that, any alien will suffice.

The reason why people have pulled you up on the racism thing is because you went out of your way to state that you're not a racist, and then said that a black person doesn't do anything for you. Which in itself is fine -- not being attracted to black people doesn't make you a racist, it just means that  you have a clear indication about what floats your boat.

What seemed odd about your statement, and made people pick up on it, was the fact that if you're a heterosexual guy, it would most likely be Jacob's gender, and not his skin colour, that would make you think twice about any relationship with him, even playing as a female character. You made it sound as if Jacob's skin colour was a bigger deterrent to romance than his gender.

That said, you're completely wrong about "any alien will suffice". Both Garrus and Thane were portrayed with far more human-like qualities than Jacob. If anything, Jacob is designed to be a pretty face on a buff body, but his character is often distant and wooden. Nothing about him says "I have hidden depths" or "you might want to get to know me better". When he talks about his time in the military, and with Cerberus, and later talks about his father, his voice often lacks emotion, and sometimes it feels like his VA is reading lines from a script. In other words, "any human will do".

On the other hand, Thane and Garrus have had extensive work done on their characters, including histories that are designed to draw empathy and sympathy from those listening to them. Both have back-stories that are dark at times, and are obviously painful/difficult to recall. Both characters are three-dimensional, whereas Jacob is at best two-dimentional.

It's the same argument when discussing Tali vs Miranda. Although Miranda's VA is good, the character lacks the same depth as Tali, which is why many people prefer her. When Tali's VA delivers the lines, you can hear the emotion in her voice, and you develop empathy for the character. It's this empathy that makes us love anti-heroes for their often villainous acts. Plus, people like a challenge. There's more really much that's challenging about Jacob or Miranda's character, compared to, say Thane or Jack.

[Gabey5]

i play both you...little thing called replayability both hale and meer have their weakpoints

ie male is very montone
female is very raspy

Modifié par Gabey5, 27 février 2010 - 03:41 .

[Llandaryn]

BellaStrega wrote...

RighteousRage wrote...

I
could probably deliver lines more naturally while taking a dump than
Jennifer Hale in a soundbooth, but I suppose it's not too bad

No, not really.

Awesome. Deionarra is like... my second favourite voice in a computer game, right behind SHODAN.

Didn't know Hale did Grace too.

[mopotter]

I like Jacob a lot. However I haven't romanced him yet, becuase he seems so uncomfortable with my female Shepard. That first "I want to talk about You" drives me nuts and when he says it's a little soon I'm just embarrassed for her. Plus there is the whole past with Miranda thing, I'm not sure he's over it.



I've tried twice and both time I end up saying something about backing off if he wants and that's it. After that we are semi friends. I would have much preferred a chance to start out with "just checking on my crew" in the beginning and a "I want to talk about YOU" later.



As far as the voice acting goes I also like them both. I'm currently playing my Alex Shepard and I liked very much his voice acting on the flotilla. I got the idea of sincerity when he comforted Tali and thought Mark did a great job. I do find him a little monotone in places, but I've met people who are worse and on the hole I like him. .Yes I love Jennifer Hale.

[tmp7704]

T-Kay wrote...

you're right every man and woman on the planet wants to bed a black man. And if not that, any alien will suffice.

The point is, if you base the preference for having someone in the bed (or not) on nothing else but the colour of skin of that person, then it is racist attitude. So no matter how many times you say you're not, you act like one.

Modifié par tmp7704, 27 février 2010 - 03:47 .

[Ygolnac]

since i get really involved in the characters i play in rpgs, i couldn't play a female becouse i would not feel as if it were me in the action.



This being said, in my italian version of ME2, italian male shep voice is maybe the worse of all voice acting in the game. He always sounds very detached and absent, even in the most frantic situatiios. I accepted that supposing my shep is traumatized after being DEAD for 2 years.



It's a pity that people that can understand english like me, cannot play the game in english (haven't found language option, maybe i missed it) since the original voice acting is always better. I prefear games where they leave the original voice acting and put italian subtitles, like DA:O.

[Llandaryn]

tmp7704 wrote...

T-Kay wrote...

you're right every man and woman on the planet wants to bed a black man. And if not that, any alien will suffice.

The point is, if you base the preference for having someone in the bed (or not) on nothing else but the colour of skin of that person, then it is racist attitude. So no matter how many times you say you're not, you act like one.

I disagree. If I was to say "people with brown eyes don't do anything for me" or "people with blond hair don't do anything for me", then that is not discrimination, it is simply my own personal preference. If T-Kay doesn't find black people romantically/physically attractive, then that's not racism, it's just his own preference.

If he believed that he was superior to black people, or believed that black people didn't deserve the same rights as a white person, then yeah, he'd be racist. No matter how many times I try to eat them, I can't eat prunes -- even the smell of them makes me want to retch, so I don't even bother trying to eat them.

Granted, I understand that preference between food and people is two completely different cups of tea. (Most) people have a personality, and just because you're not attracted to their looks doesn't mean you can't be attracted to their personality. But not being willing to overlook a physical aspect in favour of personal aspects... that's more of a bias/prejudice or a sign of shallowness or distaste, than out-right racism.

[tmp7704]

Llandaryn wrote...

I disagree. If I was to say "people with brown eyes don't do anything for me" or "people with blond hair don't do anything for me", then that is not discrimination, it is simply my own personal preference. If T-Kay doesn't find black people romantically/physically attractive, then that's not racism, it's just his own preference.

I considered that actually, but ultimately how many people is out there who would absolutely refuse to have sex with a person with certain hair or eye colour no matter what any other physical and/or mental features that person would possess? It's one thing if a feature doesn't do anything positive for you, but quite another when it has such negative impact on you it overrides everything else --including universal attraction cues-- as that implies some psychological hang up.

[SimonTheFrog]

Although i think that this thread lacks a certain.... point... because you simply can't compare the two voices, i wanna throw in my opinion



I usually play the femShep and i really like 95% of the lines. Sometimes i'd wish that the dialogs under fire would reflect the stress a bit more. Like when Shep is talking to Reegar and the Geth are firing at them. Reegar sounds really awesome and stressed, Shep does not... There are other situations too where i thought that a bit more panic or stress would have been adequate. But maybe there's a reason for the generally rather sterile emotion in the voice. Something like Shepard being "in control" all the time or too emotional voices can be annoying or whatever. It's not that bad, really, just something i'd handle differently if i were in charge

I agree that femSheps lines with Jacob are cringeworthy, especially if you don't date him at all.

Her lines with Tali are very warm and motherly, same with Miranda on her loyalty mission. I like that, even if it's actually a military operation and the commander should not get too close like this to people (s)he's about to throw at the enemy, but damn, I like to get close to the squadmates that i care for



So, about the maleShep. I just started my first career, just to be able to finally date the only LI that i care fore (I was really really shocked and annoyed when i found out that bioware didn't let me date that LI as femShep... i mean, i have played sooo many rpg's where the game didn't even "know" what gender i picked, or at least hardly cared. But this seems to be the "prize" for high-budget production. It's not always a good thing hehe anyway). After some hours i got a bit used to his voice. I don't see much difference between ME1 and ME2, i only see that they improved the facial animations a lot, which helps the dialogs. But if femShep is "cool" under pressure, than maleShep is cold... I like his voice and it's ok when gathers information and such. But everything that is uttered on the battlefield is just not believable ("we...have... been... spotted..."). Not sure if there is a directing problem or if the actor didn't imagine the situation vividly enough, but it just doesn't fit the circumstances at all. I wonder if he plays the game Anyway, as i said, generally i like the voice and mostly it's nice listing to him.



Apart from the voices, playing maleShep the first time makes me realize that femShep is not so well implemented as the male one. The game has definitely been written for the guy first and then the girl has been added. Many NPC's react much more natural to the maleShep and stuff like Gianna etc. is much more interesting for the maleShep. The LI's, Liara, Kelly and everything seem to be male centered as well.

FemShep is not bad... not at all... i just can't help noticing that it occasionally feels forced to play a woman in this game.

[BattleVisor]

Joanna Dark > Fem Shep

[Llandaryn]

tmp7704 wrote...

Llandaryn wrote...

I disagree. If I was to say "people with brown eyes don't do anything for me" or "people with blond hair don't do anything for me", then that is not discrimination, it is simply my own personal preference. If T-Kay doesn't find black people romantically/physically attractive, then that's not racism, it's just his own preference.

I considered that actually, but ultimately how many people is out there who would absolutely refuse to have sex with a person with certain hair or eye colour no matter what any other physical and/or mental features that person would possess? It's one thing if a feature doesn't do anything positive for you, but quite another when it has such negative impact on you it overrides everything else --including universal attraction cues-- as that implies some psychological hang up.

True enough, I suppose. I still wouldn't go so far as to call it out-right racism, though. I suppose it's a fine line (or a very grey area a mile wide) between acceptance and aversion. Then again, we all see things differently -- I grew up watching Kirk dry-hump everything from green space chicks to his chair. When he and Uhurua kissed, it was the first ever inter-racial kiss on film/television, and it caused a massive stir. I like to think that sci-fi crosses boundaries like that, and crosses them well. Sci-fi has always pushed us forward, from Jules Verne's ideas and stories that at the time seemed so wildly fantastic but now seem so tame and plausible, right through to Star Trek's inter-racial and inter-species relations. I do think it's sad that in a game where a character can romance aliens, some people are still hung up over human skin colour. How many people would be loathe to romance Kelly, for example, if she was african-american, or asian, or middle-eastern?

Anyway, how did we even get from FemShep/MaleShep to inter-species romance? If Godwin's law holds true, we should be discussing evil-germans in another few pages...