335 réponses à ce sujet

[thisisme8]

Alright, here you have it:  ME2 - Insanity Shockwave - The Lazy Vanguard.

Shockwave works on Insanity, who knew?


Note:  Believe it or not, that build was probably the best Vanguard build I've used to date - and definitely the funnest.
Edit: Don't expect it to be groundbreaking or anything though...

Modifié par thisisme8, 20 février 2011 - 07:39 .

[Tony Gunslinger]

Ha ha, nice that you whipped out the Firestorm to make things interesting. My vanguard has wide shockwave but i rarely used it except on the reaper IFF or on Samara's RM where there's lots of exploding crates and boxes. It's not the most "effective" power but definately makes you look badass when you use it right.

[Malanthor]

Havent played me2 for like a year and a half and was thinking id do a run or two, just played through me1 to make me an importable character (a vanguard) and are going to play vanguard in me2 aswell: with that said i have two builds in mind and if you could comment on them i would appreciate it.

1:
Heavy charge 4
Champion 4
inferno ammo 4
group cryo ammo 4
area reave 4

or

2:
shockwave 2
pull field 4
stasis 1
incendiary ammo 3
heavy charge 4
group cryo ammo 4
champion 4

First build has a little stronger ammo power for himself, +20% ammo damage and aoe on the scare effect, and has reave while second has aoe pull for cc and to inititate warp explosion (thane and miranda both has warp) and stasis 1 for exploiting the ragdoll bonus damage for all its worth.

Going to play one of the difficulties after normal, havent decided yet, hardcore probably.
How do these look and what if anything would you change?

[Alamar2078]

Self Controll wrote...

Havent played me2 for like a year and a half and was thinking id do a run or two, just played through me1 to make me an importable character (a vanguard) and are going to play vanguard in me2 aswell: with that said i have two builds in mind and if you could comment on them i would appreciate it.

1:
Heavy charge 4
Champion 4
inferno ammo 4
group cryo ammo 4
area reave 4

or

2:
shockwave 2
pull field 4
stasis 1
incendiary ammo 3
heavy charge 4
group cryo ammo 4
champion 4

First build has a little stronger ammo power for himself, +20% ammo damage and aoe on the scare effect, and has reave while second has aoe pull for cc and to inititate warp explosion (thane and miranda both has warp) and stasis 1 for exploiting the ragdoll bonus damage for all its worth.

Going to play one of the difficulties after normal, havent decided yet, hardcore probably.
How do these look and what if anything would you change?

I'm currently running your "build 1" in Insanity NG+.  It was tough going early on but once I got the first 3 upgrades for most things it quickly went from frustrating to "simple".  As far as the pull field goes I don't really think you'll need it.  You Pull 1 is often enough for staggers, Husks, etc.  Pull 2 should be plenty if you're warp bombing.  With the other 7 points you could get Inferno Ammo and you could put any leftover points into something else [stasis?]

If you've played on normal allow yourself some adjustment time if you jump to hardcore.   This is a pretty big jump and you can find yourself frustrated until you adjust.

[Saaziel]

I think Slam is a much better ability to use instead of Pull & Stasis , as it end up combining both effects of Pull & Stasis on a single ability on a shorter cool down. Moreover you don't have to purchase 2 ranks on Shockwave to get it. And its not like there is a lot of additional powers to choose from that compliments the Vanguard very well.

[Alistair_Dunscon]

Self Controll wrote...

Havent played me2 for like a year and a half and was thinking id do a run or two, just played through me1 to make me an importable character (a vanguard) and are going to play vanguard in me2 aswell: with that said i have two builds in mind and if you could comment on them i would appreciate it.

1:
Heavy charge 4
Champion 4
inferno ammo 4
group cryo ammo 4
area reave 4

or

2:
shockwave 2
pull field 4
stasis 1
incendiary ammo 3
heavy charge 4
group cryo ammo 4
champion 4

First build has a little stronger ammo power for himself, +20% ammo damage and aoe on the scare effect, and has reave while second has aoe pull for cc and to inititate warp explosion (thane and miranda both has warp) and stasis 1 for exploiting the ragdoll bonus damage for all its worth.

Going to play one of the difficulties after normal, havent decided yet, hardcore probably.
How do these look and what if anything would you change?

I've played build 1. I played something pretty close to your build 2; I exchanged pull field for inferno ammo and champion for destroyer. I didn't have any problem playing either through insanity.

I have to say, however, that I prefer playing vanguards with a bonus power other than reave. Reave is such a good power that its tempting to just sit back and cast it even though it is far more fun to charge and warp bomb (and stasis if you go that route) through the game.

[Malanthor]

Thank you for the tips.

[Jmrice88]

I am curios as to which bonus weapon you suggest taking on the collector ship. I notice in the videos you have up you use the Scimitar, which is all fine and dandy, but if you don't take the Claymore what do you pick?

Also, I notice a lot of people using slam. I started my first vanguard today and chose reave to give myself an option when charge may not be the best choice. Is slam a "better" choice or just one of preference? One other thing, I used Stasis for the last third of my most recent Sentinel playthrough. is that something that would fall into a vanguard's arsenal well?

[Influ]

Jmrice88 wrote...

I am curios as to which bonus weapon you suggest taking on the collector ship. I notice in the videos you have up you use the Scimitar, which is all fine and dandy, but if you don't take the Claymore what do you pick?

Well I usually pick the assault rifle training. However I tend to only use it on those enemies I can't charge, meaning mostly longer range targets on some platforms or balconies, so sniper rifles would do fine too. There's no definite best choice, just go with what works for you.

[Magragoc]

Jmrice88 wrote...

I am curios as to which bonus weapon you suggest taking on the collector ship. I notice in the videos you have up you use the Scimitar, which is all fine and dandy, but if you don't take the Claymore what do you pick?

Also, I notice a lot of people using slam. I started my first vanguard today and chose reave to give myself an option when charge may not be the best choice. Is slam a "better" choice or just one of preference? One other thing, I used Stasis for the last third of my most recent Sentinel playthrough. is that something that would fall into a vanguard's arsenal well?

I'd say take the Claymore anyways; it's not as if you give up all of your other shotguns to do so.  You'll just have the best of both worlds to choose from.  Especially if you have access to the Locust to deal with unchargeable enemies.  Reave and Slam are both good, don't worry about it.  The main draw of Slam is its fast cooldown, and your ability to use it to set up a warp bomb yourself; you aren't forced to dump points into Shockwave to unlock pull, or carry along a squaddie for it.  In the end, it just comes down to preference.

Stasis is a tricky thing.  It can either be completely gamebreaking, or useless.  If you take advantage of the "stasis bug" you can one-shot even YMIR mechs or use it to insta-kill the Scions on the Platform flight.  So it can make hard fights trivial, or if you use it poorly, you'll be swinging in the breeze and not long for this earth.

Hope that helps, and I hope you enjoy the class.  There's nothing in this game quite like careening around as a biotic cannonball!

[Kronner]

Magragoc wrote...

I'd say take the Claymore anyways; it's not as if you give up all of your other shotguns to do so.  You'll just have the best of both worlds to choose from.  Especially if you have access to the Locust to deal with unchargeable enemies.  Reave and Slam are both good, don't worry about it.  The main draw of Slam is its fast cooldown, and your ability to use it to set up a warp bomb yourself; you aren't forced to dump points into Shockwave to unlock pull, or carry along a squaddie for it.  In the end, it just comes down to preference.

Stasis is a tricky thing.  It can either be completely gamebreaking, or useless.  If you take advantage of the "stasis bug" you can one-shot even YMIR mechs or use it to insta-kill the Scions on the Platform flight.  So it can make hard fights trivial, or if you use it poorly, you'll be swinging in the breeze and not long for this earth.

Hope that helps, and I hope you enjoy the class.  There's nothing in this game quite like careening around as a biotic cannonball!

Agreed. There are very few unchargeable enemies, so I wouldn't worry about long range weapons.

I prefer Slam to Reave, because it has much shorter cooldown and it works in any mission, as long as you take proper squad with you. Reave is useless against shielded enemies, and they are the most common enemy type.


As for Stasis, it is possible not to abuse the Fall of Death bug, and still enjoy 1S1K-ing YMIR mech - this means killing everything but the YMIR mech first, and at that point Stasis just saves you time, because a lone mech can't do anything to you if there is a cover around.

Stasis is pretty good for Arrival DLC (if you plan on fighting all enemy waves in The Last Stand), because you play solo; I prefer Slam for all other missions.

Modifié par Kronner, 12 avril 2011 - 06:43 .

[Kronner]

The problem I have with Energy Drain is, that Vanguard has a barrier, not shield..so how is ED supposed to work then? ED boosting biotic barrier makes no sense to me, so I just don't use it for Vanguard/Adept.

Modifié par Kronner, 12 avril 2011 - 10:40 .

[Jmrice88]

I will probably hold onto reave until I get to Kasumi's loyalty then just so I have a more viable long range attack than slam then respec once I have the Locust. I will likely make a spare save right before I get to choose my bonus weapon and go with the Claymore to begin with and try it out then see how I feel about it.

I enjoyed the easy quick CC you get from 1 point in stasis on my Sentinel so I may give that a shot at some point too.

Also, @ iOnlySignIn your signature is evil... I used to love mudkipz but no longer!

[iPwnTheSlayer]

Reave is as good as it gets for the vanguard in most situations

[gavgav77]

thisisme8 wrote...

Alright, here you have it:  ME2 - Insanity Shockwave - The Lazy Vanguard.

Shockwave works on Insanity, who knew?


Note:  Believe it or not, that build was probably the best Vanguard build I've used to date - and definitely the funnest.
Edit: Don't expect it to be groundbreaking or anything though...

This idea occurred to me the other day, so I'm pleased that the first post I read today has exactly this recommendation:lol:. I'd love to play as an Adept with a shotgun, same with Sentinel. In both cases its the shotgun that I miss the most since it takes pretty much half the game to get to the advanced weapon training.

So a Vanguard covers both the biotic aspect (I just love that Warp sound), and carries a shotgun from the get-go. As a bonus power Reave would compensate for the Adept/Sentinel's lack of Warp, and then some.

A fascinating idea.

[IBYCFOTA]

Which bonus power you should use depends entirely on the mission you're playing. In general though I would say either Reave or Energy Drain are the most useful. Lately I've been playing around with Stasis. I concur with the guy who said that it is either useless or amazing in any given mission. There are some parts where it makes the game significantly easier, like Grunt's recruitment mission where you have to fight a boss with shield / armor, a YMIR Mech, and a Krogan. Using Stasis you can take the Mech out of the fight completely, focus on the synthetic Boss, and from there you pretty much have it in the bag. Stasis makes mini-boss fights in general a cakewalk. However in just about every other scenario it has limited use, especially once you've got a bunch of upgrades and are powerful enough to take down most enemies without any help. On the other hand Stasis doesn't need to be upgraded to be effective, so you can leave one point in it allowing you to spend the remaining points on your other abilities.

If you have the Element Zero to spare, I'd definitely recommend changing your bonus powers liberally. This shouldn't be an issue either if this is your second (or more) playthrough since the game gives you an abundance of the stuff, way more than most people will end up using. In particular I'd say the Collector Missions you should switch to Reave if you don't already have it. Even with one point only Reave is highly effective against Collectors, and because spamming Charge is less advisable on these missions it can be a go to ability as a Vanguard.

Having said all that, once you get to a certain point the Vanguard becomes so powerful that Bonus powers become an afterthought. Why bother with them when you can Charge your way to victory on most missions with ease? That's how I see it anyways. For now I suppose I'll keep Stasis for the non-collector missions just for the occasional annoying YMIR Mech / Geth Prime fight.

Modifié par IBYCFOTA, 03 août 2011 - 09:33 .

[Longsword-83]

I just started an NG+ Insanity run and cleared Freedom's Progress and Mordin's recruitment without much difficulty and dying only once on FP (shields are a Vanguard's worst enemy with those weak starter weapons...)

This loadout seems to work out really well so far.

Weapons:
Vindicator/Mattock (AR Training, makes taking down shields and isolated opponents MUCH easier)
Eviscerator Shotgun
Locust SMG (Close-range firestorm)
Phalanx pistol (Good stopping power at extreme long range- when I run out of AR ammo)
Arc Projector/Grenade Launcher (SCREW YOU HUSKS)/ Collector Particle Beam (all other occasions)

Build:
4- Heavy Charge
4- Inferno Ammo (may change to Squad Incendiary after Horizon)
4- Improved Shockwave
1- Pull
4- Champion
4- Area Reave

All things considered it's working very well right now. I can soften up targets at range with the Shockwave and AR, whittle down their defenses and use pull while Miranda slaps them with a Warp, and so on, Charging towards the end of waves It's a very versatile build so far. The addition of Kestrel armor to my arsenal works wonders too.

[JeffZero]

Oh man, I just finished watching all these vids. The one with the twenty crates was amazing. Deserves even more views than it got, really.

Great thread. I'm doing a Hardcore Vanguard FemShep run of both games right now. Still on ME1 but this will really help for ME2.

[Quething]

So I've been trying out a more flexible Mattock/Eviscerator caster vanguard build, something a bit more akin to Bozorgmehr's adeptlike vanguard than the traditional Chargebot I'm used to, and I'd like some input on my bonus power.

The basic skeleton of the build is this:

10 inferno ammo
1 cryo
10 heavy charge
6 shockwave
10 pull field
10 champion
1 bonus

I could go 10 improved shockwave, 1 bonus, and lose cryo entirely, but I don't like respeccing (prefer to just have a build that's flexible enough to work wherever), and it's nice to have cryo on synthetic missions or for the odd husk or varren. That leaves me with 3 extra points, 2 of which can go either in cryo or the bonus power.

What I'm trying to decide is whether I should go 3 cryo/1 stasis, or 1 cryo/3 slam, or 1 cryo/3 reave.

Basically, reave and slam look appealing because if I'm going to call myself a caster, I want to be able to kill with my powers alone. Slam would allow me to make my own biotic combos (pull+slam is so hilarious, I never get tired of it), and its miniscule cooldown is definitely appealing, but its best traits are redundant with pull field and it only works on unprotected foes. Reave is the more powerful option, and gives me a strong tool against the game's most annoying foes, but the cooldown is a bit brutal, especially for only 2 ranks of benefit (reave has always struck me as an all-or-nothing power).

And then there's the simple utility option of stasis, which would free up two points to make cryo a little better when I need it, since I've never found a use for more than 1 point in that skill (particularly with the duration bonus from Champion). But stasis doesn't give me that sense of "killing things with my biotics" that I'm looking for.

Thoughts?

Modifié par Quething, 27 septembre 2011 - 03:36 .

[RedCaesar97]

@Quething:

A possible caster Vanguard could look something like this:

1 - Incendiary ammo
0 - Cryo ammo
4 - Heavy Charge
4 - Shockwave
4 - Pull Field
4 - Champion
4 - Reave

Cryo ammo--like Cryo Blast--can interfere with biotics, so it is probably better that you do not invest points in it if you want to throw biotics around.

Inferno ammo is great for setting more than one person on fire, but a 1-point Incendiary ammo should be good enough for a caster Vanguard; just enough to stop health regeneration and to set organics on fire and cause all but the toughest organics (read: Krogan) to panic.

I agree that Pull+Slam is fun, but it is not usually enough to kill a target quickly, unlike Pull+Throw. And Slam and Pull do most of the same things. At the same time, Charge, Shockwave, and Reave are on a base 6-second cooldown so having another short cooldown like Slam is more appealing.

[Quething]

IDK, I find that protection-ignoring AoE stagger off Inferno is really, really, really hard to pass up, almost like not maxing a class passive, it's that good. Biotics are more reliable, but they have cooldowns and don't ignore shields, so it's nice to have that backup no matter what else your playstyle.

[RedCaesar97]

Quething wrote...

IDK, I find that protection-ignoring AoE stagger off Inferno is really, really, really hard to pass up, almost like not maxing a class passive, it's that good. Biotics are more reliable, but they have cooldowns and don't ignore shields, so it's nice to have that backup no matter what else your playstyle.

Okay. That limits your options somewhat.

If you are willing to use Stasis:
4 - Inferno ammo
0 - Cryo ammo
4 - Heavy Charge
4 - Improved Shockwave
4 - Pull Field
4 - Chamion
1 - Stasis

Or here is one that uses Slam:
4 - Inferno ammo
0 - Cryo ammo *
4 - Heavy Charge
4 - Improved Shockwave
1 - Pull *
4 - Champion
4 - Crippling Slam
 * You can move the point from Pull into Cryo ammo if desired

This the the Reave build you mentioned earlier:
4 - Inferno ammo
1 - Cryo ammo
4 - Heavy Charge
2 - Shockwave
4 - Pull Field
4 - Champion
3 - Reave

[capn233]

Those aren't bad...

I liked this though: Viper Vanguard

Inferno
Squad Cryo
Heavy Charge
Shockwave - 1
Pull - 0
Champion
Crippling Slam

Advanced weapon training - sniper rifles. Level slam last since it is useful at 1 pt. Very last point into shockwave. Your goal is to primarily charge and blast people with your Eviscerator or Scimitar if you prefer that. Squad covers and strip defenses. The sniper allows you to weaken the enemies at range before charging. Viper also helps strip defenses after you get it. You can use the Locust to have something that is mildly effective mid range, but I preferred the Tempest after I got it because it is effective short range and can be used in lieu of the shotgun.

[xassantex]

i'm about to start my 1st ng+ ever... using the claymore.

think i'll keep inferno ammo and squad cryo .
i've hardly ever used shockwave , so i'll dismiss it.
pull rank 1
champion
crippling slam (for warp bombs with miranda ) .
heavy charge of course.