335 réponses à ce sujet

[Average Gatsby]

Sabresandiego wrote...

That is an intelligent critique of my video that is quite accurate. Good post Gatsby, now to answer your inquiry:

My first video does highlight reave. Any class can use reave and there is marginal difference between the classes. Vanguards are biotic specialists and therefore one of the better classes to use reave with (perhaps sentinel is better).

My reave build has reave, and against collectors reave is extremely strong which is why I use it often. I am about to post a video using my same reave build but against geth where reave is terrible.

I dont use biotic combos in my reave video because I specd Samara wrong and gave here area throw instead of pull field and there is no way to respec squadmates that I know of. If I could respec samara to pull field, i would be launching warp explosions instead of double reaves half the time.

Now to answer your numbered questions

1. Did I use reave 15 times on shepard or 15 times on shepard and samara combined? Either way, I just use what is the most effective ability at the time. A vanguard is probably the second or 3rd best reave class after sentinel and adept. Nonetheless, charge is an awesome ability and I use it more than any other ability.

2. I have not played a sentinel so your analysis may be correct.

3. Im using my shotgun with inferno ammo, squad cryo ammo, and charge quite often. I dont think a sentinel has these abilities.

4. Yes I am. I am simply playing what is effective. It is more effective for me to "soften" a horde of enemies before I charge in.

Anyways your critique is good, and is one of the reasons I made the Pull/Barrier video. For people who feel that reaving is not true to form for a vanguard they can use pull/barrier build which is just as powerful as a reave build if you have thane and miranda for warp explosions.

I was only counting shepard's reaves, and counting by the number of times I saw his arm go up and reave hit a target, then seeing a cooldown indicator on shepard.

Here's something to consider with Reave as far as the other biotic classes go:

With the Sentinel, you can have a 30% cooldown bonus and a 15% power damage bonus just from your abilities (Guardian Passive and Power Armor), so it is the most effective user of Reave.
With the Adept, you can get a 20% cooldown bonus and 15% more damage with just one ability, Nemesis passive.
The Engineer can do the same thing, with a 20% cooldown bonus and a 15% damage boost (Operative).
The best the Vanguard can do is a 9% power cooldown bonus and a 15% damage boost (Destroyer). Its unclear right now whether power duration actually effects the damage of DoT abilities, since its not exactly clear how its calculated.
The Infiltrator has the exact same passive stat as the Vanguard.
The Soldier has a 15% power damage bonus.

So the vanguard is actually tied very low on the chain of caster classes. A caster heavy Vanguard, or Soldier or Infiltrator, is better off playing a more powers friendly class.

Another note about biotic combos: Part of the vanguard's uniqueness is it is only 1 of 3 classes that can have a direct part in creating a biotic combo. Sure you could have been doing more pulls and warps spec'd properly, but in your reave build, the vanguard never plays a role in that besides defense stripping, even though it has the (somewhat) unique potential to do be a direct participant. Consider that it really isn't any different in principle besides style and tactics whether one uses reave or one uses a shotgun to take off defense, they still aren't directly creating that biotic combo, only creating the opportunity for one.

A Vanguard has guns and ammo, unlike casters, and to be playing at absolutely peak levels the vanguard must use those vastly more than anything else. And the vanguard is able to use those guns and ammo by using charge to get into optimum shotgun range, just how the soldier uses adrenaline rush to maximize time spent firing and damage, and the infiltrator uses cloak for a super shot or for moving into a better position to use guns. Vanguard is a guns first, guns always kind of class that needs to be using charge aggressively to create that kind of play.

[Roxlimn]

rumination888:



That's not necessarily the case. Charge is the class-specific power for the Vanguard, but I don't think that every single Vanguard discussion should center around using Charge all the time, or even most of the time. Sometimes, you want to play a Vanguard using a well-rounded combination of abilities and powers.



Likewise, an Adept guide doesn't HAVE to center on Singularity use for half the game. A varied use of all the class's powers, IMO, demonstrates the interaction of power use for the class - an important defining point as important as which unique power that class happens to get.

[phordicus]

i'd like to see videos and discussions that focus solely on charging, whether to initiate battlefield control right at the start by charging a flanking enemy, taking out heavies, etc. all this other talk about powers other classes have is irrelevant. infiltrator is sniping, adept is combo'ing, sentinal is tanking, vanguard is charging. the rest is footnotes.

[rumination888]

@roxlimn
Every single class can play using a well-rounded combination of abilities and powers.
A class guide would serve no purpose in that situation.
You're better off making or reading a general skill guide.


....why am I even replying to you?

Modifié par rumination888, 02 mars 2010 - 12:55 .

[Roxlimn]

rumination888:



It's probably because I am making sense.



Every class can use a gun.



That doesn't mean that classes use guns the same way, or even favor all guns equally.



Every single class can play using a well-rounded combination of abilities and powers.



That doesn't mean that each class's slate plays the same way.



For instance, a Vanguard has Pull. He also has inherent ammo powers. This makes him better suited than a stock Adept at stripping armor with guns, then using Pull for the CC, or to set up the Warp Explosion, particularly if he's using that Ammo/Pull combination with something like an AR or a Sniper Rifle.



Once the WE connects and strips multiple enemies of defenses, he's in a position to immediately take advantage of the situation by using Charge to close in quickly and finish off the knocked down enemies, while his squaddies use Cryo Ammo (from him, natch) to keep other defense-stripped enemies off his back.



That does not play like an Adept, who's got Pull, nor like a Soldier, who's got Inciendary Ammo and Shotgun, nor like an Infiltrator, that's got Cryo Ammo.

[JaegerBane]

Average Gatsby wrote...

Here's something to consider with Reave as far as the other biotic classes go:

With the Sentinel, you can have a 30% cooldown bonus and a 15% power damage bonus just from your abilities (Guardian Passive and Power Armor), so it is the most effective user of Reave.
With the Adept, you can get a 20% cooldown bonus and 15% more damage with just one ability, Nemesis passive.
The Engineer can do the same thing, with a 20% cooldown bonus and a 15% damage boost (Operative).
The best the Vanguard can do is a 9% power cooldown bonus and a 15% damage boost (Destroyer). Its unclear right now whether power duration actually effects the damage of DoT abilities, since its not exactly clear how its calculated.
The Infiltrator has the exact same passive stat as the Vanguard.
The Soldier has a 15% power damage bonus.

So the vanguard is actually tied very low on the chain of caster classes. A caster heavy Vanguard, or Soldier or Infiltrator, is better off playing a more powers friendly class.

Gatsby, I mean no disrespect by this, but the above list is a very poor estimation as to whether Vanguards are any good as casters or not.

You can't simply just disregard Champion bonuses on the basis that it 'isn't clear' what it does for Reave without some sort of evidence as to why the bonus doesn't function as it says on the tin. More to the point, it is generally accepted that the Champion evolution is superior to Destroyer for most Vanguards on account of it's cooldown reduction, so it's safe to say that most Vanguards will have this, whether they're packing Reave or not. Add to the fact that the Champion bonus will disproportionately buff Reave compared to Destroyer if it functions in the way is says it does and it ends up comng across like you're ignoring stuff that doesn't support your stance.

By the same token, it isn't clear why you've made such an issue over this alleged lack of clarity but you've failed to bring in the lack of clarity over how bonuses to power damage works - that is, the developer comments that global power bonuses (such as armour) work on everything, including ammo, but bonuses that specifically state 'biotic' or 'tech' do not. This is an issue does the lack of consistency in the language used - on some passive class bonuses, it makes a point of stipulating stuff like 'biotic power damage bonus', but in other areas, such as evolving them, it does not.

Put simply, you can't really start disregarding stuff on the basis of lack of clarity but treat other stuff as golden so long as they support your viewpoint, despite being just as unclear. I happen to agree with you on the basis that a Vanguard that spams reave all the time isn't really the most powerful build at all, but at the same time, don't you think there's been enough misunderstanding on this thread already?

A Vanguard has guns and ammo, unlike casters, and to be playing at absolutely peak levels the vanguard must use those vastly more than anything else. And the vanguard is able to use those guns and ammo by using charge to get into optimum shotgun range, just how the soldier uses adrenaline rush to maximize time spent firing and damage, and the infiltrator uses cloak for a super shot or for moving into a better position to use guns. Vanguard is a guns first, guns always kind of class that needs to be using charge aggressively to create that kind of play.

This was why the whole hullaballoo about people accusing others of simply mindlessly charging came about in the first place. There is a vibe on this thread that's going around that sounds like people like yourself are claiming that it doesn't matter where you charge, so long as you're charging. That's the whole reason why this thread came about, because not everyone actually finds just relentlessly charging everything irrespective of everything else works for them.

I realise that's not what you, Sinosleep and the rest are actually advocating, but you have to admit that you're getting mighty close to it with the above quote. I'm simply pointing out that there is more to the Vanguard then Charge, and overemphasising that caused all the arguments previously.

Modifié par JaegerBane, 02 mars 2010 - 04:53 .

[JaegerBane]

Schneidend wrote...

JaegerBane wrote...

I agree with never taking a biotic bonus talent on a non-biotic class - that makes sense. What doesn't make sense is assuming that a soldier will refuse to take a sniper rifle just because they do some fighting at short range. It just seems ridiculously arbitrary.

In real military action, not every soldier carries a sniper rifle, and most aren't even trained to use them effectively. As with anything, people tend to specialize, and being a soldier is no different.

And this is relevant how, exactly?

In real military action sniper rifles do not fire sand grain-size rounds at such high velocities with targeting computers that they are apparently unaffected by gravity, wind or even air density.

In real military action sniper rifles do not collapse into ~40cm long blocks when not in use and slot neatly onto your backplate.

In real military action sniper rifles do not have mass effect fields reducing recoil and weapon weight.

In real military action, sniper rifles are burdened with an array of disadvantages that simply do not exist in the ME universe.

So to put it bluntly, what happens in real military action is immaterial to what is going on here.

[ScroguBlitzen]

This is a good guide for people that want to play the Vanguard like a p*ssy.



The Vanguard is the most beautifully violent and irrationally aggressive class when played right in any shooter ever. To hear all this talk of "thinking" and "planning" and "not wanting do die" makes me sick.



(Yes, I'm talking about Insanity.)

[Frekken]

Aggressive charging through a map is like the perfect golf swing. You may take hundreds of terrible swings, but that one perfect one makes up for all of the rest.

[sinosleep]

JaegerBane wrote...
This was why the whole hullaballoo about people accusing others of simply mindlessly charging came about in the first place. There is a vibe on this thread that's going around that sounds like people like yourself are claiming that it doesn't matter where you charge, so long as you're charging. That's the whole reason why this thread came about, because not everyone actually finds just relentlessly charging everything irrespective of everything else works for them.

I realise that's not what you, Sinosleep and the rest are actually advocating, but you have to admit that you're getting mighty close to it with the above quote. I'm simply pointing out that there is more to the Vanguard then Charge, and overemphasising that caused all the arguments previously.

You know what, honestly I'm pretty much done caring. I've participated in more of these threads than I can count explaining in detail what, when, and how to charge and if people still want to say that it seems like we're advocating to just charge anything in sight well them I just can't be bothered to care. There's been countless vanguard threads, and there's a HUGE thread right here ON PAGE ONE that goes into anything and everything vanguard related in quite a bit of detail, most of which Thismisme8 has been kind enough to update the OP with. Frankly, I am NOT going to be reposting that in every damn thread I enter where people are going to misconstrue what has been said so from here on out I think I'm just going to link to the vanguard thread and butt out. This, quite frankly, has been absolutely friggen ridiculous. 

Here's the link 

http://social.biowar...ndex/1061080/52

there are all the explanations you could possibly ever want. 

Modifié par sinosleep, 02 mars 2010 - 08:47 .

[Average Gatsby]

JaegerBane wrote...

Average Gatsby wrote...

Here's something to consider with Reave as far as the other biotic classes go:

With the Sentinel, you can have a 30% cooldown bonus and a 15% power damage bonus just from your abilities (Guardian Passive and Power Armor), so it is the most effective user of Reave.
With the Adept, you can get a 20% cooldown bonus and 15% more damage with just one ability, Nemesis passive.
The Engineer can do the same thing, with a 20% cooldown bonus and a 15% damage boost (Operative).
The best the Vanguard can do is a 9% power cooldown bonus and a 15% damage boost (Destroyer). Its unclear right now whether power duration actually effects the damage of DoT abilities, since its not exactly clear how its calculated.
The Infiltrator has the exact same passive stat as the Vanguard.
The Soldier has a 15% power damage bonus.

So the vanguard is actually tied very low on the chain of caster classes. A caster heavy Vanguard, or Soldier or Infiltrator, is better off playing a more powers friendly class.

Gatsby, I mean no disrespect by this, but the above list is a very poor estimation as to whether Vanguards are any good as casters or not.

You can't simply just disregard Champion bonuses on the basis that it 'isn't clear' what it does for Reave without some sort of evidence as to why the bonus doesn't function as it says on the tin. More to the point, it is generally accepted that the Champion evolution is superior to Destroyer for most Vanguards on account of it's cooldown reduction, so it's safe to say that most Vanguards will have this, whether they're packing Reave or not. Add to the fact that the Champion bonus will disproportionately buff Reave compared to Destroyer if it functions in the way is says it does and it ends up comng across like you're ignoring stuff that doesn't support your stance.

By the same token, it isn't clear why you've made such an issue over this alleged lack of clarity but you've failed to bring in the lack of clarity over how bonuses to power damage works - that is, the developer comments that global power bonuses (such as armour) work on everything, including ammo, but bonuses that specifically state 'biotic' or 'tech' do not. This is an issue does the lack of consistency in the language used - on some passive class bonuses, it makes a point of stipulating stuff like 'biotic power damage bonus', but in other areas, such as evolving them, it does not.

Put simply, you can't really start disregarding stuff on the basis of lack of clarity but treat other stuff as golden so long as they support your viewpoint, despite being just as unclear. I happen to agree with you on the basis that a Vanguard that spams reave all the time isn't really the most powerful build at all, but at the same time, don't you think there's been enough misunderstanding on this thread already?

A Vanguard has guns and ammo, unlike casters, and to be playing at absolutely peak levels the vanguard must use those vastly more than anything else. And the vanguard is able to use those guns and ammo by using charge to get into optimum shotgun range, just how the soldier uses adrenaline rush to maximize time spent firing and damage, and the infiltrator uses cloak for a super shot or for moving into a better position to use guns. Vanguard is a guns first, guns always kind of class that needs to be using charge aggressively to create that kind of play.

This was why the whole hullaballoo about people accusing others of simply mindlessly charging came about in the first place. There is a vibe on this thread that's going around that sounds like people like yourself are claiming that it doesn't matter where you charge, so long as you're charging. That's the whole reason why this thread came about, because not everyone actually finds just relentlessly charging everything irrespective of everything else works for them.

I realise that's not what you, Sinosleep and the rest are actually advocating, but you have to admit that you're getting mighty close to it with the above quote. I'm simply pointing out that there is more to the Vanguard then Charge, and overemphasising that caused all the arguments previously.

The Champion bonus, longer power duration, even if it does help with damage, which seems very unlikely as I never noticed any with both my adept and my engineer duration helping with damage, still makes the Vanguard the (arguably) second worst caster in the game when you consider that the Infiltrator also has Incinerate and AI Hack vs Vanguards Shockwave and Pull. The numbers are there, thats just the way it is.

Power Damage bonus means any power, just like how the Blood Dragon Armor benefits any power, so does the Power Damage modifier in the class passives. An engineer using Operative with Reave will always Reave better than a Vanguard. 

As for the charge recklessly strategy, I don't think that's implied. Using something often doesn't necessarily equal recklessness, and I think that the 1200 replies thread on Vanguard's indicates that.

I'll use my engineer as an analogy; the class is sometimes accused of drone spam. Now I use my drone constantly, but the way I play it my drone tends to stay alive for 15-20 seconds instead of dying every three seconds. I don't spam my drone since I'm only casting it usually ever 3rd or 4th ability, but I'm still using it constantly.

In the same way, a vanguard, in order to use the benefits of its Inferno ammo, Imo the best ammo power in the game, has to charge often. That doesn't always mean immediately charging at the first enemy, but it might mean charging immediately at the second or third. That's not reckless, that's smart play for maximizing damage and killing speed.

[Sabresandiego]

I want to make a few things clear, in the 2 videos I have posted so far I am clearing the map faster than in any other video I have seen (remember I do not skip the last fight) and doing it with taking relatively little damage. Now the reason I state these facts is not to boost my ego or try to be arrogant, it is simply video proof that the way I describe playing a vanguard is the furthest thing from playing passively.



Now, I highly reccommend you stop critiqueing just my reave video, as my pull/barrier video shows me employing the tactics in this guide entirely without reave. To finish, it doesnt matter if a sentinel is a better reaver or not by a 5% margin, the percentage is negligible, and because anybody who watches the videos will see tons of shotgun action, charge action, and vanguard play.

[sinosleep]

Sabre, we went over this in the other thread, no one else was trying to make a speed run either so the claim is kind of disingenuous. If you want to compare speed runs then lets compare speed runs, to but to claim yours is the fastest when none of the vids posted were speed runs in the first place is kind of a bogus claim. You make one, I make one, lets post em and compare, but until then.....

[Average Gatsby]

Sabresandiego wrote...

I want to make a few things clear, in the 2 videos I have posted so far I am clearing the map faster than in any other video I have seen (remember I do not skip the last fight) and doing it with taking relatively little damage. Now the reason I state these facts is not to boost my ego or try to be arrogant, it is simply video proof that the way I describe playing a vanguard is the furthest thing from playing passively.

Now, I highly reccommend you stop critiqueing just my reave video, as my pull/barrier video shows me employing the tactics in this guide entirely without reave. To finish, it doesnt matter if a sentinel is a better reaver or not by a 5% margin, the percentage is negligible, and because anybody who watches the videos will see tons of shotgun action, charge action, and vanguard play.

You've set up your Reave build like it is somehow on Par with the Barrier/Pull build. It isn't. Your barrier/pull play, speed, and efficiency is better in every way, because your playing the vanguard how the 1300 page thread describes vanguards playing. Consider that you use charge 12 times and Pull 10 times in the barrier/pull video, and you finish in a faster time. Its more efficient and its faster.

This is because your playing the vanguard using its strength of ability to set up biotic combos instead of playing a weak caster an constantly waiting for Reave cooldowns. In addition, in pull/barrier, you charge more aggressively and because of that you get better results. Just watch that first section and compare the two. Your aggressive charging is far better without reave than with reave, and by using your guns and ammo more you get results.

What it comes down to is your reave build is Reave with the vanguard tacked on, but not playing any differently than any other excessive reave using class, whereas your Pull/Barrier build is Vanguard play. They aren't equally powerful; your own videos show that the vanguard playing the way it's meant to is superior. And it happens that as far as centering a build around Reave, Vanguard is one of the worst classes to do it, so someone might as well play sentinel.

Bear in mind that when you set up a build with claims about it being the best or one of the best, it invites criticism as to whether that is or isn't true. You're saying that this way is, if not the best way, superior to most other ways of playing the vanguard, which invites a discussion on whether that claim is true or not.

Modifié par Average Gatsby, 02 mars 2010 - 09:50 .

[_Dannok1234]

I couldn't resist, so I went and did a run on the collector station for the part in your vids. I really wish that my pc could handle fraps as there is no way in hell I can do the same with it running and giving me 15-20fps. As is seen in my horrible quality vids, I have to pause to aim while using fraps.

But you seem to be a fairly skilled player so I'm confident that you too can do it if you want to confirm. So here goes, I started at where you are 15 secs into your pull video. (Thats to say, 15 seconds in you were at the location I started at.) I did it in 4:11 with bugs(Shepard walking sideways for some reason) and mistakes using nothing but charge and shotgun(scimitar)+melee, I did use warp/reave from samara and Miranda on a few of the collectors that I charged (as I charged), I think it would add about 5-10 seconds if I didn't do that since normal kill speed for regular collectors is about 0.6 seconds using shot+melee. (Something you really should try out by the way. Noticed you don't do that too much in your videos.) So if you don't believe me just try it out, I'm confident in your ability to replicate it as I'm far from the most skilled gamer.

However that doesn't really mean anything at all. It doesn't mean my style of play is superior then yours, it does not mean my build (Inferno, Heavy charge, Champion), my personal skill or anything else is better then yours or anyone else really. It's just different thats all. 

Edit: Note, I have had a few glasses of whiskey and some beers (maybe this will seem like a bad idea tomorrow). Also every enemy was killed obviously no part skipped. (in case it would come up)

Modifié par Dannok1234, 02 mars 2010 - 10:43 .

[Hailcloud]

Reave's an amazing ability for your Vanguard...as long as he's not the one casting it.

Edit: It's one thing to say that Reave is a good Bonus Ability on your Vanguard, but to say that having Reave on your Vanguard makes it the best Vanguard out there...well, that's something else entirely.

Modifié par Hailcloud, 02 mars 2010 - 10:47 .

[Kurupt87]

another argument for sabre to play sentinel is the fact that he uses shotgun from range alot. it was funny watching you shoot at one of the collectors, i think you popped off 3 shots on target and did no dmg. the way you play you'd be more effective with one of the pistols, no point even switching when you charge because you back up straight away. try using the pistol, you'll be "even better". i'm not arguing that your reaver isnt effective, just that, like gatsby said, the other classes do it better, and its not the "high risk high reward" strategy that the vanguard was described as by the devs.

honestly, play the sentinel.

[Iz Stoik zI]

Kurupt87 wrote...

another argument for sabre to play sentinel is the fact that he uses shotgun from range alot. it was funny watching you shoot at one of the collectors, i think you popped off 3 shots on target and did no dmg. the way you play you'd be more effective with one of the pistols, no point even switching when you charge because you back up straight away. try using the pistol, you'll be "even better". i'm not arguing that your reaver isnt effective, just that, like gatsby said, the other classes do it better, and its not the "high risk high reward" strategy that the vanguard was described as by the devs.
honestly, play the sentinel.

I have to agree.

It's not a question of skill, it's a question of strategy. Sabre plays the Vanguard more like the Sentinel than anything else. Planning, casting, defense removal etc. He loves Reave, and since it synergizes with the Sentinel so well then it is probably a more ideal class for him to play. Obviously he can play whatever he wants, but stating that the Reave Vanguard is the most powerful build is just not accurate.

And I noticed his shooting style too. Why back up when fighting enemies, especially with the Scimitar? When you do that not only do you lose the point blank damage bonus but more of your shotgun pellets are missing. You'd be much better off staying in melee range and fighting... actually using a melee once in a while would help too.

Overall, the Pull/Barrier version is quite a bit more powerful in my opinion. Still, some of the advice in this guide can come in handy and the list of upgrades is highly useful to anyone looking for an edge in the early part of the game.

[cxensign]

Here are my notes from watching those videos; note that I press hard and aim for perfection and I operate as if everyone else does too.

I got the impression that you were trying really hard to not Charge so much; maybe that was the point.  But in a lot of obvious charge situations you stayed back and shotty-sniped, taking less damage but dragging it out.

Pull usage was pretty good.  You had a lot of good pull situations presented and were quick to act on them.

Reave usage was poor, though.  I only liked a couple of the Reave uses in the entire video.  Are you not used to using Reave?  The reaction time on it was slow, you ended up throwing it late then sitting behind cover in recharge instead of being useful; those Reaves had negative value for you.

- There were a lot less good Pull opportunities in the Reave playthrough; so you didn't miss it as much as you could have...I'm wondering if that's causal.

You missed one of the juiciest Warp Explosion spots in the game at 3:30 in both videos.  Nailing that is such yummy goodness!

Overall I think you did a good job showing off Pull.  At the same time, you reinforced stereotypes of Barrier being worthless, and Reave making otherwise competent players act like idiots.  Lots of good stuff in there for discussion at least, thank you for posting red meat for everyone!

[thisisme8]

rumination888 wrote...

Infact, I think this forum needs more gameplay fundamental guides rather than class guides(i don't make guides, so don't look at me). Thisisme8's battlefield guide would probably help people out a lot more than a class guide if its their first time playing on insanity.

Hey!  I agree.  It's probably why my Battlefield blog/guide is the only non-modding blog in the top 10 on the site... 

...and I'm 2 pages too late to really respond.

[sinosleep]

This has been processing forever, tired of waiting. It'll be 720p sooner or later. Just over 4 minutes (last mob drops at 4:10 subtract time for gameplay screen and such), sure I could shave more time off although honestly I don't really care. The time isn't what's important for me, it's the fun of knowing I can just charge the crap out of everything on screen.

Modifié par sinosleep, 03 mars 2010 - 08:16 .

[Sabresandiego]

Hey guys thanks for all the constructive criticism. My pull barrier video is a better video than my reave video and I will make it the main video for this guide. I still stand by my statement that a reave build is one of the most powerful vanguard builds, unfortunately my video does not do it justice if you compare it head to head with my pull/barrier video because Samara does not have any points in pull so I was forced to use double reaves instead of 1 reave into a warp explosion.

Regardless, I like both builds equally and I am going to do a new playthrough (NG+ insanity) with barrier as my special and no reave. I will make some videos of the playthrough and add them to the guide. As to those that say I should play a sentinel instead of a vanguard, I probably would enjoy playing a sentinel but I enjoy vanguard the most because it just fits my playstyle (lots of action). I am also a charge addict, I simply love the ability. Even though I don't force bad charges, it is my favorite ability in the game.

Modifié par Sabresandiego, 03 mars 2010 - 09:13 .

[VirtualAlex]

Haha that's awesome. Some SUPER long-ranged charges in there. Sexy.



Also I have been trying to keep up with this thread but I don't really get what we are even talking about. Can everyone please clarify and just repost their thesis?

[RamsenC]

Sabresandiego wrote...

Regardless, I like both builds equally and I am going to do a new playthrough (NG+ insanity) with barrier as my special and no reave. I will make some videos of the playthrough and add them to the guide. As to those that say I should play a sentinel instead of a vanguard, I probably would enjoy playing a sentinel but I enjoy vanguard the most because it just fits my playstyle (lots of action).

Assault armor sentinel plays with a lot of action, just not as much as Vanguard. I would probably rank it tied second with hardened AR soldier in the seeing of action category. About barrier though, I hope you are only putting one point into it. Anymore is a waste, but if you do have spare points then its fine. 

[Sabresandiego]

RamsenC wrote...

Sabresandiego wrote...

Regardless, I like both builds equally and I am going to do a new playthrough (NG+ insanity) with barrier as my special and no reave. I will make some videos of the playthrough and add them to the guide. As to those that say I should play a sentinel instead of a vanguard, I probably would enjoy playing a sentinel but I enjoy vanguard the most because it just fits my playstyle (lots of action).

Assault armor sentinel plays with a lot of action, just not as much as Vanguard. I would probably rank it tied second with hardened AR soldier in the seeing of action category. About barrier though, I hope you are only putting one point into it. Anymore is a waste, but if you do have spare points then its fine. 

Why is more points in barrier a waste? Each rank supposedly increases your barrier by 25% and it seems more valuable then putting more points into pull. I cant max either one due to the two ranks of shockwave which are required for pull.