187 réponses à ce sujet

[darthcommander]

Did anyone else notice some similarities?  

[Schneidend]

Indeed. I like KotOR 2 and Mass Effect 2 better than their first installments. That's a personal similarity, though.



I found that the crew of ME1 and KotOR weren't as interesting as the crews in the sequels, and both sequels improved the gameplay for their respective franchises immensely.

[TheTrooper1138]

no, KotOR 2 sucked, ME2 doesn't...

[BatarianBob]

Beyond having the number 2 in the title, not really.

ME2 isn't perfect, but this is like comparing a shoplifter to Adolf Hitler.

That's right, this thread has been Godwined.

Modifié par Taranatar9, 27 février 2010 - 03:11 .

[MassEffect762]

They're both easily forgettable.(in my opinion)

Modifié par MassEffect762, 27 février 2010 - 03:13 .

[darthcommander]

Taranatar9 wrote...

Beyond having the number 2 in the title, not really.

ME2 isn't perfect, but this is like comparing a shoplifter to Adolf Hitler.

That's right, this thread has been Godwined.

 Both of them had a darker portray of the galaxy.  The republic/alliance wasn’t there to help you in your quest...

Modifié par darthcommander, 27 février 2010 - 03:22 .

[Schneidend]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

no, KotOR 2 sucked, ME2 doesn't...

What was so bad about KotOR 2? I liked that it was about the nature and philosophy of the Force and not another "hey the latest empire showed up let's kill them" story. Almost every expanded universe Star Wars story is about some big legion of bad guys showing up from parts unknown to mess up the Republic (although the Mandalorians are, admittedly, really awesome). That is old and tired. All KotOR 1 had going for it was that it was the first really good Star Wars game where you play a Jedi. Don't even mention the "big twist," because every soap opera ever has already done the "I had amnesia and turned out to be the bad guy" plot. Even setting that aside, the big reveal part wasn't that awesome.

[MajorStranger]

Kotor 2 was made by Obsidian, not Bioware. Don't ever insult Bioware again!

[TheTrooper1138]

Schneidend wrote...

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

no, KotOR 2 sucked, ME2 doesn't...

What was so bad about KotOR 2? I liked that it was about the nature and philosophy of the Force and not another "hey the latest empire showed up let's kill them" story. Almost every expanded universe Star Wars story is about some big legion of bad guys showing up from parts unknown to mess up the Republic (although the Mandalorians are, admittedly, really awesome). That is old and tired. All KotOR 1 had going for it was that it was the first really good Star Wars game where you play a Jedi. Don't even mention the "big twist," because every soap opera ever has already done the "I had amnesia and turned out to be the bad guy" plot. Even setting that aside, the big reveal part wasn't that awesome.

The plot was rubbish... A "wound in the Force" (or what did they call the player)? Seriously, WTF? No, that was just stupid, add to that the fact, that the game was full of unfinished story lines and quests (droid factory) and the ending was an insult to the player! 
Also the choices you made in the first did not matter in the slightest... you could tell Atton that Revan was eviiil or good and a man or a woman... great, really... 
And don't tell me the twist in KotOR did not surprise you, that was one of the best (if not THE best) twists in video game history. That's because it was so well-written, you had all the information but would never have put it together like that. It still made all sense the next time you played the game from the beginning, knowing about the twist. That's one thing that made it so good. Another was the well-written characters (unlike KotOR 2, which had not one really interesting character... "ouh, look at me, I was eviiil once, because I killed some Jediii..." yeah right, go die somewhere, Atton, nobody cares about you, at least the first one had Bastila, Jolee and of course HK-47 - OK, he was the only good thing about the 2nd maybe).
Also I hated Kreia the moment I met her... why the hell did I have to follow her advice for the entire game, full well knowing from the first moment on, she was gonna betray me? No, KotOR 2 just sucked... 
OK, it had some small (!) improvements in the gameplay, but that didn't make up for the crappy story, crappy characters and bull**** ending...

[TheTrooper1138]

plus this:

MajorStranger wrote...

Kotor 2 was made by Obsidian, not Bioware. Don't ever insult Bioware again!

[Revenant_Mortalus]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

no, KotOR 2 sucked, ME2 doesn't...

This.  Well, almost.  I wouldn't go so far as to say it sucked.  I liked the influence system, and how you could train your squaddies in the ways of the Force.

It's just a damn shame the game was only about 3/4 complete.  If only the Sith Lords Restoration Project had gotten off the ground.

I also have to say that the writers at Obsidian did HK-47 a terrible injustice.  In KoTOR 1 he was easily the greatest Star Wars droid ever...

[TheTrooper1138]

Revenant_Mortalus wrote...

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

no, KotOR 2 sucked, ME2 doesn't...

This.  Well, almost.  I wouldn't go so far as to say it sucked.  I liked the influence system, and how you could train your squaddies in the ways of the Force.

It's just a damn shame the game was only about 3/4 complete.  If only the Sith Lords Restoration Project had gotten off the ground.

I also have to say that the writers at Obsidian did HK-47 a terrible injustice.  In KoTOR 1 he was easily the greatest Star Wars droid ever...

still, the best part about KotOR 2 was his bantering about the "cheap copies".. that made me smile, but the game still sucked... also it felt so "empty" imo... in the 1st, the planets were filled with life, in the 2nd it was all so sterile and dead... hated that... and yes, some of the gameplay was improved, as I said, but it was too little to compensate for the crappy overall gaming experience...

[Revenant_Mortalus]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

still, the best part about KotOR 2 was his bantering about the "cheap copies".. that made me smile, but the game still sucked... also it felt so "empty" imo... in the 1st, the planets were filled with life, in the 2nd it was all so sterile and dead... hated that... and yes, some of the gameplay was improved, as I said, but it was too little to compensate for the crappy overall gaming experience...

Ah well, here's to KoTOR 3, 4, 5 etc aka SW:TOR.  Don't get me wrong, I'd have preferred to see a single player KoTOR 3, but this should be good...

[WillG027]

Both sequels (KOTOR2 & ME2) were massive disappointments and ruined, rather than improved upon the formulas that made both of the initial games (KOTOR & ME1) so great.

Both games took their respective franchises in totally wrong directions, so yes, I think both games do share a similarity.

[lukandroll]

MajorStranger wrote...

Kotor 2 was made by Obsidian, not Bioware. Don't ever insult Bioware again!

Don't ever insult Obsidian again!
See what I did?

[Grand_Commander13]

Similarities? Like how they both owned the original game in the series in the face? KOTOR 2 for storytelling and character customization, ME2 for gameplay and class differentiation. Like how a bunch of haters came out of the woodwork to attack every perceived flaw? About how a bunch of troglodytes didn't get the story so assail them both for not having one?

Yes, tons of similarities between the two, why?

[TheTrooper1138]

lukandroll wrote...

MajorStranger wrote...

Kotor 2 was made by Obsidian, not Bioware. Don't ever insult Bioware again!

Don't ever insult Obsidian again!
See what I did?

just got yourself banned? 

[darthcommander]

I started playing Kotor 2 before I played Kotor. Played for about a hour and got bored. It wasn't until I completed Kotor, when I could enjoy Kotor 2.

[TheTrooper1138]

Grand_Commander13 wrote...

Similarities? Like how they both owned the original game in the series in the face? KOTOR 2 for storytelling and character customization, ME2 for gameplay and class differentiation. Like how a bunch of haters came out of the woodwork to attack every perceived flaw? About how a bunch of troglodytes didn't get the story so assail them both for not having one?
Yes, tons of similarities between the two, why?

I just hope you're joking about KotOR 2 owning KotOR.. if not, I might finally lose hope in humanity... 

[BatarianBob]

Schneidend wrote...

What was so bad about KotOR 2? I liked that it was about the nature and philosophy of the Force and not another "hey the latest empire showed up let's kill them" story.

You can't base a story around the philosophy of a fictional religion.  The audience needs something more tangible.

A more "personal", smaller scale story (which I guess is what they were going for, the story's so jumpled and incoherent that I'm not really sure) would have been fine if they'd finished it.

Modifié par Taranatar9, 27 février 2010 - 04:09 .

[Grand_Commander13]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...
I just hope you're joking about KotOR 2 owning KotOR.. if not, I might finally lose hope in humanity... 

Everybody knows you can't take my opinions seriously.  I honestly enjoyed Invisible War and thought Peragus was a great starting level, so I obviously don't know what I'm talking about.

That, or I'm good enough at seeing quality in something that when I say it's bad you should take notice, Baldur's Gate 2. >.>

[TheTrooper1138]

Taranatar9 wrote...

Schneidend wrote...

What was so bad about KotOR 2? I liked that it was about the nature and philosophy of the Force and not another "hey the latest empire showed up let's kill them" story.

You can't base a story around the philosophy of a fictional religion.  The audience needs something more tangible.

A more "personal", smaller scale story (which I guess is what they were going for) would have been fine if they'd finished it.

well, actually KotOR 2 proves, that it can get even worse than "midi-chlorians", when it comes to ruining "the Force" with bullcrap ideas...

[Super Zee]

No

[Schneidend]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

The plot was rubbish... A "wound in the Force" (or what did they call the player)? Seriously, WTF? No, that was just stupid, add to that the fact, that the game was full of unfinished story lines and quests (droid factory) and the ending was an insult to the player! 
Also the choices you made in the first did not matter in the slightest... you could tell Atton that Revan was eviiil or good and a man or a woman... great, really... 
And don't tell me the twist in KotOR did not surprise you, that was one of the best (if not THE best) twists in video game history. That's because it was so well-written, you had all the information but would never have put it together like that. It still made all sense the next time you played the game from the beginning, knowing about the twist. That's one thing that made it so good. Another was the well-written characters (unlike KotOR 2, which had not one really interesting character... "ouh, look at me, I was eviiil once, because I killed some Jediii..." yeah right, go die somewhere, Atton, nobody cares about you, at least the first one had Bastila, Jolee and of course HK-47 - OK, he was the only good thing about the 2nd maybe).
Also I hated Kreia the moment I met her... why the hell did I have to follow her advice for the entire game, full well knowing from the first moment on, she was gonna betray me? No, KotOR 2 just sucked... 
OK, it had some small (!) improvements in the gameplay, but that didn't make up for the crappy story, crappy characters and bull**** ending...

Whether or not a character is interesting is purely subjective. I found the KotOR2 crew far more interesting than that of KotOR1. Jolee Bindo and Juhani were my only favorites that aren't in both games, while T3-M4 and HK-47 both thankfully made returns in the sequel. 

I liked Kreia because she was a mentor character, and I love mentor characters. She was all the more fun for me because she actually had interesting lessons. I didn't expect an Ayn Rand-like character in a Star Wars game. Once she told the story about being a Sith Lord, I pretty much knew she'd be a bad guy, but it was still cool to actually get to work with and learn from a former Sith Lord and not be forced to act like a Lawful Stupid Paladin and kill her as soon as she told her story.

And, while the KotOR twist did suprise me, its luster wore off quickly. Just about every soap opera in history has had a similar twist.

As to the ending and unfinished plots, well, it was an unfinished game. Obsidian had to chop the game apart at the last second to meet their advancing deadlines. Even still, I liked it a lot more than KotOR1. I played through it twice as many times, in fact.

[WillG027]

I agree with Schneidend that KOTOR2 wasn't all that bad really.

It had good content/characters but didn't have the execution or immersion of the original.

AKA released by Obsidian(too early/rushed), and also, not by Bioware.