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[Lumikki]

spacehamsterZH wrote...

Lumikki wrote...

Mister Mida wrote...

Kaidan is a Sentinel.

What's Kaidan's technical power?
I mean he need one to be Sentinel.

Electronics and decryption, and it clearly says Sentinel in his profile.

If those two are counted as technical powers, then Kaidan and Liara will be Sentinel. Liara become Sentinel, because she has electronic skill. How ever, if you only count decryption as technical power, then Liara would be adept and Kaidan sentinel.

Soldier: Asley, Grunt, Zaeed
Vanguard: Jacob, Thane, Jack
Infiltrator: Garrus, Kasumi
Engineer: Tali, Mordin, Legion
Adept:  Wrex, Samara, Mortinth
Sentinel: Miranda, Kaidan, Liara

This is based they powers what they have. Assuming, that Overload is technical power and all "ammo" powers are combat abilities, not technical or bionic powers.

Modifié par Lumikki, 25 mai 2010 - 05:34 .

[Iakus]

Ariella wrote...

iakus wrote...

uberdowzen wrote...

In DAO, at one point Sten confronts you and asks what your plan is. Even in game your character doesn't know what his/her plan is. And (I don't really want to do this because I love DAO) why are gathering the treaties? You don't even know how you're going to defeat the Darkspawn, why do you need an army?

In ME1, you don't even know what the conduit is. You're not even totally sure the Reapers exist. And why do you need anyone to come with you? You've always got your crew.

And remember that most of the crew of the Normandy think that going to Ilos is probably a suicide mission, they just don't make as big a deal out of it.

DAO plot aside, a large part of what you're doing in ME 1 is finding out what the Conduit is.  And Shepard at least is sure Reapers exist (or something that fits their description) thanks to the visions from the Prothean beacon. 

Going to Ilos was a last-ditch effort, once the Council and Udina tried to shut you down,  if you die, all you did was deny the Reapers the pleasure of killing you

Actually, Shepard, in the beginning thinks the synthetics may be geth (when Anderson asks about the vision). Shepard doesn't have a real idea of a name until Tali, and even then it's really foggy. The true threat of the reapers doesn't come out until near the end of Virmire.

Actually, his line was "I saw synthetics - geth maybe.  Slaughtering people.  Butchering them"  It's pretty ridiculous to believe that geth were around 50,000 years ago, but Shepard has no real reference point for what the beacon showed. Geth were the only synthetic lifeforms known at the time. Afterwards, when Tali presented her evidence, Shepard had a name for the threat.  It is on Virmire when the truly horrific scope of the threat comes to light.  But Shepard knew pretty much from the beginning that the threat was a millenia-old synthetic life form (Reapers).

[bjdbwea]

Arwyl wrote...

In ME 2, I felt pushed all the time. Kelly would push me to go talk to the characters; the characters would push me to go do their missions, the missions would appear as huge labels on the galaxy map... Reminders everywhere of what I was supposed to do, almost as if the developers thought that I would forget otherwise. I resented that.

You're not the only one. It's almost as if the developers thought their players are dumb and unable to remember anything. Which, sadly, seems to be the case with some. But I refuse to believe that it's the majority, not even the majority of shooter fans and casual gamers who are the new target audience.

There are also some side missions that are so simple, it's ridiculous. You can't even lose. These missions felt like out of a game for little children. Which ME 2 is obviously not, so why implement stuff like that?

Modifié par bjdbwea, 25 mai 2010 - 05:31 .

[Iakus]

Tempest wrote...

I do not understand the complaints about the loyalty missions. They were great and fleshed out nicely to make the squadies more organic. The only problem I got from ME2 about the loyalty missions was that...it was all we got. No continues fights or praise of Cerberus depending on what your "moral" was. No building more of Shepard's character (This is barely game #2, why do we lack character development half ways through the trilogy?) No real investigation about what the collectors are. (TIM seems to be the one doing all this, but we get very little to no info on what he has so far. Remember he is the one telling us that he is the one gathering information and that shepard is to just focus on member recruitment. I don't really blame him, I blame the story.) Well those are my personal pet peeves.

I thoroughly agree with most of your pet peevesm especially the lack of investigation concerning the Collectors.

The problem isn't the loyalty missions per se.  For me at least, the loyalty missions take place in a vacuum.  It's just you and the person you want to make loyal.  No other squaddie as anything to say.  Wouldn't you think Samara or Jack would have someting to say about Thane's loyalty mission?  Or maybe Grunt or Garrus at Zaed's mission?  Miranda or Jack at Jacob's?  Wouldn't they agree or disagree about a course of action?  Or have some bit of wisdom based on their own experiences?

In addition all the loyalty seems to flow towards Shepard. There is almost no inter-squad dialogue.  No friendships formed, even among those who already know each other.  There are exactly two personality clashes, really odd given the variety of the squad.  Doing the loyalty missions may put the individuals at their peak, and make them loyal to Shepard, but there's no evidence to show that they squad is loyal to each other.  That should be at least as important, if not more so.

[Lumikki]

Yeah, the squad members dialog actions or lack of them where little odd. Also some squad members going togather in some places can be odd. Even allow some squad members in some places at all. Example I did find it funny that Shepard got first time stoped in Citidel's new improved security, but Legion walked trough it like notting interesting happen.

Modifié par Lumikki, 25 mai 2010 - 06:05 .

[tonnactus]

uberdowzen wrote...


How is that a tactic. That seems more like if you forget to take a biotic, you're screwed.

Yes,its a tactic.Without a biotic the krogans would overwhelm you easily.There are tactics for surviving and some tactics to kill things faster.You are the one who liked teamplay,right.So in this case,in early levels(and for an engineer on insanity for all levels) a biotic is essential to have at this place.
Like its good to have a tech at the end of the mission to damp the biotics of the asari clone.

Tactics shouldn't be essential, but they should make you a lot more efficient. ME1 doesn't really even have that.

Warp and Overload exists in Mass Effect too.But they were also taktics to improve your survival rate...

I often use the combat drone to distract Harbinger. Obviously this must be a bad tactic, but even so I do it. It's gotten me out of quite a few bad situations.

Yes,if its not your own drone.

[Lumikki]

tonnactus wrote...

Yes,its a tactic.Without a biotic the krogans would overwhelm you easily.

I did not need any tactics against krogans, just shoot them dead with you pistol. I actually did sometimes run straid up agaist charcing krogan and killed it before it even reach me. Just let you gun blaze and that's it. I think hardest krogan was in Liara resque mission, but even that I killed with pistol only.

Modifié par Lumikki, 25 mai 2010 - 06:23 .

[tonnactus]

uberdowzen wrote...


But that is the plot. The story of the game is about Shepherd building his sucide squad. Just because it's not a generic sci-fi story that's about killing the generic villain doesn't mean it's bad.

Too bad that Mass Effect 2 is a mostly a generic Soap Opera with a science fiction robe.Most quests are just boring.Only the ones that expand the knowledge about the Mass Effect Universe,like that of samara,grunt,legion or tali are worth it. All other ones are a waste of time.Mostly just another reasons to slain mercs.

Modifié par tonnactus, 25 mai 2010 - 06:17 .

[KitsuneRommel]

tonnactus wrote...

Yes,its a tactic.Without a biotic the krogans would overwhelm you easily.There are tactics for surviving and some tactics to kill things faster.You are the one who liked teamplay,right.So in this case,in early levels(and for an engineer on insanity for all levels) a biotic is essential to have at this place.
Like its good to have a tech at the end of the mission to damp the biotics of the asari clone.

Is it a tactic to bring a techie to open boxes too? Actually that's the only reason to bring one. Biotics (especially Singularity) are just so much better.

[KitsuneRommel]

Lumikki wrote...

I think hardest krogan was in Liara resque mission, but even that I killed with pistol only.

Depends. That guy died in few seconds for me.

[KitsuneRommel]

bjdbwea wrote...

There are also some side missions that are so simple, it's ridiculous. You can't even lose. These missions felt like out of a game for little children. Which ME 2 is obviously not, so why implement stuff like that?

I don't get the hate. Should every mission have shooting or tower of hanoi puzzle?

[tonnactus]

uberdowzen wrote...

For starters, you went through the whole of Mass Effect not knowing what you were actually trying to achieve.

Wrong.Stopping saren was the first goal.After some main missions shepardt then learn that he is only a puppet,used by a reaper.Find out,where/what the conduit is and how to get to the place.A lot of investigation.

Quite a large portion of the game is spent chasing leads which don't turn up anything. You know that the collector base is on the other end of the Omega 4 relay (because that's always where the Collectors come from).

We know exactly nothing.Is this really the only base?Is it on a planet?How strong are the defences?

When you're building the team, you don't know exactly what you'll face but a) you'll still need a team to investigate the collectors (I guess you should just do what you did in ME1 and hope some squadmates turn up while you're investigating) and surely not knowing what you're going to face would encourage you to build a more diverse team.

But the team isnt diverse.Not in gameplay and they dont have any special roles that only they could do.Three people could do the biotic bubble.Three people could to the hacking.3 people could be good leaders.(2 of them could do it for unknown reasons except garrus)

[spacehamsterZH]

Lumikki wrote...
If those two are counted as technical powers, then Kaidan and Liara will be Sentinel.

I don't understand what you're talking about. Kaidan's stat page says he's a Sentinel. The end.

[MPaBkaTa123]

You know what I frankly don't care at all whatever people keep shouting, whether about Mass Effect 1's problems with gameplay and characters or Mass Effect 2's problems with the main plot and again characters (for different reasons). People are free to discuss that and even if they flame each other it's their opinion they'll defend it. What I get annoyed by is the idiocy that the majority of the community wants ME back to where it was before, and that the majority is displeased with the game, when on a topic that is specifically designed to express disappointment, on a forum where the majority of people who may have problems will come to complain, Around 75% are not disappointed and 60% or so find the second game better. People can blame "console tards" and other idiot arguments all day long but the object fact proven by this topic's opening page is that the majority does not agree with the fact that Mass Effect 2 is an evil game whose story and characters are horrible, and that "going for the shooter crowd" was a horrible decision. Rant Over.

[KitsuneRommel]

tonnactus wrote...

But the team isnt diverse.Not in gameplay and they dont have any special roles that only they could do.Three people could do the biotic bubble.Three people could to the hacking.3 people could be good leaders.(2 of them could do it for unknown reasons except garrus)

Two biotics. Two hackers (without paying for DLC). You don't know why Miranda or Jacob are good leaders?

[Lumikki]

spacehamsterZH wrote...

Lumikki wrote...
If those two are counted as technical powers, then Kaidan and Liara will be Sentinel.

I don't understand what you're talking about. Kaidan's stat page says he's a Sentinel. The end.

What You don't understand?

I did not define those classes base what some stat page is saying, but what powers/skills those characters really have. To be sentinel, you need bionic and technical skills/powers. That is it, what defines what sentinel is.

Adept = bionic powers only
Engineer = technic powers only
Soldier = combat power only

Vanguard = combat & bionic powers
Infiltrator = combat & technic powers
Sentinel = bionic & technic powers

All classes of course have weapons, "armors" and "ammos", so those aren't counted as combat powers.

Modifié par Lumikki, 25 mai 2010 - 06:44 .

[bjdbwea]

KitsuneRommel wrote...

bjdbwea wrote...

There are also some side missions that are so simple, it's ridiculous. You can't even lose. These missions felt like out of a game for little children. Which ME 2 is obviously not, so why implement stuff like that?

I don't get the hate. Should every mission have shooting or tower of hanoi puzzle?

I wouldn't mind a few puzzles, but of course it wouldn't fit into a game where everything else was just dumbed down. Though to be fair, that puzzle in ME 1 was also far from challenging. And even DA didn't dare to challenge the players in that regard.

That said, can you really not see what's wrong with some N7 missions in ME 2? Press a button to collect a battery, then press the same button to insert it into a Mech. Repeat three times -> congratulations, mission well done. Or the mission with the shipwreck: Careful! On wrong step, and it might fall down! Only - it actually can't, and you couldn't even make a wrong step if you wanted, invisible barriers prevent it. So you stroll around, and at the end you press a button.

Really? This the kind of missions you enjoy?

[KitsuneRommel]

bjdbwea wrote...

Really? This the kind of missions you enjoy?

No. But neither do I enjoy "puzzles" that are so old and used that it would be hard to find a person who doesn't know how to solve them. That's really the problem with puzzles. You either make them too easy for some people or too hard for others.

Edit: Of course they could add another difficulty setting for those. I remember some games having something like that.

Modifié par KitsuneRommel, 25 mai 2010 - 06:50 .

[tonnactus]

spacehamsterZH wrote...
However, and this is a point you and many others seem to find completely impossible to grasp, the loyalty quests are completely optional.

Really?You dont need a minimum of them to trigger the collector ship trap? There arent some important weapon and armor upgrades in them?Good to know.

[tonnactus]

Lumikki wrote...

tonnactus wrote...

Yes,its a tactic.Without a biotic the krogans would overwhelm you easily.

I did not need any tactics against krogans, just shoot them dead with you pistol. I actually did sometimes run straid up agaist charcing krogan and killed it before it even reach me. Just let you gun blaze and that's it. I think hardest krogan was in Liara resque mission, but even that I killed with pistol only.

Not on insanity.

[Lumikki]

tonnactus wrote...

spacehamsterZH wrote...
However, and this is a point you and many others seem to find completely impossible to grasp, the loyalty quests are completely optional.

Really?You dont need a minimum of them to trigger the collector ship trap? There arent some important weapon and armor upgrades in them?Good to know.

I think tonnactus is right, I don't think you don't need to loyalty mission to trigger main story missions. How ever, there are some dossiers what you need to recruit, before some options opens. How ever, I don't know what happens if you try to do final mission without any loyalty person's or without some upgrades to Normandy.

tonnactus wrote...

Lumikki wrote...

tonnactus
wrote...

Yes,its a tactic.Without a biotic the krogans would overwhelm you easily.

I did not need any tactics against krogans, just shoot them dead with you pistol. I actually did sometimes run straid up agaist charcing krogan and killed it before it even reach me. Just let you gun blaze and that's it. I think hardest krogan was in Liara resque mission, but even that I killed with pistol only.

Not on insanity.

Nope, that was just hardcore difficulty. I haven't played in insanity difficulty at all, it doesn't make game better, just more work.

KitsuneRommel wrote...

tonnactus wrote...

But the team isnt diverse.Not in gameplay and they dont have any special roles that only they could do.Three people could do the biotic bubble.Three people could to the hacking.3 people could be good leaders.(2 of them could do it for unknown reasons except garrus)

Two biotics. Two hackers (without paying for DLC). You don't know why Miranda or Jacob are good leaders?

I don't get this. There is 5 bionic, 3 hackers (engineer) and 3 leaders without DLC's. Miranda has even leadership skill. I don't know why Jacob is so good on leader, but he was corsair.

Modifié par Lumikki, 25 mai 2010 - 07:33 .

[bjdbwea]

KitsuneRommel wrote...

bjdbwea wrote...

Really? This the kind of missions you enjoy?

No.

So we have a consensus. The rest of the N7 missions is shooting stuff, pretty much like in ME 1. Only there we had spoken (de)briefings, planet exploration as well as interaction with NPCs and choices during the missions. At the least they should've cut the dumb and useless ones of the N7 missions, and instead added some depth to the others. Then we would have less side missions, but at least they might be interesting.

[tonnactus]

KitsuneRommel wrote...


Is it a tactic to bring a techie to open boxes too? Actually that's the only reason to bring one. Biotics (especially Singularity) are just so much better.

Stop enemy biotics with damping.Stop enemies shooting with sabotage at you like geth primes or titans.(if you dont take the sniper rifle as a bonus and fight them at near distance at early levels)
Stop rocket drones shooting rockets at you.Ai-hacking is great.You mentioned the two geth destroyers on the geth incursions...

Fighting geth colossus and/or armatures on foot was great with someone that could hack and sabotage them.

Modifié par tonnactus, 25 mai 2010 - 07:12 .

[tonnactus]

KitsuneRommel wrote...


Two biotics. Two hackers (without paying for DLC). You don't know why Miranda or Jacob are good leaders?

Two is to much because so there not real specialists anymore.Yes,i dont know.I dont play Galaxies,so maybee i miss some important background.From what i know neither Miranda or Jacob ever lead big teams in dangerous situations.If you choose jacob,miranda even told that this was his first commando....(survive eden prime and fight on his own in galaxies according to wikia)
Dont come with the argument that the game told me so....
You see,this game make a lot sense.

[KitsuneRommel]

tonnactus wrote...

Stop enemy biotics with damping.Stop enemies shooting with sabotage at you like geth primes or titans.(if you dont take the sniper rifle as a bonus and fight them at near distance at early levels)
Stop rocket drones shooting rockets at you.Ai-hacking is great.You mentioned the two geth destroyers on the geth incursions...

Fighting geth colossus and/or armatures on foot was great with someone that could hack and sabotage them.

Yes, but that was 30 levels ago. You know how I fought 2 Geth Armatures and 3 Geth Destroyers (the ones with rapid fire rocket launchers) in Feros skyway? Ran around them keeping the Destroyers in Singularity and Armatures Lifted or Thrown.