10273 réponses à ce sujet

[Ecael]

tonnactus wrote...

Ecael wrote...


The Mass Effect trilogy was designed with that purpose. The gun combat (and ground vehicle combat) illustrates this.

Crap.What weapons soldiers should use in a sci fi rpg? Light swords? But even kotor have pistols,so they target the shooter crowd too?
When we talk about progression. Now shepardt could use a sniper rifle but is too dumb to use some type of ammo without points in it?
This made more sense i guess...
Does this progression made sense? Its interesting enough that no one complaint that shepardt has to learn biotic and tech attacks too.

It doesn't, realistically. Then again, Mass Effect is not supposed to be realistic.

Still, the trilogy itself targets the "shooter" crowd.

[Orchomene]

fidgit.com/archives/2010/06/11_ways_alpha_protocol_is_bett.php

fidgit.com/archives/2010/01/ten_things_gone_terribly_wrong.php

Modifié par Orchomene, 03 juin 2010 - 02:50 .

[Arwyl]

Jebel Krong wrote...

that's lovely: should i write a note to bioware to tailor the game exclusively for you in the future? because other people might like another location to be included on the disc rather than somewhere we've already exhausted before....
in an ideal world, sure, why wouldn't you go back to places you've been before - not just the citadel, but all the planets, but this isn't real-life and DVD-9 disc-space is very restrictive.

Nah... No need to write notes to anyone. If you take the time to read some of the 160 pages of this thread, and a couple of other threads too, you'll realise you're actually the only one claiming that the presidium is fine as it is in ME 2.

[tonnactus]

Orchomene wrote...


Asking about Samara and Thane is not asking about the main mission which is not recruiting people but stoping the collectors.

Ashley always gave her view about the main missions you done.This is also something that doesnt exist in the sequel

[tonnactus]

[quote]bjdbwea wrote...

[quote]Ecael wrote...


The most ridiculous one is perhaps the one with the slave trader on Illium who stands there all day, just waiting for you to talk to the possible buyer... who stands virtually right next to her, of course also with nothing else to do. A prime example of dumbing down and "streamlining" the game. Can't have the player "waste" their time walking a few steps, right? Everything has to be immediate.
[/quote]

I have to disagree there.Remember the asari on noveria who offer you a spy job.

[Ecael]

You messed up the quote tags there, Tonn.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Samara's loyalty mission was pretty much Noveria minus the terrible

[Lumikki]

Ecael wrote...

You messed up the quote tags there, Tonn.

He does that about 50% of time, what makes hard to read who wrote and what.

Modifié par Lumikki, 03 juin 2010 - 02:56 .

[Ecael]

tonnactus wrote...

Orchomene wrote...


Asking about Samara and Thane is not asking about the main mission which is not recruiting people but stoping the collectors.

Ashley always gave her view about the main missions you done.This is also something that doesnt exist in the sequel

There's quite a few squadmates that give their opinion on every mission. Joker even does this in Mass Effect 2.

[bjdbwea]

Ecael wrote...

I don't see how making it easier for the player to enjoy conversation is dumbing down the game.

Because it's totally unrealistic? It destroys any immersion and any chance of me enjoying the quest / conversation, if while listening I have to think about how unrealistic it is that this guy stands right there. Proper game design doesn't just drop NPCs somewhere and tack a quest on. Of course ME 1 didn't have day and night cycles or anything complicated like that either, but you can at least invest some effort into creating the illusion of a living world. As I said before, NPCs constantly repeating their "funny" conversations aren't helping either.

BioWare of all sorts should know better. But as Mr. Woo said, the game had to be "immediate". Even if that makes it ridiculous and dumb, apparently.

Modifié par bjdbwea, 03 juin 2010 - 02:56 .

[Ecael]

Orchomene wrote...

fidgit.com/archives/2010/06/11_ways_alpha_protocol_is_bett.php

fidgit.com/archives/2010/01/ten_things_gone_terribly_wrong.php

One way Alpha Protocol is not better than Mass Effect 2:

Alpha Protocol 66.76%
Mass Effect 2 95.74%

[Ecael]

bjdbwea wrote...

Ecael wrote...

I don't see how making it easier for the player to enjoy conversation is dumbing down the game.

Because it's totally unrealistic? It destroys any immersion and any chance of me enjoying the quest / conversation, if while listening I have to think about how unrealistic it is that this guy stands right there. Proper game design doesn't just drop NPCs somewhere and tack a quest on. Of course ME 1 didn't have day and night cycles or anything complicated like that either, but you can at least invest some effort into creating the illusion of a living world. As I said before, NPCs constantly repeating their "funny" conversations aren't helping either.

BioWare of all sorts should know better. But as Mr. Woo said, the game had to be "immediate". Even if that makes it ridiculous and dumb, apparently.

Like tonnactus said, there's quite a few quests in Mass Effect 1 that are guilty of the same exact thing.

Mass Effect was always "immediate". Are both games ridiculous and dumb then?

[Orchomene]

Ecael wrote...

Orchomene wrote...

fidgit.com/archives/2010/06/11_ways_alpha_protocol_is_bett.php

fidgit.com/archives/2010/01/ten_things_gone_terribly_wrong.php

One way Alpha Protocol is not better than Mass Effect 2:

Alpha Protocol 66.76%
Mass Effect 2 95.74%

This is now really ridiculous. I've never trusted critics for a good reason : I don't like "hyped" games, I like good games. Critics for games are not at all reliable.

[Ecael]

Orchomene wrote...

Ecael wrote...

Orchomene wrote...

fidgit.com/archives/2010/06/11_ways_alpha_protocol_is_bett.php

fidgit.com/archives/2010/01/ten_things_gone_terribly_wrong.php

One way Alpha Protocol is not better than Mass Effect 2:

Alpha Protocol 66.76%
Mass Effect 2 95.74%

This is now really ridiculous. I've never trusted critics for a good reason : I don't like "hyped" games, I like good games. Critics for games are not at all reliable.

Except there's near unanimous agreement that Alpha Protocol is mediocre, while there's near unanimous agreement that Mass Effect 2 is great.

But you're right. Sometimes it's hard to trust the critics, especially with first impressions...

http://www.destructo...ing-40483.phtml

"[Mass Effect 1's] gameplay looks like your standard FPS fare, which is to say that I didn't see anything great or remarkable..."

http://news.filefron...-disappointing/

"Even the action they showed though looked all too familiar: moving a targeting reticule around and shooting at enemies in real time. [Mass Effect 1] didn’t feel like an RPG, but more like a third-person shooter with RPG elements (which we didn’t get to see in action either)."

http://www.dailygame...ives/005656.php

"Using these weapons is much different than simply upgrading and creating lightsabers in KOTOR, though, as the combat in Mass Effect is entirely real time. Basically, Mass Effect is a third-person tactical shooter, much like Rainbow Six played in third-person mode."

http://previews.team...Mass-Effect/p1/

"While it can definitely be classified as an RPG, Mass Effect is a third-person shooter that features a nice variety of combat elements."

http://www.gamespot....id=m-1-41285859

"I was shocked that this game was as bad as it was. I expected to be a new KotOR but it was far from it...

I understand this game was pretty sweet, but, honestly, who wants to die in 2 bullets, wait 5 minutes for your health to recharge to full, wait like 1 minute to use a medkit again, ALWAYS have your teammates dying, and then button mash lift/throw/RT/warp, and STILL lose, and then start back from the last save point?"

Mass Effect being criticized for being a dumbed down third-person shooter? Where have I heard this before?

Modifié par Ecael, 03 juin 2010 - 03:06 .

[bjdbwea]

Orchomene wrote...

This is now really ridiculous. I've never trusted critics for a good reason : I don't like "hyped" games, I like good games. Critics for games are not at all reliable.

This, absolutely. Actually, if the people who gave ME 2 all that ridiculously exaggerated praise now bash AP, maybe that one is worth a closer look after all.

[Jebel Krong]

Orchomene wrote...

Jebel Krong wrote...
again: huh? so on noveria you could ask about benezia, but Illium you couldn't ask about samara/thane? Omega was all about the reapers: they were behind the plague, remember?

Asking about Samara and Thane is not asking about the main mission which is not recruiting people but stoping the collectors. About the plague, it was so well explained that it came from the reapers that I forgot about it.
Of course you can say I'm biased since I don't like ME2 as a game nor as a story. I've lost interest at the story about half way in the game because I didn't find any interest in it. Thus, nothing was really memorable to me in the game and since I also don't think there is any replayability in the game but just trying another class to see how it plays ( and I don't like how the game is played, thus I don't really want to try again), there is no way I remember a lot of tthe overall story. ME1 was ok, ME2 doesn't give me the desire to see how the story will end.

recruiting samara and thane for the suicide mission was part of the main game, it's just as valid as asking about benezia, who was only saren's 2nd. but that's ok, mature storytelling isn't for everyone.... and the me2 defenders are supposed to be the "no attention-span, immediacy-needing shooter-crowd" :innocent:

[KitsuneRommel]

bjdbwea wrote...

Because it's totally unrealistic? It destroys any immersion and any chance of me enjoying the quest / conversation, if while listening I have to think about how unrealistic it is that this guy stands right there.

Same people spending the entire time you are on missions sitting in the same bar kind of immersion breaking? Or Shepard the supersoldier getting 1000x times better at fighting during the ME1 campaign than he did during all his previous training and combat experience? I still managed to enjoy ME1 despite that plot hole the size of OJ 287.

[Ecael]

bjdbwea wrote...

Orchomene wrote...

This is now really ridiculous. I've never trusted critics for a good reason : I don't like "hyped" games, I like good games. Critics for games are not at all reliable.

This, absolutely. Actually, if the people who gave ME 2 all that ridiculously exaggerated praise now bash AP, maybe that one is worth a closer look after all.

You are aware that Mass Effect 1 got much praise after it was released, correct?

Judging by the reviews (and your standards for what defines an RPG), prepare to be disappointed heavily by Alpha Protocol.

[tonnactus]

Exzellent party banter in Mass Effect:





Something like this didnt exist in the sequel.

[Ecael]

tonnactus wrote...

Exzellent party banter in Mass Effect:


Something like this didnt exist in the sequel.

The two starting characters in one conversation counts as banter?

You did notice all the bickering between Miranda and Jacob starting from Lazarus all the way to the end, right?

[tonnactus]

Ecael wrote...

tonnactus wrote...

Exzellent party banter in Mass Effect:


Something like this didnt exist in the sequel.

The two starting characters in one conversation counts as banter?

You did notice all the bickering between Miranda and Jacob starting from Lazarus all the way to the end, right?

You mean the "briefing" after shepardt gets to the "only available shuttle"(there were three of them).

[Lumikki]

Ecael wrote...

You are aware that Mass Effect 1 got much praise after it was released, correct?

Ecael I don't think you can make others see how biased they are, because they dislike. It's short of blinds them to see what you say. When people don't like something, they seem to see everyting  bad to related what they don't like and something what they like, everyting is so good.

How ever, there is also some truth on some comments, even if most of them are just whining very small details.

Example ME2 story was fine, but story telling was not good at all. It had alot of plot holes and it also seem that some people did not even understand the story at all. Example they did not understand why Shepard was recruiting and doing loyalty missions.

Also ME2's character development and customation was simplified alot, way too much, what wasn't really that good. People usually like alot customation and making character development direction choises. Now in ME2 it was so minimal and general. When players like bigger variety and more personal customation.

These where the two major problems in ME2, all other complains are minor detail stuff. Some of them are even totally based players own taste of game style.

Modifié par Lumikki, 03 juin 2010 - 03:39 .

[Jebel Krong]

tonnactus wrote...

Ecael wrote...

tonnactus wrote...

Exzellent party banter in Mass Effect:


Something like this didnt exist in the sequel.

The two starting characters in one conversation counts as banter?

You did notice all the bickering between Miranda and Jacob starting from Lazarus all the way to the end, right?

You mean the "briefing" after shepardt gets to the "only available shuttle"(there were three of them).

on-ship banter after (and before) some of the later missions, the repercussions of jacob's loyalty mission, you miss all those conversations?

Modifié par Jebel Krong, 03 juin 2010 - 03:38 .

[bjdbwea]

Lumikki wrote...

These where the two major problems in ME2, all other complains are minor detail stuff. Some of them are even totally based players own taste of game style.

Oh, really. Whereas your opinion is the objective measurement. Of course.

[Ecael]

tonnactus wrote...

Ecael wrote...

tonnactus wrote...
Exzellent party banter in Mass Effect:


Something like this didnt exist in the sequel.

The two starting characters in one conversation counts as banter?

You did notice all the bickering between Miranda and Jacob starting from Lazarus all the way to the end, right?

You mean the "briefing" after shepardt gets to the "only available shuttle"(there were three of them).

No, I mean the 1,202 lines Jacob has and 1,266 lines Miranda has throughout the game, a lot of it dealing with Cerberus, the other Cerberus operative, The Illusive Man or the Collectors.