10273 réponses à ce sujet

[Lusitanum]

tonnactus wrote...

Colossus armor begins to drop at level 40 like savant and prodigy amps.The money for spectre weapons you get far earlier in the game. The difference between the first savant and savant x isnt that big anyway.

You still don't get the best equipment without the side missions. That's the point: you get more rewards if you do the side missions than if you don't as with ME2, even if you can still beat the game.

tonnactus wrote...

That is your opinion.Dont forget
that.Enemies have immunity too(at least on insanity).Yes,you could
charge in combat with immunity,but gain nothing without having someone
who did some crowd control.

Right, that's why even when swarmed by enemies and with my two squadmates down I still could fend off wave after wave of enemies, even in Survival mode in Pinnacle Station. At a given point I was so sick of killing the same enemies over and over again for the last 8 minutes that I actually started blindfolding myself. "OK, now no more Unity. *kills several enemies* Right; no Immunity from now on. *another slaughterfest later* No more using medi-gel *kill, kill, KILL!* OK, these guys are getting slaughtered and my health regeneration is healing me faster than they can injure me. What's next, I have to restrict myself from shooting them?"

And, incidentally, that's just what I had to do: stop shooting and camp in front of a Krogan's shotgun until he killed me. And it took him about 15 seconds to do even that.

tonnactus wrote...

And
you have to explain what is different now.In the first game,you spam
immunity,now you spam adrenaline rush,cloak,or singularity. At least
people used more powers frequently in MAss Effect then just one or two
over and over.

My last ME1 playthrough: Immunity + W key + LMB = not a single death in the whole game.

This ME2 playthrough: Rush to enemy "OH CRAP, half my health is gone, got to find cov-"*dead*

Same difficulty level, same exact character and class, totally different results. Now I'm actually using tactics, dealing with fancy terms like "flanking", "cover fire", "shooting intervals" and leaving my squad powers deactivated so I always have the power I need when I eventually need it, instead of just saying "yeah, just spam those powers all at once. I don't actually need them, but at least I'll clear this room faster".

That's the difference.

[7a7ec]

You are using tactics in ME2 ? lol ....
This is the same as saying I am using tactics in call of duty game ...

Modifié par 7a7ec, 23 juin 2010 - 07:07 .

[Vena_86]

Lusitanum wrote...
Although it's not like we need the unnecesariily big worlds of the first game that just looked like bland, empty obstacles that you had to surpass with the goddamned moving bathtub with springs for wheels that someone once dared call a "vehicle" (yes, Mako, I still hate you with a passion and I think I always will). That was just tedious, annoying and one of the main reasons why people stoped playing the game halfway through it (the fact that they usually came from the incredibly boring Citadel and got dropped right into a Mako section didn't help... ).

Just looking at all the footage from satilites that are beeing published recently, like the one showing the huge symetric obelisk on phobos (the moon of mars) makes me want to land right there and see up close what the hell is up with that. That would be an adventure which doesnt need hot alien chicks, bullets and explosions. It would not matter that the rest of the planet/moon is bland and lifeless.
Mass Effect had huge potential for this kind of thing. I was excited when I suddenly saw a pyramid in the middle of the wasteland of a lifeless planet. Then came the dissappointment that there was nothing to do, nothing to discover.
There I was hoping for BioWare to really make use of the potential that comes with their established franchise in the sequel. So the dissappointment was even bigger when it turned out that the game almost abbandones the space exploration aspect which a CoD MW could never provide. Instead the focus was put on prefabricated looking level corridors filled with non-stop action which every other game has already. It leaves no chance to really dive into a believeable world/universe.
Developers trade a believable atmosphear with action any time these days and many players forget what "immersion" means. So each time "nothing" is happening its interpreted as boring and pointless.
Well, I think action followed by more action becomes boring and pointless too. There need to be moments of silence (specially in space!) where other things than taking someones life are interesting. As long as it is presented in a believable way, this can give players far more memorable moments then another explosion.
No matter how good of a game ME2 is, I feel BioWare is really wasting the potential of the franchise by pushing out another cover based TPS. Its like opening a Burger King next to McDonalds. Instead of gooing where no man has gone before, ME2 lets us go exactly where everyone has gone before and ME1 is not much better at that.

[tonnactus]

spacehamsterZH wrote...
 Yes, the looting's been neutered and the stats system has been "streamlined" a bit too much, but upgrading your powers, especially when you get to level four and choose a specialization, very directly and noticeably affects combat and goes well beyond a simple rise in damage output.

What?? The difference in area between heavy overload or area is so small that it is always better to choose the heavy version. And all those specialisation are something to laugh at. Basic overload had a better range in the first game then "evolved" overload in the second.

Modifié par tonnactus, 23 juin 2010 - 07:31 .

[tonnactus]

Lusitanum wrote...


You still don't get the best equipment without the side missions. That's the point: you get more rewards if you do the side missions than if you don't as with ME2, even if you can still beat the game.

I dont know what you mean?? What is better then savant x and spectre weapons?

tonnactus wrote...

Right, that's why even when swarmed by enemies and with my two squadmates down I still could fend off wave after wave of enemies, even in Survival mode in Pinnacle Station.

What difficulty/mission?Because even wrex could go down when a pack of geth destroyers charge him?
And in insanity,a soldier couldnt defeat enemies without warp in a acceptable time.(at least mercs)

My last ME1 playthrough: Immunity + W key + LMB = not a single death in the whole game.

This ME2 playthrough: Rush to enemy "OH CRAP, half my health is gone, got to find cov-"*dead*

Mabyee you should start from level one on insanity in Mass Effect.Before you got good armor and master immunity,at least krogans could kill you very easy and fast just with melee.Even the bouncer in choras den could do that if you dont use kaidans crowd control skills.
Krogans know are not that dangerous,even in melee mode.

Modifié par tonnactus, 23 juin 2010 - 08:32 .

[Lusitanum]

tonnactus wrote...

I
dont know what you mean?? What is better then savant x and spectre
weapons?

Nothing. And you won't get them by just completing the main quests.

tonnactus wrote...

Right, that's
why even when swarmed by enemies and with my two squadmates down I still
could fend off wave after wave of enemies, even in Survival mode in
Pinnacle Station.

What difficulty/mission?Because
even wrex could go down when a pack of geth destroyers charge him?
And
in insanity,a soldier couldnt defeat enemies without warp in a
acceptable time.(at least mercs)

I've just said it: Pinnacle Station. Survival mode.

And we're not talking Insanity here, we're talking the normal modes. You know, the ones most people play so we can have a decent frame of reference.

tonnactus wrote...

Mabyee
you should start from level one on insanity in Mass Effect.Before you
got good armor and master immunity,at least krogans could kill you very
easy and fast just with melee.Even the bouncer in choras den could do
that if you dont use kaidans crowd control skills.
Krogans know are
not that dangerous,even in melee mode.

Again, we're talking normal levels here. Casual to Veteran. The ones that most people play. But just for the sake of the discussion, I'll humour you.

I did play Insanity on Mass Effect. And it wasn't hard, it was boring and a test of my patience. The game didn't become hard due to a genuine offer of a bigger challenge, it just tipped the odds in its favor by giving everyone insane amounts of health.

Even clearing a room became a chore because you would damage an enemy and then he'd run away and recover while his fully recovered buddys kept shooting at you. It was a battle of atrition, not a test of skill.

Oh, and thank Jesus there are no more bullrushing Krogans in ME2! Those were by far the cheapest thing in the first game, bullrushing you with a shotgun and aiming for you and only you because that's all they needed to get you to a Game Over screen. Again, that's not a challenge, that's being cheap.

7a7ec wrote...

You are using tactics in ME2 ? lol ....
This is the same as saying I am using tactics in call of duty game ...

Hemm... yes? The moment that you have to take the aspects I mentioned into consideration, we're talking about "tactics". It's not the best or deepest of tactical games, but they are tactics.

And yes, you could also use tactics in a CoD game, it just depends on what you're doing. Are you playing by yourself and just shooting bad guy after bad guy throughout an endless series of corridors, then no, you're not really using a lot of tactics. Now, if you're playing with a team and you're actually trying to use the specific strenghts of each of your members and using the terraint to your advantage to take down your enemy, then you are using tactics.

And that's what I do in ME2. It's been a long time since I've felt more satisfied in a fight than in this one, where I can take down an enemy squad by prioritizing, positioning my squad in an effective way and using their different abilities to take my enemies down one by one. And in the end, I actually smile at the enjoyment I'm getting from the fight.

Modifié par Lusitanum, 23 juin 2010 - 08:43 .

[tonnactus]

7a7ec wrote...

You are using tactics in ME2 ? lol ....
This is the same as saying I am using tactics in call of duty game ...

Yes,really,what tactics?? Most usefull powers are just defense stripping powers instead of those who could disable an enemy.

[Lusitanum]

tonnactus wrote...

7a7ec wrote...

You are using tactics in ME2 ? lol ....
This is the same as saying I am using tactics in call of duty game ...

Yes,really,what tactics?? Most usefull powers are just defense stripping powers instead of those who could disable an enemy.

Would you kindly quote all the people you want to quote in a single post? Not only it's a pain to edit a post after you, but double (and even triple) posting is considered to be spamming and kind of frowned upon.

Thank you.

[Iakus]

nelly21 wrote...

@ iakus

Okay. Garrus I could concede on then. I don't recall the conversation about reapplying to the Spectres but if it's there, your premise would work.

Samara, however, is different. You're recruiting a justicar specifically because she is a powerful warrior that does not answer to any government organization. This is important. Remember, Shepard's mission isn't sanctioned officially. Technically, he's rogue. Therefore, it stands to reason that the Council would forbid an Asari officer from joining Shepard.

Lastly; wouldn't your proposal for the Thane loyalty mission simply add a few forced and ultimately meaningless conversations to the mix? I have to speak to Chorban because he had a ten minute cameo in ME 1? It would feel needless.

First:  Garrus thanks you for your help, and tells you he's going back to C-Sec and reapplying for Spectre training, but now he feels he's doing it for the right reasons. "if the people I'm sworn to protect can't trust me, then I don't deserve to be the one protecting them"

re Samara:  There's a lot of "powerful warriors" in the dossiers.  Kinda light on specialists.  At least useful ones. No ship officers, no demolition experts.  Mordin's the closest thing to a medic.  Gotta wonder if they had a proper ship's officer if the order to "get in close and finish them off" would have been given.

At any rate, this is just one idea I had to potentially link events from ME 1 to ME 2.  I'm not a writer of any kind and can't say if this would work with any certainty.  If such an idea were to be implemented, I'm sure something could be worked into the recruitment mission to justify her.  If not, maybe Samara has a sister on the Ascension, a mate, a close friend.  Point being, a good way to see what kind of effect the galaxy-spanning decisions made in ME 1 would have been to see what your desicions did to affect those closest to Shepard.  Namely the squadmates.

Thane's mission:  I prefer to think of it as, "Who do I know on the Citadel that can help me?"  i don't see it as being a forced conversation any more than talking to Captain Bailey (not that hearing Michael Hogan's voice wasn't cool) .  It could even be incorporated as a shortcut, allowing a player to skip ahead.  If a more "official" information type is needed, how about Executor Pallin, Barla Von, or Detective Chellik instead?

Again, these is just ideas which I know can't really fit seemlessly into what ultimately ended up becoming the missions.  I'm just floating ideas that perhaps could have been used to make choices in  ME 1 more relevant to ME 2

[tonnactus]

iakus wrote...

Thane's mission:  I prefer to think of it as, "Who do I know on the Citadel that can help me?"  i don't see it as being a forced conversation any more than talking to Captain Bailey (not that hearing Michael Hogan's voice wasn't cool) .  It could even be incorporated as a shortcut, allowing a player to skip ahead.  If a more "official" information type is needed, how about Executor Pallin, Barla Von, or Detective Chellik instead?

Executor Pallin is dead i guess.Because chellick is the executor now.

[Iakus]

Vena_86 wrote...

Developers trade a believable atmosphear with action any time these days and many players forget what "immersion" means. So each time "nothing" is happening its interpreted as boring and pointless.
Well, I think action followed by more action becomes boring and pointless too. There need to be moments of silence (specially in space!) where other things than taking someones life are interesting. As long as it is presented in a believable way, this can give players far more memorable moments then another explosion.

QFT

[Iakus]

tonnactus wrote...

iakus wrote...

Thane's mission:  I prefer to think of it as, "Who do I know on the Citadel that can help me?"  i don't see it as being a forced conversation any more than talking to Captain Bailey (not that hearing Michael Hogan's voice wasn't cool) .  It could even be incorporated as a shortcut, allowing a player to skip ahead.  If a more "official" information type is needed, how about Executor Pallin, Barla Von, or Detective Chellik instead?

Executor Pallin is dead i guess.Because chellick is the executor now.

You're right, Chellick is the new Executor.  Though it wasn't said that Pallin is dead. Still fact remains that Shepard has a (potential) in at C-Sec

[tonnactus]

Lusitanum wrote...

I did play Insanity on Mass Effect. And it wasn't hard, it was boring and a test of my patience. The game didn't become hard due to a genuine offer of a bigger challenge, it just tipped the odds in its favor by giving everyone insane amounts of health.

It was quite challenging when starting at level one.Mass Effect 2 is not even challenging at the beginning because all powers have a really small cooldown right at the start.

Even clearing a room became a chore because you would damage an enemy and then he'd run away and recover while his fully recovered buddys kept shooting at you. It was a battle of atrition, not a test of skill.

When it becomes a chore you dont use the right squadmates or their talents in the right way. Lift and/or singularity,warp and even the mercs in the tonn actus base get killed fast on insanity.(also with some poison ammo that prevents regeneration)

Oh, and thank Jesus there are no more bullrushing Krogans in ME2! Those were by far the cheapest thing in the first game, bullrushing you with a shotgun and aiming for you and only you because that's all they needed to get you to a Game Over screen. Again, that's not a challenge, that's being cheap.

And how is this different now? Whenever i enter a combat in Mass Effect 2,all enemies concentrate their fire on shepardt and mostly ignore squadmates.

Modifié par tonnactus, 23 juin 2010 - 10:16 .

[Lusitanum]

smudboy wrote...

More?  I didn't know Harbinger had any.  Far as I recall, he was a windup doll prattling random sentences, minus
the string.

Wasn't that... you know, kind of the whole point?

Weren't the Collector's mere tools of the Reapers, with no will and motivation of their own, dedicated solely to serving their masters?

The only difference from Saren is that at least the Harbinger is an actual threat to Shepard in combat. He keeps showing up, boosts the defence and attack of a given enemy and even if you kill it, he'll just show up someplace else.

Complainingabout his lack of personality in this case is like complaining about how Nemesis on Resident Evil 3 wasn't a well-develloped character: he's not supposed to, he's just meant to be a constant threat to you throughout the game. And at least the Harbinger isn't defeated by a measly Lift power, unlike Saren.

tonnactus wrote...

It was quite challenging when starting at level one.Mass Effect 2 is not even challenging at the beginning because all powers have a really small cooldown right at the start.

Yeah, small cooldown, but your shields go down quick too, so you actually have to manage them this time.

And again, Insanity in ME1 wasn't challenging because it never actually asked you to be better at the game, it just forced you to shoot at people a lot more and to ridiculous amounts. The moment that I found myself shooting a prone guy in the ass with my shotgun while he merely twitched as a reaction (as if he were enjoying it) I just thought to myself "Something is very, very wrong here".

That's not a challenge, that's just a test of your patience.

tonnactus wrote...

When it becomes a chore you dont use the right squadmates or their talents in the right way. Lift and/or singularity,warp and even the mercs in the tonn actus base get killed fast on insanity.(also with some poison ammo that prevents regeneration)

Yeah, I did all that, I needed to have biotics to deal with all those rushing Krogans, didn't I? And again, it wasn't a challenge, it was a chore because it felt like the game was just lazily slowing me down by giving everyone obscene ammounts of health.

When you get to the point where even the an Asari scientist on Virmire, a bookworm, has the endurance to resist dozens of your bullets with Immunity, that's when I pull the BS card on the game.

tonnactus wrote...

And how is this different now? Whenever i enter a combat in Mass Effect 2,all enemies concentrate their fire on shepardt and mostly ignore squadmates.

It's different in the sense that now I don't have to use all my biotic powers just to keep Pushing/LIfting/pulling into a Singularity (yeah, having all those different powers who all had the same effect really made the game a lot deeper, didn't it?) all the Krogans that decide to bullrush me (and only me) and if the enemies in ME2 keep focusing their fire solely on Shepard then that's because you're the one closer to them and are therefore the primary target.

If you send someone to the frontlines, they will start aiming for them instead. They won't all suddenly shift their attention, but they'll react differently to each threat.

Modifié par Lusitanum, 23 juin 2010 - 10:57 .

[Seipher05]

Lusitanum wrote...
Wasn't that... you know, kind of the whole point?

Weren't the Collector's mere tools of the Reapers, with no will and motivation of their own, dedicated solely to serving their masters?

The only difference from Saren is that at least the Harbinger is an actual threat to Shepard in combat. He keeps showing up, boosts the defence and attack of a given enemy and even if you kill it, he'll just show up someplace else.

Complainingabout his lack of personality in this case is like complaining about how Nemesis on Resident Evil 3 wasn't a well-develloped character: he's not supposed to, he's just meant to be a constant threat to you throughout the game. And at least the Harbinger isn't defeated by a measly Lift power, unlike Saren.

Umm, Harbinger is a Reaper, not a Collector, so his lack of personality is definitely a legitimate gripe...

Lusitanum wrote...
It's different in the sense that now I don't have to use all my biotic powers just to keep Pushing/LIfting/pulling into a Singularity (yeah, having all those different powers who all had the same effect really made the game a lot deeper, didn't it?)

Instead, now you have to spam Warp to lower Armor, after you've used your gun to lower Shields, since both those abilities effectively cancel the vast majority of the Biotics avaialble to you, so how is it any different? 

Lusitanum wrote...
...all the Krogans that decide to bullrush me (and only me)... 

While I agree that the Krogan's focusing exclusively on Shephard was rediculous, weren't you the one talking about how much more "tactical" the gameplay in ME2 is? The krogan bullrush was an excellent tactic, and truly made the Krogan a viable challenge. Now? Krogan are a joke, easily one of the weakest, most ineffective combatants out there.

I also take issue with your claim about the tactical depth of ME2. While the combat is certainly better than in ME1, it basically boils down to "take cover at conviniently located wall/barrier/crate" and one of "shoot enemies who stay under cover but don't close with you and still occasionally pop out so you can hit them" or "shoot enemies who use no cover and rush you". At least, that was the experience I had...

[tonnactus]

Lusitanum wrote...

smudboy wrote...

More?  I didn't know Harbinger had any.  Far as I recall, he was a windup doll prattling random sentences, minus
the string.

And at least the Harbinger isn't defeated by a measly Lift power, unlike Saren.

Yes.Now one singularity to stun him and shoot him to death is enough.More then one singularity alone could even kill him,because the power destroy his defenses slowly.

And again, Insanity in ME1 wasn't challenging because it never actually asked you to be better at the game, it just forced you to shoot at people a lot more and to ridiculous amounts. The moment that I found myself shooting a prone guy in the ass with my shotgun while he merely twitched as a reaction (as if he were enjoying it) I just thought to myself "Something is very, very wrong here".

That's not a challenge, that's just a test of your patience.

And now? Some foot troopers are easily killed, like the geth troopers in the first game on all difficulties.
But elites like upper blue suns troopers,asari vanguards and krogans have still a big amount of health and protection.

And when it comes to subbosses like wasea they are just brickwalls of armor,health and barriers like in the first game.Not that much different from immunity spammers.

To make it worser,the "bosses" not even have some unique abillities.Asari commandos are just warp spammers like the lesser vanguards.They are not challenging,there are just tedious to kill.

Yeah, I did all that, I needed to have biotics to deal with all those rushing Krogans, didn't I? And again, it wasn't a challenge, it was a chore because it felt like the game was just lazily slowing me down by giving everyone obscene ammounts of health.

Warp was the answer to kill enemies fast on insanity.To immunity spammers,mercs and krogans.

tonnactus wrote...


It's different in the sense that now I don't have to use all my biotic powers just to keep Pushing/LIfting/pulling into a Singularity (yeah, having all those different powers who all had the same effect really made the game a lot deeper, didn't it?) all the Krogans that decide to bullrush me (and only me) and if the enemies in ME2 keep focusing their fire solely on Shepard then [i]that's because you're the one closer to them and are therefore the primary target.

They concentrate their fire on shepardt no matter at what range i am.And what do you mean that all biotics have the same effect in the first game???

Seipher05 wrote...
 Krogan are a joke, easily one of the
weakest, most ineffective combatants out there.

Yes,its
so funny.Slow dumb enemies that forgot how to use an an assault rifle and use shotguns at all ranges. The same it true for asari enemies now.But at least they take cover sometimes.

Its ridicolous that there isnt an enemy that use more then one weapon in the game. Mercs in the first use assault rifles at long to medium range and shotguns at small ranges.

Modifié par tonnactus, 23 juin 2010 - 11:43 .

[MEATBONES]

My hope is that these forums are viewed by the developers. I really REALLY wish the auto aim/aim assist could be disabled in ME2. I hate that I'm aiming where where an enemy is undercover, I scope (Infiltrator) with the sniper rifle and bam I'm scoping onto some other jerk while the one I was aiming at is empyting rounds into me.

I just want to be in control of what I'm pointing at, not have my view jerked over to whatever enemy is closest or whatever it's doing.

[Lusitanum]

Seipher05 wrote...

Umm, Harbinger is a Reaper, not a Collector, so his lack of personality is definitely a legitimate gripe...

Yeah, you're right, he's a Reaper, but then again, he's still an emotionless machine simply bent on eating everything up just to keep on surviving until the next purge. Bringing the Nemesis example back, there's not much in the way of motivation that you can put in it: the thing just wants to destroy you/eat you, they're not villains bent on shaping the world to a new order that they envisioned or something like that.

Seipher05 wrote...

Instead, now you have to spam Warp to lower Armor, after you've used your gun to lower Shields, since both those abilities effectively cancel the vast majority of the Biotics avaialble to you, so how is it any different?

Because "spamming" an ability and "using" it are not the same thing.

Seipher05 wrote...

While I agree that the Krogan's focusing exclusively on Shephard was rediculous, weren't you the one talking about how much more "tactical" the gameplay in ME2 is? The krogan bullrush was an excellent tactic, and truly made the Krogan a viable challenge. Now? Krogan are a joke, easily one of the weakest, most ineffective combatants out there.

"Excellent tactic?" Rush at MACH speed towards the enemy just because you have an obscene resistance to damage and kill you in 1-2 shots? That's not a tactic, that's just charging and shooting. Can't get much more brainless (and cheap) than that.

Seipher05 wrote...

I also take issue with your claim about the tactical depth of ME2. While the combat is certainly better than in ME1, it basically boils down to "take cover at conviniently located wall/barrier/crate" and one of "shoot enemies who stay under cover but don't close with you and still occasionally pop out so you can hit them" or "shoot enemies who use no cover and rush you". At least, that was the experience I had...

Don't know if you noticed, but I also said that I never said that ME2 combat was all that deep either and yes, it could certainly afford to get better  . And you basically covered my whole point: it wasn't all that deep but even what you mentioned had more tactical depth than previous Bioware games like ME1 or Dragon Age.

tonnactus wrote...

And now?
Some foot troopers are easily killed, like the geth troopers in the
first game on all difficulties.
But elites like upper blue suns
troopers,asari vanguards and krogans have still a big amount of health
and protection.

And yet they still go down faster than the Krogans in the first game if you have the right squad members and use their powers wisely. More than I can say for my squad in the first game.

tonnactus wrote...

And when it comes to subbosses like wasea they
are just brickwalls of armor,health and barriers like in the first
game.Not that much different from immunity spammers.

To make it
worser,the "bosses" not even have some unique abillities.Asari commandos
are just warp spammers like the lesser vanguards.They are not
challenging,there are just tedious to kill.

They're bosses and sub-bosses. The whole point is that they're supposed to be hard to kill. But, unlike the Krogan, there's not two or three of them in almost every base you go into.

tonnactus wrote...

Warp was the
answer to kill enemies fast on insanity.To immunity spammers,mercs and
krogans.

Used.

That.

Told you.

I used the biotics.

Please pay attention

tonnactus wrote...

They
concentrate their fire on shepardt no matter at what range i am.

No. No they don't. Some of them might keep shooting at you, but they won't all focus on you or your squad members would never die.

tonnactus wrote...

And what
do you mean that all biotics have the same effect in the first game???

"Oh crap, here comes a Krogan rughing at me again! *Push* He's getting up again for another rush and Push hasn't had time to cooldown yet! *Lift* Oh, great, here he comes again. *Singularity* Here comes another rush. Thankfully Push has had the time to cooldown now *Push*"

Latter, rinse, repeat.

Like I said, there's not much point on giving your squadmembers lots of different powers if you're just going to use them for the same thing anyway. At least when I use Miranda in ME, her Warp is used for one thing, her Overload for another and Slam for something else. Less than half the powers than Liara had, but I actually use her for more than just pushing keeping Krogan away from me and softening them up with Warp.

MEATBONES wrote...

My hope is that these forums are viewed
by the developers. I really REALLY wish the auto aim/aim assist could
be disabled in ME2. I hate that I'm aiming where where an enemy is
undercover, I scope (Infiltrator) with the sniper rifle and bam I'm
scoping onto some other jerk while the one I was aiming at is empyting
rounds into me.
I just want to be in control of what I'm pointing at,
not have my view jerked over to whatever enemy is closest or whatever
it's doing.

Isn't there an option in the settings menu
for that? At least I know there is on the PC version.

[Seipher05]

Lusitanum wrote...
Yeah, you're right, he's a Reaper, but then again, he's still an emotionless machine simply bent on eating everything up just to keep on surviving until the next purge. Bringing the Nemesis example back, there's not much in the way of motivation that you can put in it: the thing just wants to destroy you/eat you, they're not villains bent on shaping the world to a new order that they envisioned or something like that.

I dunno, I thought Sovreign was pretty cool, even though you really only have that brief exchange with him. I just thought it was a golden opportunity to actually give a "feel" for the Reapers, you know? Instead, he basically gives us the ME2 version of  "Enemies everywhere" and "I will destroy you"

Seipher05 wrote...
Because "spamming" an ability and "using" it are not the same thing.

But they're not. "Using" means I use it in roughly the same proportion that I do other powers. "Spamming" means I use it damn near exclusively. Warp is needed far more than any other Biotic power, with the possible exception of Singularity.

Seipher05 wrote...
"Excellent tactic?" Rush at MACH speed towards the enemy just because you have an obscene resistance to damage and kill you in 1-2 shots? That's not a tactic, that's just charging and shooting. Can't get much more brainless (and cheap) than that.

But that's how Krogan work. I believe the ME1 Codex even establishes this, as it says that their military tactics were originally based around brute force assaults, in which they basically used human wave assaults (obviously, this is before the genophage). In addition, Krogan are supposed to have "obscene resistance" that's one of the reasons they're so feared! While agree that a Krogan on the highest difficulty levels is broken, the challenge they posed on the upper ones was excellent IMO, and really did a great job conveying how powerful and dangerous they were.

Finally, "charging and shooting" is indeed a tactic, why do you think it isn't?

Lusitanum wrote...
Don't know if you noticed, but I also said that I never said that ME2 combat was all that deep either and yes, it could certainly afford to get better  . And you basically covered my whole point: it wasn't all that deep but even what you mentioned had more tactical depth than previous Bioware games like ME1 or Dragon Age.

Ok, maybe I misinterpreted your post. I just got the impression that, since you were talking about having to consider "flanks" and "bases of fire" etc, etc, that you were making out ME2 to be far more tactical than it actually is. I really didn't find it anymore "tactical" than I did GoW, but that's my opinion

[Lumikki]

Combat been tactical is about two thing, in my opinion.

Like what kind of possiblities game has to offer for use of tactics and second more like is tactics needed to solve situation. So, it's not so much did player use tactics, because player can deside to use it or not. It's just harder not to use tactics. How ever, sometimes game is so easy that tactics isn't needed, even if there is possibilities for it.

If player use allways same solution to everyting, then there is three possibilities. Player isn't even trying to find better solutions or there is no need for other solution or there is no other possiblity.

I would say that if player says there is no tactics in game, it's more about player not using tactics, than it's not there. Because most the time tactics is about player imagination to find other solutions.

Modifié par Lumikki, 24 juin 2010 - 04:27 .

[Seipher05]

Lusitanum wrote...
"Oh crap, here comes a Krogan rughing at me again! *Push* He's getting up again for another rush and Push hasn't had time to cooldown yet! *Lift* Oh, great, here he comes again. *Singularity* Here comes another rush. Thankfully Push has had the time to cooldown now *Push*"

Latter, rinse, repeat.

Like I said, there's not much point on giving your squadmembers lots of different powers if you're just going to use them for the same thing anyway. At least when I use Miranda in ME, her Warp is used for one thing, her Overload for another and Slam for something else. Less than half the powers than Liara had, but I actually use her for more than just pushing keeping Krogan away from me and softening them up with Warp.

So you only used Liara against Krogan?

[Splinter Cell 108]

My disappointment with ME2 is the lack of a lot of customization options. You can't change the armor on teamates, there isn't enough weapons to choose from, amps and omni tools were removed and other things. It seems like change = removal as far as the inventory goes. The inventory had problems but it could have been fixed. Then the armor for teamates, people like customization. Why remove something like that? I'm sure everyone would have liked to have their team wearing the same colors as Shepard.



Then there's armors, we only have 4 different sets of real armor since the others can't be customized and become boring after a while. Aside from that these armors are accesible however it can only be done through modding on the PC. Why remove options and especially options that worked correctly in the first game. There would be way more variety if the armor from ME1 wasn't unaccessible. Why not add as parts into the customizable armor or something? I'm pretty sure that it's upsetting to see that the enemies wear cooler armor and have something that the player can't get.



Another thing is NG+, yes I'm grateful it's there but the point of it was that it allowed for the story to be enjoyed without having to worry about leveling up. In ME2 it feels as if you are starting a new game at level 1 instead of feeling as tough as you did in ME1. The upgrades aren't kept, the player is forced to planet scan something that is terribly boring and also to look for and to buy the upgrades alll over again.



There's also stores which are completely useless after you get all the upgrades and armor. I bet there are more stores than in ME1. What's the point though? Once all upgrades and armor are bought then there is nothing to do with them.



There's also the little details I liked from ME1, I liked to be able to land in a place and stay on the ship like in ME1 when you went to the CItadel. That can't be done anymore, instead of going into the decontamination chamber or going outside of the ship we get boring loading screens.



I loved ME2 and all but I feel like there are things that should have not been removed because of that I like ME1 more than ME2. ME2 had a great story and enough dialogue although I didn't find anything as lengthy as Vigil's conversation in ME1. I would like all those things mentioned to come back to ME3 or to get them as DLC such as the ME1 armors even if they should've been there in the first place.

[Terror_K]

Lusitanum wrote...

"Near-perfect balance"? Are you kidding? The combat was by far the worst aspect of the whole game. It wasn't so bad as to kill the enyoyment of playing it, but it felt weak throughout the whole thing. You could go through the whole game by just charging headlong into enemy fire with Immunity on as a combat class or spam powers as a support class. And you call that a "perfect balance" when combat is what you spend most of the time doing in the game?

What you're talking about there isn't even balance-related; you're just stating how you felt the combat was flawed. I'm talking about the TPS to RPG ratio here, not how successful these elements were or weren't.

In either case, I always find it amusing when people complain about ME1's spamming of powers when the blink-of-an-eye recharge rates on the cooldowns in ME2 make things far worse; you can just spam the same power every two seconds. Even if you did spam all the powers in ME1, at least the player was out for a minute or so.

How in the hell was ME2 focused on combat alone? Most of the changes in the sequel were combat-related, yes, but that's because the combat in ME1 was flawed and had to be changed. Other than that, the RPG elements were fine as they were and only needed a few tweaks here and there.

But the RPG elements weren't simply "tweaked here and there" they were massively cut back and simplified in ME2. And as I've said several times before, one could have changed the nature and style of the combat in the same way without needing to cull, simplify and reduce the RPG factors too. Why does making the combat player-skill-based instead of stat-based mean all the other stuff has to go too? The only thing that needed to go to accomplish that was the cone-of-death and the weapons skills associated with it.

And what I meant by ME2 "being focused on combat alone" was that all the RPG elements were now focused pretty much just on combat. Unlike most RPGs there are no longer any non-combat skills: its all just about killing the enemy faster and protecting yourself from getting killed and that's about all. There's no alternatives any more with each fight being pretty much inevitable and nothing related to things like hacking, decryption, first aid, persuasion, etc.

And honestly, "you make an RPG too simple and you miss the point of it entirely"? Even if making a game that's hard to get into wasn't a terrible idea to begin with, since when were other Bioware RPGs like ME1 and Dragon Age not simple? You could just pick up and play them just fine because that's how games should be.

To you and me yes. But you'd be surprised how many people I hear complaining about them being too complicated, slow and not actiony enough. To say that an RPG like Baldur's Gate, NWN and DAO has less or equal complexity to that of the average shooter is just false. That and options for building and progressing your character in varied and meaningful ways, which while wasn't as in-depth in ME1 as in most of BioWare's previous offerings was still more than we got with ME2.

I was one of those fans. ME1 was the game that made me love Bioware again after my major loss of faith caused by playing Sonic Chronicles for the DS (you don't want to know... ). I loved ME1. And I loved ME2. Just like I loved Dragon Age, The Witcher, Fallout 3, Neverwinter Nights, KotOR, Jade Empire, Morrowind, Oblivion and even Fable. And yes, I was (mostly) satisfied with them. But they all had things that could have been changed.

But they all did things differently in some way. They all had their qualities and their flaws. And they all tried something different, instead of doing the same tired thing over and over just because their fans wanted a carbon copy of a given game and were afraid that they'd throw the "sell-out" card at them.

And the funny thing is that they all did get their fair share of fans complaining about how they'd sold-out, how they had just given in to the desire to make money (because before that, they apparently made games for the hell of it and the bills were paid by the Holy Spirit) and how the consoles and the "Haloz" were to blame.

And yet nowadays, they're "classics", games that are revered for what they brought to the industry and models to which new games should aspire to. Funny how the world works, isn't it?

I don't actually recall it, though I did notice that each BioWare game was getting less and less RPG-heavy as time went on, with the exceptions of ME1 being step up from Jade Empire and DAO being a rather large step up again. ME2 on the other end dived the seemingly-rising curve. In either case, I didn't see any major claims of BioWare selling out until the first DAO advertising came along, and then again with some of the ME2 stuff. Thankfully DAO was nowhere near as bad as its advertising made out, which made it look more like God of War with dragons than a spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate. ME2 was thankfully better than most of its advertising, though only just. It wasn't until around the same time that I saw devs responding with the "we have to make money by going mainstream" posts and comments too. I guess you and I just have different memories.

Modifié par Terror_K, 24 juin 2010 - 06:52 .

[AndroLeonidas]

So I will give this a whirl...



Not enough squad banter back and forth. I thought it was great to listen to your teammates talk back and forth during ME1. Heck... some of them had some really funny lines.



Planet scanning was tedious when game first came out but they have since corrected that and my complaint goes away.



Not being able to equip teammates with different armor is a drag. I liked that part of ME1. They didn't need to put all the armors for every character, but choices would have been nice. That you can remove helmet from downloaded armors keeps me from using them at all. What's so hard about coding that? I really like the upgrades in this game. Easier to deal with and such. ME1's upgrades were tedious and frustrating at times.



I don't like the pull away from RPG to shooter. That was one of two or three things that really annoyed me. I didn't think the main story was very good... they certainly didn't need to kill Shepard to make this game. I thought some of the side missions were excellent... and the loyalty missions were also a very nice touch. Emotion was there but not as significant as ME1.



I was truly pissed off that you spent the whole ME1 experience romancing either Ash or Liara (for males) and in the second game they totally toss both of their characters under the bus. Ash's reaction is understandable to an extent... but terribly done. IMO they completely butchered Liara's character to the extreme with nio acknowledgment of a romance if she was your LI. Based on dialogue with her in the first game and how she said Asari view relationships, I find it impossible to believe she just dismisses you as she does. "Go hack some computers for me." Very disappointed with how BW handled that and it's probably the main reason I will not buy ME3 when it first comes out. Not without some hint of closure with your LI from ME1 if you remained loyal to them. Or some sort of DLC with former LI and discovering if it is truly over or not. Something like that. Even Dragon Age Awakenings had closure to it if you romanced Leliana in Dragon Age. It says at the end that you return to the love of your life the red haired bard Leliana in the epilogue. Nothing even resembling that in ME2. Bad. Bad. Bad. BW dropped the ball in a major way with her character and how she was protrayed in ME2. I don't know what kind of reward they can give to you in ME3 to make up for that, especially if they have Liara disappear entirely or become a bad guy or the new SB or something silly along those lines. Almost like they wanted you to cheat on your ME1 LI. Just my opinion.



Overall... I like the game alot. Not as well as ME1... but enough where I have downloaded all the DLCs and continue to play it occassionally. Will hesitate to buy ME3 unless I know there will be closure. I do not want to see Mass Effect go the way KOTOR did. If BW does something like that I will never buy anothe rproduct of theirs no matter how good.