10273 réponses à ce sujet

[SithLordExarKun]

iakus wrote...


True there is development in the dialogue, though that was present in ME 1 as well (whether it was done as well is debatable)  But I was referring to development in other missions, be it main questline missions or other characters' recruitment/loyalty ones.  I could not believe how passive some of the characters can be towards what's happening, given what kind of people they are supposed to be.

Imo this is a flaw present in both games, i wonder why can't we actually speak to squadmates outside of the normandy somewhat like KOTOR or DAO and characters should have had more dialogue during quest missions or loyalty ones. Lets say i brought Miranda for Garrus loyalty mission, its a little weird she says absolutely nothing at all during the mission.

It would have been interesting to see how your squadmates react during missions(like Miranda trying to calm Garrus during his mission or if Jack is taken along she tries to convince him to finish Sidonis).

iakus wrote...
Agree 100%  The Reaper plot is what's supposed to be connecting the Mass Effect Trilogy.  This game had us spinning our wheels in that regard.  Makes me wonder why they bothered with a trilogy. 

Well the first games revelations were very late as well and the revelations in the second game were just as late imo, they should have expanded alot more on the enemies we're facing.

But i get the feeling almost all our questions will get answered in the final game.

[Pocketgb]

lazuli wrote...

My assumption is that you know all of this already.  You just don't buy it as a suitable plot structure.

Interestingly enough this is pretty much what DA:O was. The only difference being that instead of recruiting people you recruited races.

Modifié par Pocketgb, 29 juin 2010 - 03:45 .

[Iakus]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

 Imo this is a flaw present in both games, i wonder why can't we actually speak to squadmates outside of the normandy somewhat like KOTOR or DAO and characters should have had more dialogue during quest missions or loyalty ones. Lets say i brought Miranda for Garrus loyalty mission, its a little weird she says absolutely nothing at all during the mission.

It would have been interesting to see how your squadmates react during missions(like Miranda trying to calm Garrus during his mission or if Jack is taken along she tries to convince him to finish Sidonis).

This was a weakness in ME 1 as well.  However, "the squad" was not the main focus of the game, So some slack can be cut for it.  ME 2, however, had the squad as the entire point.  Thus the flaw is even more egregious

Also, I  could imagine Thane and Samara would have a lot to say about each others' missions, what with their poblems with their respective children.  Jacob and Miranda have a past.  It's odd that he says nothing during Miranda's mission (or vice versa).  I'd have liked to hear Tali's views on Mordin's mission.  Would she identify more with the salarians, for doing what was necessary to stop a force they unleashed on the galaxy, or the krogan, who have seen their civilization destroyed and themselves brought to the brink of annihilation?

[Xeranx]

Lumikki wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

Lumikki wrote...

I'm sorry but you are wrong here. Most main side missions in ME1 and ME2 was all little related to main plot equal much. You know, exploring geth activity to find clues and recruiting squad memebrs to become stronger. Shifting happens in ME1 more because that was part of the story.  Both games shift alot in beging, but after sertain early missions, direction does become clear as what needs to be done.

Doing a geth mission is paramount because of your first introduction to the geth.  You met them on Eden Prime.  They have ravaged a colony and you don't know why until you are told of Saren.  You lose a squadmate to machines, gain a squadmate who has lost her entire squad due to machines,and  are attacked by husks that were once civilian colonists on the very world you stand.  And to the last part of that sentence, you know the husks were once colonists because you saw a couple of machines impale a barely alive civilian on a spike much like the spikes that held the husks that come after you later.

If I remember correctly, on every main side mission you go up against the geth.  They're more like your plot points.  They let you know that something of importance is/was/might be going on there that might interest you in your battle against Saren and later Sovereign.  It seems you're trying to diminish something that represents a highly likely important piece of a very large puzzle you're trying to solve in ME1.  

I bolded for you,  where I was talking about ME1. After the word "and" in same sentense is about ME2. My point is that one way or other "many" main side missions was little connected to main plot in BOTH games.

I know after your statement about ME1 you were talking about ME2.  I, however, was dealing with your comment about how (as you put it) the "main side missions" were very loosely connected to the main story and disagreeing with your stance.  They (the geth) are integral to the story as you can't go to any world Saren has been on without fighting them.  A possible staging area for a geth invasion is a perfectly legitamate concern.  

Think about it in terms of real life: If you hear of a possible staging area for a rival nation hellbent on invading your country are you saying you wouldn't investigate because it's not central to the matter at hand of finding out what the rival nation's general is up to?

[Christmas Ape]

ME1 plot had holes too, but they were not that obvious and maybe they are not plotholes at all (but rather somthing that's going to overarch into ME3)... ME2 holes are ofthen the result of poor artistic solutions, "fluent shooter gameplay" focus, and general policy shift from making sense to "fleshing out coolness".

I'm always curious as to why ME1 gets a pass for being part of a trilogy but not ME2.

Besides the obvious "nostalgia" answer.

[Terminatort800]

This game is great. So no...I'm not disappointed.

[UBER GEEKZILLA]

thats it ive had it with the me2 hate..OK first off..the exploring in ME1 SUCKED...the mako was boring as were the barren landscapes...what matters is not how big the place you explore is what matters is how well designed the world you explore is..i must say ME2 has WAY more interesting worlds and enviornments...ME1 only had 2 interesting places to explore the citadel and illos..that was it...me2 has OMEGA,the prison ship, illium, anf the collector ship. yes the structure is more linear but the places you explore are way more intersting... and yes the game has more action but is that really BAD??? theres plenty of dialouge and character development.the characters in me2 are much more interesting and the loyalty missions are amazing, and the love relashionships are way better. in me1 all you had to do to get ashely to fall in love with you is talk to her like once and say "your pretty" bam she loves you..in me2 you have to actully THINK about what you say to miranda...you have to be kind and admire her, but ya got to talk to her alot(and compliment her body)...the dialouge scenes are amazing..the characters( espacilly shepard) show more emotion and the game looks like a cinematic movie, and lets face it those renegade interupts ROCK...

now i know everyone misses customizing BUT SO WHAT... the character creation is WAY BETTER(in me1 you either made a cross eyed neanderthal our a pale chinease guy) and you can still color your armor and theres TONS of upgrades to get, and another plus is instead of going in a menu, giving your weapon inferno, using it a bit, then going back and giving your gun cryo, in those HORRIBLE inventory menus... in me2 you simply TAP the bumper and switch between those attacks in like 2 seconds(instead of 2 minutes) and yes the main story might be more...simple then the plot in the first, but the side stories, loyalty missions, well thought out characters, and the emotion of the characters make it MUCH better...



so there

Modifié par UBER GEEKZILLA, 29 juin 2010 - 06:35 .

[SithLordExarKun]

iakus wrote...

This was a weakness in ME 1 as well.  However, "the squad" was not the main focus of the game, So some slack can be cut for it.  ME 2, however, had the squad as the entire point.  Thus the flaw is even more egregious

Also, I  could imagine Thane and Samara would have a lot to say about each others' missions, what with their poblems with their respective children.  Jacob and Miranda have a past.  It's odd that he says nothing during Miranda's mission (or vice versa).  I'd have liked to hear Tali's views on Mordin's mission.  Would she identify more with the salarians, for doing what was necessary to stop a force they unleashed on the galaxy, or the krogan, who have seen their civilization destroyed and themselves brought to the brink of annihilation?

Yeah thats what i didn't like, they had alot to say in their own respective missions but say absolutely nothing when present in another squadmates mission.

Also, seeing Legion and Tali argue when wandering around would be interesting, somewhat like bastila and mission or alistair and morrigan.

[Orchomene]

UBER GEEKZILLA wrote...

thats it ive had it with the me2 hate..OK first off..the exploring in ME1 SUCKED...the mako was boring as were the barren landscapes...what matters is not how big the place you explore is what matters is how well designed the world you explore is..i must say ME2 has WAY more interesting worlds and enviornments...ME1 only had 2 interesting places to explore the citadel and illos..that was it...me2 has OMEGA,the prison ship, illium, anf the collector ship. yes the structure is more linear but the places you explore are way more intersting... and yes the game has more action but is that really BAD??? theres plenty of dialouge and character development.the characters in me2 are much more interesting and the loyalty missions are amazing, and the love relashionships are way better. in me1 all you had to do to get ashely to fall in love with you is talk to her like once and say "your pretty" bam she loves you..in me2 you have to actully THINK about what you say to miranda...you have to be kind and admire her, but ya got to talk to her alot(and compliment her body)...the dialouge scenes are amazing..the characters( espacilly shepard) show more emotion and the game looks like a cinematic movie, and lets face it those renegade interupts ROCK...
now i know everyone misses customizing BUT SO WHAT... the character creation is WAY BETTER(in me1 you either made a cross eyed neanderthal our a pale chinease guy) and you can still color your armor and theres TONS of upgrades to get, and another plus is instead of going in a menu, giving your weapon inferno, using it a bit, then going back and giving your gun cryo, in those HORRIBLE inventory menus... in me2 you simply TAP the bumper and switch between those attacks in like 2 seconds(instead of 2 minutes) and yes the main story might be more...simple then the plot in the first, but the side stories, loyalty missions, well thought out characters, and the emotion of the characters make it MUCH better...

so there

It's just a matter of taste. I find that every location in ME2 is boring, with to few interactions possible. Those locations give a "comic" or "manga" feeling. The wost being collector ships and bases. The planet scaning is boring and, alas, necessary. It's even totally illogical since there an AI in the ship that can scan itself the entire planet. The loyalty missions are repetitive and lack of originality with almost always the same ideas (family issues, emotions, fights against mercenaries). The relationships are badly written and give a harassment feeling more than seduction. Shepard show even less emotion in the dialogues than in ME1 and has very bad facial animations. The customizations in ME2 are mostly cosmetic and are a bad replacement of a real RPG mechanic. The ammo system is illogical and putting ammo type in skills is dumb : only the soldier knows how to put cryo munitions in his weapons ? Come on. ME2 is a mediocre game at most. It's just a commercial try to go on the shooter market and even this goal is a failure seeing that it sold less than ME1.

[Terror_K]

Lumikki wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

Uh... not really. Mass Effect's main missions were pretty much all centred on the main plot. Sure, there were a lot of sidequests and a lot of wandering around on planets in The Mako, but everything that was part of the main mission was linked to the main plot, as opposed to ME2's main plot regarding The Collectors being sidelined for companion quests all the time. The main difference is that in ME1 the focus of the main plot keeps shifting and changing as you progress and uncover more. ME2 has a somewhat pre-defined structure whereby as soon as TIM outlines what's ahead of you you pretty much know what's going on and just carry out your task.

I'm sorry but you are wrong here. Most main side missions in ME1 and ME2 was all little related to main plot equal much. You know, exploring geth activity to find clues and recruiting squad memebrs to become stronger. Shifting happens in ME1 more because that was part of the story.  Both games shift alot in beging, but after sertain early missions, direction does become clear as what needs to be done.

That's all very well, but I wasn't talking about side-quests, I was referring to the main ones. What I was saying was that ME1's main missions all pretty much kept on course, while ME2's one (The Collectors) kept getting pushed to the side for the squadmate stuff. One could easily go about doing 4 or 5 main missions that have next to nothing to do with The Collectors and then suddenly it hits you like a ton of bricks that that's what things are all about because you've been avoiding them for so long, making you go "Oh yeah... that's right. I forgot what this was supposed to be about."

ME1 is more about trying to find out what's ahead of you and uncovering things. At the start of ME2 you know that the end involves a Suicide Mission. At the start of ME1 you have no idea where it's going to end up.

You problems and assumptions is comming that you keep ignoring ME2 main story. What you say above is the difference in main stories. You do understand that what story is? In the Lord of the Rings did the hobbit has job to destroy the ring and how early of the story was this known? Story is not just the uncovering story, it can also be about journey in the story. You base you assumption like story has to be done this way and then make assumption that other game is bad because story isn't told the way you want. That has been the problem here all the time. People wanting they way, not what it is. Like every game has to be design how someone wants it to be. Are you sure everyone wants same as you?

I keep hearing this crap how good ME1 is and how bad ME2 is. That's 100% BS. Both games has they problem and major ones. Yes, ME1 storytelling was better than ME2 in my opinion, but that doesn't make ME2 bad game or ME1 good game.

Whoa! Easy there... where did I bash ME2 in my post, exactly? I was just pointing out  the error in you saying that both games diverted from the main plot just as much as each other. I was defending ME1, not bashing ME2. I suppose one could say both are kind of the same from a certain POV, but I never said it was a bad thing. It just happens to be the way ME2 goes about things. It's more like it has two main plots that kind of intermingle here and there, one being The Collectors and the other being recruiting your squadmates, with both of them linked to the whole Suicide Mission part. I don't think ME2 has worse writing for it, as much of it is really strong, but it doesn't flow quite as well and lacks the overall mystery. It didn't help that The Collectors just didn't really have a really strong central villain, or even strong sub-villains, to hold them up better. ME2 actually reminds me a little of Dragon Age in that it's actually a really simple and straightforward story for the most part, but the quality of its writing stops it from being bland. Especially the few twists that there are. Pretty much all of my beefs with ME2 are gameplay related, as I think the story, writing, characters and cinematic stuff is pretty top knotch (with a few rare exceptions here and there where things seemed to go all modern Hollywood, but these are fairly minor.)

If we're talking about non-main missions, ME1 actually deviates more than ME2, which has strong ties to Cerberus and the main plot even in its sidequests. I know that was intentional from Casey and the team since they said several times they wanted to tie sidequests more into the main plot to add depth to it, but I actually felt this was a little overdone. I do sidequests to give me a breather from the main story, and I generally prefer it when they bring something completely fresh and different to the table than just being an extension of the stuff I'm already doing.

[Massadonious1]

Vena_86 wrote...

Massadonious1 wrote...

you just choose who you can better fight with and who fits your visual taste (Mirandas ass), leaving out a whole lot what scifi is all about at the same time.

Kirk took Spock everywhere because he clearly had the most knowledge about other races, first contact situations, and whatnot. The only reason you took anyone that didn't fit your "visual taste" or had a combat proficiency that you liked in ME1 was because they could open doors or chests. I would hardly consider that to be "what sci-fi is all about"

When did I say that ME1 did it right?

You implied as such. You went out of your way to give this grandiose statement about specicalists and "not feeling like a Commander", specifically pointing out something about ME2 that made you feel this way, (Miranda's "assets") without mentioning that  ME1 is pretty much the same way.

[Pocketgb]

Massadonious1 wrote...

You implied as such. You went out of your way to give this grandiose statement about specicalists and "not feeling like a Commander", specifically pointing out something about ME2 that made you feel this way, (Miranda's "assets") without mentioning that  ME1 is pretty much the same way.

EX: Chorra's Den, anyone? Or heck any of the sex scenes in general?

Modifié par Pocketgb, 29 juin 2010 - 09:16 .

[Vena_86]

Massadonious1 wrote...

Vena_86 wrote...

Massadonious1 wrote...

you just choose who you can better fight with and who fits your visual taste (Mirandas ass), leaving out a whole lot what scifi is all about at the same time.

Kirk took Spock everywhere because he clearly had the most knowledge about other races, first contact situations, and whatnot. The only reason you took anyone that didn't fit your "visual taste" or had a combat proficiency that you liked in ME1 was because they could open doors or chests. I would hardly consider that to be "what sci-fi is all about"

When did I say that ME1 did it right?

You implied as such. You went out of your way to give this grandiose statement about specicalists and "not feeling like a Commander", specifically pointing out something about ME2 that made you feel this way, (Miranda's "assets") without mentioning that  ME1 is pretty much the same way.

I literally said that ME1 only did it slightly better. And for a sequel ME2 should have improved and emphasized this aspect instead of making it worse. I never praised ME1 for doing it great, because this doesn't always have to be about some idiotic ME1vsME2 war. I was rather looking at the franchise as a whole and found that among other things ME1 and specially ME2 don't put enough effort into making the characters appear as such. Neither do they interact with each other through the course of missions like in Dragon Age or KotoR (or ME1 to a leasser extend) nor do they have any other qualities than combat and looks. Thich takes away a lot from the fascination of having a team of specialists, where everyone has something to offer that makes them valuable for the team. This  would add another layer of depth to characters, next to combat strength and appearace.
Specially in ME2 where you are supposed to put together a team of specialists, you just end up setting up a team of warriors. Only the last missions actually goes further than that, which is a good start. Hopefully BioWare will concentrate more on the potential that comes with the setting and story in ME3.

Modifié par Vena_86, 29 juin 2010 - 11:34 .

[Vena_86]

*double post*

Modifié par Vena_86, 29 juin 2010 - 10:28 .

[Darth Drago]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

iakus wrote...

This was a weakness in ME 1 as well. However, "the squad" was not the main focus of the game, So some slack can be cut for it. ME 2, however, had the squad as the entire point. Thus the flaw is even more egregious

Also, I could imagine Thane and Samara would have a lot to say about each others' missions, what with their poblems with their respective children. Jacob and Miranda have a past. It's odd that he says nothing during Miranda's mission (or vice versa). I'd have liked to hear Tali's views on Mordin's mission. Would she identify more with the salarians, for doing what was necessary to stop a force they unleashed on the galaxy, or the krogan, who have seen their civilization destroyed and themselves brought to the brink of annihilation?

Yeah thats what i didn't like, they had alot to say in their own respective missions but say absolutely nothing when present in another squadmates mission.

Also, seeing Legion and Tali argue when wandering around would be interesting, somewhat like bastila and mission or alistair and morrigan.

-There certainly was a lot of lost potential dialog in the loyalty missions that’s certain. Its as if the writers or someone just didn’t want to take that extra effort to add replay value and add more depth to your squad mates actually interacting with each other rather than being there just to shoot things.

Dragon Age did this in the right way with their random group banter. You got a sense that the group was actually a group of people and not just statues at camp. The only way it could have been better if the 3rd companion in your group joined in the dialog with the other two but maybe that will be added in the sequel.

What surprised me is the big 2 obvious pairings, Jack/Miranda and Tali/Legion had nothing to say at all. Well ok Jack gets a one liner in but I think that was it. Which is surprising considering how they react to each other with their fights that you need to resolve. My firt run through the game I took Miranda on Jack’s loyalty mission to hear what she would say and was more than a little annoyed that she didn’t have anything to say at all.

-Miranda and Jacob should have been a no brainer with the history between them.

-Tali and Garrus another obvious pairing for dialog in their missions.

-Jacob or Miranda on Tali’s should have sparked something from at least the Quarians you meet and talk to.

-Grunt on Mordin’s could have been interesting. Funny how Garrus had a bunch of lines here.

-Grunt on Jack’s considering his interest in seeing her in action on Purgatory when she goes on her rampage.

-Samara on Thane’s, not for their children chat as mentioned but for him being an assassin and her possible conflict with that being a Justicar. Funny how after I think on that one Jacob and Thane would be a good one considering Jacob’s dislike of assassins.

-On Zaeed’s there should have been a lot of vocal outbursts from several of your squad selections if you chose the renegade route, but again nothing.

The list of good combinations for potential unique dialog is vast indeed. To bad they didn’t want to take that extra effort to make the best part of the game (the characters you recruit and their missions) even better.

[Soirreb]

(copied my post from another thread, then edited because the act of copying seems to have destroyed the formatting)

I'm sure this has been said before, but here's what I didn't like about Mass Effect 2 (bearing in mind that I play on a PC):

• Removal of the Mako in favor for the seldom-used Hammerhead

I acknowledge that many people disliked the Mako, either because of the terrain or because of difficult handling, but I have to respond to those complaints with "l2drive".  I admit the Mako has a bit of a learning curve to learn fine control, but once that control is mastered I really think it's a fine vehicle to drive.  Terrain problems can be overcome,
too; just don't try driving straight up a vertical cliff.  The weapons you could use with the Mako are also a pleasure to shoot.

The Hammerhead, by virtue of being a hover-ship, has far more maneuverability than the Mako.  Jumping, using the boost to zip around, and sliding side to side are all very fun activities, but this inherent agility is detrimental during the instances where you have to stop and pick something up on the ground.  Even the word 'picking up' is inaccurate, as you really just turn on a giant vacuum cleaner to suck up something on the ground, without the benefit of just having some kind of grabber-claws to reach down and pick the damn thing up, or even extendable landing gear to stop the Hammerhead from shaking around worse than a dog trying to break the neck of its victim.  I also refuse to call the Hammerhead a 'hover-tank' because of the pitiful defenses the thing is equipped with.  You aren't even given an accurate gauge to tell when you should seek cover, just some incredibly annoying alarm that is only loud enough to be heard in the heat of a battle when it's too late to seek nonexistant cover before getting blown out of the sky.  The weapon, on the other hand, is quite reasonable, given the vehicle's high maneuverability, but still disappointing in a roundabout way: why can the Hammerhead have an unlimited supply of guided missiles but Shepard still has to rely on random supply boxes laying around to get ammo for the heavy weapons?

• Thermal Clips and the removal of Grenades

Despite what Bioware may think or want you to think with a paper-thin explanation by way of a single codex page, going suddenly from reasonably-managed heat thresholds before a weapon overheats to a hard limit on the number of shots that can be fired at a time and forcing us to hunt around the level to replenish our weapons is a giant step backwards in in-game weapons technology.  Even the behavior is inconsistent with its description; if a thermal clip is just a heat-sink that can be ejected, why am I still arbitrarily limited in how many shots my weapon can make?  Why cant the heat dissipate on its own and replenish the number of shots I can make until the weapon overheats?

With the exception of one scene in one optional DLC, thermal clips are synonymous with ammunition.  For all intents and purposes, Bioware wanted something closer to a 'shooter' experience in a universe that already had superior technology.  Foricbly bringing weapons technology back to the dark ages does not a convincing sci-fi setting make, Bioware.

• Planet Scanning

Wanting to upgrade the ship and the squad's weapons is reasonable; wanting to survive the suicide mission with all hands intact is reasonable; requiring that Commander Shepard, geth-slayer and galactic badass, become a world-raping mining foreman to perform those upgrades is not.  Mining rights? We don't need no stinkin' mining rights!  Populated worlds?  Screw 'em, we'll drop mining probes on all their cities.  Starbucks and I are gonna be best friends with how much coffee I'll be ordering to stay awake during each and every mining operation to scrape together every last ounce of four seemingly randomly-selected elements to make these upgrades.  

Time may fly when you're having fun, but it slows to a crawl when you're stuck in some planet's orbit, scrolling around slowly and watching a gauge spike to try to find some resources.  Alas, you can't just buy the resources from someone else, oh no, you must go to each and every world, scan each and every square inch yourself, and launch each and every probe yourself.  A game is not meant to feel like watching paint dry.

• Removal of Grenades, the new inventory system, and lack of same-sex paramour options

I'm lumping the three of these together because I have less to say about removing grenades and the new inventory system, and because I've griped elsewhere and in other threads about the lack of same-sex paramour options (please see Fight for the Love).  I'm disappointed in the removal of grenades primarily because they were a valued and useful weapon in my arsenal from ME1; setting traps and flushing enemies out of problem spots was delightful.  That isn't to say I like some of the new grenade-analogues in the powers; concussion blast is fun.

The streamlined inventory system does save time, but I don't like the limited choice in weapons, all comparably weaker than their potential ME1 counterparts.  Why would I want a machine gun that couldn't hit the broad side of a barn when I could put together something with more damage per shot, unlimited shots with an easily-managed heat threshold, and far greater accuracy than the beefy-looking Revenant?  The new weapons sure do look badass, though.  Granted, my weapon complaints go away with some well-placed tweaks in the Coalesced.ini.  ../../../images/forum/emoticons/cool.png

To reiterate my gripes on the lack of same-sex paramour options:  I don't like it when things like this get cut from the game; the spoken dialogue exists for both genders of Shep with all the love interests in ME1, and at least some is proven to exist in ME2.


Now, just so y'all don't think I'm some crusty, hateful old curmudgeon, I'll put forth some things I'm greatly pleased with in ME2:

[*]Shooting gameplay

The shooting sections of each mission are very well-executed and developed, and are a grand pleasure to play. Mowing down scores of whatever foe is suicidal enough to dare tempting the wrath of Commander Shepard in the game while trash-talking in the real world is one of my guilty pleasures.  Even the separation of the melee attack from shooting is a thoughtful move (having Shepard's VA's record attacking sounds for this is icing on the cake).  I'm not sure I like how much more you're forced to use cover compared to the first game, but getting in and out of cover feels significantly tighter and easier-controlled than the previous game.

• New class powers

I play a soldier in both ME1 and ME2, and I gotta tell ya; Adrenalin Rush pure gravy.  Having the time to line up perfect headshots and getting double damage while I'm at it is the reason why I max it first, every time.  This power is also the reason I don't play any of the other classes (heavy armor was what kept me on Soldier in ME1).  I'm not too ecstatic about Bioware moving ammo mods to ammo powers, though.

• Upgraded graphics

The new lighting system and graphics used for ME2 really do bring this game to the fore for visuals.  Sunset on a planet really feels like sunset, darker corridors with some neon lights elsewhere cast convincing light across objects and characters, and the whole shebang feels much smoother overall than the previous game (the previous game also looked pretty good, but there were some spots with strange lighting or choppy framerate where it didn't look like it should be choppy).

Modifié par Soirreb, 29 juin 2010 - 04:04 .

[tonnactus]

lazuli wrote...


In this regard, it's not too different from ME1.  The council sends Shepard out with a checklist of places to visit in his quest to stop the enigmatic enemy.  But that's where the similarities end.  Because the Illusive Man knows less about the Collectors than the council did about Saren, the missions in ME2 don't really embody ME1's "chase down the mysterious villain" vibe.  Instead, Shepard needs to be prepared to face this vague threat.  So he builds a team.

But why are those specific teammates are needed? Why in the hell  shepardt needs an assasin? Why he/she needs samara. This was never told in the game. The player just got a to do list. In the first game,the player at least investigate what saren/benezia do in the specific places. Far better then this.

[Lumikki]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

Also, seeing Legion and Tali argue when wandering around would be interesting, somewhat like bastila and mission or alistair and morrigan.

As I play at the moment first Kotor, I can say I don't really like these team members arguments. In impression points they are fine, but sometimes it takes too long and they are too often.

Also sometimes they want to talk with you and that can be annoying as hell. Like if you don't want to talk to them, you can't avoid it, because they keep trying it again and again untill it's done. Little same way than some quest, where they offer the dark path option. It's not really option because what every you choose you will have to listen the "quest" and get it. Meaning even if some people likes them, I don't like them. I like small impressions, but I don't like 5 minute watching two squad member arguing. I don't like listening long quest dialogs, when I have zero interest for that quest.

My point is that not all players likes what you ask. Mostly because they are forced to you.

Modifié par Lumikki, 29 juin 2010 - 04:00 .

[bjdbwea]

Lumikki wrote...

As I play at the moment first Kotor, I can say I don't really like these team members arguments. In impression points they are fine, but sometimes it takes too long and they are too often.

Also sometimes they want to talk with you and that can be annoying as hell. Like if you don't want to talk to them, you can't avoid it, because they keep trying it again and again untill it's done. Little same way than some quest, where they offer the dark path option. It's not really option because what every you choose you will have to listen the "quest" and get it. Meaning even if some people likes them, I don't like them. I like small impressions, but I don't like 5 minute watching two squad member arguing. I don't like listening long quest dialogs, when I have zero interest for that quest.

My point is that not all players likes what you ask. Mostly because they are forced to you.

Fair enough. You do know that you can skip dialogue lines, right? But if even that is too much, there's an easy solution: Go play a pure action game. The amount of dialogue in KotoR has already been "streamlined" too, first for the console audience, and second because they had to record every line. If that is still "too much" for you, why play an RPG in the first place? There are enough shooters out there, including TPS. Just stick to them. But please, don't try to take over one of the few remaining RPG series and force your preference for more shooting and less talking on it.

Modifié par bjdbwea, 29 juin 2010 - 04:14 .

[lazuli]

tonnactus wrote...

But why are those specific teammates are needed? Why in the hell  shepardt needs an assasin? Why he/she needs samara. This was never told in the game. The player just got a to do list. In the first game,the player at least investigate what saren/benezia do in the specific places. Far better then this.

The Illusive Man doesn't know much about the Collectors, so he has Shepard build a diverse team.  The usefulness of squadmates should be reason enough to get them.  If you, as Shepard, don't think an assassin will be necessary, you have the option not to recruit him.

As for Samara...

Justicar Samara

-Biotics strength near that of an asari matriarch

-Extensive weapons training

Samara is a justicar, a rare member of an asari monoastic group trained
in enhanced combat biotics alongside standard weapons. Samara was
recently sighted on Illium, outside of normal asari space.

This sounds like someone I'd want on my team if I were preparing to face a foe as dangerous as the Collectors.


Shepard does investigate what the Collectors do in specific places (Freedom's Progress and Horizon).  But this is, like I've said, in response to sudden Collector action.  In ME1, the plot could be summed up thusly: "Chase down and stop the mysterious villain."  In ME2, the enemy is more distant and Shepard is on the defensive, calling for a different plot summary: "Prepare to face the mysterious villain in whatever way you can."

[Lumikki]

bjdbwea wrote...

Lumikki wrote...

As I play at the moment first Kotor, I can say I don't really like these team members arguments. In impression points they are fine, but sometimes it takes too long and they are too often.

Also sometimes they want to talk with you and that can be annoying as hell. Like if you don't want to talk to them, you can't avoid it, because they keep trying it again and again untill it's done. Little same way than some quest, where they offer the dark path option. It's not really option because what every you choose you will have to listen the "quest" and get it. Meaning even if some people likes them, I don't like them. I like small impressions, but I don't like 5 minute watching two squad member arguing. I don't like listening long quest dialogs, when I have zero interest for that quest.

My point is that not all players likes what you ask. Mostly because they are forced to you.

Fair enough. You do know that you can skip dialogue lines, right? But if even that's too much, there's an easy solution: Go play a pure action game. The amount of dialogue in KotoR has already been "streamlined" too, first for the console audience, and second because they had to record every line. If that is still "too much" for you, why play an RPG in the first place? There are enough shooters out there, including TPS. Just stick to them. But please, don't try to take over one of the few remaining RPG series and force your preference for more shooting and less talking on it.

Eh?

Where did I say anything like liking shooters?

There is different between player wanthing to long talks and player forced to listen long talks.

I like good stories and playing games. I have allready sayed here in this thread that in my opinion both Mass Effects have too much combat. How ever, that doesn't mean I like passively listen long time how two team members are arguing. I can ingnore some team members need to talk to me, but game keep pushing it untill it's done. I could not ignore the dark side quest dialogs. I did choose I'm not interested option and I got same result, same long quest story dialogs. Hear me out, I make it quick. Yeah next 5 minutes listen something what you aren't interested. Meaning it doens't matter what you choose, game push the choises anyway.

Example team member talk in ME1 elevator was great (under 1 min). Because it was short impression add to place where you could not realy do anything else. If player wants long talks, then it should come as choise of player, not forced from the game.

Is you answer allways this, when someone doens't like what you like?

Modifié par Lumikki, 29 juin 2010 - 04:31 .

[bjdbwea]

If you skip the dialogue, it's not 5 minutes, but 5 seconds. If that's still too much, then RPGs are probably just not your kind of game. I'd even say if you don't like to listen to your companions in the first place, it's not your kind of game.



And if you are unhappy when a games pushes certain paths upon you, why do you like ME 2 so much? This game does it constantly.

[Lumikki]

bjdbwea wrote...

If you skip the dialogue, it's not 5 minutes, but 5 seconds. If that's still too much, then RPGs are probably just not your kind of game. I'd even say if you don't like to listen to your companions in the first place, it's not your kind of game.

And if you are unhappy when a games pushes certain paths upon you, why do you like ME 2 so much? This game does it constantly.

Okey, I ques you don't get it. Example If I skip team member dialog in Kotor. I can choose Ignore the request, it takes like you say 5 second. How ever, if I do that same team member is trying to push that same dialogs again and again every 10 minute untill you do the talk. It's never ending situation. Game doesn't allow you permamently ignore that talk, just delay it. You can delay it by choosing ignore it rest of the game, but that's alot of 5 sec choises as total. What is equal annoying.

Modifié par Lumikki, 29 juin 2010 - 04:36 .

[bjdbwea]

Now I don't even know what you're talking about. If you don't like a companion, yes, you have no choice but to ignore them. So what? I had to do the same thing in ME 2. There are no forced talks in KotoR that would repeat every 10 minutes. Are you sure you are playing Knights of the old Republic?

[Lumikki]

bjdbwea wrote...

Now I don't even know what you're talking about. If you don't like a companion, yes, you have no choice but to ignore them. So what? I had to do the same thing in ME 2. There are no forced talks in KotoR that would repeat every 10 minutes. Are you sure you are playing Knights of the old Republic?

Yes, I do know what game I play. The 10min was example as how long it takes to hit special spots while normally playing the game, they allways starts dialogs if there is need for one. if you have delayed talk by ignoring it, then there is allways need. You did not notice how some dialogs allways happen is same spots? You can't even allways go around that spot, if you remember where it was.

Modifié par Lumikki, 29 juin 2010 - 05:23 .