10273 réponses à ce sujet

[William Adama]

brfritos wrote...

William Adama wrote...

brfritos wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

If you don't recruit ALL the team characters you wont progress the story. Wheres the choice? You can leave Garrus/Grunt/Kaiden/Ashley in ME1, you can't leave any in ME2.

You can sell Legion, not activate Grunt and leave behind two more squadmates in ME 2

Actually you can leave five if you want.

I've finished a playthrough right now where I didn't recruited Thane, Samara and Tali, sold Legion to Cerberus and do not activated Grunt's tank.

Sure, this will hurt some things A LOT, but it's my choice and it didn't hurted the story (because the main story is too simple)
And in ME1 you only have the option not to recruit Garrus and Wrex, the rest of the gang you don't have the choice.

You're nitpicking the wrong way.

No I don't think so. You MUST complete the recruitment missions for these characters in order to progress the story. I could completely bypass both Garrus and Wrex in ME1 and still complete the game.

The big difference was that the squadmates in 2 were woven INTO the main story, which was really stupid seeing that they were supposed to help you defeat the collectors not help you survive the suicide mission.

And one question, HOW did you avoid recruiting Tali, Samara and Thane? How is that possible? Thane and Grunt were a given but then again YOU HAD TO COMPLETE their missions before you decided to not recruit them.

Hummm...it's a great question, how did you avoid recruting Tali, Samara and Thane?
Let's see...wait, I know!!!
Not doing their dossier missions?



Miranda and Jacob already start in you party, you don't have a choice. The only ones that are forced to be recruted are Mordin, Grunt, Jack and Garrus.
Even then, you aren't forced to release Grunt from his tank.

This game forced me to complete a loyalty mission that had NOTHING to do with the main quest. What does doing personal crap for a merc have to do with surviving a mission? If I was a Commander of a ship I wouldn't give 2 hoots if my helmsman had a outstanding personal matter before a big op. You have a duty to perform to the ship and the bond I share with this individual is bred through combat and brotherhood, not through me fetching his sick pet fish from back home just so he sleeps better at night.

It's so inbelievable.

You don't need to do a loyalty mission, if you're willing to pay the price for this decision.
They are completely optional.
Just to you know, I did one playthrough with Legion, Zaeed, Thane and Grunt not loyal.
Everyone of them survived, BTW (it's more difficult to do Shepard die, you really have to plan this, LOL).

I agree with you in one point, EVERY LOYALTY mission is expandable, they have nothing to do with the main plot.
What's the relevance for the main story the loyalty's missions of Miranda, Thane and Grunt?
But they are not forced on you, you have to choose to do them.

This is a no spoiler section, but you can survive the suicide mission without doing ANY loyalty mission if you want
Yes, everyone not loyal!
Take a look on this (the results after finishing the last mission, everyone non loyal)

I repeat, you don't need to do a loyalty mission, if you're willing to pay the price for this decision.

You're still nitpicking, the problems of ME2 are others.
Like knowing when and where a battle will occur, for example, even in the first very playthrough.
Or the lacking in polishing that affects the entire game.
Or the oversimplification in the game itens.
Or the conection between the main story and the loyalty missions.

HOW??? How can you progress the main story towards the suicide mission without recruiting Tali, Samara or Thane? Is the IFF mission immediately available after you complete the collector colony mission?

If you really think about it, you don't need more than 4 people in you crew to do the final mission.

[William Adama]

Who to blame; EA or Bioware?

[A.N.A.N]

@Adama doing any eight or so missions after Horizon, be they N7, recruitment, or loyalty will trigger the Collector Ship. The IFF mission will be available straight after this.

[Iakus]

A.N.A.N wrote...

@Adama doing any eight or so missions after Horizon, be they N7, recruitment, or loyalty will trigger the Collector Ship. The IFF mission will be available straight after this.

Actually, I tried this once (wanted to try a Suicide Mission run with six)  You do need a minimum of eight squad members to trigger the Collector ship.  Once you have eight, yah it's just a matter of doing other missions until it triggers

[Ragnarok521]

This may seem small compared to the other subjects discussed in this thread, but those large, obnoxious pop-ups whenever I got a new codex entry or upgrade really bothered me. I just don't like seeing that box take up a good portion of the screen after every conversation/research/etc.

Modifié par Ragnarok521, 09 août 2010 - 04:44 .

[Terror_K]

Il Divo wrote...

Terror_K

Just out of curiosity, what's it like wandering slowly across the plains in Morrowind for somebody who hates The Mako? Because from what I recall the slow trundling from one place to the next was even more tedious than ME1's vehicular sections. Hell... the hills were even far more of an issue for me in that than they ever were in ME1!

You mean like finding incredibly awesome artifacts like the Boots of Blinding Speed? Umbra? Daedric Shrines? The problem isn't the controls. It's not even the mountains. It's simply the question: what's the point? Why must I bother driving the Mako to reach that same generic merc base and kill my enemies? The Mako was a great idea that was placed in terrible circumstances. There was nothing 'unique' to discover with the Mako.

If I recall, a couple pages ago you were talking about 'instant gratification' and Mass Effect 2. Morrowind is a great example of a game that makes you work for your 'gratification'. I can't say the same for driving the Mako around which tells me exactly where all those merc bases are located. It's more like an exercise in futility.

Wait, wait, wait... so are you actually tacitly admitting that The Mako itself would be fine if the execution of the quests it was involved in was better and more unique and had a better payoff?

Also, I have to agree that the Boots of Blinding Speed were awesome. I don't think an RPG has simultaneously both annoyed me and made be crack up so much as when I got those for the first time. Best. RPG. Item. EVER!

[brfritos]

iakus wrote...

A.N.A.N wrote...

@Adama doing any eight or so missions after Horizon, be they N7, recruitment, or loyalty will trigger the Collector Ship. The IFF mission will be available straight after this.

Actually, I tried this once (wanted to try a Suicide Mission run with six)  You do need a minimum of eight squad members to trigger the Collector ship.  Once you have eight, yah it's just a matter of doing other missions until it triggers

Zaeed, Kasumi, Mordin, Garrus, Grunt, Jack, Jacob, Miranda = 8 squad members

Don't do Tali, Thane and Samara recruitment mission.
Sell Legion after the IFF mission.

As for the numbers required for the Collector Ship, I've always been able to do 5 missions before triggering it.
How can you do six or eight after Horizon, I'm interested in this.

But I still think that immortalizing Miranda until the very last assigment is low standart, not what I'm used to see in Bioware games.
Until now.

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

Mister Mida wrote...

I played Halo 3 not so long ago. And when I started driving the vehicles, I practically missed the Mako. I don't know if there is a significant amount of people ****ing about the Warthog, but Bioware did a better job with the Mako than Bungie did with that vehicle. The Mako needed a bit of tweaking, that's it.

I have been saying that for well over two years now. With all these people complaining about the mako, why is it the warthog doesnt get ragged on? Those things were even worse with such crappy traction skidding all over the place.

[Mister Mida]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

Mister Mida wrote...

I played Halo 3 not so long ago. And when I started driving the vehicles, I practically missed the Mako. I don't know if there is a significant amount of people ****ing about the Warthog, but Bioware did a better job with the Mako than Bungie did with that vehicle. The Mako needed a bit of tweaking, that's it.

I have been saying that for well over two years now. With all these people complaining about the mako, why is it the warthog doesnt get ragged on? Those things were even worse with such crappy traction skidding all over the place.

Add to that with the Warthog camera and vehicle controls are linked to eachother, which isn't the case with the Mako. You can only say if the thog can go forward or backward but for going left or right you have to turn the camera.
So the question now is: where is the love for the Warthog hate?

[bjdbwea]

Indeed. I for one think the Mako controls in the PC version are as close to perfect as you can get. With hindsight, it's funny that people actually complained about the PC port. Wasn't that one reason BioWare wanted to do the PC version themselves this time? Okay, the graphics and sound work almost perfectly. They should teach some other developers how to use this engine properly. But the controls are bad, and apparently they've no interest in creating a patch that makes proper use of mouse and keyboard.

Modifié par bjdbwea, 09 août 2010 - 11:32 .

[shootist70]

I agree. The Mako was fine- it was the environments you explored with it that were lacking. Personally, though, I'd have preferred those open-world areas to have been explored on foot, and for them to be far smaller and with more content and more enemies, and better mission goals.

[Il Divo]

Terror_K wrote...

Wait, wait, wait... so are you actually tacitly admitting that The Mako itself would be fine if the execution of the quests it was involved in was better and more unique and had a better payoff?

Pretty much. Although the controls were hardly perfect, it was fine for virtually every main quest assignment (Ilos was awesome). It broke up the monotone, changed the pace, etc. I overall would have enjoyed the Mako if not for the side quests. Even something closer to Listening Post Alpha, where you could hook it up the generator, would have helped substantially. I just feel that the developers didn't treat the Mako with the proper respect by implementing it so often.

Also, I have to agree that the Boots of Blinding Speed were awesome. I don't think an RPG has simultaneously both annoyed me and made be crack up so much as when I got those for the first time. Best. RPG. Item. EVER!

One of my craziest moments as a Morowind fan was when my friend told me about a way to get past the 'blind' effect of the boots. I found out that if you cast a resist magicka spell (1 second on self I believe), you could actually put on the boots without suffering the blinding effects. Good times surfaced from there on out. Much joyriding.

Modifié par Il Divo, 09 août 2010 - 01:20 .

[tonnactus]

Terror_K wrote...


Also, I have to agree that the Boots of Blinding Speed were awesome. I don't think an RPG has simultaneously both annoyed me and made be crack up so much as when I got those for the first time. Best. RPG. Item. EVER!

I dont know about Morrowind. But in oblivion,all the items i found in dungeons outside of oblivion gates were crap compared with the ones
i enchanted myself with sigil stones.

Modifié par tonnactus, 09 août 2010 - 02:36 .

[Il Divo]

tonnactus wrote...

I dont know about Morrowind. But in oblivion,all the items i found in dungeons outside of oblivion gates were crap compared with the ones
i enchanted myself with sigil stones.

That's because Oblivion's enchanting system was flat out simple and boring. Sigil Stones were a terrible idea. Oblivion's enchanting system does not have an ounce of creativity to it.

Modifié par Il Divo, 09 août 2010 - 02:50 .

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

shootist70 wrote...

I agree. The Mako was fine- it was the environments you explored with it that were lacking. Personally, though, I'd have preferred those open-world areas to have been explored on foot, and for them to be far smaller and with more content and more enemies, and better mission goals.

Driving across those stunning vistas was fantastic in ME1 (provided you avoided "mountain climbing"). What wasnt stunning was combing them for the often rather dull and flat things to do. Hit buttons in succession to scan minerals or loot probes and wrecks. Or just go straight to the pre-fab objective right away.

Still, Id say it beats watching a graph and hitting a button, or just popping out of cover and whacking moles for almost the entire mission. Its shame really, since they made a token effort to add non shooter missions, but generally they were simple "interact with this thing" missions. Nothing really going for it. (examples being the crashed ship that collapses, the shielded base and the VI controlled facility).

Kinda makes you appreciate those brief ME1 missions that offered some roleplaying dialogue at the end along with interaction from your party members on occasion, instead of just constant combat.

Modifié par Dinkamus_Littlelog, 09 août 2010 - 03:06 .

[haberman13]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

shootist70 wrote...

I agree. The Mako was fine- it was the environments you explored with it that were lacking. Personally, though, I'd have preferred those open-world areas to have been explored on foot, and for them to be far smaller and with more content and more enemies, and better mission goals.

Driving across those stunning vistas was fantastic in ME1 (provided you avoided "mountain climbing"). What wasnt stunning was combing them for the often rather dull and flat things to do. Hit buttons in succession to scan minerals or loot probes and wrecks. Or just go straight to the pre-fab objective right away.

Still, Id say it beats watching a graph and hitting a button, or just popping out of cover and whacking moles for almost the entire mission. Its shame really, since they made a token effort to add non shooter missions, but generally they were simple "interact with this thing" missions. Nothing really going for it. (examples being the crashed ship that collapses, the shielded base and the VI controlled facility).

Kinda makes you appreciate those brief ME1 missions that offered some roleplaying dialogue at the end along with interaction from your party members on occasion, instead of just constant combat.

The loss of these "immersive" qualities left me unable to enjoy ME2, I just felt like I was in a corridor shooter (which I don't like).

Big open RPG games, that is my ideal game.  ME1 was almost there, it certainly hinted at it, ME2 failed miserably.

Morrowind was awesome, for those mentioniong it.  Same with Oblivion (loaded with mods like FCOM).

[Il Divo]

haberman13 wrote...

Morrowind was awesome, for those mentioniong it.  Same with Oblivion (loaded with mods like FCOM).

Midas Magic> all other Oblivion mods. Nothing quite compares to creating a Watermelon Atronach.

[haberman13]

Il Divo wrote...

haberman13 wrote...

Morrowind was awesome, for those mentioniong it.  Same with Oblivion (loaded with mods like FCOM).

Midas Magic> all other Oblivion mods. Nothing quite compares to creating a Watermelon Atronach.

Haha, or a cheese one!

Midas does rock, but really, for me Oblivion is ... not great ... without tons of mods.

I just started a new character, using FCOM/Loths/Qarls/Midas/and a ton more small mods...

incredible experience, possibly the best game ever made (imo).

Back on topic: ME2 was dumbed down, I can't handle it. :innocent:

Look at the community reactions from a random website to the ME2/DA2 formula.  PC gamers are not happy.

http://www.bluesnews...threadid=112946

Modifié par haberman13, 09 août 2010 - 05:00 .

[tonnactus]

By the way,i would rather explore stories then items that just make killing a little easier.Like how l2 biotics were treated for example.Best would be both of course,but i dont expect that mercs having top of the line weapons anyway. In Oblivion this became absurd on high levels,when even bandits had deadra armor.

[Il Divo]

tonnactus wrote...

By the way,i would rather explore stories then items that just make killing a little easier.Like how l2 biotics were treated for example.Best would be both of course,but i dont expect that mercs having top of the line weapons anyway. In Oblivion this became absurd on high levels,when even bandits had deadra armor.

I'll take Oblivion's Dark Brotherhood quest line over all of Mass Effect's side quests put together. Hell, at least they put some thought into designing them.

[haberman13]

tonnactus wrote...

By the way,i would rather explore stories then items that just make killing a little easier.Like how l2 biotics were treated for example.Best would be both of course,but i dont expect that mercs having top of the line weapons anyway. In Oblivion this became absurd on high levels,when even bandits had deadra armor.

Fixed with FCOM... but yeah, one of my complaints from vanilla.

Honestly, I hated Oblivion for its randomly generated design, only with mods does the game become an equal (and surpass) Morrowind.

Unique Landscapes compilation is amazing, makes exploration much more interesting and worthwhile.

Oblivion really is incredible now, with all the work the community has put into it.

I can't imagine playing vanilla on a console, pretty sure I just would pass.

Modifié par haberman13, 09 août 2010 - 05:24 .

[bjdbwea]

Yeah, too bad that we can't really mod ME 2. All its flaws could be much easier forgiven if the community had the chance to fix them. That's how it was with Oblivion and Fallout 3 too. Both were somewhat dumbed down too, to be able to run on consoles, but mods can make the games better than they could have been made by the developers themselves.

Modifié par bjdbwea, 09 août 2010 - 06:38 .

[Whatever42]

haberman13 wrote...

tonnactus wrote...

By the way,i would rather explore stories then items that just make killing a little easier.Like how l2 biotics were treated for example.Best would be both of course,but i dont expect that mercs having top of the line weapons anyway. In Oblivion this became absurd on high levels,when even bandits had deadra armor.

Fixed with FCOM... but yeah, one of my complaints from vanilla.

Honestly, I hated Oblivion for its randomly generated design, only with mods does the game become an equal (and surpass) Morrowind.

Unique Landscapes compilation is amazing, makes exploration much more interesting and worthwhile.

Oblivion really is incredible now, with all the work the community has put into it.

I can't imagine playing vanilla on a console, pretty sure I just would pass.

I pretty much did pass, never finished the game. You're making me think I should go back and take another look.

[tonnactus]

bjdbwea wrote...

Yeah, too bad that we can't really mod ME 2.

Gameplay changes alone wouldnt make the game much better.

[bjdbwea]

That's true, and rewriting the story properly would of course need a lot of additional voice acting.