204 réponses à ce sujet

[Flamewielder]

I'm a completionist myself and had all the upgrades maxed out before entering the Omega 4 relay.



The only clue I had before hand was that you needed to enter the relay ASAP after aquiring the IFF to save all your crew. No exact idea of how much time I had, so I did all my other loyalty missions before aquiring the IFF and only did Legion's Loyalty mission then entered the relay.



Everyone survived to enter the collector base. I used Tali for the vents, which seemed the most logical choice to me. I had to choose a person with leadership ability for the 2nd fire team, so I chose Miranda because she was the Lazarus cell team leader.



I sent Mordin back with the crew because he seemed the least powerful and was wondering if his scientific knowledge wasn't essential to the crew's health.



I chose Samara for the long walk, which worked out well, then used Samara for her Biotics/Assault Rifle and Tali for her Techs/Shotgun in the final fight, to cover long range and close range combat. I was tempted to use Grunt but I had a weird glitch that caused him to be Loyal but didn't unlock his special power. So he stayed behind to hold the line under Miranda's command.



Brought back everyone!

[The Uncanny]

If that is cheating... then I guess I cheated.

Everything was going well, up until my specialist - Legion - got shot in the head with Zaeed in charge of the group. I was sad, but ready to press on.

Then I got treated to the sight of Kelly getting liquefied and I ran screaming from the room. Who knew taking a little time to get a few more upgrades would have actual repercussions?!? But there it was - she was dead and it was my fault. Oh the guilt!

So I reloaded. And I don't care.

Modifié par The Uncanny, 01 mars 2010 - 01:10 .

[Bomber51]

I had Zaeed take the crew back to the ship, and didn't have Mordin in my final boss party, and everyone survived.

Modifié par Bomber51, 01 mars 2010 - 01:09 .

[Kenshen]

I made the mistake of picking Zaeed as the team leader for the first mission so I lost the tech in the pipe. Second play I lost Jack cause I couldn't settle the cat fight. Since then I have not lost anyone...unless it was on purpose that is.

[insochris]

Oawa wrote...

Vaenier wrote...

having a rock kill a squad member based on their loyalty is a bad design. how are loyal squad members better at surviving rocks?

Your last one is just a nitpick imo.

and on this: sometimes you just need an excuse for someone to be able to die.

[banshee768]

I'm a completionist as well, which meant that everyone was loyal and I had all upgrades.

I didn't know that your crew would be killed off if you didn't hurry through the relay, but since Legion's loyalty mission is a freebie and it was all I had left, the crew survived.

Choosing the roles were pretty easy. Mirandy as leader, given that she was a Ceberus officer, Tali is the techi, since, well, she can easily fit inside the tubes and she's Quarian.

The biotic was also a simple choice. You have 2 people dedicated to biotics and one of them has had a thousand years to practice and the other is a selfish, undisciplined, bald woman who can't be trusted with anything except her own life. I went for the former.

And seeing as Jacob's only strength is his loyalty, he could be trusted to escort the crew back to the Normandy.

Mission successful.

[kaimanaMM]

Mordin's death explained : http://social.biowar...5/index/1117936 

Dusty Everman wrote...

Mordin's death is not a glitch or bug.  I believe that when people are surprised with Mordin's death, it's during the "Hold the Line" time where you leave crew behind as you and two squad mates move onward.   Tech had their moment in the sun with the tunnel infiltration.  A biotic is key for the protective bubble.  The Hold the Line sequence is time for your soldier types to do their best.

Basically you want your best DEFENDERS to hold the line.  Don't think about offensive solo strikers.  Think about the guys that can dig down and hold a position with moxie.  You want them to hold the line.

Under the hood, each character has a "hole the line" score, which gets a bonus  if the character is loyal.  Characters like Mordin, Jack and Tali are squishy and not exoeruenced with bunkering down and holding out for an extended period of time.  Characters like Grunt and Zaeed are tanks who thrive on this type of work.  The score is tallied for all the team members that are holding the line, and the number of survivors are calculated.  If people are to die, the non-loyals squishies go first through the list to the loyal tanks.  Alas, I think Mordin is at the head of the death list.  Some characters can't survive without help even if they are loyal.  Others can survive even if not loyal.   

Here are some examples for the group holding the line:
Loyal Mordin by himself:  He can't hold the line by himself.  He dies.
Non-loyal Grunt by himself: Grunt lives.  He hunkers down and gets the job done, and doesn't have to worry about helping any one else.
Loyal Mordin and non-Loyal Grunt:   Grunt dies, but Mordin lives.  Grunt is able to hold the line but goofs up helping Mordin... he was just too aggressive without his right of passage.
Loyal Mordin and Loyal Grunt: They both live.

Note it is possible to get non-loyal henchmen to survive through the end game with the proper group holding the line.

So what is a good strategy?  Send back a loyal squishy with the crew, like Mordin or Tali.   Leave your defensive bad asses to hold the line (hmmm, Garrus defended a base all by himself to an extended period of time....)  and take your loyal offensive favorites with you to the end.

As for saving Kelly and the crew, you just need to make sure you go through the Omega-4 relay right after the crew is taken, and make sure you send a loyal squad mate back as an escort.

I didn't cheat, but I did reload, once, no spoilers.  My first time through I chose Tali for vent duty and Samara as B Team leader.  Tali ate a rocket to the face, oh noes!  So I reloaded and instead chose Legion and Garrus for B Team leader.  Garrus again for B Team leader, Samara for biotic barrier and Jacob to lead everyone back to the Normandy.  Everyone loyal, all ship upgrades.

[FredegarKadere]

Ashley had her chance and she told me it was over. Tali was ready to fill that empty void.

But to the real question.. On my first playthrough, I kept all squad members alive without realizing that the hold the line part was special. For the earlier steps I used common sense and read the descriptions to send specialists on each task. My prime squad was always Garrus/Legion/Tali so the Hold the Line part worked in my favor when I used Legion and Tali to take out the reaper baby.

My second playthrough worked the same way, except that the crew of the Normandy was turned into goo for the reaper baby since I wanted Legion as quick as I could get him. I avenged them. Used the same squad setups so still didn't lose any of my squad.

I didn't find out that the Hold the Line was a special/hidden part until a few days ago when reading the board.

[The Uncanny]

aryon69 wrote...

I made the mistake of picking Zaeed as the team leader for the first mission so I lost the tech in the pipe.

That took me by surprise - surely Zaeed qualifies as an experienced and authoritative potential leader? Apparently not!

[Booglarize]

aryon69 wrote...

I made the mistake of picking Zaeed as the team leader for the first mission so I lost the tech in the pipe. Second play I lost Jack cause I couldn't settle the cat fight. Since then I have not lost anyone...unless it was on purpose that is.

Yeah, that's another thing. I wouldn't consider it cheating if the only reason someone had casualties in the end was because they didn't have enough points on a red/blue meter to unlock a certain conversation option. Because let's face it, that's kind of ridiculous. So a replay at that point would be nothing more than compensation for a minor shortcoming in the game. 

I actually had Miranda unloyal at that point due to this very reason, though curiously, she survived. Then again, I didn't select her as a specialist or as a fire team leader (Garrus both times). 

Modifié par Booglarize, 01 mars 2010 - 01:18 .

[Octorox]

 I "cheated" by reloading the IFF mission to activate Legion so I could do his loyalty quest before the squad gets abducted. Got through the suicide mission with everybody the first time though

[Booglarize]

Interestingly enough, in my first playthrough the ship upgrades were the very first things I bought ( as soon as I unlocked them). Not because I knew their significance, but because I was extremely paranoid and was half-expecting to be randomly ambushed by another collector vessel mid-game. Still, it felt pretty damn satisfying going through the Omega 4 relay and seeing them get put to some actual use (though I was half expecting there to be casualties anyway).

[Tal-N]

See my reasoning with not sending Mordin with the crew is that he simply cannot fight well by himself. Especially against Collectors. So I figured I'd send Zaeed since at least he has the firepower and guts to hold up in a firefight. I was personally expecting the game to toss me something like they did with Joker where I'd have a side mission controlling whoever was escorting the crew. It didn't happen.



I figured it would be a huge fight at the core and when I saw that Reapman (REAPer-huMAN, geddit? lol) I thanked my luck that I didn't bring Mordin along. That he was safely defending a position along with 7 other skilled squadmates. I mean come on, he can solo squads of Blue Sun mercs on Omega but he can't survive a firefight when teamed up with some of the toughest people on in the galaxy. Jack, Miranda, Jacob, Tali, Legion, Samara and Garrus? They had two freaking snipers, all of our toughest Biotics and some solid techs too?



I just feel a little peeved that Bioware feels he would have stood more of a chance escorting the crew back to the ship ALONE or facing down a Reaper and a horde of Collectors with only me and a squadmate. Like folks have said, it would have been nice to just tell him to stay on the ship and play with his test tubes because he was never a suitable choice for anything we did on that suicide mission.

[Kyria Nyriese]

Pulled through with every squad mate first play through. Wasn't hard to do, and didn't require reloading. I'm a completionist, and did every mission before heading to the relay.

[Fjordgnu]

My first playthrough was disastrous. Well. A few people died. Thane, Miranda and Mordin, I think. I felt a little cheated, though, as I didn't quite understand, well, how it all worked, what with the Reaper IFF triggering the abduction and all, and that waiting would kill Kelly.



I'm not going to leave anyone behind on the character I import to ME3, that's for sure.

[mentosman8]

My squad all survived my first playthrough. Only lost the like half crew from not going right away. Since then saved every person on subsequent playthroughs. I was worried Jack was gonna die on me, was non-loyal thanks to the argument and holding the line, but she held up and all survived.

[crimsonrhodelia]

I lost Legion (noooooooo!) and Samara on my first play through. Legion is too awesome to lose, so I finished up, then restarted from going through the relay and I managed to save everyone.

[mentosman8]

*sigh* double post>_>

Modifié par mentosman8, 01 mars 2010 - 01:22 .

[crapmonster13]

Mordin never died for me personally, and I never took him with me to final boss nor did I have him escort the crew.



As for loyalties, I dont see why anyone wouldnt have all of them done. Most are relatively easy to do and at the least, are some of the more engaging parts of the game.



The choices as well I find mostly common-sensical. For group leaders, both the character descriptions in-game for Miranda and Garrus make mention of them as such. For the biotic bubble, why wouldn't anyone choose Jack or Samara? Tech specialist as well is a similar situation. Personally, I saw Tali as the obvious choice because once again, they literally describe her as such in the character description but as others have mentioned, shes not the only choice that works.



The only one that isn't blatantly obvious is the escort for the crew. Ive personally gone with Thane and its never failed.

[Leww]

lost nobody on my first playthrough.



miranda leading both teams, jack doing my biotic barrier, and grunt, of all people, escorting the survivors back ><. mordin and morinth came with me.

[Tal-N]

Bomber51 wrote...

I had Zaeed take the crew back to the ship, and didn't have Mordin in my final boss party, and everyone survived.

Ahh same as me.

Except that I didn't have Tech Damage 5/5 because I didn't have enough cash. I'm a little ticked off that after running all of the side missions I had purchased almost all of the upgrades but was left with 50'000 credits and the tech damage upgrade cost me 75'000. So I bit the bullet and decided to head on the suicide mission without it because time was wasting. I suppose if I had taken that upgrade Mordin would have survived since you made the same choices as me and that appears to have been on the only possible difference.

Hard to believe, the game didn't have the extra cash available for me to purchase an upgrade that would have saved Mordins life.

[Landline]

I have to playthrough templates that I'm going to use.



One where everyone survives, another where everyone dies save for Shepared, Tali and whoever is stubborn enough to not die on me.

[Asheer_Khan]

I think somebody from Bioware have confir that Morodin and Tali (if i am not mistaken) are so called random kills during that mission.



During my first full run i send back unloyal Legion as crew escort (Abduction fired up right after i completed Thane's l.mission and didn't have Zaaed) but everybody survived because i followed hints giving by journal and beside as ME 1 player i known pretty well garrus and Tali's ability so they were most logical choices for squad leading and tube run.



Since that i finished four runs without single lost but i agree that Morodin is good choice for crew escort because he will help Dr Chakwas tend possible wounded crew members.

[Tal-N]

Here's a question. Is it possible to have Shepard die? The impression I got from the previews and developer intervews is that it is possible to have him/her die on the suicide mission and therefore end up with a new lead character in ME3.

[eternalnightmare13]

Even though I botched Thane's loyalty quest and he ultimately died on my first 'canon' suicide run I didn't reload. I liked his character a lot but would rather play out the story the reload and reload. He was the only one to die so in some ways it even had a bigger impact on me. I think the character deaths lose impact if you ''cheat''. Besides, I have still play through with my male ''canon'' so I have a chance to keep Thane around.