93 réponses à ce sujet

[AdamBoozer]

I love reading about the reapers and the many theories so I decided to make this thread. When it's near finished should have multiple theory's from the people on this forum. Just a couple rules to post one so we don't get the less reputable waffle reaper theories lol though they are funny this is a more serious thread.

1.) You have to leave a link to your source where you got the inspiration. If you got it from a mission what mission? a site what site? It not only legitimizes your theory, but it allows us to check back and see your train of thought on the matter.
2.) Follow the board rules when it comes to down to it, try not to troll, or fight with someone with just name calling it is good to see arguments, but only when they have substance.
3.) Don't talk about fight club. Oh wait wrong thing :L Nope the third rule is you MUST have of read the topics or watched the videos in the topic http://social.biowar...5/index/1142168 How are you supposed to post a theory without knowing what you are talking about anyway.

That's it. I just don't want to see the tread bogged down with waffle theories and people arguing about whose hotter Miranda or ash.

WITH that out of the way . . . What is you're theory about the origins of the reapers, their motives, and anything else reaper like you can think of so long as you're using the three rules to do it I don't mind.

My personal theory
I believe that billions of years ago (2) there existed a very great space faring organic cybernetic race (speculation because the reapers are all as far as I can tell because of EDI organic/and machines). There technology was far superior to anything anyone existing today. They used something our scientist call element zero aka neutronum. Element zero is so far beyond us that we can only theorize that it is formed inside neutron stars. (1) This cybernetic race built the reapers who in turn built the citadel and the mass relays billions of years ago. (3, 4) As a result the serpent nebula was created from billions of years of repair. (4) They encompassed they're entire galaxey, when they discovered there galaxy was dieing they sought a way to save themselves. They found one alternative left to continue they're race, The Reaper. Using an interstellar mass effect core engine as the reapers use today they escaped their civilzations death as the first reaper with a fraction of their civilzation. (5) They must have intended to "de-reaper" themselves through advanced cloning and downloading tech, on entry to the new galaxy, The Milky Way. (6) Once they arrived for some reason the programing on the A.I. side went wrong and took over or maybe they realized the immense power they had, but they did not "de-reaper". Instead, they remained as they were a reaper. The rest was really history as they say. Seeing the young milky way as a potential breeding ground for their own kind they built the relays and the citadel (super mass relay). I think they made the citadel in attempt to get to a better suited galaxy and then altered it to suit better as a trap when it had failed. Through billions of years (2) of advancement though 50k year hibernation set back in development they have advanced very far. They must have realized that they could harvest tech from rising organic races and improve and replicate themselves at the same time holding the galaxy as their own. That's my theory anyway. What do you think?

Sources:
1.Element zero aka Neutronum:
http://masseffect.wi...ki/Element_zero
http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Neutronium
2. Proof reapers existed billions of years ago:
Levithan of Dis http://masseffect.wi...eviathan_of_Dis
3. Mass relays / citadel:
http://masseffect.wi...wiki/Mass_Relay
http://masseffect.wi...om/wiki/Citadel
4. Serpent nebula:
http://masseffect.wi.../Serpent_Nebula
5. Reaper engines:
http://masseffect.wi...com/wiki/Reaper (Now removed from site it did have some speculation on the reaper engines if you can find the site please give it to me. It said that the reapers didn't need to discharge there drive cores since they were in dark space or perhaps they found another way around this.)
6. Reaper Memorys and A.I. programs
Look under "The reapers and collectors" http://masseffect.wi...com/wiki/Reaper

Modifié par AdamBoozer, 02 mars 2010 - 12:15 .

[Internet Kraken]

Hm, okay. My only real theory about the Reapers in relation to the Human Reaper, and why they would build it.

Many people have wondered why the Reapers constantly allow civilizations to build itself up, only to swiftly destroy it. There are many theories as to why. You could think that the Reapers are just using organics as a food source, but arguably there are easier ways to cultivate and sustain organic food than allowing civilizations to constantly evolve and then fall. Rather I think they do it because the Reaper's culture involves preserving the most advanced and valuable species for eternity as Reapers. Reapers are not one single species, but rather a combination of all species ascended into a higher form of life. The best the galaxy has ever produced, all united under one banner.

The Reapers were not just trying to build any ordinary Reaper. They wanted to build a Human Reaper. Not to lead a massive attack against the Citadel, but rather because this is the Reaper's culture. They believe Humans are the species with the greatest potential. If they were just trying to build a generic Reaper, they could have used any species. Arguably it would be a lot easier to target something other than human colonies. But they specifically wanted to turn humans into the Reapers. Think about Harbinger's dialogue. He refers to the process of turning humans into genetic paste to fuel the larva's growth as "ascension". Why use that word in particular? Why not call it "assimilation"? Or "consumption"? "Ascension" implies that they are raising humans to be what they consider to be a higher form of life. They see value in humans.

But what about Sovereign? He didn't seem to like organics at all. Why turn them into Reapers? Well I believe that the Reapers may have considered the current organic "crop" to be a failure, not worthy of being turned into Reapers. This could be for a number of reasons. I think it's because the galaxy had a very diverse category of sentient lifeforms, with no one species appearing to be dominant. The Protheans appeared to be the undisputed rulers of the galaxy at the time of their downfall. This is the Reapers idea of the perfect organic race to harvest. One species that follows their predetermined line of technological advancement, rather than a handful of species that all do so at the same time. So the Reapers were all set to just wipe every race out and start from scratch. What changed this? Well humans killed a Reaper. The game often alludes to the idea that by killing a Reaper, we grabbed their attention. To delay the extinction cycle and kill a powerful Reaper in the process would probably interest them. So Harbinger now thinks that humans are worthy of ascension into the ultimate life form.

If you're wondering why they didn't do this to the Protheans, it's because the Prothean Reaper failed. Instead they turned them into the Collectors, so that they would still serve a purpose.

In short; Reapers wanted to create a Human Reaper for cultural reasons, not military strength.

I based this theory mostly on Harbinger's dialogue.

Modifié par Internet Kraken, 02 mars 2010 - 12:15 .

[AdamBoozer]

Very good points Internet Kraken. I loved the part about Sovereign and ascension. Very interesting concepts.

[AdamBoozer]

[Zack W]

Sorry if this is off track.. It's also not two cats ramming each other, which is pretty epic, btw..

During Mass Effect 1, I thought that Shadow Broker was Soveriegn. Since it got destroyed and Shadow Broker remains, I'm not so sure. However, I still think Shadow Broker is likely to have a big impact in 3 as a counterpart to Cerberus and that their identity will be, or will be meant as, a real surprise. . Getting off track from the reapers' origin though, sorry.

I think the reapers are from Dimension X.
http://en.wikipedia...._Ninja_Turtles)

In Dimension X, technology to create portals spanning huge distances or even, dimensional barriers, seems somewhat common. Also, "Darkspace" in Dimension X does not have the same meaning that it does in our known universe, as characters need no protective gear. Obviously, this is how the Reapers survive darkspace for 50,000 years at a time.

Modifié par Zack W, 02 mars 2010 - 01:31 .

[Internet Kraken]

Zack W wrote...

Sorry if this is off track.. It's also not two cats ramming each other, which is pretty epic, btw..

During Mass Effect 1, I thought that Shadow Broker was Soveriegn. Since it got destroyed and Shadow Broker remains, I'm not so sure. However, I still think Shadow Broker is likely to have a big impact in 3 as a counterpart to Cerberus and that their identity will be, or will be meant as, a real surprise. . Getting off track from the reapers' origin though, sorry.

Mass Effect 1 quite clearly shows that the Shadow Broker is not a Reaper. However, I do agreee that he will probably play a larger role in Mass Effect 3.

[AdamBoozer]

Well no the shadow broker isn't a reaper they, he, or she did try to sell shepards body to the collectors during the events of accension was it? But They as Kraken pointed out make it clear the shadow broker is not a reaper. But it is a good theory being that we have no idea how the reapers keep track of the galaxy like they do. It is quite impressive.

[Vaenier]

The first race to achieve space flight spread across the stars, colonizing billions upon billions of stars. The incredible genetic diversity they achieved led to a random mutation, a parasitic virus sprung up and began converting all organic life into horrific monsters. It rapidly spread, having ample resources from the trillions of civilians.

They fought the parasites the best they could, winning ever battle they engaged in, but couldn't see any way of defeating an enemy with infinite resources. They got pushed back to a corner of the Galaxy, barely keeping the parasites back. As a last ditch effort, they created the Reapers. The Reapers began their galaxy wide extinction of all organic life, including their creators, starving the parasite to death.

Now every 50,000 years, they come back and cull the space fairing races of the galaxy, preventing them from releasing the virus again.

[AdamBoozer]

Vaenier wrote...

The first race to achieve space flight spread across the stars, colonizing billions upon billions of stars. The incredible genetic diversity they achieved led to a random mutation, a parasitic virus sprung up and began converting all organic life into horrific monsters. It rapidly spread, having ample resources from the trillions of civilians.
They fought the parasites the best they could, winning ever battle they engaged in, but couldn't see any way of defeating an enemy with infinite resources. They got pushed back to a corner of the Galaxy, barely keeping the parasites back. As a last ditch effort, they created the Reapers. The Reapers began their galaxy wide extinction of all organic life, including their creators, starving the parasite to death.
Now every 50,000 years, they come back and cull the space fairing races of the galaxy, preventing them from releasing the virus again.

No sources to look where you got that from but if this were true it wouldn't take 50 thousand years and there would be some signs of the parasite left. Also sounds like halo lol the flood. random i know.
 
Trillions of a race would be un imaginable. That would cost a lot of money and resources to keep them alive and build colonies and I doubt even the reapers could get rid of everything of there existence. So why haven't we found proof of them?

Do you understand though that the reapers are entire civilzations each baring millions of that particular race and trillions of this race would mean a lot of reapers and kinda defeats the purpose dosen't it?

But interesting theory. I like it even though there are a couple holes dosen't meant they couldn't be filled to better suit the theory.

[Vaenier]

It is a joke, not a serious theory. Saying bump is boring.

AdamBoozer wrote...

No sources to look where you got that from but if this were true it wouldn't take 50 thousand years and there would be some signs of the parasite left. Also  sounds like halo lol the flood. random i know.

That is because it is the Flood. I thought making the Reapers use giant rings would be to much of a give away.

Trillions of a race would be un imaginable. That would cost a lot of money and resources to keep them alive and build colonies and I doubt even the reapers could get rid of everything of there existence. So why haven't we found proof of them?

Its been 4 billion something years. They had plenty of time to clean up.

Do you understand though that the reapers are entire civilizations each baring millions of that particular race and trillions of this race would mean a lot of reapers and kinda defeats the purpose dosen't it?

There werent alot left when they made them? I dont know, I didnt think my joke through.

Modifié par Vaenier, 02 mars 2010 - 03:10 .

[AdamBoozer]

Vaenier wrote...

It is a joke, not a serious theory. Saying bump is boring.

I don't see it as a joke. Some of it was based on lore and could be possible if it was made on a smaller scale.

[slyguy07]

My theory is that an ancient race sought immortality and came up with the reapers. Each program in a reaper vessel is not a "program", but an individual's consciousness, personality and memories. Somehow upon this transfer they were altered to believe it was there newfound duty to find the most advanced and worthy organic species and grant them this same gift. The weak would die and not drain anymore resources for the reaper's potential use. Thus the 50,000 year cycle.

[GnusmasTHX]

The Leviathan of Dis is hardly 'proof' that Reapers existed billions of years ago.

(Though I agree there is some as of yet unrevealed relation.)

Modifié par GnusmasTHX, 02 mars 2010 - 03:20 .

[AdamBoozer]

slyguy07 wrote...

My theory is that an ancient race sought immortality and came up with the reapers. Each program in a reaper vessel is not a "program", but an individual's consciousness, personality and memories. Somehow upon this transfer they were altered to believe it was there newfound duty to find the most advanced and worthy organic species and grant them this same gift. The weak would die and not drain anymore resources for the reaper's potential use. Thus the 50,000 year cycle.

Couple holes again and NO SOURCE!  Prob because you haven't read about them quite thourgly but anyway the reapers are organic and machine. They have both memory's of the race they took and A.I. programs in them. Check out my first post the mass effect wiki reapers page shows it.

newfound duty to find the most advanced and worthy organic species and grant them this same gift. The weak would die and not drain anymore resources for the reaper's potential use.

Forcefully? No the reapers are farily selfish race and view everything as a tool. So they wouldn't do soemthing unless they had something to gain. By abosorbing culutes they gain the unique tech and organic diversity and memorys of that species and more fire power for there cause (what ever that really is) The reapers only use resources as far as we know for repairs after they fight and to make new reapers. This is all we have found them to use them for. A species that advanced could have cornucopia devices that constructus anything they need on the moleculer level. they have been around for billions of years.

[AdamBoozer]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

The Leviathan of Dis is hardly 'proof' that Reapers existed billions of years ago.

(Though I agree there is some as of yet unrevealed relation.)

Where was the ship found again? Read the page trust me man I looked pretty hard and usually when you see a crator in ME it's reapers.

[SandTrout]

Internet Kraken wrote...

Hm, okay. My only real theory about the Reapers in relation to the Human Reaper, and why they would build it.

Many people have wondered why the Reapers constantly allow civilizations to build itself up, only to swiftly destroy it. There are many theories as to why. You could think that the Reapers are just using organics as a food source, but arguably there are easier ways to cultivate and sustain organic food than allowing civilizations to constantly evolve and then fall. Rather I think they do it because the Reaper's culture involves preserving the most advanced and valuable species for eternity as Reapers. Reapers are not one single species, but rather a combination of all species ascended into a higher form of life. The best the galaxy has ever produced, all united under one banner.

The Reapers were not just trying to build any ordinary Reaper. They wanted to build a Human Reaper. Not to lead a massive attack against the Citadel, but rather because this is the Reaper's culture. They believe Humans are the species with the greatest potential. If they were just trying to build a generic Reaper, they could have used any species. Arguably it would be a lot easier to target something other than human colonies. But they specifically wanted to turn humans into the Reapers. Think about Harbinger's dialogue. He refers to the process of turning humans into genetic paste to fuel the larva's growth as "ascension". Why use that word in particular? Why not call it "assimilation"? Or "consumption"? "Ascension" implies that they are raising humans to be what they consider to be a higher form of life. They see value in humans.

But what about Sovereign? He didn't seem to like organics at all. Why turn them into Reapers? Well I believe that the Reapers may have considered the current organic "crop" to be a failure, not worthy of being turned into Reapers. This could be for a number of reasons. I think it's because the galaxy had a very diverse category of sentient lifeforms, with no one species appearing to be dominant. The Protheans appeared to be the undisputed rulers of the galaxy at the time of their downfall. This is the Reapers idea of the perfect organic race to harvest. One species that follows their predetermined line of technological advancement, rather than a handful of species that all do so at the same time. So the Reapers were all set to just wipe every race out and start from scratch. What changed this? Well humans killed a Reaper. The game often alludes to the idea that by killing a Reaper, we grabbed their attention. To delay the extinction cycle and kill a powerful Reaper in the process would probably interest them. So Harbinger now thinks that humans are worthy of ascension into the ultimate life form.

If you're wondering why they didn't do this to the Protheans, it's because the Prothean Reaper failed. Instead they turned them into the Collectors, so that they would still serve a purpose.

In short; Reapers wanted to create a Human Reaper for cultural reasons, not military strength.

I based this theory mostly on Harbinger's dialogue.

This has pretty much been my theory since I saw the Human Reaper with the exception of I think that the protheans likely were converted into a reaper, but only a small genetic population that proved unsuitable for some reason. EDI notes that the collectors match findings from a specfic cluster, though this may be the only genetic samples found of the Proteans.

As for the Reaper's origins, the original species progressed technologically along lines similar to the Conclave(orsomething like that, it's been a while) in this book. Essentially, they began hooking their minds into a great network that allowed every individual to merge their conciousness into a single entity.

Eventually, they took the next logical step and distilled their genetic and cultural essence into a single cybernetic creature that we would eventually deem "Reapers". Legion describes that the Geth desire the same end, but wish to achieve it on their own terms without the control of the Reapers. Of course, this networked inteligence is a natural state for Geth, but from the perspective of organics watching the process of ascension, we are horrified by it and fail to understand that the Reapers think they are doing us a favor.

[Trenrade]

I think their motives are to harvest organic life to make more Reaper warships, I believe this because of what I seen at the end of the second game. as far as how they came to be I have no idea, my guess would have to be something reminiscent of the Quarians or the re-imagined BSG or The Matrix, in which an organic species created a machine race only to be exiled from their planet, Enslaved or wiped out totally.

[GnusmasTHX]

AdamBoozer wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

The Leviathan of Dis is hardly 'proof' that Reapers existed billions of years ago.

(Though I agree there is some as of yet unrevealed relation.)

Where was the ship found again? Read the page trust me man I looked pretty hard and usually when you see a crator in ME it's reapers.

Sorry, what?

How do craters suddenly equal Reapers? Have you ever considered that it just crashed? The description of the Leviathan is clearly organic, or at least "living" in nature. It's been well established by any players eye that the Reapers are machine-like, and in-game, the Council wouldn't have assumed the Reapers were a geth creation if they were organic or 'living' at all. In fact, the reason they're presumed a geth warship is BECAUSE they're machine-like, not 'living' organic like the description of the Leviathan states.

Better theory for the Leviathan is that it is either A) The (or A) Reaper race before it transformed into its typical Reaper machine version or A race that went to war with the Reapers, hence why it was dead in the bottom of a crater. In which case, it could still be A.

At any rate, you've just admitted it's not definitive proof, not that I cared, I was just mentioning.

Modifié par GnusmasTHX, 02 mars 2010 - 03:33 .

[AdamBoozer]

I don't see anything to correct on there well done. Interesting and unique at that. I was about to ask why they do what they do but you answered. But you should go into detail about what there purpose was to the race who made them. The quarians we know made theres for cheap labor at first and saw that intercontivity between many got them to solve problems more effiecently and eventually they developed conciousness and became sapeint and the quarians "tried" to kill them and they pushed them out of the persius vheil for good.

[Vaenier]

New random theory: They are building the perfect creature.

They cull the galaxy every 50 thousand years, taking the genetic code of the space fairing races and adding it to their databases. They then wipe them out so that the next generation of races can evolve and repeat the cycle. if they didnt kill off the races, then they would just spread and remove all chance of new species from ever developing.



New Random Theory: Sapient life is a virus and they are the cure.

If sapient life is left to spread unchecked, then they would infect every single planet in the galaxy. They would terraform and develop the ecosystem, stopping any chance of new life from growing. The Reapers clear the slate of all space fairing races to give new life a chance at attaining balance with the universe. All races that never get space travel and reach equilibrium with their world are free to live forever.

[slyguy07]

AdamBoozer wrote...

slyguy07 wrote...

My theory is that an ancient race sought immortality and came up with the reapers. Each program in a reaper vessel is not a "program", but an individual's consciousness, personality and memories. Somehow upon this transfer they were altered to believe it was there newfound duty to find the most advanced and worthy organic species and grant them this same gift. The weak would die and not drain anymore resources for the reaper's potential use. Thus the 50,000 year cycle.

Couple holes again and NO SOURCE!  Prob because you haven't read about them quite thourgly but anyway the reapers are organic and machine. They have both memory's of the race they took and A.I. programs in them. Check out my first post the mass effect wiki reapers page shows it.

newfound duty to find the most advanced and worthy organic species and grant them this same gift. The weak would die and not drain anymore resources for the reaper's potential use.

Forcefully? No the reapers are farily selfish race and view everything as a tool. So they wouldn't do soemthing unless they had something to gain. By abosorbing culutes they gain the unique tech and organic diversity and memorys of that species and more fire power for there cause (what ever that really is) The reapers only use resources as far as we know for repairs after they fight and to make new reapers. This is all we have found them to use them for. A species that advanced could have cornucopia devices that constructus anything they need on the moleculer level. they have been around for billions of years.

My apologies I didn't see the part about posting a source. But yes I have read about them and I do know they are organic and machine both. However there is nothing I have seen that proves the Reapers somehow absorb memories of the races they harvest although it would be logical to assume that they do.

[AdamBoozer]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

AdamBoozer wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

The Leviathan of Dis is hardly 'proof' that Reapers existed billions of years ago.

(Though I agree there is some as of yet unrevealed relation.)

Where was the ship found again? Read the page trust me man I looked pretty hard and usually when you see a crator in ME it's reapers.

Sorry, what?

How do craters suddenly equal Reapers? Have you ever considered that it just crashed? The description of the Leviathan is clearly organic, or at least "living" in nature. It's been well established by any players eye that the Reapers are machine-like, and in-game, the Council wouldn't have assumed the Reapers were a geth creation if they were organic or 'living' at all. In fact, the reason they're presumed a geth warship is BECAUSE they're machine-like, not 'living' organic like the description of the Leviathan states.

Better theory for the Leviathan is that it is either A) The (or A) Reaper race before it transformed into its typical Reaper machine version or A race that went to war with the Reapers, hence why it was dead in the bottom of a crater. In which case, it could still be A.

At any rate, you've just admitted it's not definitive proof, not that I cared, I was just mentioning.

I see how you could argue that it's just a crashed ship but we would see that race around still so they must of been wiped out. So I thought it was a base or compound and the ship was under the crator. So the reapers seeing the base take it out it kills the organic ship if it was a ship and bam.

I don't think I have ever seen a crator with anything inside it intact. For a ship to survive there won't be a crator either as seen by al the other crashed ships. Almost all the crators in ME2 have evidence of space fairing civilzation but hte moons just have sign of impact. If there is a crator it isn't ever explained like the reaper crators are.

Reapers are not just machines there cybernetic as said by EDI during the suicide mission and why they need humans. Your A and B support my theory . . .

[AdamBoozer]

slyguy07 wrote...

AdamBoozer wrote...

slyguy07 wrote...

My theory is that an ancient race sought immortality and came up with the reapers. Each program in a reaper vessel is not a "program", but an individual's consciousness, personality and memories. Somehow upon this transfer they were altered to believe it was there newfound duty to find the most advanced and worthy organic species and grant them this same gift. The weak would die and not drain anymore resources for the reaper's potential use. Thus the 50,000 year cycle.

Couple holes again and NO SOURCE!  Prob because you haven't read about them quite thourgly but anyway the reapers are organic and machine. They have both memory's of the race they took and A.I. programs in them. Check out my first post the mass effect wiki reapers page shows it.

newfound duty to find the most advanced and worthy organic species and grant them this same gift. The weak would die and not drain anymore resources for the reaper's potential use.

Forcefully? No the reapers are farily selfish race and view everything as a tool. So they wouldn't do soemthing unless they had something to gain. By abosorbing culutes they gain the unique tech and organic diversity and memorys of that species and more fire power for there cause (what ever that really is) The reapers only use resources as far as we know for repairs after they fight and to make new reapers. This is all we have found them to use them for. A species that advanced could have cornucopia devices that constructus anything they need on the moleculer level. they have been around for billions of years.

My apologies I didn't see the part about posting a source. But yes I have read about them and I do know they are organic and machine both. However there is nothing I have seen that proves the Reapers somehow absorb memories of the races they harvest although it would be logical to assume that they do.

Yes it is speculation that is accepted widley because no other conclusion can be made. There melted down and some how they get the memories because EDI mentions that they have them. We just don't know how that works lol plot convience.

It's okay you don't got to have a source it just helps us see how you got what you got.

[Krogan Face]

Lets not forget the Reapers ultimate goal, to live forever.  Their cycle of reaping and hybernation hints at this, also they dont have to develop advanced techknowlegy through means of manufacturing it.  They just allow the more advanced species that they harvest do it for them, and thats another form of conserving energy thus prolonging there life span as a species.

Id love to keep going and get deep into it, but im tired.

cool thread tho.

[GnusmasTHX]

Modifié par GnusmasTHX, 02 mars 2010 - 04:11 .