619 réponses à ce sujet

[Dethateer]

Yes, there is, (in the ME Universe): there are more of them.

[Mcjon01]

Dethateer wrote...

Shandepared wrote...

Dethateer wrote...

If you know that, then why would the galaxy need a reason to exist?

I never said the galaxy had any reason to exist. As far as I'm concerned nothing does. If you want answers I suggest you talk to a priest.

I'm an atheist. But that's beside the point. We have no claim over this galaxy, even if it is utterly devoid of life. There is no reason whatsoever for us to survive at the expense of others.

There might not be any objective reason, but if it came down to the wire and the choices were "all other species extinct" and "all humans extinct", we'd have every reason to act in a way that would bring about the former.  That reason being that we're human.

Seriously, this is the same kind of logic that makes me hate crazy environmentalists that think we need to protect the enivironment at the expense of humanity, as well as the fatalists that argue that the earth will be fine but humanity will eventually die out no matter what.  We need to regulate our effect on the earth, but as a first step toward exerting control over it.

Err... sorry, didn't mean to go off on a weird tangent.

[Dethateer]

Other life on our planet isn't sapient, it's irrelevant to the current discussion.

[Speakeasy13]

Shandepared wrote...

Dethateer wrote...

Why?

...because I'm human.

...That's a very dangerous logic. White supremists operate under that very same racist notion that because you belong to one race, all others are therefore less important and ultimately expendable. Truth be told, I fail to see how in terms of sapience, a human can be any different than a Turian, a Krogan or even a Hanar. Humans are saints and jerks, so are every other speicies out there. I wouldn't sacrifice a Turian family man to save a human hoodlum. They are all just people to me. Being xenophobic in that logic is reducing yourself to a biological creature of the herd.

That, and I really don't think humans are going to make the world a better place. I wouldn't trust the fate of the universe to a speicies whose history is written with genocide and slavery and inequality. If all humans were to be destroyed I would've comfortably resigned to my fate.

Modifié par Speakeasy13, 20 mars 2010 - 01:36 .

[Asheer_Khan]

Shandepared wrote...

Asheer_Khan wrote...

Udina jump on ocassion to size control over new council because of  temporal chaos after battle whit Sovieregin BUT soon or later new leaders (and this time blood thirsty hawks) will take command over Turian fleet and having no respect for new council they will take action to put at end Human dominance on the Citadel.

Except that they haven't and won't.

Are you 100% sure?... because i am not.

I won't be surprised if renegade ME 3 will start whit Siege of the Citadel by Turian forces and constant incomming pleas for help from raided colonies.

Ann no... Galaxy was not created for humn dominance... heck do you ever ask yourself why despite over 6000 years of human civilization egsistence we are still unable to establish even small human settlement on the Moon?

Human history is almost constant blood sheeds of thousand bigger and smaller wars and genocides... hell even our current level of  technological advancement was possible because of nuclear arms race between USA and Soviet Russia.

It's very possible that if any civilization does egsist in space then for them we are at the same level of advancement as Egiptians from very early times of the first dynasty.
Look what we uses to "explore" space: radio waves and optical instruments, and even if earth would be somehow able to build space ship able to reach Alpha Centauri (closest stettle able star system) then this journey will take almost 130 years so to Alpha Cetauri will arrive second generation of those who left Earth in the beginning.

So i would advise to slow down a little whit "Humanity deserve to rulig everybody" attitude.

[Dethateer]

Shandepared wrote...

Dethateer wrote...

Yes, there is, (in the ME Universe): there are more of them.

We'll see about that...

Smart. Kill 5 civilizations to save one, simply because that one is yours.

Say someone gave you a gun, and revealed three people tied to chairs: one klingon, one rodian, and one drell. If you shoot yourself, the other three get to live. On the other hand, you have to shoot all of them to keep yourself alive. Who would you kill? One sapient being to save three, or three sapient beings to save one?

Modifié par Dethateer, 20 mars 2010 - 01:43 .

[Dethateer]

That was sarcasm.

[Speakeasy13]

Asheer_Khan wrote...

Shandepared wrote...

Asheer_Khan wrote...

Udina jump on ocassion to size control over new council because of  temporal chaos after battle whit Sovieregin BUT soon or later new leaders (and this time blood thirsty hawks) will take command over Turian fleet and having no respect for new council they will take action to put at end Human dominance on the Citadel.

Except that they haven't and won't.

Are you 100% sure?... because i am not.

I won't be surprised if renegade ME 3 will start whit Siege of the Citadel by Turian forces and constant incomming pleas for help from raided colonies.

Ann no... Galaxy was not created for humn dominance... heck do you ever ask yourself why despite over 6000 years of human civilization egsistence we are still unable to establish even small human settlement on the Moon?

Human history is almost constant blood sheeds of thousand bigger and smaller wars and genocides... hell even our current level of  technological advancement was possible because of nuclear arms race between USA and Soviet Russia.

It's very possible that if any civilization does egsist in space then for them we are at the same level of advancement as Egiptians from very early times of the first dynasty.
Look what we uses to "explore" space: radio waves and optical instruments, and even if earth would be somehow able to build space ship able to reach Alpha Centauri (closest stettle able star system) then this journey will take almost 130 years so to Alpha Cetauri will arrive second generation of those who left Earth in the beginning.

So i would advise to slow down a little whit "Humanity deserve to rulig everybody" attitude.

I think the answer you're looking from him is not "he's sure", it's "he doesn't care". ethonocentrism and egoistism often comes hands in hands. Because one believes his own "La Raza" to be superior, one is also inclined to think they are ready, willing and able to cut down whatever obstacle in their way to what they preceive as "the goal".

In this case, so what if we're going to war with the Turian? We'll kill all of'em birdman bastards. Nevermind the fact that they KICKED OUR ASS in the first contact war; nevermind the fact that we'll be biting the hands that fed us. We're so superior we deserve every little single bit of kindness the world has shown us, and we'll show them none in return. Viva la Raza.

Modifié par Speakeasy13, 20 mars 2010 - 01:45 .

[Barquiel]

Shepards children will be asari (if BW allows it^_^). Why would I want humans to rule the galaxy?

[Mcjon01]

Dethateer wrote...

Shandepared wrote...

Dethateer wrote...

Yes, there is, (in the ME Universe): there are more of them.

We'll see about that...

Smart. Kill 5 civilizations to save one, simply because that one is yours.

Say someone gave you a gun, and revealed three people tied to chairs: one klingon, one rodian, and one drell. If you shoot yourself, the other three get to live. On the other hand, you have to shoot all of them to keep the yourself alive. Who would you kill? One sapient being to save three, or three sapient beings to save one?

I'd kill 4 sapient beings, actually.  The three in the chairs, and the bastard who set up the situation in the first place.  I wouldn't like it, I wouldn't be happy about it.  I'd probably have to invest in a good therapist afterward.  That doesn't change the fact that self-preservation comes before the lives of utter stangers.

[Dethateer]

Ok, apparently I'm defective, because I can't understand why you should place your own life above others', whether you know them or not.
[e]
Didn't someone already try to do that in one of the movies?

Modifié par Dethateer, 20 mars 2010 - 01:50 .

[Mcjon01]

Shandepared wrote...

Speakeasy13 wrote...

Nevermind the fact that they KICKED OUR ASS in the first contact war; nevermind the fact that we'll be biting the hands that fed us.

Actually the opposite happened.

There was very little ass-kicking on both sides, really.  The Turians occupied on of our colonies, we took it back, and the council intervened before the Turians got serious.  500 or so casualties on both sides. Which is good, since they would have obliterated us through sheer firepower at that point.

A war now would be more even, but the Turians still have a bigger fleet by a fairly large margin.  Humans have their carriers, yes, but the other species are adopting that tactic too as a way of sidestepping treaties.  It doesn't all come down to fleet size, though, since humans would be at a heavy disadvantage against the united Council species.  Mostly because they all represent one aspect of human military power taken to an extreme humans can't reach.

[Dethateer]

For you, the defining characteristic of "worth" is that it belongs to your species. For me, that it's sapient. I cannot place multiple civilizations above my own, simply because they're not human.

Modifié par Dethateer, 20 mars 2010 - 01:57 .

[Dethateer]

Because a civil war would be too costly during a galactic crisis?

The Turian fleet was also larger than the Asari one, why didn't they simply attack the Asari?

Modifié par Dethateer, 20 mars 2010 - 02:00 .