619 réponses à ce sujet

[Default137]

The Angry One wrote...

A big problem with the game is that quite a few of the renegade options amount to being a Cerberus stooge.
That's just wrong. They shouldn't assume that renegade = pro-Cerberus. A renegade gets the job done at all costs, sure. But that doesn't mean goose-stepping to TIM's agenda, that's not being a renegade at all, that's being an idiot.

There are huge problems with the Renegade/Paragon system, far more then just this.

Honestly, I kept the base, I figure the worst thing that could possibly happen is Cereberus feeds some more colonists in to it, and I have to go stop them, but what do I care if a few colonies continue to die? I never see the NPCs, not my goddamn problem that Cerberus goes stupid and tries to make a Reaper. All the other alternatives just add more depth to the game, if they get indoctrinated, then I have to go beat them up, and I'll get more stuff, there is also the fact if it stays there, I get more chances to go back and show the Alliance or the Council the base, or heck, TIM might not be as bad as people want to believe he is, and may actually use it to outfit me better for some of the final fights.

I'm amused by the sun at the end, and would find it hilarious if it was actually a sign of sorts. As if you do destroy the base, it goes dark, like its died due to Dark Matter poisioning, meanwhile, if you keep the base the sun stays burning bright, and the blue only covers a small portion of the sun, which seems like a far more hopeful symbol.

Modifié par Default137, 02 mars 2010 - 06:52 .

[CmdrFenix83]

Reiella wrote...

rasblak wrote...

So the "database" of the Reapers is all that's needed? Somehow that's different and separate from "the tech itself", right?
Why bother going after the IFF module if "the tech itself" is such a bad thing to have around?

If EDI can't hack into the Omega 4 relay, what makes you think that she can tell head from tail of the reapers' so very valuable "database" thing that you came up with?

Just a point here, the IFF wasn't so you could access the Relay.  Any old ship was able to access it, they just never came back.  And the flotsam you dropped into on your way shows part of why .

The IFF was so in theory, the automated defenses/ships defending the sector wouldn't know the Normandy wasn't supposed to be there.  It didn't seem to work out so well  for us .  A fair point may be that there were a number of automated systems that didn't frag us on Normandy's approach.  Personally, I feel that the IFF should now be worthless, since one ship did in fact confirm target on the Normandy, which should have invalidated that specific IFF, but that's plot handwavium .

Although more on point, IFF signal hacking is exactly what EDI was programmed for.  That's a pretty primal ECM/ECCM idea .  You make a very good point on her not being able to manage it either.  Although there is a different timescale in play.

This automated defense you speak of was the Omega4 Relay itself.  A normal ship going through has a drift of several thousand kilometers.  In an area surrounded by black holes, the odds of being sucked into one was very good.

The Reaper IFF was required to get the relay to acknowledge the Normandy as a Reaper, and allow it to pass through that relay much more accurately.  Now, I'm sure several of those ships passing through the relay over the millenia were indeed brought through on-target, and those Oculus creatures obliterated them instantly, hence the debris field.  Normandy was a warship expecting a fight, not a scout ship caught offguard.

[The Governator]

Vaenier wrote...

The Governator wrote...
The short answer is that the tech is tainted and it is essentially taking the short easy route to victory that was built upon the suffering and demise of countless lives.  To partake of such a victory stains your essence with sin, in my opinion.

Making those deaths meaningless is better than making their sacrifice save others? Interesting...

You could plausibly make that argument for saving the genophage research (though I still find it tasteless), but making that argument for the preservation of tech that is arguably no better than the mass relays and the citadel is patently wrong.  

[CmdrFenix83]

Vaenier wrote...

Blowing it up is the Renegade option. You put your own feelings above the safety of the galaxy. Saving it is Paragon option. You put aside your personal hate for the base in order to use the sacrifices of the Collector's victims to saves countless more innocent lives.

Saving base is the equivalent to telling TIM to go ahead and sacrifice hundreds of thousand to millions of people to make his own Reapers to fight the Reaper Fleet.  How that sacrifice could be labeled as anything but Renegade is beyond me.

As a paragon Shep says, "I won't let fear compromise who I am."  Or when explaining it to TIM afterwards, "And I'm going to do exactly what you brought me back to do, and I'll do it without sacrificing the soul of our species."

It's pretty obvious which is the idealist and which is the 'at any cost' stance here.

[screwoffreg]

How would TIM create a Reaper even? With 150 members of Cerebrus, he'd have a hell of time gathering millions of humans. I can see him using reaper technology, but creating a Reaper is beyond his power.

[rasblak]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...
She infiltrated their computer system, that's her *entire* purpose.  And in case you don't remember, that IFF *was* a bad thing to have around.  I won't say exactly why, because this is a 'no spoiler' section, but you know exactly what I'm talking about.  The only reason your mission wasn't a complete failure, was EDI... in more than one instance even.

Ok, you're probably right there. I can't recall the exact details of what went wrong; I'd need a 2nd playthrough.

Did you not even pay attention to anything Sovereign and Legion stated?  "Your civilization is based upon the technology of the Mass Relays, our technology.  By using it, your society develops along the paths we desire."  They *want* us using their tech.  Developing our own and finding something that deviates from that path means they most likely won't have a defense set up to handle it.

You're right again, yes, they said that. Here's what I am saying: The Reapers could be Microsoft.
Microsoft wants everyone to use Windows; but Microsoft does not want anyone outside Microsoft to study the source code to Windows, do they?
Does that make the difference between 'using Mass Relay tech' and 'studying reaper-building tech' clearer for you?

Of course any intelligent people would want to "develop [their] own" instead of repeating the mistake of being merely users of the technology. However, how do you know that what you develop is good enough if you throw away vital information about what's coming?
Had the Native Americans known long enough beforehand that there were conquerors coming with cannons, rifles, and gun powder, do you think they would have stuck with the bow and arrow?

Well, you could be right on that. There's hope for you after all.

I'm glad that even in the point you agree, you can still try to be condescending. 

You're right. There was no need for that on my part. Apologies.

Modifié par rasblak, 02 mars 2010 - 07:23 .

[II Numero6 II]

Because it's like a trojan horse , exactly like in the Trojan War .



The Greeks pretended to sail away, and the Trojans pulled the Horse into their city as a victory trophy. That night the Greek force crept out of the Horse and opened the gates for the rest of the Greek army, which had sailed back under cover of night. The Greek army entered and destroyed the city of Troy, decisively ending the war.

[Default137]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...

Vaenier wrote...

Blowing it up is the Renegade option. You put your own feelings above the safety of the galaxy. Saving it is Paragon option. You put aside your personal hate for the base in order to use the sacrifices of the Collector's victims to saves countless more innocent lives.

Saving base is the equivalent to telling TIM to go ahead and sacrifice hundreds of thousand to millions of people to make his own Reapers to fight the Reaper Fleet.  How that sacrifice could be labeled as anything but Renegade is beyond me.

As a paragon Shep says, "I won't let fear compromise who I am."  Or when explaining it to TIM afterwards, "And I'm going to do exactly what you brought me back to do, and I'll do it without sacrificing the soul of our species."

It's pretty obvious which is the idealist and which is the 'at any cost' stance here.

Because its obvious TIM wants to use the base to make a Reaper, right, despite the fact its said quite a few times during the course of the game that the Colonies together wouldn't have even completed the one they were working on, and that they would have to raid Earth to finish it, and since he'd be starting fresh, he'd have to raid most of Earth just to get the thing started.

The Paragon option in this case just looks really stupid to be honest, this may just be the fact I was raised Military Style, but if a Paragon Shepard was under my command, I'd have his ass courtmarsheled in a second, he destroyed something that could have given us a huge fighting chance against galactic genocide to "stick it to the man" with no real proof that guy was anything more then an inconsiderate ****. Yeah sure, TIM is a dick, but you don't blow up the greatest chance we have to stop the reapers because your commanding officer was an ass to you, thats preschool level thinking right there, and his talk of "I WON'T LET FEAR COMPRIMISE WHO I AM" just felt so painfully forced and shallow it was pathetic.

The entire game was built to getting this tech, every sacrifice every character made was to get this tech to help stop the Reapers, you may not have known that, but thats what the Illusive Man was doing, every scientist, crewmember, and squadmember that died, did so in an attempt to help you get to that base, so we could use its technology against the Reapers and a Paragon Shepard just sticks his finger up his ass, goes DURR, and blows it up because TIM called him names.

[CmdrFenix83]

screwoffreg wrote...

How would TIM create a Reaper even? With 150 members of Cerebrus, he'd have a hell of time gathering millions of humans. I can see him using reaper technology, but creating a Reaper is beyond his power.

Batarian Slavers?  He's been doing it for years for smaller numbers.  He gets several billion credits a year in funding, who's to say he can't just start paying the slavers to collect his 'sacrifices' for him.  He doesn't necessarily need humans only either, we simply don't have enough intel on the subject.  He could just start having people disappear all over, but instead of having them delivered to research facilities to be tortured, he has them delivered to an outpost to be sent over and be liquified.

Every Cerberus research project we've seen has ended in a disaster.  Why on Earth would you think this one would be the 'one that works'.

[The Angry One]

II Numero6 II wrote...

Because it's like a trojan horse , exactly like in the Trojan War .

The Greeks pretended to sail away, and the Trojans pulled the Horse into their city as a victory trophy. That night the Greek force crept out of the Horse and opened the gates for the rest of the Greek army, which had sailed back under cover of night. The Greek army entered and destroyed the city of Troy, decisively ending the war.

And thus was a saying burned into our ancient memory:

"Beware of Trojans, they're complete idiots."

[BurstAngel75]

I can't believe this. The base is inheritly evil. Its technology is base on murder, on genocide. You and your crew have seen what it does and you still want to keep it?!? The reason there is no other option other than Cereberus is because the outcome will be the same whether you give it to the Alliance or to the Council. That kind of power will corrupt even the best organizations in the traverse. So the question your asking yourself is whether to stand against all odds, to win or lose on your own merits as a civilization. Or become the enemy to defeat and then replace them.

[CmdrFenix83]

rasblak wrote...

Ok, you're probably right there. I can't recall the exact details of what went wrong; I'd need a 2nd playthrough.

Reaper IFF shut down the Normandy and called the Collectors to come abduct your crew.  If we had been on board, who knows how it would have turned out.  No way of knowing.  However, for whatever reasons, we took all 12 of us into a shuttle(why?!) to go fly around until they had finished.  Either way, without EDI, that Reaper 'virus' they called it would have doomed the mission right there.

You're right again, yes, they said that. Here's what I am saying: The Reapers could be Microsoft.
Microsoft wants everyone to use Windows; but Microsoft does not want anyone outside Microsoft to study the source code to Windows, do they?
Does that make the difference between 'using Mass Relay tech' and 'studying reaper-building tech' clearer for you?

Well, that's true.  In theory, that could be why they rushed to harvest the Protheans, despite them not being suitable enough to make into a Reaper(as far as we know).  They were on the cusp of unlocking the Relay technology themselves.  They want organics to use the tech without understanding it, hence the Keepers, etc.

The only problem with this applying to the base, however, is assuming we'll be able to actually understand the tech in the base before the Reapers show up.  Without understanding, and modifying, we're just doing what they want.  The other races have been out here for thousands of years already, and as far as we know, they haven't unlocked squat. 

However, in theory, especially with EDI, we might be able to do just that.  So I will definitely conceed that point.

Well, you could be right on that. There's hope for you after all.

I'm glad that even in the point you agree, you can still try to be condescending.  

You're right. There was no need for that on my part. Apologies.

Apology accepted.  I enjoy civil debates. 

[Sharn01]

I normally do not make reaper tech argument's because I think it is the least important factor in keeping the base, perhaps not even a factor at all if you remove TIM from the equation, but something to think about.



Does anyone actually know what the Collector's plan was? They where kidnapping colonist's to make a Reaper, if we assume the end result of the reaper would be anything like Sovereign, it was no where near completed after hundred's of thousand's of colonist's where kidnapped. There is no way they could have gotten enough people to finish it without forcing the coucil and alliance to take action no matter how inept they seem to be portrayed in ME2.



What if their plan was not to make a reaper at all, what if the plan was for us to get the base all along?

[CmdrFenix83]

Default137 wrote...

Because its obvious TIM wants to use the base to make a Reaper, right, despite the fact its said quite a few times during the course of the game that the Colonies together wouldn't have even completed the one they were working on, and that they would have to raid Earth to finish it, and since he'd be starting fresh, he'd have to raid most of Earth just to get the thing started.

The Paragon option in this case just looks really stupid to be honest, this may just be the fact I was raised Military Style, but if a Paragon Shepard was under my command, I'd have his ass courtmarsheled in a second, he destroyed something that could have given us a huge fighting chance against galactic genocide to "stick it to the man" with no real proof that guy was anything more then an inconsiderate ****. Yeah sure, TIM is a dick, but you don't blow up the greatest chance we have to stop the reapers because your commanding officer was an ass to you, thats preschool level thinking right there, and his talk of "I WON'T LET FEAR COMPRIMISE WHO I AM" just felt so painfully forced and shallow it was pathetic.

The entire game was built to getting this tech, every sacrifice every character made was to get this tech to help stop the Reapers, you may not have known that, but thats what the Illusive Man was doing, every scientist, crewmember, and squadmember that died, did so in an attempt to help you get to that base, so we could use its technology against the Reapers and a Paragon Shepard just sticks his finger up his ass, goes DURR, and blows it up because TIM called him names.

Shepard makes his/her reasoning for blowing it quite clear.  "It liquified people!"  Every single crew member agrees with destroying it.  Miranda even quits Cerberus over TIM's ravings when Shepard goes to destroy it, and she was his biggest supporter, even supporting the atrocities that Cerberus did with their Husk, Rachni, and Thorian Creeper experiments.

The entire game was *not* about obtaining this technology.  Until EDI relayed the info about the base to TIM, it wasn't even known that this radiation pulse could be set off at all.  The point was to stop them from abducting people.  Mission Accomplished. 

You have no way of knowing what that base could do other than liquify people to make Reapers.  No idea whatsoever.  You can't even guarantee that what's in there would be helpful against the Reapers.  All that's there is blown-up shell of a Reaper in its' beginning stages of construction.  It didn't have its' outer shell, no kinetic barriers, no armor, nothing.  You can take it down with a pistol.  What good is studying it going to accomplish?  That data might not even be in the base, Harbinger could be doing everything from his own memory banks.  You have no way of knowing.

The *only* thing we know that the base is capable of, is liquifying people to make Reapers.  That's it.  The end.  Shepard has maybe 30 seconds or so to choose.  (S)he can choose to act on the information (s)he knows for sure, that it's a horrific device meant to slaughter millions to make Reapers, or (s)he can base the decision on what it 'might' hold beyond that.  So it's simple.  Act on what you know, and destroy this lil shop of horrors, or risk things like indoctrination, Cerberus Reapers at the cost of millions, etc, for the chance of learning something of value to beat the Reapers. 

It's painfully obvious which choice is the idealist, and which is the 'at any cost' mindsets here.

[syltman]

I haven't read all the comments only some..



but don't you think that Cerberus would basicly try to become the new collectors? Settle down somewhere where the others can't touch you and rule the world as they want it.

[Vaenier]

syltman wrote...

I haven't read all the comments only some..

but don't you think that Cerberus would basicly try to become the new collectors? Settle down somewhere where the others can't touch you and rule the world as they want it.

Settle in the one place where Shep knows exactly how to kill you... good idea.

[laxduck40]

Umm, does no one appreciate how Legion talks about the Geth finding their own future and how technological development is not a straight line? And does no one get that using RT in the past is how the galaxy got in this mess in the first place? So using more RT is going to get us out of the problem? You see how that logic just doesn't hold for me?

[rabbitchannel]

You have no idea what exactly the base holds. If you destroy it you throw it and all it's potential away. If you keep it and it turns out there is nothing useful to be gained, then oh well. But do you really think you would be given the option to choose to hold it if it had nothing? Import to ME 3 then, "haha! The base is worthless, chumps!". Then again, if there IS something useful then you have gained an advantage. There are 5 paths I see:



1. Keep the base. Reapers lose. Illusive Man uses base for evil.

2. Keep the base. Reapers lose. Illusive Man keeps it in check and doesn't use base for evil.

3. Keep the base. Reapers win.

4. Destroy the base. Reapers win.

5. Destroy the base. Reapers lose.



If #1 happens, well you've just beaten an entire fleet of Reapers. You really think TIM is going to give you trouble? Again, this goes back to the notion of some people that TIM is the greatest evil in the universe. Not the *sigh* massive fleet of galaxy-raping sentient machines. Assuming you've just massed a huge intergalactic armada, TIM is probably going to stand down under their pressure. Armada + Shepardgod. Plus, you know where the base is. If you want to destroy it after, you can. Though it would be pointless. "The Chevaliers of Orlais are not the threat here". Blindness! You Loghains will be the death of us all! *ahem*



#2 Well then, everything's super, isn't it? This is possibly my desired outcome. Everyone wins. Except you lot who say the base is evil.



#3 In this case the Reapers win anyway. It wouldn't have made a difference if you destroyed it. Perhaps you would have died quicker.



#4 Here you'll be thinking, "I wonder what would have happened if I just kept the base?" You would have no guarantee that you would have fared better had you kept it but there is the possibility and that is always worth considering. I'd probably say, "I told you so".



#5 Your most desired outcome. Also what I think has the lowest likelihood of happening, logically, but maybe the highest probability for a I'm-a-good-little-Paragon ending.



Storywise, if BW is avoiding an "everyone is eaten by the Reapers ending", in order of likelihood:

1&5, 2, 4, 3.



If everything is fair game, 1, 4, 2, 3, 5.



This is all HIGHLY subjective though. I'd say the I'm-a-good-little-Paragon ending has a pretty high probability of success. Because it's part of the whole game. Keeping the base is still the most sane and sensible thing to do, I still say.



Lastly, again against those who say the base is an abomination, it's like saying you won't sleep in a room because someone was murdered there and now you're scared that it's haunted. If you are that type of person, then fine, I won't argue any further. If not, then I hope you see how silly that is.

[Default137]

CmdrFenix83 wrote...

Default137 wrote...

Because its obvious TIM wants to use the base to make a Reaper, right, despite the fact its said quite a few times during the course of the game that the Colonies together wouldn't have even completed the one they were working on, and that they would have to raid Earth to finish it, and since he'd be starting fresh, he'd have to raid most of Earth just to get the thing started.

The Paragon option in this case just looks really stupid to be honest, this may just be the fact I was raised Military Style, but if a Paragon Shepard was under my command, I'd have his ass courtmarsheled in a second, he destroyed something that could have given us a huge fighting chance against galactic genocide to "stick it to the man" with no real proof that guy was anything more then an inconsiderate ****. Yeah sure, TIM is a dick, but you don't blow up the greatest chance we have to stop the reapers because your commanding officer was an ass to you, thats preschool level thinking right there, and his talk of "I WON'T LET FEAR COMPRIMISE WHO I AM" just felt so painfully forced and shallow it was pathetic.

The entire game was built to getting this tech, every sacrifice every character made was to get this tech to help stop the Reapers, you may not have known that, but thats what the Illusive Man was doing, every scientist, crewmember, and squadmember that died, did so in an attempt to help you get to that base, so we could use its technology against the Reapers and a Paragon Shepard just sticks his finger up his ass, goes DURR, and blows it up because TIM called him names.

Shepard makes his/her reasoning for blowing it quite clear.  "It liquified people!"  Every single crew member agrees with destroying it.  Miranda even quits Cerberus over TIM's ravings when Shepard goes to destroy it, and she was his biggest supporter, even supporting the atrocities that Cerberus did with their Husk, Rachni, and Thorian Creeper experiments.

The entire game was *not* about obtaining this technology.  Until EDI relayed the info about the base to TIM, it wasn't even known that this radiation pulse could be set off at all.  The point was to stop them from abducting people.  Mission Accomplished. 

You have no way of knowing what that base could do other than liquify people to make Reapers.  No idea whatsoever.  You can't even guarantee that what's in there would be helpful against the Reapers.  All that's there is blown-up shell of a Reaper in its' beginning stages of construction.  It didn't have its' outer shell, no kinetic barriers, no armor, nothing.  You can take it down with a pistol.  What good is studying it going to accomplish?  That data might not even be in the base, Harbinger could be doing everything from his own memory banks.  You have no way of knowing.

The *only* thing we know that the base is capable of, is liquifying people to make Reapers.  That's it.  The end.  Shepard has maybe 30 seconds or so to choose.  (S)he can choose to act on the information (s)he knows for sure, that it's a horrific device meant to slaughter millions to make Reapers, or (s)he can base the decision on what it 'might' hold beyond that.  So it's simple.  Act on what you know, and destroy this lil shop of horrors, or risk things like indoctrination, Cerberus Reapers at the cost of millions, etc, for the chance of learning something of value to beat the Reapers. 

It's painfully obvious which choice is the idealist, and which is the 'at any cost' mindsets here.

So your saying its better to destroy something because IT MIGHT BE EVIL/TIM IS A BAD MAN, rather then to hold on to it, see what happens, and if it is evil, blow it up later?

You realize destroying the base removes all what if situations, all of them, with it gone, so is all the advanced tech that can be reverse engineered, all the Collector Data on the Reapers, all the information of Collector Tech, all the guns, ammo, ships, and other stuff the Collectors stored there, stuff that was well known to be several years advanced from the rest of Galatic Civilization, all of that is gone because there is also a liquefying machine. Yes, holding the base is a risk, but someone who was raised through the Military would NEVER destroy such a treasure trove of information, even if it was used to liquefy people, the chance of finding advanced tech would be to great to pass up, and the Military STRESSES that in situations like this, you take that base, and when and if problems occur, you handle them in kind.

Lets say the ****'s found a cure for Cancer in the Concentration Camps, would you destroy them posthaste to because they are evil places, and because the only thing that seems worthwhile is the giant gas chambers? Well good for you, you just blew up the cure for Cancer, and probably killed thousands more people then the ****'s did in your blind stupidity.

[Meglivorn]

http://masseffect.bi...m/market/books/

So much about TIM wouldn't use humans just for see how the base works. And "for all humanity".

[rabbitchannel]

Why TIM is not currently a threat:



The Reapers are as much a threat to TIM as they are to the whole galaxy. Until the Reapers are defeated I think it's safe to say he will not impede any attempts to face them. He will only become a threat AFTER you defeat the Reapers. At which point you should be powerful enough to face him anyway. It's worth it, I think.

[BurstAngel75]

If I was going to sleep in a house where a murder took place, I will definitely have it check by a paranormal expert and then have the house blessed by a priest. I got to 2 small children, you can never be too careful when dealing with spirits of any kind (and historically, they tend to target children). And yes I'm very serious. My husband live in a house that was haunted, he was targeted, growing up in it. Better yet, I would never live in a house where a murder took place. I'd sue the realstate agent so fast, it would take their head off.

[CmdrFenix83]

Default137 wrote...

CmdrFenix83 wrote...

Default137 wrote...

Because its obvious TIM wants to use the base to make a Reaper, right, despite the fact its said quite a few times during the course of the game that the Colonies together wouldn't have even completed the one they were working on, and that they would have to raid Earth to finish it, and since he'd be starting fresh, he'd have to raid most of Earth just to get the thing started.

The Paragon option in this case just looks really stupid to be honest, this may just be the fact I was raised Military Style, but if a Paragon Shepard was under my command, I'd have his ass courtmarsheled in a second, he destroyed something that could have given us a huge fighting chance against galactic genocide to "stick it to the man" with no real proof that guy was anything more then an inconsiderate ****. Yeah sure, TIM is a dick, but you don't blow up the greatest chance we have to stop the reapers because your commanding officer was an ass to you, thats preschool level thinking right there, and his talk of "I WON'T LET FEAR COMPRIMISE WHO I AM" just felt so painfully forced and shallow it was pathetic.

The entire game was built to getting this tech, every sacrifice every character made was to get this tech to help stop the Reapers, you may not have known that, but thats what the Illusive Man was doing, every scientist, crewmember, and squadmember that died, did so in an attempt to help you get to that base, so we could use its technology against the Reapers and a Paragon Shepard just sticks his finger up his ass, goes DURR, and blows it up because TIM called him names.

Shepard makes his/her reasoning for blowing it quite clear.  "It liquified people!"  Every single crew member agrees with destroying it.  Miranda even quits Cerberus over TIM's ravings when Shepard goes to destroy it, and she was his biggest supporter, even supporting the atrocities that Cerberus did with their Husk, Rachni, and Thorian Creeper experiments.

The entire game was *not* about obtaining this technology.  Until EDI relayed the info about the base to TIM, it wasn't even known that this radiation pulse could be set off at all.  The point was to stop them from abducting people.  Mission Accomplished. 

You have no way of knowing what that base could do other than liquify people to make Reapers.  No idea whatsoever.  You can't even guarantee that what's in there would be helpful against the Reapers.  All that's there is blown-up shell of a Reaper in its' beginning stages of construction.  It didn't have its' outer shell, no kinetic barriers, no armor, nothing.  You can take it down with a pistol.  What good is studying it going to accomplish?  That data might not even be in the base, Harbinger could be doing everything from his own memory banks.  You have no way of knowing.

The *only* thing we know that the base is capable of, is liquifying people to make Reapers.  That's it.  The end.  Shepard has maybe 30 seconds or so to choose.  (S)he can choose to act on the information (s)he knows for sure, that it's a horrific device meant to slaughter millions to make Reapers, or (s)he can base the decision on what it 'might' hold beyond that.  So it's simple.  Act on what you know, and destroy this lil shop of horrors, or risk things like indoctrination, Cerberus Reapers at the cost of millions, etc, for the chance of learning something of value to beat the Reapers. 

It's painfully obvious which choice is the idealist, and which is the 'at any cost' mindsets here.

So your saying its better to destroy something because IT MIGHT BE EVIL/TIM IS A BAD MAN, rather then to hold on to it, see what happens, and if it is evil, blow it up later?

You realize destroying the base removes all what if situations, all of them, with it gone, so is all the advanced tech that can be reverse engineered, all the Collector Data on the Reapers, all the information of Collector Tech, all the guns, ammo, ships, and other stuff the Collectors stored there, stuff that was well known to be several years advanced from the rest of Galatic Civilization, all of that is gone because there is also a liquefying machine. Yes, holding the base is a risk, but someone who was raised through the Military would NEVER destroy such a treasure trove of information, even if it was used to liquefy people, the chance of finding advanced tech would be to great to pass up, and the Military STRESSES that in situations like this, you take that base, and when and if problems occur, you handle them in kind.

Lets say the ****'s found a cure for Cancer in the Concentration Camps, would you destroy them posthaste to because they are evil places, and because the only thing that seems worthwhile is the giant gas chambers? Well good for you, you just blew up the cure for Cancer, and probably killed thousands more people then the ****'s did in your blind stupidity.

You realize your entire post is the defining point of view of the Renegade, right?  Risks and costs be damned, whatever it takes.  The only thing we know the base does, is liquify people.  That's it.  That's the only fact we have.  Choose to keep a base based on that, or 'what if's'.  The base juiced people to make Reapers, the paragon(and *every* squadmate agrees!) believes that whatever you *might* learn from the base isn't worth the risk.