205 réponses à ce sujet

[Sharn01]

Everything the OP stated was a plot hole, the signifigance of each is different, there is nothing wrong with making post's like this, at worst, it does nothing, at best it encourages Bioware to do better in the future, making the games even more ejoyable then they already are.

There are too many people who jump to Bioware's defense solely on principle, they enjoyed the game so obviously they are correct and no one else's opinion matter's.

I do not care what each person's opinion of a plot hole is, go to google and type "plot hole definition" and read it, that is a plot hole, if something in the game meet's any of that criteria, it is a plot hole, how signifigant that plot hole is, is irrelevent, it is still a plot hole.

One could argue that the number of waist high barricades and frequent use of explosive canister's and crates in home decoration is a plot hole, it is actually, it is worth stating that it is a plot hole and maybe Bioware will do better with combat for ME3.

You can argue that you like the mechanics of waist high barricades and explosive canister's littering every structure and field in the game and say it makes combat more exciting. That is your opinion and you have a right to it, it does not make it cease to be a plot hole regardless of your opinion.

There are ton's of plot holes in ME2, I support the OP in pointing them out, and I will point it out to him if something he notes clearly does not meet the criteria. The council may or may not be a plot hole for instance, it depends on what happen's in ME3, they may be playing dumb, but Shepard's inability to present evidence that s/he already has will remain a plot hole regardless of their change.

The same however could be said of much of Shepard's dialog option's, all are plot hole's, the question for each is, is the lack of this dialog option signifigant enough of a plot hole to hurt the games ability to tell a story and make it believeable, and in some instances the answer is yes.

Modifié par Sharn01, 03 mars 2010 - 08:53 .

[BinaryHelix101]

These are not what you call plotholes. These are what you call nitpicking, seriously you play through the game constantly agonized at every little detail?

[Xandurpein]

I sincerely hope that Bioware do NOT delay ME3 a year just to cater to the few that needs every little possible inconsistency removed from the game.

[Mox Ruuga]

I see the usual Bioware rimming squad is fast at work, agonizing over someone not loving the game as well as they do. Fanboys whose happiness and contentment is tied to other peoples' opinions about the things they appreciate.

[Massadonious1]

amg why is dere clipz on jakobs mizzion aren't dey like 10 yrs in da past lolz?

[XWAU_Forceflow]

Well, I'd say most of the things the OP mentioned is simply bad writing, but not a plot hole. Nevertheless they are worth discussing.

1) Not a problem, It is actually quite feasible to have a large quantity of explosive containers together. This is common practice. It’s also not a problem until you start shooting around. While this behaviour is normal in the game, in the normal world you don’t usually start shooting in a medical facility.
2) Yes, bad writing. It would have been enough to simply show a mech that was destroyed somehow. (Maybe a fallen over shelf that saved him or something like that) It’s not really a plot hole, just something that should be explained.
3) Not a problem at all. Miranda never says that nobody survived, so there could easily a pilot already on board. For that matter there could have been many more who survived and are actually on board with you. (Since we later learn that 12 people can actually fit the shuttle) Never the less, it would have been much cooler to actually have them sitting in the cockpit with Jacob doing the flying.
4) Not a plot hole, not even bad writing. Easily possible and not worth mentioning if you ask me.
5) As was mentioned before, he was a tech specialist, he could have saved the recordings in his bio-tool thingy. (Damn, what’s that thing called again?) It was specifically mentioned that he was the only non human to ever be on a planet that was attacked. Thus the only survivor who could recover (or maybe record) the data. This however leads to a possible plot hole, but more on that later.
6) Not really bad writing, certainly not a plot hole. He simply doesn’t leave you a chance. Do what I want or be stuck here.
7) He never mentioned a bounty, but it is mentioned in the game that the collectors appear to be interested in Shep. Since they are also known for slavery it is quite possible that they let it known to certain individuals that they would pay for you.
8) Yes, this one is quite annoying. But I guess it does fall into the same category as enemies dying with a single shot in the cinematic sequences. So I would say it’s forgivable
9) Bad writing which needed more explanation. It is feasible why they do not want to recognise the threat openly, but this should have been explained with a couple of extra lines.

Possible plot hole (but also more of bad writing)
So, an unknown number of colonies have disappeared. Since we are talking plural it’s at least two, more likely three or four and more.
Now, the collectors only appear to target humans, and with Veetor being there it seems they even go so far as to ignore other species. This however would mean that not a single alien was living on the other colonies? Come on, no foreign dignitaries, no vendors, no tourists, no friends? Not a single one? This one sounds a bit strange to me.
But I would still not really count this as a plot hole.

For me the definition of a plot hole if something actually contradicts something else in the story!

The people using heat sinks on Jacobs loyalty quest is a plot hole, but since it’s not really important to the actual ‘plot’ of the game, it’s not really a big deal.

An example of a real plot hole is the movie fantastic voyage:
A team of scientists shrink themselves to go inside a patient's body in a tiny little ‘spaceship’. The whole plot is around them having only a certain amount of time until they must leave the body because they will then go back to their normal size no matter what. (Killing the poor guy in the process) In the end they make it out, but not the spaceship they had with them, which is being ignored in the end.
This is a real plot hole because a major plot point (having no possibility to stop the ‘unshrinking’ after a certain amount of time) is later contradicted completely. (The ship does not grow back, thus not killing the patient)

Modifié par XWAU_Forceflow, 03 mars 2010 - 12:52 .

[GenericPlayer2]

I am kind of wondering what the purpose of Horizon was at all. We already knew that the collectors were behind the attack, so TIM should have already been devoting resources to finding a way through the Omega-4 relay. I can see its an opportunity that BW created to get your first taste of collectors, uncover some TIM treachery, and meet up with the Virmire survivor. But I really did not know how it fit in with the larger scheme of things.

[Srau]

trigger2kill1 wrote...

I'm not sure if this falls into your criteria but how but the second relay in the omega system?
Since when do they have 2 relays in a single system? Of course the Citadel relay but that one is only conected to Ilos and is only a reciever.

That is not a typical relay, it is red and not blue (guess all noticed that ) but if you look carefully you'll notice this relay has "antenna" thingies on its bottom that other relays do not have.
If i didn't know the story and the background of the Omega 4 relay, i would think when first seeing it "**** this relay is not like others, it must be special and have a purpose others don't have".

[Urazz]

glacier1701 wrote...

A plot hole, or plothole, is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot, or constitutes a blatant omission of relevant information regarding the plot. These include such things as unlikely behaviour or actions of characters, illogical or impossible events, events happening for no apparent reason, or statements/events that contradict earlier events in the storyline.

 Defined by boardnfool86 in this thread here. Its a very good definetion. Each plot hole will have a number. It will also include WHERE it occurs, WHAT it is, its TYPE, WHY its a plot hole and finally a NOTE made in which either a reasoned explanation is put as to why a plot hole is not one (if determine so at a later date) OR whether or not its acceptable.

Lets make some other definetions before we go further in this topic. In defining a plot we need some categories for them to be put into. A Category 1 plot hole is a plot hole that, regardless of when it appears ingame, is always a plot hole. A Category 2 plot hole is a plot hole if certain events occur/do not occur by the time that 'plot hole' comes up. So it is not always a plot hole under all circumstances within a playthrough.
Plot holes can be further categorised as to how they are plot holes. A plot hole can be categorised as being MAGIC WAND for example a needed item is 'suddenly' at hand just when you need even though it was never there before and is never there again afterward. Or it can be an OUTSIDE SOURCE plot hole by which I mean its not explained within the game but a logical fan explanation might be made up though not necessarily one the writers believed was the explanation.

At the end of each plot hole a note will be made as to whether the plot hole is acceptable or not. While plot holes should be avoided there are points in which use of a plot hole - the tutorial phase in particular - illustrates game mechanics and allows play of the game. It could be much harder to display use of things without such a plot hole.

The point of this thread is to bring up all the plot holes people have spotted into one topic and to see how many there are according to the players. If you feel something is not a plot hole then a through explanation is needed. Just stating something is not a plot hole is not good enough. Links to dev posts, wiki articles etc. are encouraged to back up claims something is not a plot hole.

And now onto some plot holes:
(1) WHERE: Tutorial phase just after Shepard's awakening
    WHAT: The large number of explodable containers clustered together near the exit to the room you are in.
    TYPE: Category 1, MAGIC WAND
    WHY: No logical reason as to why such a large number of containers should be stored in your room and by a door. Nor any reason as to why they are about to explode.
    NOTE: ACCEPTABLE - used to explain a game mechanic.

(2) WHERE: Meeting up with Wilson and his shooting by Miranda.
    WHAT: Wilson is in a room where he declares he was shot by a mech.
    TYPE: Category 1, MAGIC WAND
    WHY: No evidence of mechs in the room when up to that point it is made clear that mechs would only stop killing someone if they were destroyed before doing so. While this meeting is used to explain a game mechanic it is ignored when Wilson is killed by Miranda where Jacob and Shepard act surprised.
    NOTE: NOT ACCEPTABLE - but just barely in that an important game mechanic is explained. It makes Shepard appear stupid when other actions ingame clearly indicate the opposite and on even less clear cut ingame clues.

(3) WHERE: The shuttle flight away from the Lazarus Project base.
    WHAT: Miranda, Jacob and Shepard are seated in the same passenger compartment while it travels to another Cerberus base.
    TYPE: Category 1, OUTSIDE SOURCE
    WHY: Shuttles need a pilot yet the only survivors from the base are NOT in the pilot compartment. While there could be an autopilot and indeed may be the case here the game does not make it clear that shuttles can be flown by autopilot.
    NOTE: NOT ACCEPTABLE - but only barely in so far as 1 line of dialog could have cleared this point up in this instance. Small details can make or break a game and this is an instance of a small detail that was overlooked considering the amount of dialog entered into about NO SURVIVORS other than Jacob, Miranda and Shepard.

(4) WHERE: Outside picnic table near landing on Freedom's Progress.
    WHAT: Remains of meal being eaten outside in a cold climate.
    TYPE: Category 1, OUTSIDE SOURCE
    WHY: Living as I do in a cold climate and having done so for 40 years it is not normal for meals to be eaten outside in freezing weather as is indicated by the snow falling when Shepard and party land at Freedom's Progress. (Considering where BioWare is located makes you wonder why this was missed.)
    NOTE: NOT ACCEPTABLE - but once again only just barely. Another small detail missed.

(5) WHERE: Meeting Veetor.
    WHAT: The security camera footage showing the Collectors.
    TYPE: Category 1, MAGIC WAND
    WHY: While we do not know much about Freedom's Progress compared to other colonies that have suffered abductions it cannot be assumed that it is any different from those other colonies. So why is there camera footage now and not from any other prior colony abduction?
    NOTE: NOT ACCEPTABLE - and clearly not so. It is a major plot point that is thrown in to advance the plot with no explanation as to why suddenly such a thing now exists in an average colony. Also helps create plot hole #9.

(6) WHERE: Talking to TIM.
    WHAT: No account of background to call TIM's account of Cerberus.
    TYPE: Category 1, MAGIC WAND
    WHY: Emphasises the railroading of Shepard down the one path that BioWare writers want us to travel down by ignoring an important aspect of what makes Shepard Shepard.
    NOTE: NOT ACCEPTABLE - this basically breaks immersion in the character by showing how much lack of control the player has over the character when a few lines of dialog can easily allow a player to feel that they are more in control even if makes no difference in the end.

(7) WHERE: PURGATORY
    WHAT: Being betrayed by the Warden and thus having to fight to leave.
    TYPE: Category 1, MAGIC WAND
    WHY: Nothing in the game up to this point indicates that a bounty is on Shepard's head which can be excused if an explanation is forthcoming at some point. However nothing is said at any point during the rest of the game as to why this action is taken thus leaving it a mystery.
    NOTE: NOT ACCEPTABLE - this comes out of the blue (no pun intended). It appears to be just a plot device to allow some combat and to highlight Jack's abilities without any other justification though it also introduces plot hole #8 by its presence.

(8) WHERE: PURGATORY
    WHAT: Jack's biotic abilities.
    TYPE: Category 1, MAGIC WAND
    WHY: In essence we are shown that Jack can take out 3 YMIR Mechs (perhaps 4 by the wreckage we can see), punch holes through bulkheads and walls and literally lay waste to a high security space station yet her ingame combat abilities never match this in any way, shape or form.
    NOTE: NOT ACCEPTABLE - some licence is allowable within cutscenes but the amount taken here is too extreme. It gives an impression of power to Jack which is impossible in combat at any time. Had plot hole #7 not been there by just allowing Shepard and company to walk out two plot holes could have been easily avoided.

(9) WHERE: Councillor Anderson's office on the Citadel
    WHAT: Gathered evidence such as security camera footage from Freedom's Progress, DNA evidence from the Collector ship, the attack on Horizon, the derelict Reaper or information from Legion convinces the Council that there is a Reaper threat.
    TYPE: Category 2, MAGIC WAND
    WHY: This is a plot hole that gets worse the longer you take to visit Anderson on the Citadel. Quite literally the Council is supposed to be stupid but the evidence you can accumulate is beyond belief in it being able to be ignored. Moreover Shepard only needs to go public with that evidence of incompetence and the political fallout for the Council/Alliance should have anyone denying the truth of the threat running for cover because of the political ****storm that would occur.
    NOTE: NOT ACCEPTABLE - this is pure bad writing at its finest. It is intended to emphasise that Shepard cannot get support from the Council/Alliance but the way this is handled is amateurish beyond belief. Emily Wong would have a field day if you had the option to bring it to her attention.

MORE TO COME.

Okay most of your points are just pure idiocy and don't need much explaining.

1. Umm...Hospitals and medical bays have gas containers there all the time for either helping patients breathing or as anesthetics and the like.  Even then you could just say it was fuel tanks for some medical equipement if you want.

2. Sure it's a bit sloppy on bioware's part but they could've intentionally done it as a way to make us suspicious of Wilson.  Shepard at least didn't buy Wilson's story if you chose the renegade conversation option or just decides to forget about it and move on.  I thought they were more suprised about Miranda's shooting of Wilson not even a second after the door was opened.

3.  It could've easily had a pilot.  Miranda never said there weren't other survivors and do we really need to see the pilot of the shuttle who is some minor no-name character we'll never see again?

4.  WTF!  Why is that important.  That's just an aesthetic gripe and a very minor one at that.  Not even a plothole.

5. Umm..He was the only one there to rebuild the data/record things while the colonists were being abducted.  A first amongst the other abducted colonies.

6. Okay, this one is a bit more understanding but is a more minor thing and could be reasoned away as bioware wanting to save money/time.

7. The collectors are interested in Shepard, kinda obvious who would offer a reward for him.

8. Bad game mechanics nothing more.  They couldn't make Jack 'that' powerful as a squadmate or she would be basically essential or make the game easy-mode no matter the difficulty.

9. I don't think it's a plothole much myself.  Most of the evidence you get at that point just points to the Collectors abducting human colonies. Nothing about the reapers being involved.  Husks is to light of evidence to say they are tied to the reapers. The coucil can just reason it away as the collectors getting some Geth tech.  I'm thinking that after Horizon, Shepard basically gave up on trying to get the council/alliance to help on the Collector threat.

[Nozybidaj]

Mox Ruuga wrote...

I see the usual Bioware rimming squad is fast at work, agonizing over someone not loving the game as well as they do. Fanboys whose happiness and contentment is tied to other peoples' opinions about the things they appreciate.

Yeah its a real shame too.  Haven't seen the OP return.  Good job folks, you ran off a perfectly intelligent and well spoken poster trying to give BW some feedback.  Oh well, I'm sure another "lolz lets u and i post moore tali scrog thread bumpz" waste of space will show up soon to take his place. <_<

[Daeion]

Xandurpein wrote...

I sincerely hope that Bioware do NOT delay ME3 a year just to cater to the few that needs every little possible inconsistency removed from the game.

I sincerly hope BW doesn't remove the inventory system from ME2 just to cater to those who can't take 30 seconds to stop and think about their gear....oh wait....


Is that how it's done?

[FlintlockJazz]

Srau wrote...

trigger2kill1 wrote...

I'm not sure if this falls into your criteria but how but the second relay in the omega system?
Since when do they have 2 relays in a single system? Of course the Citadel relay but that one is only conected to Ilos and is only a reciever.

That is not a typical relay, it is red and not blue (guess all noticed that ) but if you look carefully you'll notice this relay has "antenna" thingies on its bottom that other relays do not have.
If i didn't know the story and the background of the Omega 4 relay, i would think when first seeing it "**** this relay is not like others, it must be special and have a purpose others don't have".

Plus, according to the books the citadel system actually has dozens of mass relays linking directly up to other relays all over the galaxy.  I think we are meant to assume that alot of what we see on the galaxy map is symbolic and not meant to be taken literally, there are probably quite a few systems that have more than one mass relay in them.

[SurfaceBeneath]

A god damn space wizard did it.

[Avissel]

Well then. Lets go to work.

1. This kinda proves you have no idea what a plot hole actaully is. This is a PLOT DEVICE. It exsist to provid relevent information. It would only be a plot hole in the canisters randomly spawned into the room when mentioned.

2.If you pay attention. Wilson is a traitor. In order to gain sympathy and to remove suspecion, he shoot himself in the leg. This falls into what I said yeasterday that everyone that crsy plot hole works under the assumption "I dont understand. Must be a plot hole"

3. Honestly this is just totally nitpicking. How the shuttle is manages to operate is not nit picking. It can be explanined in many ways.

4. I have lived in a cold climate, and have eaten outside while it was cold....so yeah, this entire one is just idiotic.

5. Again, this is a plot device. It's not a plot hole, yes it's overly conveniant, but it's not a plot hole.

6. Hey look, another plot device. The only way the ability to refuse to work with Cereberus would have been a plot whole would be if the had been retconned to be some kind of Peace agencey. Shepard agrees to work with them because it's a neccecary evil, if you didnt figure that out from all the times you can say exactly as much, it means your dumb.

7.The guy is crazy. He rules his own little world where he is king, He's developed Megolomania and thinks he cant do wrong. Do you really think it's that far fetched from him to think. "Hey, the first human specter. Someone somewhere will pay good money for this guy." This one isnt even like..difficult to understand.

8.This is an example of when Lore and Game Mechanics dont exactly match up, sadly it's a function of every video game ever. Deal with it.

9.This isnt a plot hole. You never have any evidence that PROVES Reaper involvment or exsistince beyond a shadow of a doubt until the end of the game. All you could do would be to present evidence that Collecters are taking humans, it wouldnt change the fact that everything is happening in an area of space where the Council and the Alliance have no athourty and where sending in their ships could causes a galatic war.

In short, you have failed. Just like everybody else that runs around flailing thier arms yelling "OMAGA PLOT HOLEZ"

[glacier1701]

Maviarab wrote...
4. I know lots of people who eat outside in the cold, I think they are dumb, but there you go.

LOL well perhaps thats the explanation then but still odd and a small detail but then again I think a lot of the small details in ME2 just got plain overlooked for a number of reasons and they do detract something from the game.

Maviarab wrote...
5. Maybe the collectors disable said footage, and Veetor (being a tech) got it going again?

This would work if it were mentioned that security camera footage from other colonies had all been wiped or jammed somehow. It still means something had been found. Moreover it would also pinpoint EXACTLY when the event occured and from that possible indicators as to what ships might have been in the area at the time gained.

Maviarab wrote...
8. Its called dramatisation.

Exactly what I said but its bad in that it is way overboard compared to what can actually occur ingame combat. As potrayed by what we see we do not need anyone else to take on the Collectors.

Maviarab wrote...
9. Nothing to do with bad writing. You were dead, they covered it up. Politics.

It is bad writing in that nothing is there to stop you going public with the evidence. Politics also means that there are other politicians who are just itching to take over your job. Shepard goes public and these other politicians will have a field day yet the Council/Alliance takes it for granted that there is nothing in what you may have that would cause them any kind of bad publicity.

TheUnusualSuspect wrote...
1)  It's not explained, but perhaps these were oxygen tanks, or tanks containing other medical chemicals, just as is often found in hospital emergency rooms.  We don't know what's in the tanks, but they just rebuilt Shepard, so there may be a legitimate reason for any number of volatile chemicals to be in the room in order to complete the process.

Its still a plot hole but one that I can say is acceptable. Its a small detail but then again small details seem to have gone by the board throughout much of ME2.

TheUnusualSuspect wrote...
2) Partial agreement, although there are other areas in that room, including a staircase leading down.  Wilson may have shot the mech, which fell down the staircase and out of sight.  Alternately, he was standing in the opposite doorway of the server room, was shot by a mech, closed the door in time (the door where the mechs are on the other side) and crawled back to the position you found him.  His explanation is thereby plausible, but suspicious.

I've gone over the video I have of that area and I dont see a stair. Do not think I have a save close to that part either though I will check later.

TheUnusualSuspect wrote...
3) Who's to say that there wasn't a pilot already on the Shuttle?  He wasn't standing with Miranda, and Shep asks "Where are all the other survivors?", and Miranda says that if they're not there by now, they're not coming.  She does not state that there is absolutely no one else on the shuttle.  Alternately, as you suggest, auto-pilot as programmed by Miranda/Jacob.  Not a huge stretch really given the complexity of VI's in the game.

Damn forgot about that little bit that Miranda says. Can be said to say that people are already on the shuttle including a pilot. OKie changing that particular plot hole post.

TheUnusualSuspect wrote...
4) The weather could have changed, and it appears to be evening.  There was a significant delay between the abduction and when the team got there.  It may have been a fine 10-15C outside when the person was eating lunch, but it's now 6(?) hours later, dark, and a snow-storm has hit.  We don't know the weather patterns on that planet, and that may be completely normal.

Possible. Checked some weather records and large temperature drops especially from day to night could explain this one.

TheUnusualSuspect wrote...
5) Miranda says that Veetor has reconstructed the data himself.  The collectors may have been inducing an interefence signal, and Veeter was able to counteract that signal for selected cameras through active signal enhancement via some omni-tool mechanism.  The collectors knew how to jam basic Alliance security cams, but weren't really anticipating an intelligent Quarian working to counteract the jamming and retrieve useful images.

This is something I thought could have been an explanation except that other colonies would have blank records from the jamming thus indicating something happened that was definetly unusual. No mention of that is made. Veetor counteracting the jamming presupposes that Veetor had the presence of mind to think of that, deduce what the Collectors were doing and how to counteract it for the proper cameras. Veetor is characterised as being unstable and its highly doubtful that under the strain of the Collector attack he would be able to respond like that especially as that strain with the possibility that his suit was breached actually made him reprogram the mechs to attack ANYONE.

TheUnusualSuspect wrote...
7) We find out later that the shadow broker was trying to get a hold of Shepard's body.  Liara managed to snaffle it though through subterfuge.  There would still be a VERY large bounty out on Shepard in the black market, and given the Warden's position, he's more likely to know about that than most.

We do not know this. Until there is more information nothing can be really guessed at. After all considering what Liara is doing is it conceivable that the Shadow Broker is still interested when the SB organisation is under attack?

 

Modifié par glacier1701, 03 mars 2010 - 03:11 .

[smudboy]

In regards to (8), Jack's biotic abilities, this can also be applied to Thane and Samara. It's RPG cliche #140 (the Magus rule.)

[FlintlockJazz]

SurfaceBeneath wrote...

A god damn space wizard did it.

You know what this thread needs?  A picture of an astronaut on the moon staring off into space with Gandalf or Elminster stood next to them doing the same while smoking a pipe.

[smudboy]

I agree with OP and most of Sharn01's opinion. OP's listing is of plotholes, whether they're level or story based. Whereas I and most others on the board who have dissenting opinions, analyze the main plot and ask basic questions in logic, these are simple (alibi quite detailed ones) which are directly related to game play.

In this regard, I try to make a distinction between game play, story, and story telling. But that doesn't make the OPs analysis any less vital: both are part of the physical universe the story takes place. But when things like Jacob's loyalty mission come in, where there are thermal clips that haven't been exhausted (let alone invented 10 years ago), the use (and invention) of mech's, and the sheer logistics behind a colony to exist in that state for that long, etc., your eyes glaze over and realize that the level designers pretty much became story writers.

Modifié par smudboy, 03 mars 2010 - 03:21 .

[ThePasserby]

Well, Shepard never seems to need to use the lavatories. He never pees or take a dump. Why is that? PLOT HOLE!

He never seems to shower either. PLOT HOLE!

And how come Goldstein and Hawthorne are always eating and never seem to do any work? PLOT HOLE!

And why is it that no one, including Shepard, ever sleeps? PLOT HOLE!


Thought I'd throw those in as the OP seems to be playing a game of trivial nitpicking. And I'm trying to be sporting.

[Srau]

FlintlockJazz wrote...

Srau wrote...

trigger2kill1 wrote...

I'm not sure if this falls into your criteria but how but the second relay in the omega system?
Since when do they have 2 relays in a single system? Of course the Citadel relay but that one is only conected to Ilos and is only a reciever.

That is not a typical relay, it is red and not blue (guess all noticed that ) but if you look carefully you'll notice this relay has "antenna" thingies on its bottom that other relays do not have.
If i didn't know the story and the background of the Omega 4 relay, i would think when first seeing it "**** this relay is not like others, it must be special and have a purpose others don't have".

Plus, according to the books the citadel system actually has dozens of mass relays linking directly up to other relays all over the galaxy.  I think we are meant to assume that alot of what we see on the galaxy map is symbolic and not meant to be taken literally, there are probably quite a few systems that have more than one mass relay in them.

True, one more proof you made me think of : we were said that the Alliance built the Arcturus station in the system because it was, prior to 1st contact war, the main relay hub for human space.

[glacier1701]

The plot holes are being added as I go through a 5th playthrough of the game. Not everything I posted was something that I noticed on my first playthrough. Some only 'appeared' on later playthroughs or from reading posts in other topics that did not necessarily aim to point out flaws, bad writing or plot holes in the game. You may label me as a 'nitpicker' but that does not mean I have not enjoyed playing ME2. All it means that going through on more playthroughs and knowing how things work the odd things impinge more upon the experience of play. Some are fine or allowable but others are not. ME2 has garnered some good reviews but let me point you to this article . If BioWare only listens to those reviews in which it is quite possible that all aspects of the game were not even experienced then the next game they produce will not improve. This article sums up both why consumer feedback IS important and why I believe many people posting on issues with ME2 do so. Our opinion deserves to be heard even if it may not be a majority opinion. After all BioWare itself states (Stanley Woo to be exact) that you should not be buying a product unless you research it. You cannot research it if others do not post their opinions or issues with the product. That is why I am posting.

BTW I do not think BioWare needs to do this.

Modifié par glacier1701, 03 mars 2010 - 03:44 .

[MutantSpleen]

2. The missing mech is not a plot hole. Wilson was never shot at by a mech and why none were in the room. He shot himself in the leg to make his story more convincing. he was lying, he was the traitor and he didn't expect Miranda and Jacob, and especially Shepard to still be alive so he had to improvise a story and that is why he sounds suspicious because he is a terrible liar.



Shepard also doesn't act surprised there if you don't make Shepard act surprised, my Shep said "I knew he was just looking for an opportunity to shoot me in the back."

[glacier1701]

trigger2kill1 wrote...

I'm not sure if this falls into your criteria but how but the second relay in the omega system?
Since when do they have 2 relays in a single system? Of course the Citadel relay but that one is only conected to Ilos and is only a reciever.

This is not  a plot hole. The relevant part of the codex has this to say about relays "....There are two kinds of mass relay, primary and secondary. Primary relays can send a ship hundreds of light years but only link to one other relay, its 'partner'. Secondary relays can link to any other relay over shorter distances." So it is possible to have MANY relays of both types in a system. The primary ones to jump you across long distances and secondary ones to get you to the next cluster. So the Omega-4 relay is a primary one and thus leads nowhere else. The other relay could be either primary or secondary depending on the distance to the next relay as shown on the galaxy map.

[Daeion]

Nozybidaj wrote...

Mox Ruuga wrote...

I see the usual Bioware rimming squad is fast at work, agonizing over someone not loving the game as well as they do. Fanboys whose happiness and contentment is tied to other peoples' opinions about the things they appreciate.

Yeah its a real shame too.  Haven't seen the OP return.  Good job folks, you ran off a perfectly intelligent and well spoken poster trying to give BW some feedback.  Oh well, I'm sure another "lolz lets u and i post moore tali scrog thread bumpz" waste of space will show up soon to take his place. <_<

Didn't you hear?  If you don't agree that this is the best game ever and that ME sucks when compared to this game you are an idiot...