50 réponses à ce sujet

[Cuthlan]

Yes GEWill, the same bug WAS affecting PC's. It has been fixed for PCs, but has not yet been fixed for consoles.

Calling it the "dexterity bug/glitch" is misleading. It's actually a bug with the items, as he described.

Modifié par Cuthlan, 04 mars 2010 - 07:50 .

[GEWill]

Cuthlan wrote...

Yes GEWill, the same bug WAS affecting PC's. It has been fixed for PCs, but has not yet been fixed for consoles.

Calling it the "dexterity bug/glitch" is misleading. It's actually a bug with the items, as he described.

Thank you for answering with a simple yes since he seems incapable of typing yes or no.

[Kut]

I apologize if I was being unclear, but I still how to fail to see how the nature of the bug affects the fix.

Hypothetical situation:
If daggers on the PC were bugged and used Magic as a modifier.
And daggers on a console were bugged and used Willpower as a modifier.

Would it make a difference after being patched?
Wouldn't the end result of daggers using str/dex (once fixed) be the same?

Modifié par Kut, 04 mars 2010 - 08:13 .

[GEWill]

Well as the other person pointed out, I wasn't aware it was an item related bug over an attribute bug so thats where it wasn't clear.



As for your hypotheticals, again. I wasn't aware it was item related and not attribute related. I've always been under the impression that it was attribute related.

[Kut]

Ok, sorry for the confusion. I was only trying to help

[GEWill]

Its all good. Everything is crystal clear now. No harm no foul.

[traversc]

Wicked 702 wrote...

traversc wrote...

GEWill wrote...

obie191970 wrote...

What's the dexterity glitch?

On the consoles the Rogue class modifier is .5 when it should be .8 or 1.0 for Daggers. To me its not such a big deal, but some people think it breaks the game. My Rogue does sick damage as it is so if the dex bug were fixed it just means he would feel overpowered.

Um no....  The dex glitch is that rogues get 100% cunning modifier, when they should be getting 50% dex/50% cun.  This means that rogues are way more powerful on consoles than they should be, since it effetively doubles the damage due to attributes. 

State your source.

I've been following the "dex bug" for 2 months now and this is the FIRST time I've ever seen someone claim this to be true. Unless you can provide me with a credible thread with actual figures tested by people you are full of it.

I am... full of it?....

Wow, you're a troll.  My source is THE GAME.  If you have a PS3 or pre-patch PC, you could even try it out for yourself.  OR you could do a little bit of searching yourself and not look so clueless. 

PS: patch notes. 
"Daggers now apply 0.5 points of damage per additional point in
dexterity and 0.5 points of damage per additional point in strength, as
originally intended. This increases dagger damage for high-dexterity
characters."

You're welcome. sheesh.

Modifié par traversc, 04 mars 2010 - 10:25 .

[obie191970]

traversc wrote...

Wicked 702 wrote...

traversc wrote...

GEWill wrote...

obie191970 wrote...

What's the dexterity glitch?

On the consoles the Rogue class modifier is .5 when it should be .8 or 1.0 for Daggers. To me its not such a big deal, but some people think it breaks the game. My Rogue does sick damage as it is so if the dex bug were fixed it just means he would feel overpowered.

Um no....  The dex glitch is that rogues get 100% cunning modifier, when they should be getting 50% dex/50% cun.  This means that rogues are way more powerful on consoles than they should be, since it effetively doubles the damage due to attributes. 

State your source.

I've been following the "dex bug" for 2 months now and this is the FIRST time I've ever seen someone claim this to be true. Unless you can provide me with a credible thread with actual figures tested by people you are full of it.

I am... full of it?....

Wow, you're a troll.  My source is THE GAME.  If you have a PS3 or pre-patch PC, you could even try it out for yourself.  OR you could do a little bit of searching yourself and not look so clueless. 

PS: patch notes. 
"Daggers now apply 0.5 points of damage per additional point in
dexterity and 0.5 points of damage per additional point in strength, as
originally intended. This increases dagger damage for high-dexterity
characters."

You're welcome. sheesh.

Right, because it was 100% strength before, not cunning.

[traversc]

obie191970 wrote...

traversc wrote...

Wicked 702 wrote...

traversc wrote...

GEWill wrote...

obie191970 wrote...

What's the dexterity glitch?

On the consoles the Rogue class modifier is .5 when it should be .8 or 1.0 for Daggers. To me its not such a big deal, but some people think it breaks the game. My Rogue does sick damage as it is so if the dex bug were fixed it just means he would feel overpowered.

Um no....  The dex glitch is that rogues get 100% cunning modifier, when they should be getting 50% dex/50% cun.  This means that rogues are way more powerful on consoles than they should be, since it effetively doubles the damage due to attributes. 

State your source.

I've been following the "dex bug" for 2 months now and this is the FIRST time I've ever seen someone claim this to be true. Unless you can provide me with a credible thread with actual figures tested by people you are full of it.

I am... full of it?....

Wow, you're a troll.  My source is THE GAME.  If you have a PS3 or pre-patch PC, you could even try it out for yourself.  OR you could do a little bit of searching yourself and not look so clueless. 

PS: patch notes. 
"Daggers now apply 0.5 points of damage per additional point in
dexterity and 0.5 points of damage per additional point in strength, as
originally intended. This increases dagger damage for high-dexterity
characters."

You're welcome. sheesh.

Right, because it was 100% strength before, not cunning.

Rogues have this nifty little thing called Lethality:

"The rogue has a keen eye for weak spots, and thus gains a bonus to
critical chance for all attacks. Additionally, if the rogue's cunning
score is greater than strength, sharpness of mind lets the character
use the cunning modifier to affect attack damage in place of the
strength modifier."

[Wicked 702]

Well no, you are technically still full of it. Your statement is that "This means that rogues are way more powerful on consoles than they should be" is incorrect. DW rogues may be more powerful IF the person chooses lethality but that also means that longbow rogues are nerfed since that damage is dex based. So not ALL rogues are more powerful.

[Cuthlan]

It's not rogues, it's the items. You guys are arguing over nothing.

[GEWill]

You guys are taking this way too serious. You're arguing for no reason.

It's been clearly pointed out that its based on the item modifier and not the attribute modifier.

Just chill.

Modifié par GEWill, 04 mars 2010 - 11:25 .

[traversc]

Wicked 702 wrote...

Well no, you are technically still full of it. Your statement is that "This means that rogues are way more powerful on consoles than they should be" is incorrect.

Yeah... too bad you're bad at the game.  If anyone is full of it, it is sooo you. 

Without the dex fix, rogues are much, much more powerful.  That is a fact.  You can choose to believe it or not. 

Modifié par traversc, 04 mars 2010 - 11:30 .

[GEWill]

I'm not seeing how you figure Rogues are more powerful without the fix?



Since its based on modifiers in the item how does that make a character more powerful? Archers are a perfect example of how Rogues are not more powerful, but actually weaker in an aspect.

[traversc]

GEWill wrote...

I'm not seeing how you figure Rogues are more powerful without the fix?

Since its based on modifiers in the item how does that make a character more powerful? Archers are a perfect example of how Rogues are not more powerful, but actually weaker in an aspect.

To make things clear:

There are two issues at work here. 

1) The "dexterity bug" has NOTHING to do with longbows or shortbows.  NOTHING AT ALL.  Do NOT listen to that other guy above, he has no clue what he is talking about. 

The dexterity bug is this: crossbows and daggers do not get attribute bonuses due dexterity.  Crossbows got zilch from any stat, while daggers got 100% str (which becomes 100% cun, when you take lethality on your bstab rogue).  As of 1.02a patch, crossbows get 100% dex while daggers get 50/50 dex/cun (or str).  This means that, pre-patch, cun rogues get a massive damage boost because they can dump everything into cun and get 100% damage bonus from attributes, while post-patch, if you dumped everything into cun, you would only get a 50% damage bonus. 

Is that clear? 

2) Since release, (on the PC version), archers have been buffed considerably across the board.  Note that this really has nothing to do with any "bug" whatsoever. 

Modifié par traversc, 05 mars 2010 - 05:08 .

[PatT2]

So, can we return to the original question, then. Will this get patched for the consoles? Even if we cannot agree on exactly what to call the darned thing, the game does not do what the description says it does if you're on a console. All any of us want to know is if we can expect the same service for our $ that the pc gamers got? Or not. That's all. Will it be fixed?

[Korvayer]

Edit: Retracting my statement, pending further single/dual-wield dagger testing on consoles.

Modifié par Korvayer, 05 mars 2010 - 06:59 .

[Loc'n'lol]

AFAIK, crossbow get 0 damage bonus even after the 1.02 patch, and this ay very well be intended. (Any wepon receiving 100% damage bonus from dexterity would instantly become the 'best', because you could get attack, defense and damage from a single stat...)

[Random70]

_Loc_N_lol_ wrote...

AFAIK, crossbow get 0 damage bonus even after the 1.02 patch, and this ay very well be intended. (Any wepon receiving 100% damage bonus from dexterity would instantly become the 'best', because you could get attack, defense and damage from a single stat...)

Correct...After patch 1.01 one of the developers released an *unofficial* DEX hotfix granting daggers 50/50 str/dex and crossbow/shortbow 100% dex and yes, it made crossbows/shortbows insanely powerful. When 1.02 was released, only the dagger aspect was implemented

[GEWill]

PatT2 wrote...

So, can we return to the original question, then. Will this get patched for the consoles? Even if we cannot agree on exactly what to call the darned thing, the game does not do what the description says it does if you're on a console. All any of us want to know is if we can expect the same service for our $ that the pc gamers got? Or not. That's all. Will it be fixed?

Same service? You say that as if the current iteration is breaking your game. If you go by the definition of the above poster that means you are getting 50% more damage out of yur Rogue so in essense your character is more powerful than Rogues on the PC version of the game.

Personally I don't care if it is ever fixed or not, because I don't overload cunning anyways so my Rogues are basically on par with Rogues from the PC.

[traversc]

Random70 wrote...

_Loc_N_lol_ wrote...

AFAIK, crossbow get 0 damage bonus even after the 1.02 patch, and this ay very well be intended. (Any wepon receiving 100% damage bonus from dexterity would instantly become the 'best', because you could get attack, defense and damage from a single stat...)

Correct...After patch 1.01 one of the developers released an *unofficial* DEX hotfix granting daggers 50/50 str/dex and crossbow/shortbow 100% dex and yes, it made crossbows/shortbows insanely powerful. When 1.02 was released, only the dagger aspect was implemented

Oh wow, that sucks.  They still should have made crossbows have some attribute bonus.  70-80% would probably have been balanced. 

[PatT2]

GEWill wrote...

PatT2 wrote...

So, can we return to the original question, then. Will this get patched for the consoles? Even if we cannot agree on exactly what to call the darned thing, the game does not do what the description says it does if you're on a console. All any of us want to know is if we can expect the same service for our $ that the pc gamers got? Or not. That's all. Will it be fixed?

Same service? You say that as if the current iteration is breaking your game. If you go by the definition of the above poster that means you are getting 50% more damage out of yur Rogue so in essense your character is more powerful than Rogues on the PC version of the game.

Personally I don't care if it is ever fixed or not, because I don't overload cunning anyways so my Rogues are basically on par with Rogues from the PC.

Well, this isn't about you personally. This is not the only bug that hampers or affects the rogue class on the console. It's one of 3. The menu for the traps/bombs/poisons is broken as well.

So if you don't mind, the fact that you don't want anything to change is irrelevant to my concern that we get some nod or whatever from bioward that they give a gosh darned if the game works on all platforms identically. I did not attack you personally. This isn't personal at all. So happy for you it works for you. But when you add the trap problem, and a few other things, this becomes drag for the rogue class. That you haven't noticed isn't really the issue.

I'm just saying. The game should substantially operate the same on all platforms. It's not personal.

[Korvayer]

Kut wrote...

This bug allows Rogues (specifically DW Cunning Rogues) to simply stack Cunning for massive damage, since the damage modifier is 100% Strength (Cunning) instead of 50% Strength (Cunning) and 50% Dex.

traversc wrote...

As of 1.02a patch, crossbows get 100% dex while daggers get 50/50 dex/cun (or str).  This means that, pre-patch, cun rogues get a massive damage boost because they can dump everything into cun and get 100% damage bonus from attributes, while post-patch, if you dumped everything into cun, you would only get a 50% damage bonus.

GEWill wrote...

If you go by the definition of the above poster that means you are getting 50% more damage out of yur Rogue so in essense your character is more powerful than Rogues on the PC version of the game.

I understand the theory, but I'd like to confirm for myself that it is actually working this way. I've done some brief testing on the Xbox 360 version of the game. For damage values I've gone with what is displayed on the character sheet, which I understand to be adjusted for the speed of the weapon. I tested bows as well.


Single-wield dagger

~.85 points of damage per 1 point strength (or cunning w/ lethality)

dexterity has no effect on dagger damage


Dual-wield dagger

~.30 to .32 points of damage (mainhand) per 1 point strength (or cunning w/ lethality)

dexterity has no effect on dagger damage


Shortbow

~.30 to .32 points of damage per 1 point strength (or cunning w/ lethality)

~.30 to .32 points of damage per 1 point dexterity


Longbow

~.30 to .32 points of damage per 1 point strength (or cunning w/ lethality)

~.30 to .32 points of damage per 1 point dexterity


Crossbow

Strength (or cunning w/ lethality) and Dexterity have no effect on crossbow damage



How does my data compare, in practice, to what you're experiencing on the PC? I suppose we'd expect PC's to receive half the Xbox's damage bonus from strength or cunning for single and dual-wield daggers. Can anybody post or link me to a source of PC version data collection?

Thank you.


EDIT: The bulleted list function on these boards is coded strangely. I can't seem to implement it in a way that doesn't screw up the layout of the text.

Modifié par Korvayer, 06 mars 2010 - 08:07 .

[ITSSEXYTIME]

traversc wrote...

GEWill wrote...

obie191970 wrote...

What's the dexterity glitch?

On the consoles the Rogue class modifier is .5 when it should be .8 or 1.0 for Daggers. To me its not such a big deal, but some people think it breaks the game. My Rogue does sick damage as it is so if the dex bug were fixed it just means he would feel overpowered.

Um no....  The dex glitch is that rogues get 100% cunning modifier, when they should be getting 50% dex/50% cun.  This means that rogues are way more powerful on consoles than they should be, since it effetively doubles the damage due to attributes. 

Not entirely true.  It doesn't necessarily double the damage.

It does make a single point of Cunning worth "two points" in the proper system, and it is easier to stack Cunning than it is to split between Dex/Cunning.

[traversc]

Korvayer wrote...

How does my data compare, in practice, to
what you're experiencing on the PC? I suppose we'd expect PC's to
receive half the Xbox's damage bonus from strength or cunning for
single and dual-wield daggers. Can anybody post or link me to a source
of PC version data collection?



Thank you.





EDIT: The
bulleted list function on these boards is coded strangely. I can't seem
to implement it in a way that doesn't screw up the layout of the
text.

You don't need to do any testing.  Almost all the
data is readily available in xls and scripting files and the values can just be
viewed directly.  Also, a lot of the data is on the wiki as well. 

And yes, you are exactly right.  On PC with daggers, you recieve half of that damage per point.  For shortbows/longbows, I believe it is 0.5 damage per point. 

If you're interested in learning more about combat mechanics, check out this post:

http://social.biowar...66/index/223777

Modifié par traversc, 06 mars 2010 - 08:17 .