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[Sabresandiego]

The strongest squad mates are



Tier 1: Miranda and Samara

Tier 2: Jack and Thane



Everyone else is tier 3 or worse.

[The Unfallen]

In when picking favorites:



-Shepard

-Tali

-Legion

-Garrus

-Jacob

-Grunt

-Miranda

-Jack

-Samara

-Thane

-Zaeed

[ccconda]

Grunt is the most useful due to being a tank, but I wish he had more useful powers to use on guarded enemies.

Garrus is awesome but, even in ME1, he always seems to die first. haha... then again, I always use Wrex/Grunt and Garrus, so maybe garrus dies as much as any normal party member.



When its not grunt + garrus, i mix it up (Stupid that loyalty missions are half of the game, and they force you to use certain party members ). Legion and mordin are really enjoyable personality wise. Mordin's got great powers, but legion's suck. Ai hacking is boring, and so is his drone, but its better than nothing. His loyalty power is shield boost, which is even MORE boring. Wish bioware gave each member an extra power, just so there's some freakin variety.

[JaegerBane]

tonnactus wrote...
Decide what you want.You talk about gatsby and singularity+warp explosions.

Eh?

Some people refuse to understand.
Garrus role in this section is to strip shields.Mordins role is to strip armors.Adepts and sentinels have warp as Talents.
Infilfiltrators and Engineers have incinerate for amor.Soldiers have disruptor for shields and inferno ammo.
Anti-armor talents are covered there with mordin and shepardt.

Read through the post again. I don't mind explaining the thinking in detail but I'm not going to repeat myself just because you either can't or won't read.

Get your numbers right.Inferno is more effective against armor then a upgraded warp (even with biotic upgrades)
Heavy inferno:100 points over 4 seconds
Heavy warp:200 points
And unstable,what a player should always choose(because of the reduced cooldown) is even more weaker.
And soldiers have inferno ammo power and disruptor,infiltrators disruptor.They dont need miranda even there.

Oh sweet lordy.

Is it even worth me pointing out that, as a combat power, Inferno Grenade sees *no* improvement over the course of the game? Is that beyond your ability to understand? Will it help if I use very small words and explain each and every factor?

The point is that Heavy Warp, when factoring in the 50% damage boost, the 20% cooldown reduction and the fact that extra damage is caused when detonating another Biotic, pulls waaaaay ahead of Inferno and is only truely beaten by Incinerate. Not to mention the fact that the fragments are unpredictable and difficult to target. If we go down the retard-understanding route of simply comparing numbers in isolation of the game then I can see your point, but I'd like to think that we're not ignoring the rest of the game altogether.

Oh gee, yeah, there is also the small matter that warp does DOUBLE DAMAGE to ARMOUR. Before talking about numbers, I suggest you practice what you preach and, at least try to look at some data before using it in argument.

Whether a player should choose unstable is up to the player. I know your opinion of yourself is rather high tonnactus, but surely you haven't reached such delusional heights that you think your own choice is superior simply by being your own. I personally don't bother with it as Wide Singularity tends to draw enemies in well enough, and Heavy Warp packs enough punch to work as direct attack for the Adept.

But never the best.She isnt the number one.Not even close.

I'll agree she's not the best. But I would submit that she is close... simply by virtue of being the gap filler. Any idiot can understand that if you know what you're going to face and have all that you need you can specialise, but how you specialise is up to the class of the player. Miranda remains the only character who is consistently useful irrespective of class, level or area of the game.

While you may feel she isn't useful enough to certain classes, in a ranking of the characters by definition away from Shepards class, you can't really ignore this.

(Well, given the way you apparently forget whole aspects of the game when considering anything, I'm not willing to bet on it, but the point remains).

Modifié par JaegerBane, 06 mars 2010 - 10:10 .

[implodinggoat]

Ranked by Usefulness. (ME2 only)



# 1: Miranda :Wins by a mile, Miranda has everything. Warp for armor and barriers, overload for shields and synthetics, slam for a quick incapacitation and a passive bonus which boosts the health and weapon damage of the entire squad. Plus, she's smoking hot.



# 2: Samara : Pull is the best power for incapacitating unprotected enemies and she has Area Reave which is like warp except it can hit multiple targets and it heals her. On top of that she can lay down the damage with her assault rifle and she is also smoking hot.



# 3: Garrus :Overload is great for bringing down shields and he can throw down the damage with either an assault rifle or a sniper rifle. Armor Piercing ammo is also great although it can be a nuisance if you use squad ammo since the AI doesn't know how to use ammo powers properly.



# 4: Mordin :Incinerate is the single best ability against armor and cryo blast is great for incapacitating unprotected enemies. On the downside Cryo Blast renders his neural shock ability completely redundant.



# 5: Grunt :He's damn hard to kill, does a lot of damage with his assault rifle and he can trample anything that gets in close. He's absolutely incredible against husks since his Krogan charge kills them outright even on insanity.



# 6: Tali :Very underrated in my opinion. She has Energy drain for shielded enemies, AI hacking for synthetics, and the underrated Attack Drone which makes for a great distraction against anything. Against Geth no one can touch her, not even Miranda.



# 7: Thane : He has warp for armor and barriers and he can lay down really heavy damage with his Sniper rifle. On the downside Shredder Ammo is utterly worthless and Samara can match nearly all his abilities and has pull instead of throw (plus she's hot).



# 8: Zaeed : Another underrated squadmate. He can do more damage with his weapons than any other squad member and his durability is second only to Grunt. He can Snipe and he has Inferno Grenade which isn't a half bad ability against armor or unprotected organics.



# 9: Legion : With the Widow in his hands he's the best Sniper you've got. He's pretty durable, he can hack synthetics and he can distract enemies with the attack drone. On the other hand the lack of Overload hurts his value in my opinion.



#10: Morinth : She has warp and pull and she can use an assault rifle; but Dominate pales in comparison to her mother's Area Reave ability. Still Dominate is like AI hack for Organics, so it can be pretty useful. Her Mom is way better though, so unless you're dedicated to evil, I'd pass.



#11: Jack : On lower difficulties Shockwave is the most devastating power in the game; but the higher the difficulty the more useless she becomes. On insanity any biotic without warp is pretty useless.



#12: Jacob : He has pull and he can take a lot of damage; but Thane and Samara also have pull and they can do more damage with their guns and they have Warp and Reave which is vital on higher difficulty. Still he's tough and he has pull so that's worth something.

[implodinggoat]

Ranked by Personality (ME1 and ME2).

# 1: Wrex  (Badass yet charming and witty)
# 2: Mordin (Damn funny, yet ethically conflicted and very deep)
# 3: Liara   (Lovably nerdy, brilliant and beautiful.  I've got a thing for smart chicks)
# 4: Miranda  (Cunning and disciplined.  She supresses her emotions and her morals; but never loses them.)
# 5: Garrus  (Just yet ruthless and a lot more personable in ME2)
# 6: Tali  (Tragic and sweet.  I've got a thing for smart chicks.)
# 7: Samara  (She places her duty above everything to give her life meaning and to escape her sadness.)
# 8: Grunt  (Shallow compared to Wrex.  Still his "LETS KICK ASS!" attitude really grows on you)
# 9: Zaeed (Cynical and ruthless with a dark wit.  Like Wrex sans the honor.)
#10: Thane (Wracked with regret and supressed guilt, struggling to give his life meaning before he dies.)
#11: Jacob (Stoic and honest.  Seems like he could have been better developed)
#12: Ashley (Tough, sentimental, and self conscious.  Latent bigotry is intriguing.)
#13: Legion (He' intriguing; but Geth don't have a lot of personality)
#14: Jack  (Seriously why does Shepard take her ****?  Too much ****, not enough crazy.)
#15: Kaiden (Dull as dishwater)
#16: Morinth (She's a compulsive serial killer and you invite her on your ship?  That's brilliant.)

Modifié par implodinggoat, 06 mars 2010 - 11:02 .

[Avanaco]

Pardon my "hijacking"... I don't feel like ranking

Favorite for min/maxing: Miranda. I can't see doing an Insanity run without Miranda in the party 100% of the time. I mean, come on... squad bonus, overload, and warp? Thanks Bioware! As the wow kiddiez/icanhascheezeburger types would say, if you don't have Miranda: "ur doin it wrongz"! Unfortunately, Miranda is my least favorite for storyline and character development. She plays the artificially tough "sexy" girl, and somehow fails at being sexy regardless of the endless contrived T&A shots throughout the game.

Favorite romance: Jack. Now let me first say that I've never really gotten into RPG romances beyond the storyline that they provide. However, after finding Miranda's romance underwhelming, I decided to try Jack's romance on my first Insanity run. If you refuse her first offer, the subsequent romance plot is strangely moving. Leave it to Bioware to invent a crazy butch near-nympho that can really evoke an emotional response.

Favorite for "good cop" badass: Garrus! I liked Garrus in ME1, and I was thrilled when I saw that he was Archangel in ME2. (I intentionally avoided spoilers leading up to ME2 release, so if this was known before release, I didn't know about it.) So excited, in fact, that when I finally convinced my wife to do just a single easy-mode run through of ME2, she accused me of having a man-crush on Garrus. But really... if you explore his conversation options and look at his character development from ME1 to ME2, it fits perfectly. Excellently developed character. And let's face it - with a viper and a vindicator, overload, AP ammo, etc... he's a not a bad party member at all. Some of his lines had me chuckling as well... for instance, the Krogan hospital line!

Favorite "bad cop" badass: Zaeed. Since he is technically a DLC character, I had second thoughts about putting him here. But, well... if you buy the game new (as you should, because the replay value is extreme), you have free access to this character. I think the character is very well designed. His character, abilities, and personal mission have one main theme: FIRE! ... and it's very well done, including the paragon option in his personal mission.

Favorite plot character: Legion. But... why couldn't we have more time with Legion? This character is simply awesome. I didn't see his plot twist coming. I've only played ME1 and read the 2 released books, so I don't know if this development was alluded to in any comics or ME1 DLCs... but Legion's plot importance is huge. I have faith that bioware can carry over Legion's personal mission decision over to ME3 (and beyond? please?)

Special mention: Mordin .  Morin has a very well developed personality - even to his unique meter! Excellent exhibition of moral ambiguity. Also a rather strong character. (My first complete insanity run was Shepard + Miranda + Mordin, and I'm not sure how I overlooked him in my earlier normal->hard runs).

Don't get it: Tali. I honestly don't understand why everyone is Tali-crazy. :-( I am definitely an odd man out from the ME2 fanboi community on this one, I guess. I don't "feel" her persona, and she is a fairly weak character.

Modifié par Avanaco, 06 mars 2010 - 11:52 .

[tonnactus]

JaegerBane wrote...



Oh sweet lordy.

Is it even worth me pointing out that, as a combat power, Inferno Grenade sees *no* improvement over the course of the game? Is that beyond your ability to understand?

Simple mathematics?400 points grenade damage compared to 300.(with upgrades)
Even less,when choose instable warp because of the reduced cooldown time.
No way warp outmatch the inferno grenade.
Also its reave that did double damage to armor and barriers,not warp.

When taking miranda to grunts mission,she has at best level 2 warp and overload,if you want diversity and dont put anything in the class talent.
Garrus has overload at least at rank 3 to 4,also mordin have incenerate level 4.And they have independent cooldowns.

Modifié par tonnactus, 06 mars 2010 - 09:53 .

[Frybread76]

I would second the notion that Miranda is the MVP of ME2 due to her versatility. She has powers that take down shields, barriers, and armor while giving passive bonuses to squad damage and health. I don't get why some people think she sucks, other then they are upset their favorite character isn't as valuable as Miranda.



Garrus would be one step down from Miranda, IMO. He has Warp and AP ammo along with Assault Rifle training.



While Thane might not be high on the list, I like him for having Warp, Sniper Rifle, and a 50% damage bonus, along with 80 percent extra damage against organics with Shredder Ammo.

[Arde5643]

Again, Miranda is great for weapon-based classes : infiltrator, soldier, vanguard, but loses quickly to specialist squadmates for the power-based classes.



And I can attest to that since I've played as a vanguard, adept, engineer, inffiltrator.

Miranda was the constant pick when I was playing infiltrator and vanguard, however she proved mediocre when I play as an adept or engineer.



Miranda is a great choice for the weapon-based classes because she can strip any type of defenses - she's however a mediocre choice for the power-based classes simply because the power-based classes can strip defenses much faster and more efficiently than Miranda ever can.



Her squad weapon/health boost is also much less useful for the power-based classes since the power-based classes will not expose themselves in a firefight as much as the weapon-based classes, and because of that they will not use their weapons as much as the weapon-based classes.

What this means is if a power class takes Miranda as a squaddie, he/she now gets a boost to the most useless stat of his/her class (weapon damage and health) and also has a squad member with middling quality in stripping defenses (Miranda doesn't get bonuses to duration/cooldown/damage in her passive skill unlike other specialist squadmates).



Now, if there is a squad member with passive skills that can boost the power cooldown/damage/duration of Shepard's skill, then that squad member will probably be the best squad member for a power-based class. Unfortunately, there isn't anyone like that currently.



If all of you Miranda nuthuggers still don't get it, I don't know what else to say to you.

[tonnactus]

I dont know.Soldiers with heightened adrenaline rush get 140 percent weapon damage.I doubt mirandas bonuses matters in this case.

[Arde5643]

It's for the times when the soldier is on cooldown after adrenaline rush unless the player always stays in cover for 3 seconds after every adrenaline rush.



But I don't think they play like that, or at least I'm hoping they don't play that way since that seems to be even more of a bore-fest than the soldier class already is.

[5Warlocks]

Squad Cyro is probably the most effective way to play the game; therefore I tend to rate squad members with their own ammo powers downward since the AI interferes with keeping Squad Cyro active. In practice I always use Garrus anyway, but I choose a third who will always be freezing enemies.

[Urazz]

ccconda wrote...

Grunt is the most useful due to being a tank, but I wish he had more useful powers to use on guarded enemies.
Garrus is awesome but, even in ME1, he always seems to die first. haha... then again, I always use Wrex/Grunt and Garrus, so maybe garrus dies as much as any normal party member.

When its not grunt + garrus, i mix it up (Stupid that loyalty missions are half of the game, and they force you to use certain party members ). Legion and mordin are really enjoyable personality wise. Mordin's got great powers, but legion's suck. Ai hacking is boring, and so is his drone, but its better than nothing. His loyalty power is shield boost, which is even MORE boring. Wish bioware gave each member an extra power, just so there's some freakin variety.

Grunt is best against collectors.  He can't remove shields but he can help remove barriers with concussive shot and his ammo is good at removing armor.

[DapperDan77]

imo, Miranda is the worst character. Not for her abilities (In that regard she's probably the best squad member in the game), but for her shockingly bad voice actor. ME2 has a HEAP of dialogue (obviously), and her flat delivery I find breaks immersion. Which is a real shame, as Yvonne Strahovski rocks in Chuck, and is one of the hottest things walking around on 2 legs.

[tonnactus]

Urazz wrote...
 His loyalty power is shield boost, which is even MORE boring.

Geth shields boosts is better then fortification and barrier,because harbringers attacks seem to do more damage to the last two.A great lifesaver.

Grunt is best against collectors.  He can't remove shields but he can help remove barriers with concussive shot and his ammo is good at removing armor.

I dont put any points in his inferno ammo.His role is the tank.So all points are spend into pureblood,heavy fortification and concussive blast.He use ammo powers through squadmates or sheaprdt.

[JaegerBane]

tonnactus wrote...

Simple mathematics?400 points grenade damage compared to 300.(with upgrades)
Even less,when choose instable warp because of the reduced cooldown time.
No way warp outmatch the inferno grenade.
Also its reave that did double damage to armor and barriers,not warp.

*sigh* look tonnactus, the developers themselves confirmed that Warp does double damage to armour/barriers, just like Reave. It's on the wiki. Hell, if you'd bothered testing this you'd know. It's common fricking knowledge.

If you haven't even realised simple stuff like this I don't understand why you're still arguing. You clearly haven't any idea of what you're talking about.

When taking miranda to grunts mission,she has at best level 2 warp and overload,if you want diversity and dont put anything in the class talent.
Garrus has overload at least at rank 3 to 4,also mordin have incenerate level 4.And they have independent cooldowns.

Miranda has whatever level Warp and Overload I choose to give her, just like all the other characters. If you're trying to claim that Miranda is less powerful then 2 other squadmates combined, gee, no s*** sherlock. No character is more powerful than 2 others for god's sake, that isn't a measure of capability.

[Andaius20]

Wow people still saying Miranda isn't the most versitile companion even though she has abilities against everything?

[Arde5643]

I'd agree with most versatile - best squadmate however I disagree with.



Versatility isn't as useful if it doesn't synergize as well with other teammates or your own class.

[Andaius20]

she should synergize with anyone since she does everything....

[Arde5643]

Well see,that's the thing.. unless you start using specialist teammate combinations with your own class, you won't find anyone doing it better than Miranda.

Here's an example:



As an engineer, I find Garrus and Mordin to be the best combo ever for any blue suns mission. Why? Shields were never a problem (Garrus + Engie). Armor? Again, same thing (Mordin + Engie).

Garrus has better overload than Miranda and Mordin is better at stripping armor than Miranda.

Not only that, Mordin can use cyro blast every 3.5 seconds making him the best cc squadmate, Garrus has better weapons and can use squad AP ammo that does more than Miranda's squad bonus.



Why the hell would I take anyone else as an engineer in here - even the most "versatile" squadmate, Miranda? Sure, I can use her weaker overload, weaker warp, and middling weapon/health bonus.



So to answer your charge, Andaius : she does synergize with anyone, she just doesn't do it well enough to actually be more useful for the adept or engineer.

[SmilingMirror]

Andaius20 wrote...

SmilingMirror, not everyone play's a biotic using class....By your logic you would never ever do warp combo's if you aren't a biotic.

yeah i don't do warp combos on a soldier because I'd rather just focus on making my guns as deadily as possible.
The warp combo is the crutch for classes with low base damage, low cooldowns and shield ripping powers.

Modifié par SmilingMirror, 09 mars 2010 - 01:11 .

[Andaius20]

Wait so your saying if you had two biotic companions you'd completely ignore the warp combo with them? you wouldn't even use there abilities to the fullest? you'd just play wack a mole with your guns?

[Urazz]

Arde5643 wrote...

Well see,that's the thing.. unless you start using specialist teammate combinations with your own class, you won't find anyone doing it better than Miranda.
Here's an example:

As an engineer, I find Garrus and Mordin to be the best combo ever for any blue suns mission. Why? Shields were never a problem (Garrus + Engie). Armor? Again, same thing (Mordin + Engie).
Garrus has better overload than Miranda and Mordin is better at stripping armor than Miranda.
Not only that, Mordin can use cyro blast every 3.5 seconds making him the best cc squadmate, Garrus has better weapons and can use squad AP ammo that does more than Miranda's squad bonus.

Why the hell would I take anyone else as an engineer in here - even the most "versatile" squadmate, Miranda? Sure, I can use her weaker overload, weaker warp, and middling weapon/health bonus.

So to answer your charge, Andaius : she does synergize with anyone, she just doesn't do it well enough to actually be more useful for the adept or engineer.

Miranda has a weaker overload?  News to me.  They have the same exact overload.  I's a matter of your leveling and what skills you are maxing out first on both characters.

I agree with your ranking of her as an adept or engineer though.  Miranda works better with the more combat heavy classes and sentinals as well as a backup warp detonation (I love bringing her and Garrus for Blue Suns on my sentinal.  Nothing has their shields or armor for long and warp detonations are blowing up every few seconds after that.

[Andaius20]

I think that he's talking about Garrus' bonus tech cooldown or damage bonus some such.

Modifié par Andaius20, 09 mars 2010 - 01:26 .