167 réponses à ce sujet

[wrexfan32hanalei]

it might've been best for the galaxy but I love wrex way too much to see it from anybody else's perpective. and it is murder because the krogan babies have little bodies and everything.

[Chaos-fusion]

XxTaLoNxX wrote...

Krogan are a race of intelligent beings with souls and to produce a virus that disrupts the life cycle of Krogan is wrong. As it would be wrong to drop such a virus on India the one similar country to what Krogan are going through... overpopulation, outsourcing of jobs that leads to resource drains, and other problems.

If India decided to try and conquer the surrounding countriees to gain their resources, then people would take steps against them, wouldn't they?

[Apollo Starflare]

The real issue was with the Salarian's (and others? Can't remember) encouraging the Krogan's development as a species before they were ready. Mordin says something similar in the game and I agree with him.



The Krogan's were on a one way trip to actual genocide, be it theirs or some other species that got in their way. The genophage isn't a good thing by any stretch of the imagination, but it was certainly the lesser evil at the time.



I suppose the biggest question is whether it should be reconsidered in the 'present'. I tend to think it probably should be, but only after a concerted effort from both the Krogan and outside groups to ensure their society is ready to rebuild itself and not merely overbreed and lead down the road to nuclear devestation once again. Afterall did the Krogan are as much a danger to themselves as anyone else in their previous state, just look at their homeworld.

[KhanQuest 419]

Masterchief killed the flood same concept. Kill the few to save the many. some evils are necessary

[addiction21]

Chaos-fusion wrote...

XxTaLoNxX wrote...

Krogan are a race of intelligent beings with souls and to produce a virus that disrupts the life cycle of Krogan is wrong. As it would be wrong to drop such a virus on India the one similar country to what Krogan are going through... overpopulation, outsourcing of jobs that leads to resource drains, and other problems.

If India decided to try and conquer the surrounding countriees to gain their resources, then people would take steps against them, wouldn't they?

I am sure some people thought like you when Alexander, The Ottoman Empire, The United States, Franks, Roman Empire, **** Germany, Stalin...  The list is pretty long.
Sure maybe steps would be taken but the question is "How long till they are taken and how big are those steps?"

[Chaos-fusion]

addiction21 wrote...

Sure maybe steps would be taken but the question is "How long till they are taken and how big are those steps?"

What exactly would be a good, alternate solution if your home/world/species is threatened? Sitting back thinking "We can't just kill them, we should wait to them to realise there are alternatives to coming killing us for our food" doesn't strike me as a particularly good option.

[taylormanoogian]

The genophage is one of my favorite parts of mass effect, it's truly a perfect grey area subject. Before mass effect 2 I had believed that the Genophage was bad and should be cured, but the character mordin solus literally opened my eyes and showed me that it was right thing to do.

[Chaos-fusion]

And if your enemy breeds faster than you, and is alot tougher to kill, then what? .. And when he's finished with your country and moves onto the next? And so on.

[Ryzaki]

Chaos-fusion wrote...

And if your enemy breeds faster than you, and is alot tougher to kill, then what? .. And when he's finished with your country and moves onto the next? And so on.

Maybe you should have left him on his planet where he was unaware of you no? 

Frankly the Genophage isn't the right thing to do in my eyes but yeah by now its necessary. I just can't wait for the Krogan's to get their act together and then either wipe out or extremely devastate the Salarians. Payback is a ****.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 07 mars 2010 - 01:46 .

[Chaos-fusion]

Ryzaki wrote...

Chaos-fusion wrote...

And if your enemy breeds faster than you, and is alot tougher to kill, then what? .. And when he's finished with your country and moves onto the next? And so on.

Maybe you should have left him on his planet where he was unaware of you no? 

would have been best, undoubtably. But they were needed to fight the rachni, since that war wasn't going so well for the citadel races at the time, if I remeber that right.

Modifié par Chaos-fusion, 07 mars 2010 - 01:50 .

[The Capital Gaultier]

Chaos-fusion wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Chaos-fusion wrote...

And if your enemy breeds faster than you, and is alot tougher to kill, then what? .. And when he's finished with your country and moves onto the next? And so on.

Maybe you should have left him on his planet where he was unaware of you no? 

would have been best, undoubtably. But they were needed to fight the rachni, since that war wasn't going so well for the citadel races at the time, if I remeber that right.

Winning a war in a pyrrhic fashion isn't a good option.

[Ryzaki]

Chaos-fusion wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Chaos-fusion wrote...

And if your enemy breeds faster than you, and is alot tougher to kill, then what? .. And when he's finished with your country and moves onto the next? And so on.

Maybe you should have left him on his planet where he was unaware of you no? 

would have been best, undoubtably. But they were needed to fight the rachni, since that war wasn't going so well for the citadel races at the time, if I remeber that right.

Truth which is exactly why I want to see the Salarians get owned. Yes petty and naive but hell they knew better desperate or no,  did it anyway and decided to punish the other group for their mistakes. Krogan's ascending and wiping them off the face of the galaxy would be lulz.

...and now I have a Krogan Reaper in my head. Oh noes.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 07 mars 2010 - 01:54 .

[Chaos-fusion]

The Capital Gaultier wrote...

Winning a war in a pyrrhic fashion isn't a good option.

Worse than being wiped out entirely?

[Landline]

Ryzaki wrote...

Chaos-fusion wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Chaos-fusion wrote...

And if your enemy breeds faster than you, and is alot tougher to kill, then what? .. And when he's finished with your country and moves onto the next? And so on.

Maybe you should have left him on his planet where he was unaware of you no? 

would have been best, undoubtably. But they were needed to fight the rachni, since that war wasn't going so well for the citadel races at the time, if I remeber that right.

Truth which is exactly why I want to see the Salarians get owned. Yes petty and naive but hell they knew better desperate or no,  did it anyway and decided to punish the other group for their mistakes. Krogan's ascending and wiping them off the face of the galaxy would be lulz.

...and now I have a Krogan Reaper in my head. Oh noes.

They would whipe out the salarians, then the Turians, then the Volus, then the Elcor, then the asari, then the humans, then the quarians and so on.

[Chaos-fusion]

Ryzaki wrote...

Truth which is exactly why I want to see the Salarians get owned. Yes petty and naive but hell they knew better desperate or no,  did it anyway and decided to punish the other group for their mistakes. Krogan's assending and wiping them off the face of the galaxy would be lulz.

Hey, I'd love to see it personally.

But, I can't really have sympathy for the krogan, since they're faced with the death of teir species because of their fast-breeding and aggresion, but they've not even attempted to solve that (the aggression at least) over the last 1000 years. I know krogan solve their problems by killing things, but only Wrex seems to have noticed that won't work this time.

Landline wrote...

They would whipe out the salarians,
then the Turians, then the Volus, then the Elcor, then the asari, then
the humans, then the quarians and so on.

And then each
other when they run out of new places to deplete of resources. Much
like they already do on Tuchanka. The only difference is billions of
extra lives lost.

Modifié par Chaos-fusion, 07 mars 2010 - 02:02 .

[ImperialOperative]

Genophage vs Extinction

The only other option was to annihilate the Krogan entirely, like they did with the rachni.

Whether it was "right" or "wrong" is irrelevant.

Modifié par ImperialOperative, 07 mars 2010 - 01:57 .

[addiction21]

gmartin40 wrote...

Lets point out that Genophage sounds like Genocide....

Butter sounds like Batter
Flour sounds like Flower
Witch sounds like Which
Two sounds like To and they both sound like Too.

Did you have a point? 

[ImperialOperative]

gmartin40 wrote...

Lets point out that Genophage sounds like Genocide....

l2 prefix and suffix

[Akka le Vil]

Maviarab wrote...

Still think the Genophage is right?

Actually, that's appeal to emotion, and it makes the argument a dumb fallacy.
Also, if the genophage is wrong, then, what would have been the solution ? I'm eager to hear how an intergalactic war slaughtering hundred of millions people is better than keeping their number in check.

[Akka le Vil]

XxTaLoNxX wrote...

WARNING! THESE COMMENTS MAY CAUSE YOU TO THINK... IT COULD BE EXTREMELY HARMFUL OR EVEN FATAL!

*Note* I do not feel this way, this is another perspective.

White People = Salarians
Black People = Krogans

Let's say that Black people are overpopulating earth and are starting to rape and increase crime rates due to ethnical backgrounds. Would it be right for White people to make a virus that causes 90% of them to die or not able to reproduce basically amounting to massive genocide?

NO! So for you to think that anything similar to the genophage in a fictional world is still right whether logic dictates it is the only logical answer, then you have to find another answer that is equally effective and not morally horrendous.

Let me quote myself here, as someone as already made a very similar comparison, and you obviously were too busy "thinking" about your reply to bother with the rest of the thread :

"This comparison is absurd.

First, the genophage doesn't kill Krogan, it lowers their birthrate. It's not "we'll shoot 999 children and only let one survive", it's "you'll get one thousand less children from now on". Birth control, not mass elimitation.

Second, you're comparing human to human. People in Africa and China are the same species than people in other country, they have not an innately higher birthrate nor an innately-built higher agression.

Finally, I'd like to her what OTHER solution you'd find. Fine to say "genophage is bad". I can understand. What is the ALTERNATIVE ?"

Modifié par Akka le Vil, 07 mars 2010 - 02:22 .

[odinn93]

I think Mordins explanation is good enough. They weren´t ready for the galactic community. Without Tuchankas hostile environment to keep their numbers in check, their population exploded. They had to evolve beyond their lust for blood, rebuild Tuchanka (after the nuclear winter has past) and find their own solution to the shortage of resources that would follow after their population would increase. Only then they would be ready for the galactic community. But unfortunately, that might take tens of thousands, even hundreds of thousands of years (because of the nuclear winter).



And also....

The genophage isn´t that unethical. Without it, millions might suffer because of lack of resources and the eventual war that would follow (it´s exactly what happened in the Krogan Rebellions). And the Krogan wouldn´t be the only species whose most of offspring don´t survive birth.

Although it´s a little diffrent, Male human beings can produce millions of sperm cells at a short time. Only 1 or 2 ever become children. The rest die. So technically, humans have the same problem, but the Krogan offsprings just get a little bigger before they die.