387 réponses à ce sujet

[Collider]

Sesshomaru47 wrote...

enormousmoonboots wrote...

I believe getting out of the relationship is always in the Paragon spot, for all romances (notably, you get no Paragon points for it). The game's sort of built on the assumption you romanced someone in ME1 and thus, getting out of the 'cheating' relationship would be the Paragon option.

Paragon responces for Jack and Thane move the relationship forward though. As far as I know the only two that can be "talked out" of it are those two, Tali and Garrus.

The paragon choices usually further the romance, but with Tali during the third romance conversation she asks if you're still interested. You can end it and say it's too dangerous or you can say that you still want to be with her. If I heard correctly, there's a point in all romances where you're allowed to end it and it's the paragon option.

[Collider]

IccaRa wrote...

Which is irrelevant. The lack of f/f is in no way these characters fault. They have nothing to do with it. You don't have to romance them. Simple as that.

It's like looking at a basket of apples and saying "This basket has no oranges!" and then looking for reasons to hate the apples because they are not oranges. What the heck? The apples were never TRYING to be oranges. It's not their fault you didn't get an orange. It's projection.

And let's be frank, most people who come to these boards saying "OMG FEMALE SHEPARD ROMANCES SUUUCK WHERE IS MY F/F OPTION B'AAAAAWWW" are not genuinely interested in the depth of a f/f romance, nor are they lesbians -- they are straight guys who are butthurt that they can't get an OMG TEH LESBIANZ scene in ME2 so now their buxom FemShep has no purpose because, let's face it, one of the only reasons they even made one was to get the OMG TEH LESBIANZ scene with Liara in ME1.

Pretty much. I agree 100% Iccara. The Asari in general seem to be the sci-fi nerd's ultimate fantasy - bisexual space babes who are sexually open minded aka fanservice for male players. I would have much rather had the Asari have two genders or at least not so sexualized.

[Collider]

jlb524 wrote...Fair would be offering a m/m option to the guy Shepards and a f/f option to the gals.  That didn't happen this time, of course

It's not really an issue of fairness. Having lesbian romances to begin with is rare and unique. Bioware is not the government, they do not owe you any romances whatsoever.

[Collider]

JohnnyDollar wrote...
With that said, I don't want my MaleShep to go talk to Garrus and have a conversation and then suddenly I'm telling him he has a tight butt or something.

It should be fairly obvious whether you're genuinely flirting with him or not. And if the romances in ME3 are like ME2, you can end the romance at any time, if in the unlikely situation that you start it by accident.

Let's be honest though.  They may make a F/F in Me3, but their won't be a M/M in it.  It's a double standard.

a) It's not a double standard. There is no standard to begin with.
I don't think you can rule out M/M in ME3. It could happen.

[Collider]

jlb524 wrote...

superimposed wrote...


That's not even gratuitous to be honest. It's actually a little.. well, it's just the stripper at Afterlife all over again.

It's gratuitious in the sense that it just seemed tacked on to Kelly's character to give some cheap f/f kicks.   Kelly didn't have to be bisexual or even interested in Commander Shepard regardless of gender.  She didn't even have to exist in the game period.   She serves no valuable purpose, IMO.

This is true of everything in the game. They didn't have to be there. Kaidan and Ashley did not need to be in ME1, nor did they have to be interested in Shepard.

[Deflagratio]

I think it's  pretty equal. Maleshep has only 1 nonfail romance (Tali), Miranda is hot, but not a romance, just a sexpuppet). and Femaleshep has Garrus as th eonly nonfail romance.

I can understand "Beauty is in the blah blah" on Jack, but her Personality is just so stock and uninspiring. "Baaaaaw, bad things done to me, baaaaaw angry face baaaaaawwwwwww". Also, I'm positive she has Herpes, because she has a herpe on her lip.

[Collider]

Aniki_21 wrote...
Lets be honest folks. If Jacob being black was factor as to why he is clearly the least liked love interest if not the least liked squad member in the game, would anyone actually admit it? Perhaps it may even be a subconcious thing for some people.  Just imagine Jacob as a smooth, handsome white guy with the same killer bod. I honestly thing he'd be a  lot more popular.  He's often compared to Kaiden as being too normal and boring yet Kaiden  still gets far more love than Jacob does.

It likely has very little to do with skin color. If his cartoonish torso to hip ratio was made more realistic, I'm sure his body would be attractive to many female players. The problem though, is that his romance is lackluster, and female shepard sounds she wants to rape him right off the bat. It would be much better if it developed subtly rather than femshep abruptly going "omg you're hot"

[Blackveldt]

RighteousRage wrote...

Did you seriously go through and read all those articles, Blackveldt?

More than that, actually.  Much more.  My major is Cog-Sci Psychology and I work part-time as a research assistant.  I even offered to provide a summary for the article most difficult to read/understand.

[KentGoldings]

If no woman, how about some interesting men. All three of the major love interests for the male Shepard are much more compelling than the most compelling for the female. Frankly, I'm not interested in playing through another pseudo-lesbian romance as much as I am interested in seeing something more palatable for the woman to sleep with. ...with all due respect to the Garrus-lovers out there.

[Collider]

yoshibb wrote...
Can't you see that there might be some sort of frustration for some people if you aren't really interested in aliens that look like that. You're then just left with Jacob. Just saying.

There's always Kaidan. I know Kaidan and Ashley were both cameos in ME2, but put it into perspective. Jacob, Thane, and Garrus only have one romance, one game. Kaidan and Ashley have two games - albeit the younger game delegating them into cameos. Once ME3 is released, they'll be two fully fledged games for all of these romances.

[Ghostano]

Collider wrote...

JohnnyDollar wrote...
With that said, I don't want my MaleShep to go talk to Garrus and have a conversation and then suddenly I'm telling him he has a tight butt or something.

It should be fairly obvious whether you're genuinely flirting with him or not. And if the romances in ME3 are like ME2, you can end the romance at any time, if in the unlikely situation that you start it by accident.

Let's be honest though.  They may make a F/F in Me3, but their won't be a M/M in it.  It's a double standard.

a) It's not a double standard. There is no standard to begin with.
I don't think you can rule out M/M in ME3. It could happen.

 I think they have said before Shapard is hetersexual so yeah you can rule out the m/m. They also do not see a relationship with Liara as a f/f one since she is a asari and they are considered monosexual. I just think doubleing the number of romaces just stretched there writing ablity to thin. it is either that or they just did not try to hard and I want to give them the benfit of the doubt.

 Could always try romanceing Samara she will shot you down but you can tell you were testing her will

[MarginalBeast]

Collider wrote...

MarginalBeast wrote...

lol you guys.

If Garrus and Shepard are just having a cheap one-night stand, why is he so visibly hurt when you turn him down? He just loves sex that much?

Because Shepard leads him on and is rejected before the suicide mission where everyone could possibly die?

...What? That's not even close to being in-character for Garrus.

And you said yourself that you didn't even do the Garrus romance.

[Collider]

JohnnyDollar wrote...
It's a cycle that never ends.  We need a f/f now, then it will be we need a m/m, then it will be we need a transgender.  Then it will be beastiality (hope not).  How far do we go before we say that this is too far?

Transgender and bestiality is a far cry from heterosexual/bisexual/homosexual. You're using a slippery slope. While I don't think Bioware owes us any romance nor is being unfair by excluding romances of any nature, I don't think that including homoexual or bisexual whatever would in any way lead to bestiality or transgendered relationships. The latter at least would be fine anyways, although the audience for it would be very small.

[Collider]

JaylaClark wrote...
I have to disagree with you about Jack ... but I won't even try to convince you, it's just personal taste.

Yep.

Though that belt-getup... sheesh.  I have no clue what they were thinking.

Neither do I. It's just ugly and unnecessary. She can wear something much less ridiculous and still show her tattooes.

[Collider]

[quote]Ghostano wrote...
I think they have said before Shapard is hetersexual so yeah you can rule out the m/m.[/quote]
I severely doubt that. What they did say is that in many ways, Shepard is predefined, I don't believe they've ruled out M/M romances.

They also do not see a relationship with Liara as a f/f one since she is a asari and they are considered monosexual.[/quote]
They obviously do see it as lesbian, anyone being reasonable would. She has a female form, a woman being attracted to Liara would be lesbian or bisexual, or just making an exception for liara (unlikely). It's convenient for them to say that it wasn't lesbian as apparently some backwards people think there's something wrong with same sex relations.

[Collider]

MarginalBeast wrote...
...What? That's not even close to being in-character for Garrus.

And you said yourself that you didn't even do the Garrus romance.

What I mean by leads him on is Femshep expresses her desire to be with him physically. If that's not in the romance with Garrus, my apologies, but that's basically what I've read.

[KentGoldings]

Neither do I. It's just ugly and unnecessary. She can wear something much less ridiculous and still show her tattooes.

All the character models need a collar of some find for they can turn their heads without look strange. Jack's is just weird.

Modifié par KentGoldings, 08 mars 2010 - 03:05 .

[Ghostano]

[quote]Collider wrote...

[quote]Ghostano wrote...
I think they have said before Shapard is hetersexual so yeah you can rule out the m/m.[/quote]
I severely doubt that. What they did say is that in many ways, Shepard is predefined, I don't believe they've ruled out M/M romances.

They also do not see a relationship with Liara as a f/f one since she is a asari and they are considered monosexual.[/quote]
They obviously do see it as lesbian, anyone being reasonable would. She has a female form, a woman being attracted to Liara would be lesbian or bisexual, or just making an exception for liara (unlikely). It's convenient for them to say that it wasn't lesbian as apparently some backwards people think there's something wrong with same sex relations.

[/quote]

 Predefined as something means they are that way. Not alittle that way or a smug that way. Shapard is heterseual does not mean you will be gay because enough people on forums say so.

 You obviosly see it that way not them. Just because you do not agree with what they say or believe does not change that till they say differently. Being that they have breasts is the main reason some say they are females. If not for that we would be saying Liara(funny name for a man but there are men named Sue ) was a M/M relationship for shapard.

 Untill Bioware comes in here and says Shapard is now bi/homosexual he is still a Hetersexual. No matter how you want to play word games. As much as I like the extra depth a romance can add to a game I can see why they are not in such a hurry to add them now.

 In the end I do not really care I think the main story was weak and if I have to choose between a far better story that makes sense and does not use forced progression to add a sense of urgancy or a horny shapard screwing everything they come across to make everybody that wants m/m,f/f,m/f,m/f/f and f/m/m. I will take the story.

 Feel free to flame me,call me a troll hell ignore me what ever makes everyone happy. You want a m/m relationship play Dragon Age Zevron is waiting. Now I shall call it a day I must get back to studying Nihongo.

 Peace out I like ham and cheese no you can not have any

[Onyx Jaguar]

LIara was a F/F relationship... O_o, not a m/M one I think you misunderstood both of those people's posts

*EDIT:  Also Asari being monogendered does not change that fact, technically Humans could evolve to be MOnogendered female if survival dictated that making males obselete.  The lack of M/M is probably because it would draw more attention to Bioware like DA had (because the Zevran M/M romance drew more controversy than the Leliana F/F romance).  If Bioware felt comfortable then yeah I could see them putting in a M/M romance but that wasn't what this thread was about.

Modifié par Onyx Jaguar, 08 mars 2010 - 03:18 .

[Blackveldt]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

Blackveldt wrote...
That was low.  And you've based your entire argument on a very basic fallacy (slippery slope).  It's not even close to the same thing; you should really educate yourself at least a little on the subject before jumping to such conclusions so vehemently.  *Sigh*


If you understand even a third of that, I'll be impressed.  If you don't, I actually don't mind summarizing the findings.  And if this is too much for you, then simply be sure to state that your opinions are just that--opinions.  And that is fine, but it irks me when people state their opinions as if they are fact--especially when they clearly no nothing of the subject matter.  That earns an automatic face-palm :/

I am educated and familiar with journals and can comprehend literature, but thanks any way for the insult.
 
Though I do sincerely appreciate your willingness to summarize it.

I never provided references or infered that I recall, that my statesments were fact.  It is opinion based on history and what I have seen in my lifetime.  I could delve into politics and modern history and give you numerous examples correlating to my reasoning.  This is not the place for it though and I don't want to get into it anyway frankly.  Actually I should have just stayed away from this thread to be honest with you.  That is partly why I was reluctant to give my reasoning earlier.

Now I am not closed minded (at least I don't think so), I am willing to listen to other views and look at facts.  I see you have references to what looks like journals and literature about sexualtiy.  What does sexuality have to do with my argument of society constantly degrading which what you consider as based on informal fallacy.  And by the word degrading I am not talking specificaly about a persons sexual preference.  I am talking about societal standards. 

BTW I was being honest with my comments and not trying to be LOW.

Your surmised that homosexuality would ultimately lead to beastiality.  This was your argument; and it should be apparent that [******]sexuality can be and is attached to social stigma.
You also state that you base your reasoning on what you've seen in your lifetime (anecdotal evidence) and "history."  What history would this be?
I understand that you want to drop this, so I won't post anything else about this particular matter lest you're interested.  I do however believe your sources are inaccurate, fallacious, and invalid.  You cannot form an accurate opinion or properly educate yourself off of such sources.  I just think it would be a good place to start for you to read something that is actually peer-reviewed.  Even high-profiled news articles are crap, reporting 'statistics' of a flawed study.
Feel free to message me for a summary of the meta-analysis if you wish it.

[Onyx Jaguar]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

*EDIT:  Also Asari being monogendered does not change that fact, technically Humans could evolve to be MOnogendered female if survival dictated that making males obselete. 

What is this based on?  You talking about evolution or just sci-fi?

Mainly observed in other species.  Do not have reference of that data, but Females carry all the genetic code needed as well as the facilities to continue reproduction.  It would be unlikely for Humans to do this but not impossible

*Also the point of males is to spread genetic material for varience and is almost a population control for all species, this Monogendered phenomenon is only in extreme cases where it is necessary for survival

Modifié par Onyx Jaguar, 08 mars 2010 - 03:26 .

[Tinnic]

Well my Female Shepard didn't feel disadvantaged. She had Kaiden in ME 1 and Thane in ME 2.



Somewhat off-topic, I am surprised at how many people are equating Jacob's unpopularity with him being black. Don't get me wrong, I totally understand that whenever you have a situation like this, it is hard to tell if or if not race is a factor but most people who don't like Jacob, or in the very least prefer others to him, have given very good reasons as to why they don't like him.



The character of Jacob has issues, especially as a romance. I mean, female Shepard starts flirting with him from the first time you pick the option "I want to talk about you". He shoots you down and is all cold but Female Shepard just comes onto him as if she can't wait to have him! I am sorry but that really bugged me. Especially since my female Shepard was an import from ME1, where she had been in something resembling a relationship with Kaiden. I know it's been two years since Shepard died but that's the point. For Shepard no time has passed really and as such for her, everything would be "recent". I am shocked that Bioware expected me to swallow that female Shepard would start flirting with Jacob straight off the bat like that.



Secondly, Jacob says "Miranda needs a better man then me" at the end of his loyalty mission. That combined with how Miranda looks at him is clear indication that he loves her and would like to be with her. Now you tell me what self-respecting woman would be the consolation prize.



Thirdly, considering that I imported my character from ME1 - I needed a reason to put that photo of Kaiden face down in my cabin. Garrus - it's Garrus! That's reason enough. Thane - tragic hero, short time to live, kind of person who can really understand what Shepard is going through. Jacob - ... a lot of people have been calling him the black Kaiden. I am not going to list all the reasons why that's wrong, I am just going to mention one. Alliance fanboy though Kaiden is, he was genuinely into Shepard in ME 1 and from his email he makes clear that he's still rather into Shepard. Jacob on the other hand clearly isn't.



In short, there are a lot of reasons why Jacob is the least preferred romantic option. Him being black isn't one of them for the majority of the people who don't like him. It certainly wasn't for me.