272 réponses à ce sujet

[Vaenier]

The Angry One wrote...

Vaenier wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Vaenier wrote...

dolphins? they can communicate in a simple manner with us, and use tools for problem solving. Could be horribly wrong and my memory has been messed up about discovery chanel show from several years ago.

Not really. Their "communcation" is open to interpretation. They certainly  do not communicate on our level, with our concepts of logic and such.
Plus they have no grasp of our technology or how to use it.
Moreover (again) we're not out to exterminate them.

We simplfy our communication so they can understand what we want. Soverign probably does the same when talking to Shep. They communicate at the speed of light. We talk much slower. Must be so annoying for robots to communicate with a human, gets really boring waiting for the next word.

Irrelevant. They can still understand us without room for interpretation.
I'll remind you that the Geth have the same capability, but don't look down on organics for lacking that ability, and the Reapers look down on the Geth.

Very true.

Hmm. So the Reapers are so far above communicating at light speed, the idea of talking is torture, and they wish to stop the voices the galaxy produces!... maybe? no?...

[marshalleck]

The Angry One wrote...

 they already have a population that overconsumes an entire galaxy forcing them to hibernate for 50,000 years and they still want more.

Supposition. Present your supporting facts please.

[superimposed]

The reapers harvest the current stock they cultivate by providing it with the technology to advance, at which point they then let the stock replenish itself without damage to the environment. It's sustainable farming.

[Computron2000]

The Angry One wrote...

Computron2000 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...
Here we go again.

1) Chickens aren't sapient creatures, they are animals. 
2) Our society generally looks down on the unecesarry abuse of animals for fun and profit. Reaper society endorses abuse of sapient creatures.

Hmm then what is to say we could not be considered animals, fit only for consumption by a self declared higher lifeform. You do know that the words "Our society" does not represent many countries? Dogs are considered pests in some countries and a consumable meat in korea/china. This is acceptable for their societies but unlikely acceptable for the societies you know.

Because we can communicate with them in a language they understand.
We can use their technology, and make it our own.
Show me a chicken, or a dog, or a primate that can do that and then we'll talk.

So now it is because we can communicate and use their technology, the Reapers should be wrong to think that they are a higher lifeform?

Take for example a an octopus http://www.wired.com.../octopus-tools/
or for a more general view http://www.wired.com...01/animaltools/

Then we have the communication by dogs. I don't think this requires an scientific article. Just ask yourself this question, do you know when your dog is in pain? frightened? happy? Is this non verbal communication?

[Dave the Seagull]

The Angry One wrote...

Computron2000 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Computron2000 wrote...

Dave the Seagull wrote...
Bacteria and Ants never had a Prog Rock period. Therefore they are not higher intelligant life.

So if we say we are higher intelligent life and thus we should not care about other life forms, then if the Reapers say they are a higher intelligent life and thus do not care about pest races like humanity...

Prove that the Reapers are to us what we are to bacteria.

Then i would need to prove what they are thinking. That they consider themselves a higher life form much like we consider ourselves a higher lifeform.

To do so would be easy. Both Sovereign adn Harbinger consistently display attitutes and conversations to such intentions. Since you have played both, you do not seriously require me to find and quote text for you do you?

So what? To a.. member of the National Socialist Worker's Party, a Jew was little more than bacteria.
This did not make them right, or good. It in fact made them evil scum.

GODWINS LAW ALERT!

END THE THREAD! I REPEAT END THE THREAD!

Was a please argueing with you guys.

[The Angry One]

marshalleck wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

 they already have a population that overconsumes an entire galaxy forcing them to hibernate for 50,000 years and they still want more.

Supposition. Present your supporting facts please.

The fact that they require an entire galaxy's worth of species to consume and without this, they must hibernate?
The fact that with a smaller population they could draw this out longer and perhaps not need to consume as much and hibernate so long?

[Vaenier]

When the Reapers hibernate in dark space, do they completely shut down, or do they simply stop ship functions but continue running their minds in some uber matrix style existence?

[marshalleck]

Actually, the thread was Godwinned back on page 3 or 4.

[superimposed]

Stop calling Godwin. The longer a thread continues the probability of someone mentioning Hitler or the Third Reich approaches 1. When it does, you ignore it and move on.

[The Angry One]

superimposed wrote...

The reapers harvest the current stock they cultivate by providing it with the technology to advance, at which point they then let the stock replenish itself without damage to the environment. It's sustainable farming.

Rubbish. They wipe the entire stock out and hope that new stock will arise to replace it in time.
No damage to the enviroment? Yeah, cause planets like Feros are pristine, aren't they?

[superimposed]

The Angry One wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

 they already have a population that overconsumes an entire galaxy forcing them to hibernate for 50,000 years and they still want more.

Supposition. Present your supporting facts please.

The fact that they require an entire galaxy's worth of species to consume and without this, they must hibernate?
The fact that with a smaller population they could draw this out longer and perhaps not need to consume as much and hibernate so long?

Why should they? What exactly says that what they're doing is bad?

[marshalleck]

The Angry One wrote...

The fact that they require an entire galaxy's worth of species to consume and without this, they must hibernate?
The fact that with a smaller population they could draw this out longer and perhaps not need to consume as much and hibernate so long?

This is speculation. I am looking for facts that support your claims. To my knowledge the exact reasons the Reapers do what they do and their total population has yet to be revealed.

[Dave the Seagull]

superimposed wrote...

Stop calling Godwin. The longer a thread continues the probability of someone mentioning Hitler or the Third Reich approaches 1. When it does, you ignore it and move on.

I thought the rule was that once Godwin's law is called, the arguement ends, as it has deteriorated to the point of no return.

And  "stop" calling Godwin? As if I did it every page for the whole thread?

[The Angry One]

Computron2000 wrote...

So now it is because we can communicate and use their technology, the Reapers should be wrong to think that they are a higher lifeform?

Take for example a an octopus http://www.wired.com.../octopus-tools/
or for a more general view http://www.wired.com...01/animaltools/

Then we have the communication by dogs. I don't think this requires an scientific article. Just ask yourself this question, do you know when your dog is in pain? frightened? happy? Is this non verbal communication?

Oh for god's sake. Animals using rudimentary tools is not relevant.
Did they make human-equivalent tools? No. Do they understand our tools? No. Can they build a factory? A house? A dog kennel? No. Can they take our technology and reverse-engineer it? No.
We can do all of that with Reaper tech.

[superimposed]

It happens on almost every thread on this forum. That was a general 'stop calling Godwin' not just you.

[DarthCaine]

How the hell did this thread get to 7th page in less than 2 hours ?

[Onyx Jaguar]

Ah ok, now I see. Carry on. Was getting a little befuddled.

[superimposed]

The Angry One wrote...

Computron2000 wrote...

So now it is because we can communicate and use their technology, the Reapers should be wrong to think that they are a higher lifeform?

Take for example a an octopus http://www.wired.com.../octopus-tools/
or for a more general view http://www.wired.com...01/animaltools/

Then we have the communication by dogs. I don't think this requires an scientific article. Just ask yourself this question, do you know when your dog is in pain? frightened? happy? Is this non verbal communication?

Oh for god's sake. Animals using rudimentary tools is not relevant.
Did they make human-equivalent tools? No. Do they understand our tools? No. Can they build a factory? A house? A dog kennel? No. Can they take our technology and reverse-engineer it? No.
We can do all of that with Reaper tech.

When you say human-equivalent, are we talking the unmnaipulated rocks we used? The stones we threw to frighten off predators? Those were tools used by humans, unshaped and unworked.

[The Angry One]

marshalleck wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The fact that they require an entire galaxy's worth of species to consume and without this, they must hibernate?
The fact that with a smaller population they could draw this out longer and perhaps not need to consume as much and hibernate so long?

This is speculation. I am looking for facts that support your claims. To my knowledge the exact reasons the Reapers do what they do and their total population has yet to be revealed.

That's the evidence we have.
Either they do it because they're a stagnant society that overconsumes itself into hibernation, or they do it for teh lulz.
Either way is evil.

[The Angry One]

superimposed wrote...

When you say human-equivalent, are we talking the unmnaipulated rocks we used? The stones we threw to frighten off predators? Those were tools used by humans, unshaped and unworked.

This argument would be highly relevant if we were cave men.
Seeing as we are in fact a society that split the atom, it is not.

[Dave the Seagull]

superimposed wrote...

It happens on almost every thread on this forum. That was a general 'stop calling Godwin' not just you.

Then perhaps people should actually stop, y'know, comparing things to the NaSos? Just a thought.

Modifié par Dave the Seagull, 06 mars 2010 - 06:59 .

[Vaenier]

The Angry One wrote...

Computron2000 wrote...

So now it is because we can communicate and use their technology, the Reapers should be wrong to think that they are a higher lifeform?

Take for example a an octopus http://www.wired.com.../octopus-tools/
or for a more general view http://www.wired.com...01/animaltools/

Then we have the communication by dogs. I don't think this requires an scientific article. Just ask yourself this question, do you know when your dog is in pain? frightened? happy? Is this non verbal communication?

Oh for god's sake. Animals using rudimentary tools is not relevant.
Did they make human-equivalent tools? No. Do they understand our tools? No. Can they build a factory? A house? A dog kennel? No. Can they take our technology and reverse-engineer it? No.
We can do all of that with Reaper tech.

Thought!: We can do that because they wanted us too. They left the relays and the knowlage of FTL to teach us how to use their tools. Using the thalix cannon thing was not intended, but i dought we could understand it without the basic mass accelerators we already have.

[Computron2000]

The Angry One wrote...

Computron2000 wrote...

Then i would need to prove what they are thinking. That they consider themselves a higher life form much like we consider ourselves a higher lifeform.

To do so would be easy. Both Sovereign adn Harbinger consistently display attitutes and conversations to such intentions. Since you have played both, you do not seriously require me to find and quote text for you do you?

So what? To a.. member of the National Socialist Worker's Party, a Jew was little more than bacteria.
This did not make them right, or good. It in fact made them evil scum.

Then we are back to the original premise (while ignoring the higher lifeform discussion). Do the National Socialist Worker's Party people consider themselves evil?

[marshalleck]

The Angry One wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

The fact that they require an entire galaxy's worth of species to consume and without this, they must hibernate?
The fact that with a smaller population they could draw this out longer and perhaps not need to consume as much and hibernate so long?

This is speculation. I am looking for facts that support your claims. To my knowledge the exact reasons the Reapers do what they do and their total population has yet to be revealed.

That's the evidence we have.
Either they do it because they're a stagnant society that overconsumes itself into hibernation, or they do it for teh lulz.
Either way is evil.

No, you're making inferences from what little we know. You're guessing at their motives.

[The Angry One]

Vaenier wrote...

Thought!: We can do that because they wanted us too. They left the relays and the knowlage of FTL to teach us how to use their tools. Using the thalix cannon thing was not intended, but i dought we could understand it without the basic mass accelerators we already have.

And what about all the tech before mass relays? Like the tech we have now? We did that on our own.
Furthermore the fact that they wanted us to have mass relays is irrelevant since most of the species in the game reverse-engineered it on their own, not counting uplifted species.

You can dump a nuclear reactor in the middle of a pack of gorillas and I'm telling you right now they're not making nuclear submarines any time soon.