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No US, no Romance in Awakening: Which stage are you at?


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#101
Bratt1204

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MaxQuartiroli wrote...

shedevil3001 wrote...

i was dissapointed but the fact that bioware said the romances havent ended they are just put on hold as they are trying to tell a new story that needed more attention gives me a bit of hope that my fhn hasnt seen the end of her true love alistair and that it will be picked back up on in another expansion hopefully it still bothers me a bit that he wont be at my side though but i will see how things go in awakening before i say anything bad about it if its not explained well


shedevil...

putting old romances on "hold" is just a sweet lie... 
If they didn't reconnect the romance, this time they will never do it on a future.. Maybe they will do new romances for new characters but I believe we should forget our old romances...
Stop dreaming, because it's obvious that they won't reconnect old romances in an xpac. even in a future, because in order to do this there would be a lot of work they are unable to put into an expansion pack... this is sad but true...
And a sequel will probably have a new story with a new character.. therefore I believe we have 0% possibility to see again in a future game our DA:O romances...


Exactly what I suspect.

#102
Bratt1204

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shedevil3001 wrote...

its worse having your betrothed there and not been able to even romance them i mean come on in real life the 1 you love right in front of you and you arent all over them your like erm buisness comes first. I dont think so!


I completely agree. If this is how Awakening is going to play-out for HNFs (or HNM) who chose this ending for their PC, it will just be the worst possible scenario. If this will be the case, I still cannot understand why Bioware would waste their time with a 'marriage' (become Queen/Prince) storyline for the HN if it goes nowhere in the expansions. Why even bother with it? They should have then just kept it as the other romances were; they are far easier to explain away. In my opinion, the HN storyline begins an entire new chapter for them at the end of Origins, at least that is how I feel. If Alistair (or Anora) were not present in Awakening, then there would be no issue with it, I suppose. Having your significant other there as your spouse or betrothed and not being able to interact with them accordingly is just utter nonsense. in Origins, you spend an entire year with Alistair through all the trials and tribulations associated with the Blight, fall in love and become engaged/married. Then Awakening comes and your interactions with Alistair are only on a platonic basis? This makes no sense whatsoever. My husband and I act affectionally toward each other no matter the situation - business or other. I always sneak a quick kiss when I go into his office to see him; this is just normal behavior. To act indifferently toward your significant other is abnormal and unnatural.

#103
shedevil3001

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exactly thats the thing i find most frustrating with awakening but i still have to play it to find out exactly what happens to my heart felt storyline if its bad then i just delete my save and play as another character that didnt stay with alistair see how that plays out. Its a good job i made alot of characters

#104
Ilmthara

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I also agree with Bratt1204. And about the stages, I'm still somewhere between Denial and Anger, I can't believe Bioware would leave the romance option out of the game, especially cause at least for me it really adds to the emotional level of the game. It's cool that you get to converse with your party members and become friends with them and gain influence...in which case, I don't see why on earth you couldn't romance them too. Surely it wouldn't have been such a big deal for them to write a couple of storylines including the romance option, or at least some heavy flirting and bedding your companions.



And the thing they said about Awakening being more about duty and business, well, wasn't Origins any different? Come one, there was a world to be saved and a Blight to be handled, but the main character still had time to build a romance. At least I hope there will be a chance to flirt etc. with NPC's in Awakening, cause otherwise it's just unrealistic and silly, all the characters are adults, are they expecting them to just be all 100% duty-oriented and asexual and inito platonic friendships when they could die the next day?



Yeah, it'll be long way into Acceptance...but I admit, I'm still dying to get that game into my hands and play it through.

#105
Aybeden

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Having said previously I thought I'd (sort of) reached a level of acceptance, in fact don't think I have fully other than recognising what we are getting. I still find myself feeling disappointed at what is being left out of Awakenings and a bit annoyed that they e.g. aren't providing some real accommodation for scenarios that actually fit into the Awakenings story. Like Wournos with his dwarf, I want my human male to explore Awakenings with Leliana; after all, that's in the epilogue.  Frankly, I'm not yet sure if I will want to play an expansion which is linked to but waters down the Origins experience.

However, I'm still having a blast playing Origins. It's a great game.  I still have a number of scenarios to act out with other (unfinished) characters and I've already started a new warden to repeat exactly the story of my main one and eventually replace him. The reason is to use the experience from the first to build a stronger character and then park him up, just in case there will be a future opportunity to continue the story of him and his companion. That will give me plenty of time to read any feedback from other people's experience of playing Awakenings and finally make up my mind whether to get it.

Incidentally, by chance I came across a couple of interviews with Ray Muzyka, chief of BW, about what they were trying to achieve with their games.  One is with Virgin in September and the other is with VideoGamer in November. They both say a lot about BWs vision at the time and are an informative read.

Here are a couple of small snippets, one from each:

"...the harder (emotions) to achieve are fondness, regret, sadness, genuine feeling that a romance is actually real. We're getting close to it but we're not quite there. But we're going to reach that point and break through it, like movies have. Movies have broken through that, but they've had a hundred years to develop their craft. Video games have had about 30 now, and the best is still to come."

"We're trying for emotional engagement. Moment to moment, and also on a grander level, we're trying to make the players feel their choices matter. Ideally they're going to care about the companions they bring alongside them, or dislike them for that matter. They're both equally valid expressions of emotion. You can like or dislike, but so long as you're feeling something for the companions you bring alongside you, then we're winning in a sense. We're compelling a reaction that is rewarding to the players, where they can feel like, yeah, I'm getting something back from this game. It's more than playing through a series of dialogue options and choices. It's more about, I'm starting to care about these characters or dislike them more, to feel something. It's hard, but when you achieve it it's rewarding."

I think they have made some good progress in those directions with Origins. I'm not sure if Awakenings is going to sufficiently maintain that momentum.

The full interviews are here:
http://videogames.vi...ray_muzyka.html
http://www.videogame...ray_muzyka.html

P.S. Reading those interviews makes me think it will be likely that DA2 will continue to take forward Muzyka's vision, and at least as that is to be the next major game in the story, it's more likely the necessary development time and money will be invested.

Modifié par Aybeden, 08 mars 2010 - 05:35 .


#106
Guest_Eli-da-Mage_*

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I dont need romance. Theres a mod being worked on by my friend that makes Loghain a companion again but is also retarded and talks in a stupid voice. I loled hard at the test on origins they done. Sorry if this post offends anyone with the retarded thing but its true. It will be avaliable on filefront after Awakening is released and they have time to tweak the compatibility.

#107
SurelyForth

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Ilmthara wrote...

And the thing they said about Awakening being more about duty and business, well, wasn't Origins any different? Come one, there was a world to be saved and a Blight to be handled, but the main character still had time to build a romance. At least I hope there will be a chance to flirt etc. with NPC's in Awakening, cause otherwise it's just unrealistic and silly, all the characters are adults, are they expecting them to just be all 100% duty-oriented and asexual and inito platonic friendships when they could die the next day?


Origins was different because you were basically acting in a fairly unofficial capacity. In Awakening, you're the Commander of a force of elite warriors and ranking officers really should not be going around wooing their subordinates.

As for King Alistair/female PC in a relationship with Alistair- I think a shift in their public dynamic should be expected. I doubt he'll treat any PC with indifference, you were his fellow Warden after all, but I think it would be weird for him to be super openly affectionate since you're both in positions of power.

#108
J-Reyno

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Multiple stages. Can't say I'm not a little upset and a little disappointed from the things that I hear, but I've also accepted that this is the way it is. Truthfully I think (and hope) that I'll get over it once I play the game and realize how silly I was for being at all disappointed. I just really hope that there is a lot to explore in the companions, because to me they were half the fun of the game. Without a doubt the most loved characters in Origins were the romanceable ones, so I'm wondering if any of the characters in Awakening will be able to live up to the standards of Alistair, Morrgan, Lel, and Zev. That they won't is my greatest fear.

I'm not even going to get started on the US thing. If my main gets a good playthrough out of Awakening, I will happily overlook it.

Modifié par Reyno411, 08 mars 2010 - 05:14 .


#109
Ilmthara

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SurelyForth wrote...

Origins was different because you were basically acting in a fairly unofficial capacity. In Awakening, you're the Commander of a force of elite warriors and ranking officers really should not be going around wooing their subordinates.


True, but they still could have written in some character(s) in a position to romance the PC. My point probably is that they *could* have found a way to include a romance, they just *didn't*. And that's what disappoints me. But I'll try to get over it :)

#110
Vim

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SurelyForth wrote...

Ilmthara wrote...

And the thing they said about Awakening being more about duty and business, well, wasn't Origins any different? Come one, there was a world to be saved and a Blight to be handled, but the main character still had time to build a romance. At least I hope there will be a chance to flirt etc. with NPC's in Awakening, cause otherwise it's just unrealistic and silly, all the characters are adults, are they expecting them to just be all 100% duty-oriented and asexual and inito platonic friendships when they could die the next day?


Origins was different because you were basically acting in a fairly unofficial capacity. In Awakening, you're the Commander of a force of elite warriors and ranking officers really should not be going around wooing their subordinates.


*cough* mass effect  *cough*  ashley *cough*

I seem to have something caught in my throat... ;)

As for King Alistair/female PC in a relationship with Alistair- I think a shift in their public dynamic should be expected. I doubt he'll treat any PC with indifference, you were his fellow Warden after all, but I think it would be weird for him to be super openly affectionate since you're both in positions of power.


In public yes, but not every moment should be in front of a large crowd of people.  And I don't see why power and affection need be mutually exclusive.  It may not be of interest to you, but believe it or not, for more than a few players, the emotional connection formed with your in-game love interest is an important aspect of the role-play.

#111
SurelyForth

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Vim wrote...

As for King Alistair/female PC in a relationship with Alistair- I think a shift in their public dynamic should be expected. I doubt he'll treat any PC with indifference, you were his fellow Warden after all, but I think it would be weird for him to be super openly affectionate since you're both in positions of power.


In public yes, but not every moment should be in front of a large crowd of people.  And I don't see why power and affection need be mutually exclusive.  It may not be of interest to you, but believe it or not, for more than a few players, the emotional connection formed with your in-game love interest is an important aspect of the role-play.


I am very interested in the private moments and emotional connections that any of my PC's might have with their romantic partners, but I don't think the scope of Awakening can do that justice without it being unfair to those who romanced anyone other than Alistair (since he's the only romance option who gets any face time, right?). I would be pretty peeved if my HN who is in a romance with Alistair got a chance to fool around while my mage who is with Leliana doesn't even get to see her (very devoted) girlfriend.

Obviously, I'm at "Acceptance".

#112
Lady Jess

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I
think it would be weird for him to be super openly affectionate since
you're both in positions of power.


Except that it's stated in the epilogue that the people liked how he doted on his new queen (yes it said queen for that slide).

#113
SurelyForth

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Lady Jess wrote...

I
think it would be weird for him to be super openly affectionate since
you're both in positions of power.


Except that it's stated in the epilogue that the people liked how he doted on his new queen (yes it said queen for that slide).


I just finished a HNF game last night and I could have sworn it said new bride and not new queen.

Anyway, there's still a difference between how you can interact when you're doing something like touring (which is basically PR) and how you should behave when you're acting in your roles as military leaders.

Modifié par SurelyForth, 08 mars 2010 - 07:20 .


#114
errant_knight

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SurelyForth wrote...

Vim wrote...

As for King Alistair/female PC in a relationship with Alistair- I think a shift in their public dynamic should be expected. I doubt he'll treat any PC with indifference, you were his fellow Warden after all, but I think it would be weird for him to be super openly affectionate since you're both in positions of power.


In public yes, but not every moment should be in front of a large crowd of people.  And I don't see why power and affection need be mutually exclusive.  It may not be of interest to you, but believe it or not, for more than a few players, the emotional connection formed with your in-game love interest is an important aspect of the role-play.


I am very interested in the private moments and emotional connections that any of my PC's might have with their romantic partners, but I don't think the scope of Awakening can do that justice without it being unfair to those who romanced anyone other than Alistair (since he's the only romance option who gets any face time, right?). I would be pretty peeved if my HN who is in a romance with Alistair got a chance to fool around while my mage who is with Leliana doesn't even get to see her (very devoted) girlfriend.

Obviously, I'm at "Acceptance".

Yep, it's the only way to keep the playing field even. While I've only ever romanced Alistair, I'll completely understand if the specific relationship that my PC has with him is downplayed, or absent entirely. At most, there'll be a 'don't get killed, 'kay, honey?' line, but that depends on how the import is done.

#115
dudcog

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I'm at stage 5, I was just worried that no romance options meant not so much banter.

As long as I can still see Alistair sometimes.

*Pouts*

#116
Ronnan

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I'm just gonna throw this out there:



Who says this is the only expansion pack?



I mean, who says there won't be yet another one, to complete this character's story?



Hasn't Bioware said they have a 2 year plan with this game, involving expansions and DLCs? And it's been what? Four months?



Relax.

#117
Crazy_Cat_Lady

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It seems like more people are angry at the "no romance" than Bioware making the US irrelevant. After reading some of the previews and watching that demo video on xfire, I can see why they didn't include romances in Awakening. Looks like you'll be pretty busy in Awakening, including being embroiled in politics now that you're basically an Arl as well as a Warden Commander. Now, just because there's no romance doesn't mean there couldn't be any extra interaction/dialogue between you and your significant other from Origins. Looks like it'll probably be like it was in ME2 (some extra dialogue/text/or a kiss) but that's it.



I am more upset as to how Bioware has handled the US. They might as well change that achievement to TI (Totally Irrelevant). Because that's what it is. Totally irrelevant since you are able to import your MC even if you did the US. To me that defeats the whole purpose of making that choice. Why even have us make the choice if we can still import that character into Awakening? Since Awakening is being released so soon after Origins I don't have too much of a problem with it, but I will be upset if DA2 allows you to import your MC even if you did the US.



That choice isn't suppose to be easy, so please Bioware don't give into whiny gamers who want to be able to have their cake and eat it too.

#118
Valmy

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Never was at any other stage but acceptance. I know David Gaider will do me right.

#119
Crazy_Cat_Lady

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Ronnan wrote...

I'm just gonna throw this out there:

Who says this is the only expansion pack?

I mean, who says there won't be yet another one, to complete this character's story?

Hasn't Bioware said they have a 2 year plan with this game, involving expansions and DLCs? And it's been what? Four months?

Relax.


Agreed.  Disappointed with the no romance and making US irrelevant but I'll wait to reserve judgment until a full sequel is released.  They made Awakening a very focused expansion on purpose.

#120
SurelyForth

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Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

I am more upset as to how Bioware has handled the US. They might as well change that achievement to TI (Totally Irrelevant). Because that's what it is. Totally irrelevant since you are able to import your MC even if you did the US. To me that defeats the whole purpose of making that choice. Why even have us make the choice if we can still import that character into Awakening? Since Awakening is being released so soon after Origins I don't have too much of a problem with it, but I will be upset if DA2 allows you to import your MC even if you did the US.

That choice isn't suppose to be easy, so please Bioware don't give into whiny gamers who want to be able to have their cake and eat it too.


Well, to the tons of people who played Origins who will probably never buy an expansion, the US is a viable ending to their character (if they went that route). It's also a viable ending to all those who won't import their US character. 

And even without the BW utility to do so, if anyone wanted to import a character they sacrificed they could still just go back and redo Redcliffe on and take the DR instead. It's pretty much the same idea as importing your dead Warden, it's just less work for the player.

#121
Allison W

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Bargaining.

Next expansion better let me romance Sigrun and/or Mhairi. Badass ex-military women and no romance options is just too cruel.

That said...

As far as romantic partners appearing, you'd think Leliana and Zevran would be perfect to make a return, because it's not like they have other pressing matters and are well-suited to helping the Warden with their new career in politics, up to and including ferreting out and spying on threats and returning with a full report and/or a head, even if they don't actually join the party. You'd think that would be right up their alley, to the point that even if including them would be a challenge, not including them is just a crying shame (even if they don't get a cameo, I hope we're given a very good explanation as to what they're doing to help Ferelden/the Warden(s) instead of coming to Amaranthine).

Also the problem with the way they're handling the US ending is not that you can choose to retcon it and import your sacrificed Warden, as some suggest. It's that you can't choose to import your character's choices and history while making a new Orlesian Warden, which is bad, Bad, BAD. This was a serious, egregious ball-drop, and one that does demand more criticism than it gets. It is a basic necessity for continuity.

With the price tag on the expansion, I'd rather have them push back the release date and include the things necessary to keep the player's continuity, not just get it out on time while leaving necessary things on the cutting-room floor. Leaving out the romances and returning companions, for all I'd like to see Leliana return or be able to romance the new ex-military gals, is a disappointment but ultimately acceptable. Failing to properly support the US just isn't.

I'm hoping it was the decision of the marketing department to force this out essentially incomplete, not the devs. I'd hate to think the devs themselves would show so much disregard for the US.

Modifié par Allison W, 08 mars 2010 - 08:43 .


#122
Bratt1204

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Vim wrote...

SurelyForth wrote...

Ilmthara wrote...

And the thing they said about Awakening being more about duty and business, well, wasn't Origins any different? Come one, there was a world to be saved and a Blight to be handled, but the main character still had time to build a romance. At least I hope there will be a chance to flirt etc. with NPC's in Awakening, cause otherwise it's just unrealistic and silly, all the characters are adults, are they expecting them to just be all 100% duty-oriented and asexual and inito platonic friendships when they could die the next day?


Origins was different because you were basically acting in a fairly unofficial capacity. In Awakening, you're the Commander of a force of elite warriors and ranking officers really should not be going around wooing their subordinates.


*cough* mass effect  *cough*  ashley *cough*

I seem to have something caught in my throat... ;)

As for King Alistair/female PC in a relationship with Alistair- I think a shift in their public dynamic should be expected. I doubt he'll treat any PC with indifference, you were his fellow Warden after all, but I think it would be weird for him to be super openly affectionate since you're both in positions of power.


In public yes, but not every moment should be in front of a large crowd of people.  And I don't see why power and affection need be mutually exclusive.  It may not be of interest to you, but believe it or not, for more than a few players, the emotional connection formed with your in-game love interest is an important aspect of the role-play.


Completely agree.

#123
Bratt1204

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Lady Jess wrote...

I
think it would be weird for him to be super openly affectionate since
you're both in positions of power.


Except that it's stated in the epilogue that the people liked how he doted on his new queen (yes it said queen for that slide).


Correct - and (paraphrased) ...'showed all of Ferelden how much he loved his new Queen'.

#124
LyonVanguard

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Oh GREAT. No virtual SEX? the sucks. Lol, seriously? I couldn't care less.

I knew awakening was going to be a crappy expansion from the beginning. ; )

#125
wcholcombe

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Stage 0: I couldn't care less, Romance didn't make Origins, and US is in the game to my satisfaction.