156 réponses à ce sujet

[Crazy_Cat_Lady]

SurelyForth wrote...

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

I am more upset as to how Bioware has handled the US. They might as well change that achievement to TI (Totally Irrelevant). Because that's what it is. Totally irrelevant since you are able to import your MC even if you did the US. To me that defeats the whole purpose of making that choice. Why even have us make the choice if we can still import that character into Awakening? Since Awakening is being released so soon after Origins I don't have too much of a problem with it, but I will be upset if DA2 allows you to import your MC even if you did the US.

That choice isn't suppose to be easy, so please Bioware don't give into whiny gamers who want to be able to have their cake and eat it too.

Well, to the tons of people who played Origins who will probably never buy an expansion, the US is a viable ending to their character (if they went that route). It's also a viable ending to all those who won't import their US character. 

And even without the BW utility to do so, if anyone wanted to import a character they sacrificed they could still just go back and redo Redcliffe on and take the DR instead. It's pretty much the same idea as importing your dead Warden, it's just less work for the player.

If people want to go back and do the DR and live with the consequences of that, be my guest.  But by being able to import a character that did the US, it cheapens the dilemma of the situation.  If players want to end their character with the US, then fine do that.  I just have a problem with people who ended DA:O with the US and expect to be able to import that character into the expansion or sequels.

[wcholcombe]

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

SurelyForth wrote...

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

I am more upset as to how Bioware has handled the US. They might as well change that achievement to TI (Totally Irrelevant). Because that's what it is. Totally irrelevant since you are able to import your MC even if you did the US. To me that defeats the whole purpose of making that choice. Why even have us make the choice if we can still import that character into Awakening? Since Awakening is being released so soon after Origins I don't have too much of a problem with it, but I will be upset if DA2 allows you to import your MC even if you did the US.

That choice isn't suppose to be easy, so please Bioware don't give into whiny gamers who want to be able to have their cake and eat it too.

Well, to the tons of people who played Origins who will probably never buy an expansion, the US is a viable ending to their character (if they went that route). It's also a viable ending to all those who won't import their US character. 

And even without the BW utility to do so, if anyone wanted to import a character they sacrificed they could still just go back and redo Redcliffe on and take the DR instead. It's pretty much the same idea as importing your dead Warden, it's just less work for the player.

If people want to go back and do the DR and live with the consequences of that, be my guest.  But by being able to import a character that did the US, it cheapens the dilemma of the situation.  If players want to end their character with the US, then fine do that.  I just have a problem with people who ended DA:O with the US and expect to be able to import that character into the expansion or sequels.

Maybe because it is a game and nothing to take anywhere near as serious as you seem to have done....

[Taritu]

The handling of the US is lame. That was my official ending. I don't want to ressurect her, I'd be happy to play the Orlesian, but I do want her choices to matter.



As for romances, I'm cool with their not being a new one, but in the case of both Zevran and Leiliana there is no question in my mind (especially with Zevran) that they would fight by your side against a new threat, especially since various endings talk about them helping you rebuild the Wardens. Zevran is very explicit about "storming the Black City", it is not believable he wouldn't want to be with you. Perhaps they come up with a good explanation for it, but it smells pretty damn lame.



That said, whatevah. We'll see. I'm not that excited for this and never was. ME2, though I like it, has made me suspcicious of Bioware's ability to manage continuity in any meaningful and common sensical fashion.

[Ariella]

Taritu wrote...

That said, whatevah. We'll see. I'm not that excited for this and never was. ME2, though I like it, has made me suspcicious of Bioware's ability to manage continuity in any meaningful and common sensical fashion.

Considering BW has been doing continuity since BEFORE Mass Effect, I have to wonder why one game would do such a thing to put you off (hell handling of all the OUTSIDE continuity of Kotor shows they can manage it...)

Honestly, I think all the complaints about the sacrifice are a bit silly. It's an option that you do not have to take. It is there for those who choose to do so rather than having to reload the game and things over again. It's a nice little time saver. But for those who choose to have the US their "official ending", they have other options 1) a game where they DIDN'T choose that or  2) playing the Orlesian Warden.

And while I regret that the romances aren't going to be at the forefront this time, I do remember seeing that they will not be ignored.

[SurelyForth]

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

If people want to go back and do the DR and live with the consequences of that, be my guest.  But by being able to import a character that did the US, it cheapens the dilemma of the situation.  If players want to end their character with the US, then fine do that.  I just have a problem with people who ended DA:O with the US and expect to be able to import that character into the expansion or sequels.

The situation is already "cheapened" by Origins itself- you can totally do the US, unlock the achievement, and then run back to Redcliffe, do the ritual, and live. I've done it three times myself. Does that lessen the emotional impact your US has on you? No, it doesn't. Short of nuking all saves the moment you chop off the Archdemon's head, there's always going to be an option to undo the US, even without sequels or expansions.

I can see being frustrated that you can't import a world state into Awakening and play an Orlesian Warden, but I really don't see how something that is entirely optional to the individual player can make or break your enjoyment of the game.

[Crazy_Cat_Lady]

SurelyForth wrote...

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

If people want to go back and do the DR and live with the consequences of that, be my guest.  But by being able to import a character that did the US, it cheapens the dilemma of the situation.  If players want to end their character with the US, then fine do that.  I just have a problem with people who ended DA:O with the US and expect to be able to import that character into the expansion or sequels.

The situation is already "cheapened" by Origins itself- you can totally do the US, unlock the achievement, and then run back to Redcliffe, do the ritual, and live. I've done it three times myself. Does that lessen the emotional impact your US has on you? No, it doesn't. Short of nuking all saves the moment you chop off the Archdemon's head, there's always going to be an option to undo the US, even without sequels or expansions.

I can see being frustrated that you can't import a world state into Awakening and play an Orlesian Warden, but I really don't see how something that is entirely optional to the individual player can make or break your enjoyment of the game.

Because if you go back and do the DR, and import that save file you will have to deal with the consequences of that choice.  But if you do the US and can still import that save, then there are basically no consequences of your actions.  I was happy to hear that Bioware has decided that those people who let their Shepard get killed at the end of ME2 won't be able to import that save to ME3.  There should always be consequences of your actions.  If you did the US, then you shouldn't be able to use that character moving forward.  Either use one that you did the DR with or use the Orlesian Grey Warden.

[Allison W]

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

Because if you go back and do the DR, and import that save file you will have to deal with the consequences of that choice.  But if you do the US and can still import that save, then there are basically no consequences of your actions.  I was happy to hear that Bioware has decided that those people who let their Shepard get killed at the end of ME2 won't be able to import that save to ME3.  There should always be consequences of your actions.  If you did the US, then you shouldn't be able to use that character moving forward.  Either use one that you did the DR with or use the Orlesian Grey Warden.

That's the idea. The problem is that you can't import the choices you made in a US game while starting Awakening with an Orlesian Warden--you can resurrect your character to keep playing their story, or you can play a different Warden in a completely different continuity that doesn't take into account how your character affected Ferelden beyond "ended the Blight, lol."

There's no way in which you can make the US, then continue forward with a new Warden in a continuity in which your deceased Warden's legacy survives them, and that is the entire problem.

Modifié par Allison W, 08 mars 2010 - 09:45 .

[SurelyForth]

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

Because if you go back and do the DR, and import that save file you will have to deal with the consequences of that choice.  But if you do the US and can still import that save, then there are basically no consequences of your actions.  I was happy to hear that Bioware has decided that those people who let their Shepard get killed at the end of ME2 won't be able to import that save to ME3.  There should always be consequences of your actions.  If you did the US, then you shouldn't be able to use that character moving forward.  Either use one that you did the DR with or use the Orlesian Grey Warden.

I'm pretty certain that, for US characters imported into Awakening, the DR will become their canon and they will have to deal with those repercussions as if they had made that choice all along. So they don't get off free and easy.

[ankuu]

While some don't agree to import the dead Warden think of those who do want to. You spend a lot of time making the world around him/her, you get attached. Maybe you still want to go foward with that character as starting a new one takes some time especially if you want it to have all the old quests done and gear etc.



And the US does make a difference for those who won't buy the expansion or won't import. It would be hard to implement the old dead Warden's chioces into the other one's head...It's just an expansion. Maybe in the sequel it will be different.

[Allison W]

This is assuming the sequel imports DA1 characters/continuities at all.

[Crazy_Cat_Lady]

Allison W wrote...

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

Because if you go back and do the DR, and import that save file you will have to deal with the consequences of that choice.  But if you do the US and can still import that save, then there are basically no consequences of your actions.  I was happy to hear that Bioware has decided that those people who let their Shepard get killed at the end of ME2 won't be able to import that save to ME3.  There should always be consequences of your actions.  If you did the US, then you shouldn't be able to use that character moving forward.  Either use one that you did the DR with or use the Orlesian Grey Warden.

That's the idea. The problem is that you can't import the choices you made in a US game while starting Awakening with an Orlesian Warden--you can resurrect your character to keep playing their story, or you can play a different Warden in a completely different continuity that doesn't take into account how your character affected Ferelden beyond "ended the Blight, lol."

There's no way in which you can make the US, then continue forward with a new Warden in a continuity in which your deceased Warden's legacy survives them, and that is the entire problem.

I see your point.  Perhaps they could make it so you could import your choices but not the character?  They'd just give you the Orlesian Grey Warden, but the world would still be affected by your character's decisions in DA:O.

[Allison W]

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

Allison W wrote...

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

Because if you go back and do the DR, and import that save file you will have to deal with the consequences of that choice.  But if you do the US and can still import that save, then there are basically no consequences of your actions.  I was happy to hear that Bioware has decided that those people who let their Shepard get killed at the end of ME2 won't be able to import that save to ME3.  There should always be consequences of your actions.  If you did the US, then you shouldn't be able to use that character moving forward.  Either use one that you did the DR with or use the Orlesian Grey Warden.

That's the idea. The problem is that you can't import the choices you made in a US game while starting Awakening with an Orlesian Warden--you can resurrect your character to keep playing their story, or you can play a different Warden in a completely different continuity that doesn't take into account how your character affected Ferelden beyond "ended the Blight, lol."

There's no way in which you can make the US, then continue forward with a new Warden in a continuity in which your deceased Warden's legacy survives them, and that is the entire problem.

I see your point.  Perhaps they could make it so you could import your choices but not the character?  They'd just give you the Orlesian Grey Warden, but the world would still be affected by your character's decisions in DA:O.

Yes. That is exactly what is needed to really call the expansion a "finished product" and not something rolled out incomplete, but BioWare staff have already said that feature won't be implemented.

[cbtiff]

Why not just load your character even if she/he died and just throw it to "Maker did preserve me! Haha!". Its a game. I have no problem with it.



I am however disappointed that their won't be anymore love interest going on. I really enjoyed how well the developers/writers did that. But, I imagine they will make this just as wonderful as Origins. So I won't complain... too much.



I am drooling at the thought of how fun its going to be loading my character into Awakening (I'm selfish and refuse to make the ultimate sacrifice. I like life-my life-too much.)

[Veritable Sage]

I loved DAO's downtime at Party Camp . . .and, yes, the pursuit of a romance. It was like a story running under and yet within the main quest line. I'm surprised and somewhat disappointed that Bioware has chosen to remove the romance option. It gave an already awesome game that touch of want/need that we experience in real life. I've purchased the expansion, but hope future expansions will include romance options. It's part of what made the game so great, after all.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

I could care less about the romances or DLC not being active in Awakenings. So long as they get honorable mention.



However, if the Pearl or similar establishment is absent from the expansion, I shall be very, very angry.................

[this isnt my name]

dissapointed about the US ending, this reminds me to much of fallout 3s broken steel, I hated it, so I am concearned that they are tampering with the ending making it meaningless, I gave morrigan a demon child for this just to say "Dont worry you live anyway" I could have just had her as an LI and kept it as a normal non evil god child instead, well atleast I my get a fun quest in future games.

[Aybeden]

Veritable Sage wrote...

I loved DAO's downtime at Party Camp . . .and, yes, the pursuit of a romance. It was like a story running under and yet within the main quest line. I'm surprised and somewhat disappointed that Bioware has chosen to remove the romance option. It gave an already awesome game that touch of want/need that we experience in real life. I've purchased the expansion, but hope future expansions will include romance options. It's part of what made the game so great, after all.

One of the things I find very odd about that decision is that if you read the interviews with the boss of BW - via the links I posted in my post on page 5 of this thread - it is clear that continuing and expanding those features were very much part of his vision for the future of BW games.

Modifié par Aybeden, 09 mars 2010 - 12:46 .

[YuniSticksitDeep]

No sex no romance, did Fox News buy Bioware?



I for one will boycott a game that divests itself from what i have come to expect in Bioware Game.



It is NOT too late to F I X this. post a poll, make it visable ask if they want romance...the hom. er soules...er people who are afraid of sex in games can speak up toooo!!!





I won't play a bioware game without love in it.



PERIOD.



gotta run, Jack need a new tattoo.





PS I am the ONLY one with a a Pair? GODS people show some back bone. (no offense to the spineless).



Yuni.

[cbtiff]

YuniSticksitDeep wrote...

No sex no romance, did Fox News buy Bioware?

I for one will boycott a game that divests itself from what i have come to expect in Bioware Game.

It is NOT too late to F I X this. post a poll, make it visable ask if they want romance...the hom. er soules...er people who are afraid of sex in games can speak up toooo!!!


I won't play a bioware game without love in it.

PERIOD.

gotta run, Jack need a new tattoo.


PS I am the ONLY one with a a Pair? GODS people show some back bone. (no offense to the spineless).

Yuni.

Oh yes, ranting and raving on the interwebs... thats how you show 'em what yer made of....<_<




I love what Bio does with
their story lines, I love having access to my other characters
and to develop with them. But, this is an expansion. A continuation
of the story, and they must have something very specific they want to
share with us and didn't feel that having more steamy love scenes was
the way to go.



And it is a little late considering the
expansion comes out in only a few days. Making new codes, cut-scenes,
getting all the voice actors back in for another round, then adding
it into the whole of the game and then running it to the testers to
make sure it all works.... could actually takes months to do.



Course, personally I will wait and play
the game and if it does seem lacking then I will ask Bio to consider
giving us a DLC where we could explore that realm once more.:innocent:

[Feraele]

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

SurelyForth wrote...

Crazy_Cat_Lady wrote...

I am more upset as to how Bioware has handled the US. They might as well change that achievement to TI (Totally Irrelevant). Because that's what it is. Totally irrelevant since you are able to import your MC even if you did the US. To me that defeats the whole purpose of making that choice. Why even have us make the choice if we can still import that character into Awakening? Since Awakening is being released so soon after Origins I don't have too much of a problem with it, but I will be upset if DA2 allows you to import your MC even if you did the US.

That choice isn't suppose to be easy, so please Bioware don't give into whiny gamers who want to be able to have their cake and eat it too.

Well, to the tons of people who played Origins who will probably never buy an expansion, the US is a viable ending to their character (if they went that route). It's also a viable ending to all those who won't import their US character. 

And even without the BW utility to do so, if anyone wanted to import a character they sacrificed they could still just go back and redo Redcliffe on and take the DR instead. It's pretty much the same idea as importing your dead Warden, it's just less work for the player.

If people want to go back and do the DR and live with the consequences of that, be my guest.  But by being able to import a character that did the US, it cheapens the dilemma of the situation.  If players want to end their character with the US, then fine do that.  I just have a problem with people who ended DA:O with the US and expect to be able to import that character into the expansion or sequels.

You shouldn't have a problem with people who want to import their dead character and make them walk around again......BIOWARE has stated they are allowing this.

What they aren't allowing..is the torch to be passed to the Orlesian warden.   In other words no prior history of that dramatic and heroic ending.    Its done over and the Archdemon obviously didn't die after all.

Those that play once ...and did the US ending, CAN play their dead character, that was announced over a month ago.

Other players who want their dead warden to remain dead, want the option of also importing ..but leaving dead and a small conversation or "something" that gives credit to the warden for doing what he/she is supposed to do.

But that is not going to happen....probably never.   That particular ending should never have been made part of the story ..is how I see it.   Bioware can't get the "technical end" of it together...or something like that..so not gonna happen.

Don't expect to see a statue honouring your dead warden (this is actually talked about in the aftermath ..with Alistair standing over your dead body making a speech..at least in my ending)

Don't expect to hear mention of your dead warden's heroics, any time, any where.    Thats how it is.

[Feraele]

cbtiff wrote...

YuniSticksitDeep wrote...

No sex no romance, did Fox News buy Bioware?

I for one will boycott a game that divests itself from what i have come to expect in Bioware Game.

It is NOT too late to F I X this. post a poll, make it visable ask if they want romance...the hom. er soules...er people who are afraid of sex in games can speak up toooo!!!


I won't play a bioware game without love in it.

PERIOD.

gotta run, Jack need a new tattoo.


PS I am the ONLY one with a a Pair? GODS people show some back bone. (no offense to the spineless).

Yuni.

Oh yes, ranting and raving on the interwebs... thats how you show 'em what yer made of....<_<




I love what Bio does with
their story lines, I love having access to my other characters
and to develop with them. But, this is an expansion. A continuation
of the story, and they must have something very specific they want to
share with us and didn't feel that having more steamy love scenes was
the way to go.



And it is a little late considering the
expansion comes out in only a few days. Making new codes, cut-scenes,
getting all the voice actors back in for another round, then adding
it into the whole of the game and then running it to the testers to
make sure it all works.... could actually takes months to do.



Course, personally I will wait and play
the game and if it does seem lacking then I will ask Bio to consider
giving us a DLC where we could explore that realm once more.:innocent:

Yeah 8 days to go..its already too late to expect anything to be "fixed". 

[Feraele]

Allison W wrote...

This is assuming the sequel imports DA1 characters/continuities at all.

I highly doubt that DA2 will be anything like Origins..I suspect what we are seeing here, right now..is a move to change.   Some of it seems abrupt and disconnected.   

[Feraele]

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

*sigh* Why is it that every time BioWare does something people don't like, EA gets dragged into it? While I too have my problems with EA, they've stopped being the absolute hellspawn of ultimate evil in recent years. And while I can see their fingers in BioWare's marketing and DLC/preorder bonus phail, the core games are still entirely BioWare.

As for Awakening, I'm of two minds. The US ending not being supported makes perfect sense to me--it's like the "suicide" ending of ME2. Yes, you can do it. No, we're not letting you import it. There's precedent for this. On the other hand, the expansions of NWN did include romances, and the TOB expansion for BG2 didn't include new romances, but continued the previous ones. I think the scenario for DA:A is likely due to game constraints because of the MASSIVE amounts of iterations in how peoples' DA:O game could have gone down. It's only a 15 hour game or so. (It also makes me worry about ME3, but that's a different story.)

But the point of RPGs isn't getting your mack on with someone.  It's immersion, story, character development, and choice.  And if the game still hits all those buttons, I'll be perfectly capable of enjoying it.

You missed something there...Bioware IS allowing importation of DEAD WARDEN...so that they can be a Miracle resurrect.   They aren't allowing however for those that choose to leave their dead warden dead.......any reference or news passed forward to the brand new Orlesian, who will be taking over after you have "killed" the Archdemon.

So basically..they are allowing the non-logical thing to happen,  and from what I understand, this was set up for those that only play through once ..or something.

They aren't allowing your dead warden any credit for saving Ferelden from the Archdemon.   No world state import, even in the form of a small conversation, that indicates...the self-sacrifice.    Done, over finished, but those that yelled about not being able to play their dead warden,  will be able to.

The rest of us are left with...nothing.    

I have to say that Bioware stories really draw you in...and the characters that they have created for us ..again are very well done, believable ..mostly.

People get attached to those main characters..be they dead or not.   All the US people want is some sort of closure to the story...as promised in the last part where the King or Queen is standing over your dead body and making a speech.   In that speech they say you will be entombed at Weisshopt, along with the previous 4 wardens that did the same self-sacrifice.    An honourable burial.   

They also state that a large, statue will be erected in your honour at the new keep in Amaranthine.

Whats really going to happen with that....NOTHING.    

Instead those that want to play their dead warden can.   The ultimate sacrifice is again negated, doesn't exist, same as for the first example.   Either way the ultimate sacrifice doesn't exist.

And that won't be fixed......Bioware can't do it.."technical difficulties" or some such.

My view of an expansion is exactly as a prior poster above me suggested:   it expands on the theme of the main campaign.    Sure there are going to be differences..and tapering off of different story lines.

But here we have what amounts to:   End of story....cut on dotted line ..HERE.

[Bratt1204]

YuniSticksitDeep wrote...

No sex no romance, did Fox News buy Bioware?

I for one will boycott a game that divests itself from what i have come to expect in Bioware Game.

It is NOT too late to F I X this. post a poll, make it visable ask if they want romance...the hom. er soules...er people who are afraid of sex in games can speak up toooo!!!


I won't play a bioware game without love in it.

PERIOD.

gotta run, Jack need a new tattoo.


PS I am the ONLY one with a a Pair? GODS people show some back bone. (no offense to the spineless).

Yuni.

I feel it is always very important to speak our minds.