62 réponses à ce sujet

[JaegerBane]

cxensign wrote...

The Vindicator makes a superb secondary weapon, but the ammo capacity really hurts it as a primary weapon.  On any class but the Soldier the Vindicator does exactly what I want it to do.  On a Soldier, though, it definitely pushes you into playing more like a sniper; you can't use it as your go-to weapon.  The Avenger doesn't impress me, but it definitely works better than the Vindicator as a primary weapon.

I think that is one of the biggest fails of the Vindicator. On a Soldier, taking it means you have no automatic weapons - on missions where ammo is a bit restricted I can imagine this would become a pain.

That said, the Vindicator is a fantastic weapon for class that also have SMGs.

The Revenant is one of my fave guns in the game, though. The speed it takes down Harbinger is unholy.

[Spyndel]

I don't think anyone is arguing that the Vindy, as it is, is superior to the Rev. Its just that some idiot back on the first page, made a remark to the effect that if the Vindy had twice the ammo count it does, to allow for more aggressive shooting, it would be a better weapon than the Rev....since it does do nearly the same damage, but with far more manageability, accuracy, and a much larger effective range.



But it doesnt have twice the ammo, so it isnt.

[Athenau]

It wouldn't take twice as much ammo to make the Vindicator competitive as a primary weapon.  Right now it's kind of in a weird place, where you can almost run through most fights without running out--it's perched on the razor's edge of full playability.  An additional one or two reserve mags (which means the pickups scale by the same amount) would probably be enough.

TBH, the baseline assault rifles (Avenger and GPR) need more help than the Vindicator.  If I were rebalancing the assault rifles I'd probably do the following:

1.  Increase Avenger/GPR base damage per shot by 20% (to 12.9).
2.  Increase Vindicator reserve ammo by 25% (to 120).

Modifié par Athenau, 07 mars 2010 - 11:44 .

[sandman7431]

The vindicator/widow combination really works for me. It's my personal favorite soldier combo. I think the soldier functions extremely well as a sniper. In many ways, the soldier is a superior sniper to the infiltrator because it has a better arsenal to eliminate enemies who close in on it and it has a higher damage bonus with adrenaline rush as well as a shorter cooldown when you compare it to assassination cloak.

That being said, the Revenant is a beastly weapon. It's basically like having a fast, powerful heavy weapon with tons of ammo. You have to realize that the LMG allows you to play far more aggressively with the soldier because if any enemy attempts to rush you, you can mow them down easily (even on insanity).

I like to go aggressive with my soldier builds. I use Commando and Heightened adrenaline when I take the widow. With the Revenant, some people say you should go shock trooper/hardened adrenaline but I still go commando. I'm all about offense and I find that the soldier should be an aggressive offensive class when equiped with the LMG. Adrenaline snipe with either the viper or the incisor to thin the pack a little and then use your storm speed to close in on them. Once you've taken cover close to the enemy, adrenaline rush and blow them away with the LMG. It's a great feeling.

Modifié par sandman7431, 07 mars 2010 - 11:47 .

[cxensign]

Athenau wrote...

TBH, the baseline assault rifles (Avenger and GPR) need more help than the Vindicator.  If I were rebalancing the assault rifles I'd probably do the following:

1.  Increase Avenger/GPR base damage per shot by 20% (to 12.9).
2.  Increase Vindicator reserve ammo by 25% (to 120).

I agree with this.  Exempting the Revenant, SMGs are as strong as, if not stronger than Assault Rifles on the whole.  Getting access to Assault Rifles over SMGs is supposed to be an advantage of the Soldier class, but it often feels like a disadvantage until you get the Revenant.

There's a very good, and compelling, argument that the Infiltrator has a stronger weapon loadout than the Soldier throughout the game, provided you prefer the Widow to the Revenant.

[Athenau]

Yes, it's a little lame that that the Tempest is so superior to the Avenger/GPR. Arguably it's a better all around weapon than the Vindicator too, providing comparable dps at the cost of some accuracy, but with much, much better ammo efficiency.

[Ooga600]

Revenant is the best if you have the accuracy upgrades and fire in controlled bursts, Geth Pulse rifle is only really good vs. shields. Revenant also has the most ammo. Also, why would you EVER use the avenger after getting the vindicator?

Modifié par Ooga600, 08 mars 2010 - 01:29 .

[Urazz]

I think some people also don't realize how to pulse the revenant well. You only fire like 3 to 4 shots before you stop to reset the targeting reticle and stop the kick. Hence why it can be a pain in the butt to aim since it'll have quite a kick to it and will have a fairly wide spread compared to the other assault rifles.



Essentially, you fire it like a vindicator at longer ranges.

[JaegerBane]

Athenau wrote...

Yes, it's a little lame that that the Tempest is so superior to the Avenger/GPR. Arguably it's a better all around weapon than the Vindicator too, providing comparable dps at the cost of some accuracy, but with much, much better ammo efficiency.

I'm not sure it makes sense to compare the Tempest to the Avenger. It shouldn't really come as a surprise that a Tier 2 weapon is better than a Tier 1 weapon.

Regarding comparisons to the Vindicator... personally I think they're too different to make any meaningful comparison. They're intended for completely different purposes.

[sandman7431]

Urazz wrote...

I think some people also don't realize how to pulse the revenant well. You only fire like 3 to 4 shots before you stop to reset the targeting reticle and stop the kick. Hence why it can be a pain in the butt to aim since it'll have quite a kick to it and will have a fairly wide spread compared to the other assault rifles.

Essentially, you fire it like a vindicator at longer ranges.

Pulsing the trigger is crucial at longer ranges but the real key to revenant play is getting into close range.  It is really a close range weapon.  Get in close enough to smell the enemies breath and then adrenaline rush.  The slow down will offset the weapon kickback and enemies will vanish quickly.

[sinosleep]

JaegerBane wrote...
I'm not sure it makes sense to compare the Tempest to the Avenger. It shouldn't really come as a surprise that a Tier 2 weapon is better than a Tier 1 weapon.

Regarding comparisons to the Vindicator... personally I think they're too different to make any meaningful comparison. They're intended for completely different purposes.

People compare it because for non-assault rifle wielding classes, they will have the tempest before getting access to the avenger or GPR. I know that's the reason I compared them. I already had the tempest on my engineer as a primary weapon and was trying to decide what I would take as a bonus weapon. I ran through the collector ship twice getting getting the sniper rifle on one and assault rifles on the other which forced me to make the comparison. The vindicator had too low an ammo count to replace the tempest as a primary weapon and I felt the viper did a better job of becoming my ranged warfare weapon. With the GPR and Avenger I felt that the tempest did equal or better dps and since I used it from mid to short range any way the increased accuracy of the ARs wouldn't be all that useful. classes that view ARs as a bonus or "upgrade" are going to compare it to whatever smg they have available at the time.

[Zhijn]

Agree with most here, vin and rev outclass the avenger.

Altho i did find giving avenger to Grunt will have him fire almost non-stop on targets. Add that with his fire ammo. Lovely!.