1067 réponses à ce sujet

[ThePatriot101]

llinsane1ll wrote...

I would usually say... omg another one of these... but the DLC part for being more story driven is true. Why the hell do I want MORE heavy weapons? How does help if I already beat the game 2 times? It won't change my experience. I actually never use any heavy weapons, rarely. I'm not saying it's not cool to get them free, but I prefer they put that time in making explorable-more missions-actionpack DLC instead of new heavy weapons.

Then be glad they are not focusing their DLC only on new heavy weapons.

[Rodriguer2000]

llinsane1ll wrote...

Rodriguer2000 wrote...

boo hoo

Lol you had to modify your post to spell boo hoo right...

no i just had to modify it to rant

[Babu Yagu]

Rodriguer2000 wrote...

ha i hated halos story well mostly just halo 3 but i just dont see why people would want the inventory system and pointless looting back seriously woudlnt you just want a ton of new weapons instead of going out and hoping youll find it

Either the Inventory or a ton of new weapons would do. Currently we don't have either.

[Rodriguer2000]

Babu Yagu wrote...

Rodriguer2000 wrote...

ha i hated halos story well mostly just halo 3 but i just dont see why people would want the inventory system and pointless looting back seriously woudlnt you just want a ton of new weapons instead of going out and hoping youll find it

Either the Inventory or a ton of new weapons would do. Currently we don't have either.

thats all you want really well im sure they will do that cause i want a ton of new weapon

Modifié par Rodriguer2000, 09 mars 2010 - 03:53 .

[ThePatriot101]

Babu Yagu wrote...

Rodriguer2000 wrote...

ha i hated halos story well mostly just halo 3 but i just dont see why people would want the inventory system and pointless looting back seriously woudlnt you just want a ton of new weapons instead of going out and hoping youll find it

Either the Inventory or a ton of new weapons would do. Currently we don't have either.

Didn't ME1 basically have eight weapons with just variations of stats?  ME2 actually had 19 separate weapons not counting DLC.

[DigitalMaster37]

ratzerman wrote...

Couldn't agree more, Shavon. Expanding the game's audience is great and all, but not at the expense of the core fanbase. If Bioware keeps cranking out garbage like this lightning gun nonsense, they're going to reach to reach a point where they'll be losing more customers than they gain. Shooter fans are fickle.... they'll move on to the new hotness, and Bioware will be left scratching their heads, wondering what they did wrong.

Quoted for truth, which is why I am slightly shocked BioWare didn't cater more to the RPG fans. But being a full supporter of BioWare, it makes me concerned, because I know how fickle shooter fans are. Most of them aren't even forumites. They are fly by night fans who jump to one thing and then the next weeks later. I should know, because my second favorite genre is shooters and if it wasn't for my love for RPGs, I'd be playing Bad Company/MW2 and others instead of ME2 right now and looking forward to the many shooters coming out soon.

RPG's are far fewer and in between these days, making it a more valuable market (fan wise, IMO) so the only explanation for catering to the shooter fans is money...and that goes back to my EA reference, although I hate to paint them like that, but it is the goal of most companies.

Even though it makes business sense, I can't wait to find a company that puts customers over money (I know it makes no sense). I know in the long run it will be better though, but most comapnies look for instant gratification.

[Rodriguer2000]

ThePatriot101 wrote...

Babu Yagu wrote...

Rodriguer2000 wrote...

ha i hated halos story well mostly just halo 3 but i just dont see why people would want the inventory system and pointless looting back seriously woudlnt you just want a ton of new weapons instead of going out and hoping youll find it

Either the Inventory or a ton of new weapons would do. Currently we don't have either.

Didn't ME1 basically have eight weapons with just variations of stats?  ME2 actually had 19 separate weapons not counting DLC.

yeah somthing like that the guns would just change colors lol i just realized that

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

ThePatriot101 wrote...

Didn't ME1 basically have eight weapons with just variations of stats?  ME2 actually had 19 separate weapons not counting DLC.

ME2 has more like 7 weapons.

Pistol, SMG, Shotgun, Assault rifle, sniper, and heavy weapon. They either have almost duplicate "uprgaded versions" that perform the same task with a slightly different feel, or they have, as I have pointed out already, simply repurposed powers disguised as heavy weapons.

[Rodriguer2000]

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...

ratzerman wrote...

Couldn't agree more, Shavon. Expanding the game's audience is great and all, but not at the expense of the core fanbase. If Bioware keeps cranking out garbage like this lightning gun nonsense, they're going to reach to reach a point where they'll be losing more customers than they gain. Shooter fans are fickle.... they'll move on to the new hotness, and Bioware will be left scratching their heads, wondering what they did wrong.

Quoted for truth, which is why I am slightly shocked BioWare didn't cater more to the RPG fans. But being a full supporter of BioWare, it makes me concerned, because I know how fickle shooter fans are. Most of them aren't even forumites. They are fly by night fans who jump to one thing and then the next weeks later. I should know, because my second favorite genre is shooters and if it wasn't for my love for RPGs, I'd be playing Bad Company/MW2 and others instead of ME2 right now and looking forward to the many shooters coming out soon.

RPG's are far fewer and in between these days, making it a more valuable market (fan wise, IMO) so the only explanation for catering to the shooter fans is money...and that goes back to my EA reference, although I hate to paint them like that, but it is the goal of most companies.

Even though it makes business sense, I can't wait to find a company that puts customers over money (I know it makes no sense). I know in the long run it will be better though, but most comapnies look for instant gratification.

hmmm didnt it it occur to you that theres people out there that like all types of games.

[Rodriguer2000]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

ThePatriot101 wrote...

Didn't ME1 basically have eight weapons with just variations of stats?  ME2 actually had 19 separate weapons not counting DLC.

ME2 has more like 7 weapons.

Pistol, SMG, Shotgun, Assault rifle, sniper, and heavy weapon. They either have almost duplicate "uprgaded versions" that perform the same task with a slightly different feel, or they have, as I have pointed out already, simply repurposed powers disguised as heavy weapons.

i think you got what he said confused' i could be wrong though

Modifié par Rodriguer2000, 09 mars 2010 - 03:59 .

[cruc1al]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

ThePatriot101 wrote...

Didn't ME1 basically have eight weapons with just variations of stats?  ME2 actually had 19 separate weapons not counting DLC.

ME2 has more like 7 weapons.

Pistol, SMG, Shotgun, Assault rifle, sniper, and heavy weapon.

Understatement of the year.

If you can't see the difference between the weapons in each weapon class, then that's too bad, cos you're missing out.

Modifié par cruc1al, 09 mars 2010 - 04:01 .

[ThePatriot101]

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...

ratzerman wrote...

Couldn't agree more, Shavon. Expanding the game's audience is great and all, but not at the expense of the core fanbase. If Bioware keeps cranking out garbage like this lightning gun nonsense, they're going to reach to reach a point where they'll be losing more customers than they gain. Shooter fans are fickle.... they'll move on to the new hotness, and Bioware will be left scratching their heads, wondering what they did wrong.

Quoted for truth, which is why I am slightly shocked BioWare didn't cater more to the RPG fans. But being a full supporter of BioWare, it makes me concerned, because I know how fickle shooter fans are. Most of them aren't even forumites. They are fly by night fans who jump to one thing and then the next weeks later. I should know, because my second favorite genre is shooters and if it wasn't for my love for RPGs, I'd be playing Bad Company/MW2 and others instead of ME2 right now and looking forward to the many shooters coming out soon.

RPG's are far fewer and in between these days, making it a more valuable market (fan wise, IMO) so the only explanation for catering to the shooter fans is money...and that goes back to my EA reference, although I hate to paint them like that, but it is the goal of most companies.

Even though it makes business sense, I can't wait to find a company that puts customers over money (I know it makes no sense). I know in the long run it will be better though, but most comapnies look for instant gratification.

I would say it's more that the RPG is undergoing some experimentation in combining with other genres and finding things that can work.  JPRGs nowadays are more the standard for typical linear RPGs given that they haven't changed much over the years.  As ME2 has proven you can actually combine the shooter and RPG and make something that is truly remarkable.  And as they have said, much of their changes between ME1 and ME2 was done because fans brought the issues up so I'm pretty sure they are focused on their customers.

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

cruc1al wrote...

Understatement of the year.

If you can't see the difference between the weapons in each weapon class, then that's too bad, cos you're losing out.

Actually Im losing out because I can see the truth. ME2s weapons system bores me to tears, with its ****** rock/paper/scissor tailored for idiots.

[javierabegazo]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

cruc1al wrote...

Understatement of the year.

If you can't see the difference between the weapons in each weapon class, then that's too bad, cos you're losing out.

Actually Im losing out because I can see the truth. ME2s weapons system bores me to tears, with its ****** rock/paper/scissor tailored for idiots.

How do you think ME1's weapon system is more complex than ME2's??

[cruc1al]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

cruc1al wrote...

Understatement of the year.

If you can't see the difference between the weapons in each weapon class, then that's too bad, cos you're losing out.

Actually Im losing out because I can see the truth. ME2s weapons system bores me to tears, with its ****** rock/paper/scissor tailored for idiots.

Meant missing out, lol. Not a native speaker

[ThePatriot101]

Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

ThePatriot101 wrote...

Didn't ME1 basically have eight weapons with just variations of stats?  ME2 actually had 19 separate weapons not counting DLC.

ME2 has more like 7 weapons.

Pistol, SMG, Shotgun, Assault rifle, sniper, and heavy weapon. They either have almost duplicate "uprgaded versions" that perform the same task with a slightly different feel, or they have, as I have pointed out already, simply repurposed powers disguised as heavy weapons.

Then under your argument ME1 only had 4 weapons: Pistol, Shotgun, AR, Sniper Rifle.  And, by your argument, that means ME2 has almost twice as many weapons as ME1.

[DigitalMaster37]

Rodriguer2000 wrote...

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...

ratzerman wrote...

Couldn't agree more, Shavon. Expanding the game's audience is great and all, but not at the expense of the core fanbase. If Bioware keeps cranking out garbage like this lightning gun nonsense, they're going to reach to reach a point where they'll be losing more customers than they gain. Shooter fans are fickle.... they'll move on to the new hotness, and Bioware will be left scratching their heads, wondering what they did wrong.

Quoted for truth, which is why I am slightly shocked BioWare didn't cater more to the RPG fans. But being a full supporter of BioWare, it makes me concerned, because I know how fickle shooter fans are. Most of them aren't even forumites. They are fly by night fans who jump to one thing and then the next weeks later. I should know, because my second favorite genre is shooters and if it wasn't for my love for RPGs, I'd be playing Bad Company/MW2 and others instead of ME2 right now and looking forward to the many shooters coming out soon.

RPG's are far fewer and in between these days, making it a more valuable market (fan wise, IMO) so the only explanation for catering to the shooter fans is money...and that goes back to my EA reference, although I hate to paint them like that, but it is the goal of most companies.

Even though it makes business sense, I can't wait to find a company that puts customers over money (I know it makes no sense). I know in the long run it will be better though, but most comapnies look for instant gratification.

hmmm didnt it it occur to you that theres people out there that like all types of games.

You're right, but when it comes to RPGs, there is a dedicated fanbase and although not nearly as many the number of shooter fans, we (IMO) are more passionate about our respective genre. RPGs are more personal in the first place, so it draws more patient, intellectual people (no offense shooter only fans). It is a simple fact though. The core shooter fan can care less for story which requires an attention span longer than 1 minute. The core RPG fan can last through a story 60+ hours with a very few combat elements. So yes you are correct that there are many people (like you and myself I assume) that like both genres and have a level of tolerance for long spans of both, but we are the minority in truth I think.

[javierabegazo]

ThePatriot101 wrote...
And as they have said, much of their changes between ME1 and ME2 was done because fans brought the issues up so I'm pretty sure they are focused on their customers.

Yup. this is very true. Imagine if NONE of the community had complained about the Mako. you can bet we'd probably be driving it right now.

But back to BioWare's connection to the community, despite what pessimists might think, they sure do pay alot more attention than people give them credit for. In ME2, there are several references via Newsfeed/terminal messages that are actually referring to topics brought up in the forums, or even specific forumites ala Jeirt, and her fascination with Thane, or Blast the Hanar Spectre

There's a big difference between listening to the community and simply blindly implementing whatever suggestion is passed along

[Rodriguer2000]

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...

Rodriguer2000 wrote...

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...

ratzerman wrote...

Couldn't agree more, Shavon. Expanding the game's audience is great and all, but not at the expense of the core fanbase. If Bioware keeps cranking out garbage like this lightning gun nonsense, they're going to reach to reach a point where they'll be losing more customers than they gain. Shooter fans are fickle.... they'll move on to the new hotness, and Bioware will be left scratching their heads, wondering what they did wrong.

Quoted for truth, which is why I am slightly shocked BioWare didn't cater more to the RPG fans. But being a full supporter of BioWare, it makes me concerned, because I know how fickle shooter fans are. Most of them aren't even forumites. They are fly by night fans who jump to one thing and then the next weeks later. I should know, because my second favorite genre is shooters and if it wasn't for my love for RPGs, I'd be playing Bad Company/MW2 and others instead of ME2 right now and looking forward to the many shooters coming out soon.

RPG's are far fewer and in between these days, making it a more valuable market (fan wise, IMO) so the only explanation for catering to the shooter fans is money...and that goes back to my EA reference, although I hate to paint them like that, but it is the goal of most companies.

Even though it makes business sense, I can't wait to find a company that puts customers over money (I know it makes no sense). I know in the long run it will be better though, but most comapnies look for instant gratification.

hmmm didnt it it occur to you that theres people out there that like all types of games.

You're right, but when it comes to RPGs, there is a dedicated fanbase and although not nearly as many the number of shooter fans, we (IMO) are more passionate about our respective genre. RPGs are more personal in the first place, so it draws more patient, intellectual people (no offense shooter only fans). It is a simple fact though. The core shooter fan can care less for story which requires an attention span longer than 1 minute. The core RPG fan can last through a story 60+ hours with a very few combat elements. So yes you are correct that there are many people (like you and myself I assume) that like both genres and have a level of tolerance for long spans of both, but we are the minority in truth I think.

alright i would happily accept more rpg aspects in me 3 as long as they keep the shooter aspects from mass effect 2 in how bout that? can we agree on that? oh yeah i want the cover system to stay too lol:D

Modifié par Rodriguer2000, 09 mars 2010 - 04:09 .

[DigitalMaster37]

ThePatriot101 wrote...

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...

ratzerman wrote...

Couldn't agree more, Shavon. Expanding the game's audience is great and all, but not at the expense of the core fanbase. If Bioware keeps cranking out garbage like this lightning gun nonsense, they're going to reach to reach a point where they'll be losing more customers than they gain. Shooter fans are fickle.... they'll move on to the new hotness, and Bioware will be left scratching their heads, wondering what they did wrong.

Quoted for truth, which is why I am slightly shocked BioWare didn't cater more to the RPG fans. But being a full supporter of BioWare, it makes me concerned, because I know how fickle shooter fans are. Most of them aren't even forumites. They are fly by night fans who jump to one thing and then the next weeks later. I should know, because my second favorite genre is shooters and if it wasn't for my love for RPGs, I'd be playing Bad Company/MW2 and others instead of ME2 right now and looking forward to the many shooters coming out soon.

RPG's are far fewer and in between these days, making it a more valuable market (fan wise, IMO) so the only explanation for catering to the shooter fans is money...and that goes back to my EA reference, although I hate to paint them like that, but it is the goal of most companies.

Even though it makes business sense, I can't wait to find a company that puts customers over money (I know it makes no sense). I know in the long run it will be better though, but most comapnies look for instant gratification.

I would say it's more that the RPG is undergoing some experimentation in combining with other genres and finding things that can work.  JPRGs nowadays are more the standard for typical linear RPGs given that they haven't changed much over the years.  As ME2 has proven you can actually combine the shooter and RPG and make something that is truly remarkable.  And as they have said, much of their changes between ME1 and ME2 was done because fans brought the issues up so I'm pretty sure they are focused on their customers.

I am with you on the fact that combining is good, and I actually think it is great, but then balance becomes a huge issue and I think as far as balance, BioWare has made it painfully clear that the shooter aspect is the golden child in this iteration of the trilogy.

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

javierabegazo wrote...


How do you think ME1's weapon system is more complex than ME2's??

How do you think I think that?

I played a sentinel in ME1. I wasnt forced into cover, and I had powers that werent negated by the most ridiculous and unexplained enemy defenses. ME2 forces you into cover if you want to survive, and forces you to use weapons if you want to kill your enemies. As much as ME1 is guilty of this as well, it at least failed in that you didnt need to for example use an SMG if you want to use biotics on someone.

Its part of the reason why ME2 is clearly TPS above all else when you cant use a power because that shield/armour is magically stopping the singularity from sucking him in, and you have to use an SMG or warp to "debuff" him.

And then, joy of joys, once its down youd be better of headshotting him for how worthless the biotics are given how weak the enemies are and easy to kill.

I never say ME1 was better in every respect (though I think it was in many respects). When it comes to gameplay though, I think ME2 so often simply approachs the same flaw from a different angle, only this time with a shooter perspective in mind, making things even worse.

Modifié par Dinkamus_Littlelog, 09 mars 2010 - 04:09 .

[javierabegazo]

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...


You're right, but when it comes to RPGs, there is a dedicated fanbase and although not nearly as many the number of shooter fans, we (IMO) are more passionate about our respective genre. RPGs are more personal in the first place, so it draws more patient, intellectual people (no offense shooter only fans). It is a simple fact though. The core shooter fan can care less for story which requires an attention span longer than 1 minute. The core RPG fan can last through a story 60+ hours with a very few combat elements. So yes you are correct that there are many people (like you and myself I assume) that like both genres and have a level of tolerance for long spans of both, but we are the minority in truth I think.

While I whole heartedly agree with you, it is the sad truth that there just isn't that much of a market for pure bred RPG's. I think it was pointed out in David Gaider's famous passed along RPG post where he says that AAA games that are high budget can't simply cater to a specific small niche of gaming

[Gazrion]

I honestly do not see how mass effect 2 is just a shooter like halo? I didnt play much halo as shooter only games get boring quick. So to make it clear for me can you change your appearnce in halo or upgrade weapons/ ship, effect the outcome of the story, interact with most npc in the game build a team and gain their loyalty, gain experiance and lvls to progress your charector in a way you want? just to mention a few aspects if you can i would probaly class that as an rpg. Or is it that people just want bioware to make games to the same old format like baldurs gate but in a mass effect universe?

I personaly feel mass effect is a good action rpg maybe a bit shy on some rpg elements but still a very interactive game.

Surely its good for gaming companys to go against there typical game moulds from time to time how else could they develop as a gaming company and keep bringing out new and enjoyable gaming experiances?

I also have no problems with the DLC so far as its not been out long so theres plenty of time to implement good story driven DLC before mass effect 3. God i rember the days when you were bloody lucky to get an expension pack after a year or 2. 3-4 months is not very long to wait really

Modifié par Gazrion, 09 mars 2010 - 04:15 .

[bjdbwea]

Shavon wrote...

Or the excellent dlc's for Dragon Age?

Huh? Did I miss something? Seriously though, DLC for most companies is all about making quick and easy money. Now so far the DLC for ME 2 has been free, but that only means that you can expect even less effort. Would like to be proven wrong, but the content so far has proven me right.