55 réponses à ce sujet

[Gorath Alpha]

It appeared to me that this was needed in this place even more badly than it was needed at DA: O when it was published there.

We seemed to have had a sizable influx of new arrivals who have never gamed on PCs coming in, so a list of Video Cards by how well they will handle a shader- intensive game probably will be useful.  Technically speaking, this is not "MY" list at all.  NotTheKing started it back in 2005, when OpenGL still had some adherents among game developers.  That is no longer true today.  I'll edit off a lot of pre-Dx9 entries, like the GF4s, FXes*, and their ilk, and add notes to the Xn00 cards that don't qualify for Dx9.0"B", which is the minimum (for ME, none of them, actually).

The list here included some of the Xn00 Radeons, from X700 to X850, that worked fro DA: O, bul only run with low textures because Dx9.0"C" is the primary shader used for higher quality textures.  ME-2 requires the full suite of SM3 pixel shader functions. 

(Starting from Fastest, through Minimum Capability)

- ATI Radeon HD 5900 series
- NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480
- ATI Radeon HD 5800 series
- NVIDIA GeForce GTX 470
- NVIDIA GeForce GTX275 - 280 - 285 - 295 - 460 and GTX 465
- ATI Radeon HD 5700 series
- NVIDIA GeForce GTX260
- ATI Radeon HD 4800 series
- NVIDIA GeForce GTS 250
- NVIDIA GeForce 9800 series
- NVIDIA GeForce 8800 series
- ATI Radeon HD 5600 series
- ATI Radeon HD 4700 series
- NVIDIA GeForce 9600 series
- ATI Radeon HD 3800 series
- ATI Radeon HD 4600 series
- ATI Radeon HD 2900 series
- ATI Radeon X1950 series
- ATI Radeon X1900 series
- NVIDIA GeForce 7900 series
- ATI Radeon X1800 series
- ATI Radeon X850 series    
- NVIDIA GeForce 7950
- NVIDIA GeForce 7950 GX2
- ATI Radeon X800 series
- ATI Radeon HD 3690  
- NVIDIA GeForce GTS 240
- NVIDIA GeForce 7800 series
- NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GTS
- NVIDIA GeForce GTS 220, GT 230 
- ATI Radeon HD 2600 XT
- ATI Radeon HD 3650  
- NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GT
- NVIDIA GeForce 6800 Ultra
- ATI Radeon HD 2600 Pro 
- NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GS
- NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GT
- ATI Radeon X1650 XT        (This, IMO, is the practical ME-2 Minimum Radeon)
- NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GT  (This, IMO, is the practical ME-2 Minimum Geforce)
- NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GS

_____________________

IMO, the cards below that line aren't actually
good enough to run DA: O properly.  (But we're in ME-2 now)

- NVIDIA GeForce 6800 Vanilla(PCI-e version, 256 MB) <~ This is the (nVidia)
   Official Minimum (disagree)
- ATI Radeon X1650 Pro
- ATI Radeon X1600 XT
- NVIDIA GeForce 6600 GT 
- NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GS
- NVIDIA GeForce 6800 ( AGP version, 128 MB )
- ATI Radeon X1600 Pro (256 MBs, Max usable VRAM) ( ATI Official Minimum Card )
- ATI Radeon X1300 XT (renamed X1600 Pro)
========================= 
Very Low Quality & on downward from here

- NVIDIA GeForce 6800 XT
- NVIDIA GeForce 8500 GT
- NVIDIA GeForce 6600 vanilla
- ATI Radeon X1550 (renamed X1300, slightly retuned), should not have been
      named as supported

Suffixes, from Good to Awful

ATI Suffixes: XTX > XT > XL > Pro >GTO > Vanilla > GT > SE > Hyper Anything

nVidia: Ultra > GTX > GT > GS > Vanilla > LE = XT  > VE > TC = TE (Turbocache, any variety)

PLEASE, take notice of the intermixed generations of cards, showing that "new" doesn't mean very much when the card isn't the fastest and most expensive that you can buy. 

This list was originally created by NotTheKing, and maintained from 2005 to 2008.  All onboard solutions, business grade cards, and all of the atrociously bad Geforce FX cards just had to be removed! 

Many game developers have begun describing the video cards that a given game supports in terms of grouped "series" of cards from the Vanilla through the GTX or XTX, and that simplified form is what I use at the top end in order to make the listing more concise.  There is a longer, harder to use list, eventually, in the "Ladders" post (in the Dragon Age Tech forum), suitable for an informational use, but it really isn't terribly necessary. 

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/575571

It should be noted that there is now a "trio" of hardware component reference articles. with one on the Basics of gaming system performance information for the new gamer, and another article restrcted to only the video card component's basic technical information, including links to more extensive coverage.  Those two are to be found right here: 

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/509580

and here for the one on Video Graphics Adapters:

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/519461

The original DA: O version appears here:

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/128343


Gorath

-

Modifié par Gorath Alpha, 16 août 2011 - 09:48 .

[Kalec Stromhir]

Well done Gorath, another PC expert is always needed. I've dealt with my fair share of people not understanding there system hardware and how they work.

[Gorath Alpha]

Although the nVIDIA Fermi is supposed to be released in just two days, there doesn't seem to be muich in the way of leaked information about the GTX 470 and GTX 480, other than a MSRP of $499. 

(Edited: no wonder it's been so quiet.  There won't be anything in any stores until April 12, after all, and what will be there then will be all produced as reference samples (usually handled in small numbers 60 days or so before the actual unveiling). 

It will be a couple of months before a few good benchmarks allow me to add them here (add two weeks to that, now).  Meanwhile, this was a bit interesting:

www.legitreviews.com/news/7519/

vr-zone.com/articles/nvidia-geforce-gtx-480-final-specs--pricing-revealed/8635.html

www.hexus.net/content/item.php

Gorath
-

Modifié par Gorath Alpha, 27 mars 2010 - 02:33 .

[Misael]

Hey, what is best in your opinion: nvidia geforce 9500 GT or ati radeon hd 4650?? both with 1 GB of memory??? i don't find many articles about these models...

[Gorath Alpha]

A wide variety of benchmarking sites are available to use for comparisons.  Toms Hardware includes actual games, so that's where I go for the benches.  Neither card has any wider than a 128 bit memory system, so the bandwidth keeps them from ever using more than 512 MBs, and the core speed of the HD 4650, compared to the 9500 GT, is going to limit it even further, to 256 MBs most of the time with only rare situations in which it can pass 512 MBs to a game. 

www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php

The 9500 GT's base core speed is hardly that much faster, but the memory is faster, so it should allow for 512 MBs somewhat more often.  That only makes a difference at screen resolutions as fine as 1600 by 1200.  At resolutions below that, the HD 4650 is apparently a goodly amount faster. 

Gorath
-

[Gorath Alpha]

I don't think that I have seen any members here bragging about new GTX480s yet.  Of course, I haven't visited "Off Topic" much lately (the Bazaar Crap made that forum far too boring for me), maybe that's where the proud wearers of fanboy green might be found extolling the merits of their new toys. 

[BeresaadSoldier]

GTX 295 beats any Radeon 5800 series. How can you place a single GPU (radeon) higher than a dual SLI 1.8GB card (nvidia)?  

Modifié par BeresaadSoldier, 22 avril 2010 - 03:12 .

[Gorath Alpha]

You are wrong, of course, because you ignored the premise, but I suppose that a Green Fanboy can be expected to do so.

[BeresaadSoldier]

Gorath Alpha wrote...

You are wrong, of course, because you ignored the premise, but I suppose that a Green Fanboy can be expected to do so.

How am I wrong when I can quote you a dozen benchmarks showing GTX 295 is better than radeon 5870 (the most powerful card of the 5800 series)? Calling me a Green Fanboy doesn't help your case, since the facts are on my side.

Here is a compiled list of reviews. I don't know who compiled the list in your first post, but claiming that it isn't yours doesn't make it any less wrong. And btw, Green Fanboy > you.

Modifié par BeresaadSoldier, 22 avril 2010 - 04:01 .

[Gorath Alpha]

Go away.

[BeresaadSoldier]

Gorath Alpha wrote...

Go away.

Fail argument. I rest my case.

[Gorath Alpha]

Given that we have an unhappy noob here today, complaining about his HD 4350 not handling the game (with a claim of having been using that awful piece of dreck for the game for quite some while), it must be about time to display the shader performance rankings again.

While doing so, let's remind everyone that there are more reference type articles stored in the Dragon Age Tech forum than here, because that is the older forum. 

PC Hardware Basics (and inventorying PC Components)

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/509580

Very basic discussion of video cards, video chips, and even of laptops' limits 

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/519461

Generational Ladders (and detailed NTK-based ranking list - old class markers)

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/575571

Do you Know what your PSU is doing tonight?

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/58/index/1935044

G

[Gorath Alpha]

Long overdue reminder of the relative performance levels.

[RGFrog]

Mostly agree with you, Gorath. Except the 5700 series ATi actually performs a bit worse than the 4870 and 4890. The only thing the 5700's have going for them when compared to the 4800 series is a slightly lower power consumption and less heat off the gpu.



Otherwise, good listing. Also to note the 460 is comparable if not a touch faster than the 5830 and a good buy in the $200 bracket.

[Gorath Alpha]

Generally, if the cards come out together, I follow the developers' style of lumping the series together, and using their average to place the groups (with the exception of the level close to the official minimums).  nVIDIA trickles their stuff out, making that more difficult.  Incidentally, I don't have anything from benches on the GTX 460 and don't include it yet, but I am only just answering because I don't try to keep this article particularly close to the top, waiting instead for people who just don't get the relationships with performance when it's gaming we are discussing.  

(Not the GTX "465", but the GTX460 is the one pending for addition here!)

Right now, we have someone making extravagant claims regarding a very low end business card that was designed for charts, graphs, presentations, and spreadsheets, not games.  Here is the recommended Radeon, and the silly little device that is supposed to run this game maxed out like the 8800 GT and the old HD 2900 XT would when they were on top of the heap:

www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php

How did I screw that link up?  Oh, well, fixed it.  That's the poor HD 4350 side by side with the originally recommended HD 2900 XT from the official system requirements.  Just for grins and giggles, although I have no real interest in any business level graphics, here is a rough and ready ranking for the bottom end, adding in the recent low end Radeons, with a few older Mainline cards for leavening: 

HD 3690 > HD 4650 > HD 2600 XT > HD 3650 > HD 5450 > HD 4550 > HD 3470 > HD 4350 > 9400 GT > 8500 GT > HD 2400XT > X1300 Pro > X1550 > 7300 GT > 6600 Vanilla > HD 3450 > 9300 GS > 8400 GS > 7300 GS > HD 2400Pro > 8300 GS > X1300 > 7300 LE > X550 > 7200 GS > X300 > 9550 > X1050 > X300 SE > Xpress200 (IGP) > 7100 GS > 6200A.

Modifié par Gorath Alpha, 15 août 2010 - 02:04 .

[RGFrog]

Gorath, did you intend to link back to this thread?

The 465 is a terrible card, power hungry and does not perform well.

The 460, on the other hand is a far better piece of work. It compares to the 5830 and is a little slower than the 5850 from ati. It is however, a bit cheaper, too and tends to use a little less power.

I'd say it's the card to get right now for the $200 market as it also OC's well.

[Gorath Alpha]

RGFrog wrote...

Gorath, did you intend to link back to this thread?

Mea Culpa!  It's been fixed.

The 465 is a terrible card, power hungry and does not perform well.  The 460, on the other hand is a far better piece of work. It compares to the 5830 and is a little slower than the 5850 from ati. It is however, a bit cheaper, too and tends to use a little less power.  I'd say it's the card to get right now for the $200 market as it also OC's well.

nVIDIA supposedly was intending to reduce the power demands, the waste heat production, and competitive position of the Fermi cards versus the Radeons when tinkering with the basic silicon to come up with the GTX 460.  In effect, remaing it somewhat more similar to a Radeon HD 58-- . 

Modifié par Gorath Alpha, 14 août 2010 - 02:32 .

[IBPROFEN]

I've have very little problems running ME2.
AMD Athlon 64 X2 DC 5200+ 2.60GHz 4GB Corsair
2x ATI Radeon HD2600 Pro w/ 512DDR2 crossfired (made by, powered by ATI pci cards)
2x WD 300GB HD
using win pro x64edition Ver.2003 (We are Borg).
MSI K9A2 platuim M/B
Can you run this? isn't a very good judge of computers and games. It says in alot of games I need upgrade Gfx's It doesn't pick up on the both cards crossfired.
Just hope it will be able to run ME3. If not I'll have to go back to FPS's.

Modifié par IBPROFEN, 15 août 2010 - 02:47 .

[Gorath Alpha]

The pair together should be roughly on a par with a single HD 2900 Pro, but SR Labs makes more mistakes than not recognizing Crossfire and SLI setups. It's really a terrible place to use for references, it's just wrong too often. Instead, if something similar cannot be avoided, use the Game-o-Meter at YouGamers.

[Gorath Alpha]

This reference has slipped too far from the top in a month, and needs to cycle back into currency , ,

[Kaitheus]

Well now I know where my card stands at least, now to replace my CPU X_X which is bottle-necking the hell out of my HD4890 lolz, can't wait for the 6 Series from ATI should be intresting once they come out an I get my hands on a HD6870.

[Truby-Liz]

*pops head up* Hey there! I was on the DAO version of this thread. I have a laptop with an ATI Radeon 5470, ME1 and 2 play fine. I haven't got the graphics up very high but I generally get about 30 FPS. Just a bit of info for you.

[Gorath Alpha]

There seems to be a fairly sizable performance jump from the HD 5450 to the HD 5470, but I would still hesitate to recommend your card for the Mass Effect pair of games, although I think I can probably give it the benefit of doubt for Dragon Age. If you want to compare cards, Toms hardware includes both Dragon Age and Mass Effect 2 as benchmark options you can use. 

I've just added the GTX 460 to the opening list, now that it's included in the Toms hardware lists.  I noticed that the Geforce HD 5550 and HD 5570 both made good showings in those benchmarks, better than I had expected from them (just hadn't paid much attention before, and now we are within less than 90 days of seeing the release of the HD 6n00 generation).

Right now, Microsoft and Sony are holding back on updating their game consoles and the game developers are going along with the lack of progress that entails. (I don't know that any other console system has any major influence on PC gemes, but I've never had a moment's interest in any console.) The current pair of consoles (above) are still at Direct3d's Dx9 level, not Dx10.

Very little is being developed stricty for PCs, so Dx9 still rules, and the top end video cards from three years ago can still hang in there, with today's better Mainline graphics, or close to it, at least (HD 3870, 8800GTX). The imminent release of the Radeon HD 6n00 generation's Mainline cards will likely leave those two behind, of course (Edited for a partial release only, being the HD 6850 and HD 6870, which are actually stepped up versions of the HD 5750 and HD 5770, but those have been selling so well, that both new and old cards will be selling side by side fo a good while yet).

Crytek will push the PC envelope, I imagine, with Crysis 2, but they are a rarity as a PC-only developer.  Dx10 will probably carry at least two years forward from now before any of the few PC-only game releases start really pushing Dx11. 

http://www.gpureview...1=549&card2=575

I don't remember the context of that comparison any more . . (in edit, here, the afternoon of 11-21).

Gorath

Modifié par Gorath Alpha, 21 novembre 2010 - 09:04 .

[SSV Enterprise]

Query: I am looking for a graphics card for a computer with a Core 2 Duo E6600 processor and Win XP for $100 or lower. My eyes are on the Radeon HD 56n0 and 55n0 series. I'm also open to Nvidia- one particular card, the Geforce GT 430, appears competitively priced with the Radeons. However, it's not on GPU review, so I can't figure out if it is a well-priced gaming card or an overpriced business card. How does this Geforce compare to the Radeons, and which would be best to get?

Modifié par SSV Enterprise, 21 novembre 2010 - 08:35 .

[Gorath Alpha]

SSV Enterprise wrote...

Query: I am looking for a graphics card for a computer with a Core 2 Duo E6600 processor and Win XP for $100 or lower. My eyes are on the Radeon HD 56n0 and 55n0 series. I'm also open to Nvidia- one particular card, the Geforce GT 430, appears competitively priced with the Radeons. However, it's not on GPU review, so I can't figure out if it is a well-priced gaming card or an overpriced business card. How does this Geforce compare to the Radeons, and which would be best to get?

Give me a feel for what you want to do with that PC, such as the screen resolution you play games at.  The HD 5570 is not at all bad for what I consider a borderline zone card, not specifically labelled as a Mainline Game card, but much better than a plain business card.  The HD 4650 and 4670 are still being produced new by AMD partners, and still get the Toms Hardware "Best Bang for the Buck" kudos for the under - $80 cards. 

If you watch a lot of movies and do any other HTPC-type chores on that PC of yours, those are where the Geforce GT430 shines, not in games.  The HD 5570 is faster, and the HD 5550 is slower, and both, AFAIK, are cheaper.  There will be "refresh" versions of more HD 5n00 cards over the next few weeks, so pricing is going to be affected.  TMSC was going with new 32 nm wafers and AMD planned on stretching out the HD 5n00 generation wntil Februray or so, when that Fab was going to be ready, but TMSC was dissatisfied with their progress and cancelled that step in favor or 28 nm instead. 

That meant that all of AMD's designs had to be reworked, and they didn't want to go with more 40 nm GPUs for the next major generation.  So, similar in a way to what nVIDIA did wuth their 88n0 cards and the 9n00 naming, but for a different reason, we'll soon see an HD 6990, and also refreshed moels of the HD 5670 and HD 5450. 

The only two Geforces I really like right now are the GT 240 and the GTX 460. 

Gorath

Modifié par Gorath Alpha, 21 novembre 2010 - 09:20 .