63 réponses à ce sujet

[Marbazoid]

You know you could always pick up second specialization and not spend any talent points in it. Then spend the extra talent  points on some more spells?

Modifié par Marbazoid, 16 mars 2010 - 02:03 .

[TBastian]

With Awakening coming out tomorrow? Not likely.

[Marbazoid]

You can respec in awakening so its no biggie.

[draxynnus]

Last Darkness wrote...

Just so you know Arcane Warrior makes your spells cost ALOT more unless you have them in specific armors. Namely you HAVE to wear Wade superior of whatever armor your wearing.
And really all this does is make them not as squishy which if your doing your job they shouldnt really be being attacked anyways.

Not true. The superior Wade's options are the best, of course, but the non-Superior Wade's Drakeskin has the same fatigue properties of the superior version. Regular leather is approximately fatigue-neutral (-1.5% to -0.95%, depending on quality), although it has to be actual leather rather than studded, duster, or dalish - however, even these other options provide a decent defense at roughly the same fatigue cost as using a sustainable (and unlike the sustainables, wearing armour doesn't cost you a sustaining overhead). 

Even if the mage is never attacked (although in my experience they do come under fire occasionally, although it is certainly possible to minimise this with good use of tanks and snares), if you do put the mage in one of Wade's creations, I'd say that having negative fatigue is worthwhile.

[TBastian]

The frequency in which a mage may find himself under attack also depends on role. A dedicated nuker can generate a significant amount of aggro, for example, which a single warrior will have trouble managing. Meanwhile support/healer mages will rarely find themselves being attacked at all (although some enemies seem to be naturally drawn towards mages).

Modifié par TBastian, 16 mars 2010 - 04:03 .

[Last Darkness]

Meliorist13 wrote...

then I misunderstood the question. My apologies. I just saw all the Shapeshifter is usless comments and it ticked me off. You are correct that Shapeshifter coupled with Spirit Healer, if this character is you main and or only healer, is not a good pair. I wasn't directing my comment specifically at you, but all the shapeshifter is useless comments, which in truth is a false statement.

I understand that, I too agree a Shapeshifter made correctly is very nice. Particularly in the team of Morrigan shapeshifted, Warden shapeshifted, shale and dog. The ungrabable team i belive.


@Draxynns
Spirit Healer/Arcane Warrior if your goingt all the way and are in full massive armor this presents the spell fatigue problem. Not suggested for say Wynn whos going to be in the background but maybe suggested for the Warden as monster aggro tends to prefer heavier armors and what character you are controling for their aggro.
In the vast majority of cases unless you can geta  setup with very low fatigue all your spells are going to cost more. In the +25% range or more. This is self defeating if you truly want to maximise your casting potential. This can often be offset though if This is the Warden and you have the tainted blood ability from wardens keep DLC. That allows you to tap your own health for a large amount of mana and is on  fairly short recharge.


All in all I say read a Blood mage guide on how blood magic works to get the understanding then enjoy castinsg spells at 60% of their costs from your health pool, and when you need to deactivate blood magic and use from your normal mana pool. You should NEVER run out of mana this way.

[Nerdage]

To be honest I think, if a mage is using spirit healer, then it might be an idea to not use a second specialization. I guess it depends on how you use spirit healer because I only ever used the aura after a fight to cure injuries but I guess there are other uses for it, but my healer tended to use heal, regeneration, group heal and lifeward, so I thought the best compliment to these abilities was the standard mage spells, so I ended up with alot of CC and heals and the frost and mage trees for 'damage'. The spec I made was for my PC (the one in my picture) so if anyone cares that much you could see it, I did a decent damage and all the cc/hexes proved very useful, I also had to use alot of talent books but, since my mage could then do pretty much anything, I didn't need to bring another mage with me.

[Marbazoid]

nerdage wrote...

To be honest I think, if a mage is using spirit healer, then it might be an idea to not use a second specialization. I guess it depends on how you use spirit healer because I only ever used the aura after a fight to cure injuries but I guess there are other uses for it, but my healer tended to use heal, regeneration, group heal and lifeward, so I thought the best compliment to these abilities was the standard mage spells, so I ended up with alot of CC and heals and the frost and mage trees for 'damage'. The spec I made was for my PC (the one in my picture) so if anyone cares that much you could see it, I did a decent damage and all the cc/hexes proved very useful, I also had to use alot of talent books but, since my mage could then do pretty much anything, I didn't need to bring another mage with me.

This is how I speced out Wynne.

The new Keeper spec in awakening looks like the answer for a spirit healer's second spec.

The blood mage is a great compliment for a support mage, but the obvious rolplaying issues with making Wynne a Blood mage keeps me awake at night .

[Mr_Raider]

Last Darkness wrote...

And really all this does is make them not as squishy which if your doing your job they shouldnt really be being attacked anyways.

Cleansing aura pulls a lot of aggro.

[AuraofMana]

Getting Wade's armor for negative fatigue isn't really worth it imo. You are already drawing a lot of aggro by turning Cleansing Aura on, why go even further? You shouldn't have mana issue with a decent caster robe anyway.

I do suggest that you don't keep Cleansing Aura on during fights. The heal isn't really that great, and it's only good for curing injuries. However, it's better to not let anyone die

[Aisynia]

I find Blood Mage/Spirit Healer to be spectacularly awesome. There's a certain rhythm to battle that develops which is just frightening.



I almost never turn off Blood Magic, and just stay back.



Any health I lose I can easily replenish with Blood Sacrifice on a heavy HP target like Oghren or Sten, then immediately heal them back up or hit group heal for a significant net gain of HP for the entire party in two quick actions.



Keeping Blood Magic active allows me to use Blood Wound at any time, which is just an incredibly powerful spell.



I don't really have HP or mana issues (I don't really use my mana pool though).

[AuraofMana]

Sorry, but Shapeshiftng is not "useless". You can still max magic and
have decent shifter forms or you can build specifically for a
shapeshifter. Just ask TBastion or X-President. Telling this guy
shapeshifting is useless is wrong, incorrect, and putting forth bad
information.

Shapeshifter is viable if you aim for it.  However, it'll never match the strength of a pure caster Mage.  Thus, it is useless in my eyes.  It is not a top end build, and thus in terms of efficiency it loses out.  If you want to do it for some RP reason, that's fine.  Just don't expect it to be better than or even on par with top end builds.

Using a shifted caster in bear form so it cant be
grabbed or overwhelmed, against dragons, ogres and the like, is useless
right?  wrong.

So?  With a decent caster Mage everything is CC'd all the time.  Pop a CC as soon as grab and overwhelm occurs and the problem is solved.  CC is more general purpose because it works on everything.  Shapeshifter may seem like it shines in one or two fights, but that's hardly the reason to say it's better.  Not to mention the fact that it really isn't better in those fights.

Take a sample battle, like the Arl Howe battle. The magic-based
Shapeshifter/Spirit Healer would nuke the room silly, while throwing
Group Heal and a few support spells as he goes along. He can shift into
Swarm once the mages are down, if he wants. Once Arl Howe is the last
man standing, he promply shifts into a Bear and Overwhelms Arl Howe for
something like 300+ damage, even as his party mates continue attacking. If he survives, Cone of Cold and
finish Howe off as Spider.

Blood Wound -> Mana Clash -> Petrify Arl Howe -> Cone of Cold trash mobs -> Shatter -> Sleep + Waking Nightmare if the fight is still not over.  You don't even break a sweat.

A Blood Mage usually focuses on disables,
since unlike the Shapeshifter being the center of attention with Blood
Magic on is not very healthy (especially if he picks so many sustaineds,
as you say). Nukes also draw a lot of aggro, which few are able to
handle better than a well built Shapeshifter.

Wrong, the entire point of CC is that enemies can't do anything.  Aggro isn't a problem when the enemies can't move and can't do anything.  If you are decent, you'll never run out of CC.

The Arcane Warrior on the other
hand has a very different type of gameplay. He is an armor-bearing mage
who casts fewer spells but can be tougher than even a warrior.

Except he can't hold aggro, so no one attacks him anyway.

Conclusion: get Blood Mage.  Spirit Healer and Blood Mage are the only two worthwhile specializations in Origins.  Everything else is just not on par.

Modifié par AuraofMana, 20 mars 2010 - 05:30 .

[TBastian]

Shapeshifter is viable if you aim for it. However, it'll never match the strength of a pure caster Mage. Thus, it is useless in my eyes. It is not a top end build, and thus in terms of efficiency it loses out. If you want to do it for some RP reason, that's fine. Just don't expect it to be better than or even on par with top end builds.

Incorrect. The Shapeshifter is an ideal nuker build, or would you rather have the Blood Mage be at the center of attention with Blood Magic on? The Shapeshifter spec bonus itself improves the mage's staying power, making him more durable in human form. A good Shapeshifter is one that makes nukes and AoE's its top priority. Its forms are there to help it better deal with aggro, since being a dedicated nuker it is capable of drawing far more aggro than is usually healthy for any other mage. Especially a Blood Mage.
You can argue that a Blood Mage and his disables/nukes can also clear a room, yes, but so can a Shapeshifter using only the primal nukes while also tanking whatever is being thrown at him using the right gear and spells. Shapeshifters do not need to rely on the "Improved Blood Magic" mod, so he can use both Reaper's Vestments and Lifegiver. He is free to pick a heavily nuke-centered spell selection since he doesn't need to rely on excessive CC's. He can also actually use potions while nuking, unlike a Blood Mage who is forced to CC to keep himself alive.

So? With a decent caster Mage everything is CC'd all the time. Pop a CC as soon as grab and overwhelm occurs and the problem is solved. CC is more general purpose because it works on everything. Shapeshifter may seem like it shines in one or two fights, but that's hardly the reason to say it's better. Not to mention the fact that it really isn't better in those fights.

"All the time"? Exaggeration. Especially since Spell Resistance ignores spellpower.

Blood Wound -> Mana Clash -> Petrify Arl Howe -> Cone of Cold trash mobs -> Shatter -> Sleep + Waking Nightmare if the fight is still not over. You don't even break a sweat.

Exaggeration. If I were to respond similarly a Shapeshifter would just Mana Clash->Cone of Cold->Fireball->Shock->Flame Blast. Shatter not required. A Shapeshifter has the option to basically just ignore Arl Howe. Then shift, Overwhelm Howe + your allies attacking (they have been attacking Hower from the start, since he and his men somehow thought that fixating on your Shapeshifter was going to work) = dead Howe. Nothing excessive, just straightforward nuking, slicing and dicing.

Wrong, the entire point of CC is that enemies can't do anything. Aggro isn't a problem when the enemies can't move and can't do anything. If you are decent, you'll never run out of CC.

CC is your Blood Mage's answer to everything because being a Blood Mage your mage CAN'T fight in the forefront and reliably spam Fireball, Cone of Cold, Shock, Flame Burst, Stone Fist, etc. without taking the odd aggro and ending up quite dead. The principle of the thing is in the gameplay. A Shapeshifter does not need CC's beyond what his nukes do. CC is redundant against dead/dying enemies.

Except he can't hold aggro, so no one attacks him anyway.

Exaggeration. A single Death Hex/Crushing Prison/Virulent Walking Bomb, and a boss will be quite preoccupied with the AW for a while. Your enemies also aim for the one with the highest armor first, given the choice. Miasma can create aggro. And last but not the last,  an AW will usually be on the front during a charge, so as long as he casts Fireball/Earthquake first most monsters will only be too happy to keep attacking him while everyone else switches to kill mode.

Modifié par TBastian, 20 mars 2010 - 08:35 .

[AuraofMana]

Incorrect. The Shapeshifter is an ideal nuker build, or would you rather have the Blood Mage be at the center of attention with Blood Magic on? The Shapeshifter spec bonus itself improves the mage's staying power, making him more durable in human form. A good Shapeshifter is one that makes nukes and AoE's its top priority. Its forms are there to help it better deal with aggro, since being a dedicated nuker it is capable of drawing far more aggro than is usually healthy for any other mage. Especially a Blood Mage.

You can argue that a Blood Mage and his disables/nukes can also clear a room, yes, but so can a Shapeshifter using only the primal nukes while also tanking whatever is being thrown at him using the right gear and spells. Shapeshifters do not need to rely on the "Improved Blood Magic" mod, so he can use both Reaper's Vestments and Lifegiver. He is free to pick a heavily nuke-centered spell selection since he doesn't need to rely on excessive CC's. He can also actually use potions while nuking, unlike a Blood Mage who is forced to CC to keep himself alive.

Never bothered with the "Improves Blood Magic" mod.  The only thing it does is make your spell cost less health.  There are better gears out there.
Aggro has never been an issue for me.  If you build your tank right, pulling aggro off of him is quite difficult.  Not to mention monsters are CC'd the entire time they can't even attack.
I only turn Blood Magic on to cast Blood Wound.  Unless in extreme and unlikely situations where I run out of Mana and Mana potions, I would never turn on Blood Magic to cast something else.
To be honest, to achieve the same effect as Overwhelm, use Paralyze, Glyph of Paralysis, Petrify, Sleep, and/or Force Prison to keep a boss completely shutdown and leaving you to throw spells at other enemies.

"All the time"? Exaggeration. Especially since Spell Resistance ignores spellpower.

Wrong, higher Spellpower means your spells are harder to resist.  As a caster Mage, I ALWAYS dump all my points into Magic, and respeccing in Awakening will cause all your Fade bonuses from BOTH games to be free points, which I dump into Magic.  In the end, even bosses can't resist most of my spells.

Exaggeration. If I were to respond similarly a Shapeshifter would just Mana Clash->Cone of Cold->Fireball->Shock->Flame Blast. Shatter not required. A Shapeshifter has the option to basically just ignore Arl Howe. Then shift, Overwhelm Howe + your allies attacking (they have been attacking Hower from the start, since he and his men somehow thought that fixating on your Shapeshifter was going to work) = dead Howe. Nothing excessive, just straightforward nuking, slicing and dicing.

Not exaggeration, I've played my main Mage character through Origins and Awakening twice already.  This game is a joke if you play a Mage PC.
I've never bothered to take any Fire or Lightning spells.  They are not worth it.  Fireball is too dangerous due to friendly fire.  Damage is a non-issue for me since Blood Wound deals so much damage.  I don't try to DPS the boss, I let the DW Backstab Rogue with Coup de Grace backstab the CC'd boss.

CC is your Blood Mage's answer to everything because being a Blood Mage your mage CAN'T fight in the forefront and reliably spam Fireball, Cone of Cold, Shock, Flame Burst, Stone Fist, etc. without taking the odd aggro and ending up quite dead. The principle of the thing is in the gameplay. A Shapeshifter does not need CC's beyond what his nukes do. CC is redundant against dead/dying enemies.

I've always spammed Cone of Cold + Stonefist combos in the front line.  I've never drawn aggro that way.  Plus, if you are really in need of mitigation for that, pop Mind Blast and throw down a Glyph of Repulsion.  With a high Spellpower, pretty much no one can resist the glyph and get hurled back.  Nothing will touch you.
I know you are a big fan of Shapeshifter, and I admit it's an interesting playstyle.  However, being viable does not make it on par with top end builds.  It may be able to breeze through the game, but it isn't as powerful as a CC/Nuker Mage.
Another problem with the Shapeshifter is that shapeshifting requires you to channel for a duration.  This is awkward during the middle of the fight, especially if you nuke a lot to gain threat in the beginning.  You could be interrupted while channeling.  I am not even exaggerating, by the time your form finishes casting, a CC/Nuker Mage would have cleared the wave by now.  Max Spellpower really adds a lot of kicks to spells like Blood Wound.  I think at later point of the game, it only takes 3-4 ticks from Blood Wound to kill enemies.  This is before Afflicting Hex.  With the additional of Awakening specialization spells, especially Draining Aura (since it also deals Spirit damage), the entire wave is cleared before the rest of my parties even touch the monsters.
For bosses, it's even more rediculous.  The boss is CC'd around 70% of the time, which makes the Rogue really happy.  In fact, I am going to go for a no Tank / no Healer run on my next playthrough just to see how it would work, because most of the fights in the game are so rediculously easy due to the fact that the monsters never even get an attack off.

Exaggeration. A single Death Hex/Crushing Prison/Virulent Walking Bomb, and a boss will be quite preoccupied with the AW for a while. Your enemies also aim for the one with the highest armor first, given the choice. Miasma can create aggro. And last but not the last,  an AW will usually be on the front during a charge, so as long as he casts Fireball/Earthquake first most monsters will only be too happy to keep attacking him while everyone else switches to kill mode.

Not exaggeration.  Without Taunt and Threaten (and Frightening Appearance), the Arcane Warrior has a much harder time to hold aggro.  With the introduction of new Warrior talents and specialization (Guardian) in Awakening, the Warrior becomes a much better tank.  Arcane Warrior may be able to utilize Battlemage spells such as Draining Aura to generate additional threat, but Draining Aura requires too much Mana to be kept.  All in all, Warriors are always going to be better tanks.  Since I never want to play an Arcane Warrior through the game (auto attacking is really, really boring), I am just going to end up getting a Warrior as a tank.

Modifié par AuraofMana, 20 mars 2010 - 04:20 .

[TBastian]

Shapeshifter doesn't need a tanker. Spell resistance is not affected by spellpower. Mental/Physical Resistance yes, Spell Resistance no. Blood Wound seems to be irresistable though, and only seems to either work or not.

I realize we have a difference of opinion, and unfortunately the only way to settle this properly is to show vids.I plan to but only after I play Awakenings more. There is still plenty to discover yet, and there will be plenty of time for discussion after the expansion loses its novelty value.

[Aisynia]

AuraofMana has the right idea. My BM/SH is essentially invincible, whether I'm on the front lines or not, and does a large share of party damage.



In fact, I would actually venture to say there are no "front lines" with a blood mage spirit healer specced for nuking and control, as you need never worry about anything ever attacking you or your party members. What little, little damage gets through is easily healed.



Shapeshifters may have things going for them, but there's a huge gap. You're spending time changing shape, I've already killed everything while it writhes about in pain unable to move.

[TBastian]

Like I said, it is a ridiculous assumption that a Shapeshifter would spend his time shifted when he can be nuking. While other mages would begin a battle by turning on their aura sustaineds and CC-ing, my Shapeshifter has already thrown a fireball and is spamming the 3 cone spells - all aggro goes to me by that point (threat = damage done). Each of my cone spells currently do 150+damage, so I can kill most white/yellow mobs easy while mages fall to Mana Clash. I can reach 70% spell resistance although I usually go with just 50, and turn on Spell Shield whenever I want to make sure Crushing Prison doesn't affect me. Scattered mobs are finished off by party members. By the time I cast my last cone, I am able to use Fireball and repeat the process again. I can repeat the combo one more time if necessary,  with Elemental Chaos running in the background and with Elemental Mastery/Stone Armor/Arcane Armor rustaineds on, before needing to use potions . And then I turn my attention to the surviving boss. I shift to a Bear, and promptly Overwhelm it for 500+ damage.
If something goes wrong, I use Mind Blast and shift or use pots. My Shapeshifter is always at the front, so there are hazards that I simply must learn to deal with (invisible Werewolves eager to Overwhelm me - I use Swarm for this, it hits for 60+ damage per tick now and is immune to any disable except stun and paralyze). I do not need a tanker, all my other party mates are DPS characters (Oghren with Zerker and Spirit Warrior, he hits for 200+ AoE spirit damage, Nathaniel does 200 damage per hit regularly with his bow and with Arrow Burst? and Velanna completes the party as a Blood Mage/Keeper/Spirit Healer... she's there simply because I like her) .
My mage's other specs are Spirit Healer (friendly fire is unavoidable for a pure nuker, and DPS characters are rather weaker defense wise) and Battlemage (more elemental damage). The whole point of taking shifter is for utility.

Modifié par TBastian, 21 mars 2010 - 12:57 .

[AuraofMana]

Shapeshifter doesn't need a tanker.

I don't know how many times I must repeat this, there is no tanking needed when all the enemies are CC'd or dead. In the rare case that you are being bashed by monsters, spells like Mind Blast and Glyph of Repulsion negates all of that.

Spell resistance is not affected by spellpower. Mental/Physical Resistance yes, Spell Resistance no.

The higher Magic you have (and thus Spellpower), the harder it is for enemies to resist your spells. Your spells are also more effective in terms of duration and effect (damage, heal amount, etc.) This has been tested, there is even a formula on wiki.

Blood Wound seems to be irresistable though, and only seems to either work or not.

I remember seeing it resisted, although rarely. With my maxed Spellpower, enemies just sit there and die because Blood Wound lasts so long and deals so much damage a tick. Blood Wound even works on Elites. Bosses seem to be the only one that resists it. They resist it so much I don't even remember when they do hit. I just don't bother casting it on them, there are single targeted CC spells for that.

Like I said, it is a ridiculous assumption that a Shapeshifter would
spend his time shifted when he can be nuking.

Nuking takes time to throw spells out, and shapeshifting has a long channeling time.  I don't know if you have the mod that negates the casting time, but I am talking about vanilla DAO.

While other mages would
begin a battle by turning on their aura sustaineds and CC-ing, my
Shapeshifter has already thrown a fireball and is spamming the cone
spells - all aggro goes to me by that point (threat = damage done).

What sustainables?  The only one I have on is Spell Wisp and Arcane Shield.  I always have them on.  Turning on Blood Magic and throwing Blood Wound takes than less than a second.  Then I can go and CC or run around with Draining Aura or One with Nature all I want, dealing all the damage I ever want because enemies are all CC'd so they can't even get a hit before they drop dead.

Each
of my cone spells currently do 150+damage, so I can kill most
white/yellow mobs easy while mages fall to Mana Clash.

Every single white mobs die to Blood Wound within 3-4 ticks.  The Rogue has the Elite dead before that because of continuous backstabs.  With maxed Spellpower, all my spells deal at least 150 damage.  Draining Aura deals 100~ damage every tick, and Blood Wound deals even more.

I can reach 70%
spell resistance although I usually go with just 50, and turn on Spell
Shield whenever I want to make sure Crushing Prison doesn't affect me.
Scattered mobs are finished off by party members. By the time I cast my
last cone, I am able to use Fireball and repeat the process again. And
then I turn my attention to a boss. I shift to a Bear, and promptly
Overwhelm it for 500+ damage.

How are enemy casters able to get a spell off when you have Mana Clash and CC?  Mobs never even scatter for me, they just stayed CC'd the entire time and drop dead within seconds.

If something goes wrong, I use Mind
Blast and shift or use pots.

How are you able to channel shapeshifting in the middle of battle if you are already being hit?

My Shapeshifter is always at the front, so
there are hazards that I simply must learn to deal with (invisible
Werewolves eager to Overwhelm me).

Stealth is not an issue, everything pops out of Stealth because they just got hit by a Blood Wound.

I do not need a tanker, all my other
party mates are DPS characters. My other specs are Spirit Healer
(friendly fire is unavoidable for a pure nuker, and DPS characters are
rather weaker defense wise) and Battlemage (more elemental damage). The
whole point of taking shifter is for utility.

It has been agreed on that utility is extremely useful if you are soloing the game.  In a party based game, specialized roles do a better job.  I run with a Warrior SnS Tank (no build can tank as well as a dedicated Warrior tank), DW Backstab Rogue (no one can outDPS a Rogue against a single target), and a dedicated Mage Healer/Buffing.  You know how the Archdemon flies to another place after losing certain amount of health?  Yeah, well I just CC him once, and the Rogue is able to deal enough damage within seconds for the Archdemon to fly somewhere else.

I understand you like Shapeshifter, but you are mistaken viable as better than top end.  Shapeshifter is viable, but not top end.

Modifié par AuraofMana, 21 mars 2010 - 01:00 .

[TBastian]

Spell Resistance. Not Mental/Physical but spell resistance. It always works regardless of your spellpower, and everything in Nightmare has it. It's the third row in the wiki.

I've never actually seen Blood Wound get spell resisted so far. I could be wrong, but I take Blood Mage a lot for NPC's.

How are you able to channel shapeshifting in the middle of battle if
you are already being hit

40% dodge gear and improved Arcane Shield, all with robes. Makes tanking with a mage trivial, really, as long as you have some heal. I guess this was why Arcane Warriors get to use armor runes that increase elemental damage.

Nuking takes time to throw spells out, and shapeshifting has a long
channeling time.  I don't know if you have the mod that negates the
casting time, but I am talking about vanilla DAO.

By the time I shift AoE's are no longer required, so the casting time is bearable.

AuraofMana, I'm actually not debating your opinions. I'm simply trying to dispel a few shifter misconceptions with first-hand info. You don't need to quote my posts, I already understand your point and know where you're coming at.

Modifié par TBastian, 21 mars 2010 - 01:09 .

[AuraofMana]

This is pulled from Wiki:

Resistance Checks



Mental and Physical Resistance Checks are of the form:



SuccessProbability = 100 - Max(Resistance - SpellPower, 0)



If Spellpower is higher than Resistance, the check will always be successful.



Monsters have an adjustment to their base resistance based on Rank and Difficulty Setting (up to 30 for a Boss).

Spells will be RESISTED if your Spellpower is not high enough, AKA they will NOT WORK. Even if they work, they will have reduced effects. This is why you want to have high Spellpower so you can beat the resistance, and then deal enough damage that even if they reduce some, they are still going to drop dead.

[TBastian]

Spell Resistance! It's different from Mental/Physical resistance. Here's the actual info:

Types of Resistances
Mental Resistance
Mental Bard songs and mind-control spells.
Possible to completely resist or take a limited debuff. Willpower + Magic - 20 up to 100% Captivating Song, Blood Control, Horror
Physical Resistance
Physical Direct attacks on the body.
Possible to completely resist or take a limited debuff. Constitution + Strength + *Dexterity - 25 up to 100% Knockdown, Earthquake, Paralyze
Spel Resistance
Spell Hostile magical spell attacks.
A percentage denotes a chance to completely resist a hostile spell. Friendly fire spell effects are applied normally. up to 100%

Everything has varying spell resistance in nightmare.

Modifié par TBastian, 21 mars 2010 - 01:11 .

[AuraofMana]

Yes, and maxing your Spellpower is the best way to counter all of that. Should I mention that Spirit, along with Electricity, are the most effective because monsters resist that the least and never had immunities toward it. This is why Blood Wound never seem to be resisted.

You want proof?  Check all the other threads, most people on the forums will agree with me on this.  You want even more proof?  Youtube and see how rediculous CC / Nuker Mage is.  There's no need to add my videos to the thousands of videos already posted.

Modifié par AuraofMana, 21 mars 2010 - 01:19 .

[TBastian]

You have no idea just how much you damaged your credibility with your last few statements there.
Can someone else please help explain the concept of Spell Resistance in more understandable terms?

The game has so many +spirit damage mods because there are very few spells that deal spirit damage. On top of that, so many enemies in Awakening are heavily resistant towards spirit damage. Not immune, yes, but heavily resistant.
I've been playing the game and doing more tests and I've just discovered that Draining Aura is actually capped at a certain damage.

You do know that as far as Awakening is concerned the majority are still in the dark? You didn't even know Draining Aura's damage was capped, didn't you? I wanted to see your vids since the vids I've seen and the posts I've read all point to a different playstyle altogether as compared to yours. Your claims that  your CC/Nuker mage is superior to my Shapeshifter interests me. Know that I am a powergamer - and I have very, very high standards.

Modifié par TBastian, 21 mars 2010 - 03:37 .

[Takrandro]

Then powergame with a good AW/BM/Battlemage, like i did, had a complete blast! since with the battlemage spec u really become a god as AW!! even more since the first new mage talent enhances the Arcane Shield spell to such a degree that together with a full AW tree u barely take any damage at all! even when i got overwhelmed i survived it without to much trouble and couse of the Stoic talent in the battlemage tree my mana was full also again! made me wish i got overwhelmed all the time!!

and when trying to figure out what damage type works the best against enemies, just activate Elemental Chaos and see to witch type they take the least damage... but i agree that u need a high magic score to have spells like crushing prison affect elite targets, altrough your frost spells still seem to work good eneugh(the new battlemage one is a real group killer)



they only should have given the expansion a higher difficulty then it has now, since its a breeze to go trough..

[TBastian]

Like I said I have very, very high standards. You want powergaming?
My Shapeshifter using Reaper's Vestments, the Spellward, the Mage's Running Boots and the First Enchanter's Cap has 40% base dodge, not including the bonus from Arcane Shield. In human form I walk around with 33 armor thanks to Rock Armor, Shifter and item bonuses, with 423 health from Master Vitality, Shifter bonuses, and items (my other ring is Lifegiver). With Key to the City I have 52% Spell Resistance on at all times, which I combine with Spell Shield against mages. I took Spirit Healer as my second spec, so I have more than enough heals. Combined with Elemental Mastery, I only have 20% fatigue, 30% with Draining Aura/Elemental Chaos on so I can cast nukes to go with with my auras. This fatigue is reduced to 1% with Invigorate from another mage. I only have 607 mana with Master Clarity and Staff of the Lost, but since I'm taking most of the aggro the Battlemage's Stoic and the mana regeneration from my items actually give me a higher mana pool in practice. And unlike a Blood Mage, I can use a poultice or use a Heal whenever I feel like it (rarely have). My spellpower is 202 by level 35, 226 with Spell Might for casting Inferno/Blizzard/Tempest (lazy spells).
In short, I can lead my party's charge and nuke to my heart's content with little to worry about. Each of my cone spells currently hit for 100-130 damage and with Fireball I can hit for 400-500 damage total per combo, and it is ready again after 15 seconds. All the while Elemental Chaos is hitting things around me for 40+ damage every 2-3 seconds. Hand of Winter finishes off with 250+ damage. In practice I can repeat the combo twice and pull off Hand of Winter before needing to use a mana potion, so as long as mobs don't resist I can basically do 1450-1650 total damage within 30 seconds, without Time Spiral. With so much aggro from my damage spells most mobs usually focus on me, so friendly fire is minimized (and Stoic is optimized). I use Group Heal to deal with friendly fire and other companion emergencies, or cast Force Field on a party member.
To top it all off, after spending all my nukes I can shift to Bear to Overwhelm survivors (usually a boss) for 600+ damage (yes I recently broke my own record). Before shifting back to human form I use Slam (Bear's Taunt) to draw Boss aggro so it focuses on me - Stoic turns each of its hits into mana for my mage. Against monsters with Overwhelm (the problem with Overwhelm is not the damage - Overwhelm disables my mage for 6-8 seconds preventing me from doing my job) I shift to Flying Swarm (immune to knockdown, knockback, Overwhelm). Swarm with Stoic is near invincible (it regenerates mana almost as fast as it loses it, and my 40% dodge complements the Swarm's natural evasion. Swarm also draws neaby aggro to it automatically - it draws so much aggro it can even aggro Taunted enemies, optimizing Stoic) and with the Spirit of the Woods gloves (+30% nature damage) my Swarm can hit for 60+ nature damage per tick - unlike Elemental Chaos, the Swarm's does damage every 1 second. There are enough Balms around that I don't have to worry bout Swarm's negative fire resistance.
So basically my Shapeshifter/Spirit Healer/Battlemage is a nuker/tanker/aggro-er/utility all in one, and all I need from teammates is DPS and warrior/rogue-specific utility.
That is powergaming. I'm not saying it's the best setup, as there should be several more powerful setups out there, but please do not take the term  "powergaming" lightly.
The expansion is very easy, yes, although not as much when you start off as an Orlesian Warden.

Let me spell it out for you. There are THREE types of resistances in the game, besides the elemental resistances  - mental, physical and spell resistance.  If you look at items like Key to the City or Reaper's Vestments, you'll see SPELL RESISTANCE and not mental/physical resistance. All monsters in nightmare have slight spell resistance. Spell Resistance can allow a monster to compleyely ignore any spell - regardless of your spellpower. If you want proof, simply look for "100 spell resistance builds" and you'll find a lot of threads about it.

Modifié par TBastian, 21 mars 2010 - 08:30 .