119 réponses à ce sujet

[redleafchewer]

Bigdoser wrote...

Booglarize wrote...

 People, you should know this by now - the very first characters who join you in BioWare games generally don't have great life expectancies. They've done this before, they'll do it again. Sure, they bamboozled us a wee bit by playing her up as a companion, but even then, we all saw it coming a little.

I mean, after they went and actually killed off my mom in the beginning of Origins, I knew they meant business. BioWare has no compunctions about using characters as temporary plot devices - even if they have to kill your family to do it. 

This.

The difference being, the Cousland mother, like Daveth and Jori,  was not put forth as a recruitable regular party member.  This is actually the first time I've seen them kill one off this early without options.  Usually it's more towards the endgame when one has to deal with it.  

Fortunately, I tend to play mages and rogues, so the loss of a tank character early on has no effect on my gameplay.

[Maria Caliban]

redleafchewer wrote...

"When Mhairi was a child, she was enraptured by tales of kings and nobles. All she wanted was to be like them, to fight for what she believed. Betrothed to a trader when she turned 16, she saw the life that lay ahead of her and enlisted in the army instead. Her fierce loyalty and devotion to Ferelden earned her the love and respect of her commanders and brothers-in-arms. King Cailan’s betrayal and death hit Mhairi hard, and when she learned of the two Grey Wardens who quelled the Blight almost single-handedly, she vowed to serve the Wardens. When
the call came for volunteers to help rebuild the order at Vigil’s Keep, Mhairi jumped at the chance to join."


Punked is the proper term

I gave her Yersirus. She was going to be my Ser Cauthrien.

[J-Reyno]

Yeah I was really expecting mom to be a full-fledged companion, what with her trailer and all. Reminding me to brush my teeth and wash my undies in camp. Having old woman banter with Wynne about Alistair's tight ass.

Anyway, I think part of the rage is the fact that there isn't as much to choose from, and given Mhairi's race, gender, and class she was highly anticipated. No doubt she was part of many's excitement for the game. It's not about in-game certain death and realism, it's about out of game being mislead. We are roleplayers. I am not the Warden, and don't need someone to try to make me feel emotional impact with these kinds of tactics. The only emotion I get is confusion, followed closely by rage, ending with disappointment.

It's just cheap. It would have been much better if companions had never been explicitely revealed (perhaps only bits of footage in non-companion-specific trailers) and we were left to guess as we played the game. That would have been far more effective for "realism".

[Jax Sparrow]

I am already on the fifth stage of acceptance... whatever happens... happens.  However, I believe they can still change it if they really want too.   Sure any campaign running now has her dead but how many people would restart their character if there was a way to keep Mhairi alive?   As it stands now? this is a marketing disaster for them because I love Dragon Age but if anyone asks me for my opinion? I'd tell them to wait for the book. Why? because like Reyno said the only response BioWare gets from this stunt? is anger from those who cared.   Those who did not care? BioWare failed to 'engage' them anyhow.  So whoever thought this idea up? failed in a huge way.

A month from now? every potential buyer will know how BioWare marketing treats its customers and what the game really has in it. You think that is a good thing? I have a strange feeling BioWare might end up wanting to avoid it.

Modifié par Jax Sparrow, 17 mars 2010 - 04:53 .

[Satanic Hamster]

Figures, the lame mage lives and the hot chick dies.



You know, they've mentioned several times that Grey Warden's keeping non-Warden troops attached to them; makes sense, no reason to waste too many people with the Joining. Still, you'd think they would have worked on some sort of test/screening for the Joining, figure out why people die. Or a way to lesson the fatality rate.



__________________

Currently listening to Yui's Can't Buy My Love

[Hyper Cutter]

Satanic Hamster wrote...
Still, you'd think they would have worked on some sort of test/screening for the Joining, figure out why people die. Or a way to lesson the fatality rate.

Sadly, the only person who seems to have ever tried that is Avernus...

Modifié par Hyper Cutter, 17 mars 2010 - 05:54 .

[neozurg]

And she had a nice rack too...

heheheheh

[Dasher10]

bring her back as a ghost in DA2!

[ZaroktheImmortal]

The problem is they introduced as one of the main characters of the game even created a video for her and everything. And they go kill her off early on in the game. While it can be dramatic it seems like a bad decision especially if some people were planning on having her as one of their main party characters.

[rak72]

I didn't mind her dying - she was too much of a bootlicker. I like Anders, Alistair would have thought twice about going to do his kingly duties if Anders was romancable

[CybAnt1]

Bah, it just bugs me that unlike previous "redshirts" she had an approval bar. This fools you into thinking she'll stick around. Nice psyche job.



I only mind it from a practical point of view.



After she dies, you only have one warrior (Oghren), and getting the other (Justice) takes a long freaking time.



If you're an Oghren hater - well you've gotta get over it, he's your only warrior option for a large swath of the game, there aren't even "pseudo" warriors like Shale or Dog.



The good news is Sigrun starts with something like 40 STR, which is astounding for a rogue, and medium to heavy armor, so she's a pretty good stand-in.

[roundcrow]

I didn't watch the trailers, so I didn't feel betrayed or lost - I just thought "M*********** s***, they'd better put Duncan's sword and Howe's shield back in my inventory (the answer: they did).



After that, well, not everyone survives the Joining. You're the Commander now and you have to deal with that. As well as everyone in Thedas asking you for favors. It ain't all dragon jumping, you know.



Also, FWIW, I like Oghren. There but for Andraste's Grace go I, is what I thought when I met him.

[cooldevo]

You gave Mhairi expensive gifts, didn't you?  Fitted her with your Armor of the Legion?  Wade's Superior Dragonbone Plate?

In my PC version, I gave her the best warrior armor and weapons I had on me at the time (from an imported game, which was nice Tier 7 stuff) right from the get-go.  When she died I found all the armor, jewelry, and weapon returned back into my inventory.  I didn't give her any gifts though.  I wasn't bummed at losing any equipment.

Same with all the armor from the DA:O party members.  When I first imported and looked my inventory, I was carrying everything that I had put on my party players (minus the DLC) which I was pleasantly surprised at.  Granted I was loaded to 80-ish/120 backpack slots which I wasn't so happy with, but made it through the keep with 1 space to spare.  When I sold the pieces I wouldn't need for the reduced party member count, it netted me several hundred soverign (275 if I recall correctly).

[dunachar]

I was actually glad it was her that died to tell the truth, I really liked Anders, and Ohgren is funny as hell.....Mhairi was just kind of ........eh.

[Cancermeat]

I was waiting for Ashton Kutcher to pop out somewhere after her joining.

[Daigoji Gai]

Reyno411 wrote...

Yeah I was really expecting mom to be a full-fledged companion, what with her trailer and all. Reminding me to brush my teeth and wash my undies in camp. Having old woman banter with Wynne about Alistair's tight ass.

Anyway, I think part of the rage is the fact that there isn't as much to choose from, and given Mhairi's race, gender, and class she was highly anticipated. No doubt she was part of many's excitement for the game. It's not about in-game certain death and realism, it's about out of game being mislead. We are roleplayers. I am not the Warden, and don't need someone to try to make me feel emotional impact with these kinds of tactics. The only emotion I get is confusion, followed closely by rage, ending with disappointment.

It's just cheap. It would have been much better if companions had never been explicitely revealed (perhaps only bits of footage in non-companion-specific trailers) and we were left to guess as we played the game. That would have been far more effective for "realism".

I'm a roleplayer too, and I topped off a chalice of mead and poured some out for the fallen Warden homies. A roleplayer like you shouldn't be so bitter about such things, and realize that is part of the fun of getting in character. If you were so head over heals for her (my char was smitten) it should only reinforce my desire to hunt down, decapitate and brtually crush every damn darkspawn that crossed my path (including poor chaged man and the messenger  in late game Amaranthine )

Again, maybe being an old school DnD pen and paper player (still got my first and second edition handbooks) you don't always get what you want, and not getting your way isn't cheap, but what makes roleplaying what it is, learning to deal when things go your way and more importantly when they don't.

[Daigoji Gai]

Cancermeat wrote...

I was waiting for Ashton Kutcher to pop out somewhere after her joining.

DRAGONFLY EFFECT: Your warden goes back in time to prevent the joining, only to cause unexpected larger consequences in the future of Ameranthine and Ferelden!

[Gaudion]

This irks me for several reasons. Primarily that she was the only character aside from Velanna I was actually looking forward to interacting with.

Additionally, she was the only logical choice for a sword-and-board Warrior. Which, when you consider the lack of additional Warrior-analogues, means she was the only logical choice for a tank in the entire damn game. Now I'm going to be forced to respec and roll with either Oghren (who has repulsed me since Origins) or Justice, who doesn't interest me in the slightest.

Modifié par Gaudion, 18 mars 2010 - 05:15 .

[Daigoji Gai]

Gaudion wrote...

This irks me for several reasons. Primarily that she was the only character aside from Velanna I was actually looking forward to interacting with.

Egad good Lord Gaudion... you like the waif-like ladies eh?
Note to Bioware: Don't tease these poor gamers with waif-like goddesses that get killed. The trauma is unbearable for some. 

Additionally, she was the only logical choice for a sword-and-board Warrior. Which, when you consider the lack of additional Warrior-analogues, means she was the only logical choice for a tank in the entire damn game.

Wait, only logical choice for a tank?

She could have been a DPS char or a tank , given there are plenty of tanks and dps giving companions, it isn't the only logical choice.

Now I'm going to be forced to respec and roll with either Oghren (who has repulsed me since Origins) or Justice, who doesn't interest me in the slightest.

Aha! So the penny drops. Why respec? There are other logical choices for tanks, it is just that you don't like the other tank options. Why the dwarf hate? They are good stout peoples and Oghren's foul breath can become an aquired taste! And why all the hate for the virtue of Justice! He is a good guy, learning that our realm is full of new sights, sounds and experiences from him including, as Oghren points out "polishing the southern pony"  rawr *paws at air* rawr

Don't respec! Egad, take your character and try to go for a new experience! It is what makes RPGs like this great!

Modifié par Daigoji Gai, 18 mars 2010 - 05:36 .

[q0rra]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

That's the whole point. You need to see people, good people, die to truly be a Grey Warden commander. I love it! Teasing us with a pseudo-Ser Cauthrien, only to take her away by the joining. That's the tragedy of the Wardens.

Indeed. Unexpected, heartbreaking, yet very welcome.

[WildcardOne]

I understand that the devs might have thought it'd be lame if 3 people underwent the Joining and no one died. But what they should have done was have 6-7 people try the joining, have all die except the advertised companions. Killing off Mhairi was the worst possible introduction to the game, especially considering she had one of the more interesting character trailers.

[Daigoji Gai]

WildcardOne wrote...

I understand that the devs might have thought it'd be lame if 3 people underwent the Joining and no one died. But what they should have done was have 6-7 people try the joining, have all die except the advertised companions. Killing off Mhairi was the worst possible introduction to the game, especially considering she had one of the more interesting character trailers.

The thing is, 6-7 people it would have been too obvious, dare I say transparent. Of course, this is IMHO.

The fact that one can die during the joining was almost forgotten by me. It was in the back of my head, but surely I personally wasn't expecting it.

Now what would be interesting, specifically for DA2, would be if it was a random factor. There is a 50/50 chance of a person surviving - a flip of a coin. So in one playthrough a char may survive, in another, the person may not make it. That may cut down on the frustration some are facing given Mhairi bit the dust.

Egad, is it bad I actually cheered she bit the dust after all the hype?  IMHO, I still think it was a great way to open and made me seriously think no one is sacred (like in the movie Serenity - even the most beloved characters are not immune from death and there isn't always a happy ending)

[Merci357]

WildcardOne wrote...

I understand that the devs might have thought it'd be lame if 3 people underwent the Joining and no one died. But what they should have done was have 6-7 people try the joining, have all die except the advertised companions. Killing off Mhairi was the worst possible introduction to the game, especially considering she had one of the more interesting character trailers.

well, it's only the worst possible introduction for us, that looked forward playing with Mhairi. Yes, it's a shame, but replacing her with random redshirts at the joining won't have the same impact. That said, i'd rather sacrifice Oghren (the old "favorite"... or not) for the same effect

[Daigoji Gai]

Merci357 wrote...

WildcardOne wrote...

I understand that the devs might have thought it'd be lame if 3 people underwent the Joining and no one died. But what they should have done was have 6-7 people try the joining, have all die except the advertised companions. Killing off Mhairi was the worst possible introduction to the game, especially considering she had one of the more interesting character trailers.

well, it's only the worst possible introduction for us, that looked forward playing with Mhairi. Yes, it's a shame, but replacing her with random redshirts at the joining won't have the same impact. That said, i'd rather sacrifice Oghren (the old "favorite"... or not) for the same effect

/agreed, and kudos for using "red shirts" so appropriate! ( ) her armor does have a redish/copper tint no? LOL!