133 réponses à ce sujet

[sanadawarrior]

marshalleck wrote...

Marta Rio wrote...

flem1 wrote...

VGChartz is not a legitimate news source. Their numbers are baloney.

Could you direct us to a better source so that we have some hope of discussing non-baloney sales figures?

Try looking for NPD sales reports. They collect point-of-sale data from a number of retail sources. The thing is, market research is an imperfect science. People will find flaws in any methodology.

Information is a commodity, and the more accurate and in-depth it is the less likely it's going to be made available for free.

Problem is, acording to the NPD it sold worse than what VGchartz said it did...

[marshalleck]

sanadawarrior wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

Marta Rio wrote...

flem1 wrote...

VGChartz is not a legitimate news source. Their numbers are baloney.

Could you direct us to a better source so that we have some hope of discussing non-baloney sales figures?

Try looking for NPD sales reports. They collect point-of-sale data from a number of retail sources. The thing is, market research is an imperfect science. People will find flaws in any methodology.

Information is a commodity, and the more accurate and in-depth it is the less likely it's going to be made available for free.

Problem is, acording to the NPD it sold worse than what VGchartz said it did...

I'm not sure that's a problem unless you can identify a retail POS they failed to account for. Accurate data is not a problem even if it's not the results you want.

Modifié par marshalleck, 17 mars 2010 - 04:41 .

[Murmillos]

Mass Effect 4: The Skyllian Blitz
Includes a 5-7 hour single player game, and a Online Massive Multiplayer mode pitting you and your friends against a large force of mercenaries and pirates attack (or play against your friends as one of the invading mercenaries/pirates). Includes up to 15 maps covering the different areas of the invasion from sky-lined cities, industrial centers, residential areas, farms, a space port and mountainous terrain.

This would sell more copies in 2 weeks then all of ME1, 2 &3 combined.

Modifié par Murmillos, 17 mars 2010 - 05:13 .

[llinsane1ll]

Something is wrong with the charts on the 1st link. Says a TOTAL of 1.5 million copies sold. Within 2 weeks, Mass Effect 2 sold over 2 million... They got their **** messed up

[SimonTheFrog]

A lot of titles that are very well sold are franchises. Don't underestimate the power of recognition in the shop shelves.

BioWare is basically a newcomer for consoles and even more so for shooter oriented games, so there are some obstacle for them to take when it comes to competing with the top sellers.

I just hope they sell enough for them to justify the high costs of production. ME2 must have been painfully expensive to make...

[Murmillos]

llinsane1ll wrote...

Something is wrong with the charts on the 1st link. Says a TOTAL of 1.5 million copies sold. Within 2 weeks, Mass Effect 2 sold over 2 million... They got their **** messed up

No.. its 1.5 million over 6 weeks (for the 360)

[Fiery Phoenix]

Murmillos wrote...

Mass Effect 4: The Skyllian Blitz
Includes a 5-7 hour single player game, and a Online Massive Multiplayer mode pitting you and your friends against a large force of mercenaries and pirates attack (or play against your friends as one of the invading mercenaries/pirates). Includes up to 15 maps covering the different areas of the invasion from sky-lined cities, industrial centers, residential areas, farms, a space port and mountainous terrain.

This would sell more copies in 2 weeks then all of ME1, 2 &3 combined.

I love you. 

Modifié par FieryPhoenix7, 17 mars 2010 - 05:22 .

[KotOREffecT]

yoomazir wrote...

with the exeption of the people who cares about the ME universe, ME2 is already been forgotten by the gamers, it didn't leave a mark like ME did.
Check for example Darkdsydephil (DSP) videos on youtube, the guy played FOUR TIMES ME, he absolutely loved the game, for ME2? he played once and never touched it afterward.
ME was goty material, ME2? dude, Bioshock 2 would have better chances, and you know what? both sequels suck.

I bet THIS HURTS YOU to know that ME 2 will most likely sell more than ME 1, and the fact that ME 2 was the highest selling game for the month of January, and it was only released on the 26...

[easternswordman]

Murmillos wrote...

Mass Effect 4: The Skyllian Blitz
Includes a 5-7 hour single player game, and a Online Massive Multiplayer mode pitting you and your friends against a large force of mercenaries and pirates attack (or play against your friends as one of the invading mercenaries/pirates). Includes up to 15 maps covering the different areas of the invasion from sky-lined cities, industrial centers, residential areas, farms, a space port and mountainous terrain.

This would sell more copies in 2 weeks then all of ME1, 2 &3 combined.

Um...EA's gatta buy in Bungie first after they break away from Microsoft.

[easternswordman]

llinsane1ll wrote...

Something is wrong with the charts on the 1st link. Says a TOTAL of 1.5 million copies sold. Within 2 weeks, Mass Effect 2 sold over 2 million... They got their **** messed up

I'm sure they aren't accurate, too. Even though 1.5m is only for 360, it's too few compared to 2m total first week sell. Also according to them ME2 sold 0.96m first week on 360. Can't imagine the other 1.04m were sold on PC cuz usually PC don't sell as many as console.

[rabbitchannel]

yoomazir wrote...

with the exeption of the people who cares about the ME universe, ME2 is already been forgotten by the gamers, it didn't leave a mark like ME did.
Check for example Darkdsydephil (DSP) videos on youtube, the guy played FOUR TIMES ME, he absolutely loved the game, for ME2? he played once and never touched it afterward.
ME was goty material, ME2? dude, Bioshock 2 would have better chances, and you know what? both sequels suck.

So, so bitter. ME 2 is just as appealing. Let me contradict your very specific example of one random gamer used in a weird attempt to generalize the worldwide appeal of ME 2 versus ME 1 with my own example. I played ME 1 4 times and I just started on my 5th ME 2 run. I absolutely loved the first game and I absolutely loved the second game. Hey, wait! You know what? Both those examples are so select that they don't even matter in the first place.

[Vena_86]

It was said already. The biggest reason is that most people don't like to use their brains.



The media is in a circle where products need to be dumb on the inside and flashy on the outside to appeal to the broad mass of people. This is true for music, movies and games.



Now developers and publishers can say "But we just want to make money with our work." But it is essentially their fault too that the broad mass of people is so simplistic because they give in to that demand and at the same time make the stupid crowd grow even larger. Everyone is lazy (except japanese people) and if you let them be lazy, then there will be no demand for more sophisticated products anymore.

And it is no secret that the Mass Effect franchise is going down that path too.



But despite good reviews you have people that are turned of by RPGs (ME2 still is one at heart) and also dissappointed Mass Effect 1 fans, that did not preorder right away which reduce the sales.

[RcMnt5]

ME would definately sell better if had online feature, I noticed how many people at my prefered game stop came in looking ready to get until they heard it hat no online game play (dumb-atses).

[Chaoswind]

Vena_86 wrote...

It was said already. The biggest reason is that most people don't like to use their brains.

The media is in a circle where products need to be dumb on the inside and flashy on the outside to appeal to the broad mass of people. This is true for music, movies and games.

Now developers and publishers can say "But we just want to make money with our work." But it is essentially their fault too that the broad mass of people is so simplistic because they give in to that demand and at the same time make the stupid crowd grow even larger. Everyone is lazy (except japanese people) and if you let them be lazy, then there will be no demand for more sophisticated products anymore.
And it is no secret that the Mass Effect franchise is going down that path too.

But despite good reviews you have people that are turned of by RPGs (ME2 still is one at heart) and also dissappointed Mass Effect 1 fans, that did not preorder right away which reduce the sales.

I beg to differ...

People use their brains in lan parties and multiplayer, the only difference is that they can show up and brag about it... when you play in Single Player, yeah you use your brain and overcome challening situations... but who else cares? to who you are going to brag?

The days of lone gamers playing in a dark room because the public society doesn't understand them, ARE OVER.
In this day and age, gamers can publicly say their achievements and not being shut down by it.

In this days games are like sports, and games that exploit and reward team effort are sure to get an edge in the market.

[Dethateer]

It would sell better, but it would also suck more. Much more.

[Chaoswind]

Messed conection>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Modifié par Chaoswind, 17 mars 2010 - 05:58 .

[Cross1280]

Personally, I do not even think the WII should be on that list as it is a market entirely unto itself, You have Doctors recommending WII fit to paitents, as a form of physical therepy, Hell even the retirerment home my grandmother lives in has WII tournemts vs. other retirement homes in the area. they use it for there excercise classes, sports nights.

[Dethateer]

Chaoswind wrote...

Messed conection>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Wasn't replying to you. You just posted while I was writing that.

[easternswordman]

Vena_86 wrote...

It was said already. The biggest reason is that most people don't like to use their brains.

The media is in a circle where products need to be dumb on the inside and flashy on the outside to appeal to the broad mass of people. This is true for music, movies and games.

Now developers and publishers can say "But we just want to make money with our work." But it is essentially their fault too that the broad mass of people is so simplistic because they give in to that demand and at the same time make the stupid crowd grow even larger. Everyone is lazy (except japanese people) and if you let them be lazy, then there will be no demand for more sophisticated products anymore.
And it is no secret that the Mass Effect franchise is going down that path too.

But despite good reviews you have people that are turned of by RPGs (ME2 still is one at heart) and also dissappointed Mass Effect 1 fans, that did not preorder right away which reduce the sales.

Well, I would disagree on some of things you said.


First, people have different gaming philosophies. Some people are more dedicated gamers, but others may just play games to relax from their busy and stressful daliy lives. Of course there are also dumbs you mentioned that will only go for big explosions, but you can't blame that everyone is lazy cuz they don't dedicate enough on gaming.


Second, good games could draw people in and make them adapt the game's philosophy to some degree. Many people never played a computer game or an RPG before they touched World of Warcraft; Playing a shooter well also requires skills and practice, but many newcomers got well along with Halo and COD; I don't know if anyone noticed Starcraft II beta recently, but It's extremely strategic and prob even more than the first game, however I think that game is going to sell well. We'll wait and see.


Third, honestly ME franchise isn't really the game that you need to think ton a lot to play well. But you do need to get into the story to fully enjoy what it offers. However many people are overwhelmed by the conversation wheel. They're just still not used to this way of gaming. They'd say:" If I wanna hear some dialogue I'll go watch a movie instead of playing a game."


Maybe I'm bias but I just don't think all the people out there who don't like conversation in ME are dumbasses. They just need to get used to it by a brilliant way which hasn't come up yet.

Modifié par easternswordman, 17 mars 2010 - 06:19 .

[bjdbwea]

It's because of the complicated inventory... uh, wait... ME 2 doesn't have one.

Perhaps because RPGs are so complicated... uh, wait... ME 2 has virtually removed that part.

Maybe people don't like levels where you have more than one way to proceed... uh, wait... ME 2 doesn't have that anymore.

So maybe it's because the new target audience - the shooter crowd - didn't buy the game in as large numbers as BioWare/EA hoped, because even with all the dumbing down you still have to do more than shooting stuff? And the shooting stuff doesn't work as flawlessly as in real shooters. Hopefully the lesson would be to cater less to that group, and more to the people who always bought and loved BioWare games.

Modifié par bjdbwea, 17 mars 2010 - 06:22 .

[Blk_Mage_Ctype]

Because it's not an overhyped rehash of Final Fantasy VII, VIII, & X... 

[hex23]

NPD isn't accurate. Neither is VGChartz.

It's meant to be an estimate. VG changed their first week sales for "ME2" 2-3 times. So....which is accurate?

By their own admission NPD only counts about 60% of the retailers in the U.S., and doesn't count Wal-Mart, the biggest U.S. retailer. Also, they don't count digital distribution sales, or (although this might've changed recently) PC sales.

To put it into perspective "ME2" was on the Direct2Drive top 10 best sellers list from mid January, up until last week. None of those sales are being tracked.

So in short, this isn't worth discussing because the two sources of info (VG and NPD) aren't accurate.

Modifié par hex23, 17 mars 2010 - 06:56 .

[easternswordman]

hex23 wrote...

NPD isn't accurate. Neither is VGChartz.

It's meant to be an estimate. VG changed their first week sales for "ME2" 2-3 times. So....which is accurate?

By their own admission NPD only counts about 60% of the retailers in the U.S., and doesn't count Wal-Mart, the biggest U.S. retailer. Also, they don't count digital distribution sales, or (although this might've changed recently) PC sales.

To put it into perspective "ME2" was on the Direct2Drive top 10 best sellers list from mid January, up until last week. None of those sales are being tracked.

So in short, this isn't worth discussing because the two sources of info (VG and NPD) aren't accurate.

I know, the data are not accurate. That's why I only compare based on platforms, say, copies sold only on 360.

Since we're mainly doing horizontal comparisons here, there's still some discussing value. Like you said, the data is just estimate. It didn't count every sell for ME2, neither it did for every other game. I know it's not 100% accurate, but we can still compare the sale number between ME2 and other games.

Modifié par easternswordman, 17 mars 2010 - 07:04 .

[Jaysonie]

Kalfear wrote...

JLBoyyy wrote...

its because what you pointed out (propa for info) and the fact that most people probably do not enjoy rpgs and only single-player gameplay (at least most of the time). well anyway, thats what i think

also, good luck to your friend because ME2 is more combat

I didnt read the whole opening post but saw yours.

DA:O is selling better then ME2 and doing great in sales.

ME2 is not selling as expected because the majority word of mouth is not good for game.
Game got a huge pre order from the ME1 fan and people sold on ME2 by the ME1 fans and then it dried up cause people actually played the game and it pales in comparrision to the first one.
Yes combat is better but combat is low priority in a RPG.
Listen, ME1,2,3,...191 is never going to be a true shooter because its to wordy and shooter fans want to enter and shoot, not watch and read for 5 minutes here and there for half or even 1/10th of the game, they want to shoot!

RPG fans want depth, emotional connection, MEANINGFUL STORY, interactiveness. ME2 fails on almost ever level of those demands.

Im not saying ME2 a bad game, its not, its a BAD Mass Effect GAME because ME1 set the bar so high.
That why personally I think Christina Norman and here little poower point presentation is insulting and void of understanding the REAL PROBLEM! Completely went over her head and in her own arrogence she things it her combat changes that brought the majority of people that did buy the game. Hey missy, most people bought the game cause they loved ME1, you had nothing to do with the equation.

Game sales are disappointing cause those folks that waited for the unbias player and website reveiws from those that actually didnt get free copies and paid for game was not all that great! For every "yeaaaaaa the game is perfect" post there is 100 disappointed posts. Fanbois can down play that all they want, people noticed that.
I know at my local game story and comic store I get attacked with questions on ME and Bioware/RPG games and I heard ALOT of, "well I got told this aspect was lacking in game" type questions and most of them were dead on and ended up those people (easily 50 in my circle of aquintences) ended up not buying ME2 cause of reveiws.
I 50 I know didnt buy, imagine how many that works out to if its even 10 for each of those 50?
Word of mouth matters and no amount of spin marketting or power point presentations will erase that!

Oh and ask yourself this, if me, a life long fan of Bioware games, this negative about ME2 shortcomings, imagine how bad the reveiws are from people that not Bioware fans to begin with!

Thats why the sales not as good as expected (still great, just not amazing)

You do like to make up facts, and you also seem to think you speak for a large amount of people. Truth is, ME2 has(according to vgchartz and npd) outsold all three versions of dragon age. Not combined but seeing as how Dragon Age is on three systems, i think its a great accomplishment. And, if you dont trust reviews thats fine but dont say every reviewer was bribed or has a bias.

[TJSolo]

flem1 wrote...

Marta Rio wrote...

flem1 wrote...

VGChartz is not a legitimate news source. Their numbers are baloney.

Could you direct us to a better source so that we have some hope of discussing non-baloney sales figures?

Unfortunately, there aren't any open to the public.  We just have to keep an eye on corporate announcements on sales numbers, units shipped, etc.

Bio already warned that VGCharz numbers on ME1 were bull.

Not bull but stating the first week sales on ME1 actually looked better by their books then was reported on VGchartz.
He didn't state a margin of error and the first week numbers actually in question aren't even the same on the site at this time. Dated article.
The statement was just ME1 appeared to have sold more then was was reported.

I have seen the first week sales posted as reasons for ME2s greatness and very little renoucement of vgchartz.
Now the numbers look a little different and so many people are are calling the site a bad and inaccurate place to make a claim off of.
I guess it is just a rule of convenience that if something works for your cause, support it. If it doesn't support you then just demonize it.