194 réponses à ce sujet

[Schroing]

KarmaTheAlligator wrote...

Guys, get you own thread to discuss this, would you?

Our...I don't really know what to call it, but our thing is no less derailed than your conversation, there.
So you first.

[thegreateski]

HELL NO!

Let them TheTrooper argue. It's what the Internet is for.

Modifié par thegreateski, 20 mars 2010 - 01:41 .

[KarmaTheAlligator]

Schroing wrote...

KarmaTheAlligator wrote...

Guys, get you own thread to discuss this, would you?

Our...I don't really know what to call it, but our thing is no less derailed than your conversation, there.
So you first.

Well at least we're still talking about the game <_<

[TheTrooper1138]

Little Paw wrote...

To the OP:
Atheism solves a lot of issues for me that the original poster brings up.
She was saved by science, and medical fact.
Religion and/or philosophical pretense is a made up reality that has no bearing on this fact.
Fact, she was dead.
Fact, she is now alive.
That is all I need.
Man should make his own reality, rather than believe in a made up one.

So by making up one's own reality, you really mean, just accept an atheist view point and don't ask questions about life (or rather the meaning of it)? I believe in none of the established religions, but there's enough in this world to make me believe there's more to this than the materialistic side. 
And if you just accept Atheism as your new "religion", then that's just the same as believing in "God" without questioning that belief.

[Schroing]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

Do you know what the term "common knowledge" means?
Do you understand how it applies to debates and intellectualism in general? 
Germany does have schools as well, yes?

Well, excuse me, if we don't learn about American extremist movements in German schools...   
Look, there's no such thing as "pro-life" over here, abortions are generally accepted and nobody is making a fuss about it. And the impression we have over here, is that it's an American right-wing Christian thing. Now, if you are an American and know better, either tell me about it, or if I'm right, then just stfu...
I bet you don't know about what's going on over here concerning public opinion or movements, so can your arrogance... 
  

I'm hardly being arrogant by belittling you for ignorance.
And, in fact, your own general arrogance - labeling contradictory or foreign views as "extremism" is hardly civil, and even less logical.
It's just not my duty to educate you. The burden of proof does not apply to extremely basic (conventional) knowledge - if you can't bother to understand the subject, don't try to have a conversation about. Etc, etc, etc.

[TheTrooper1138]

Schroing wrote...

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

Do you know what the term "common knowledge" means?
Do you understand how it applies to debates and intellectualism in general? 
Germany does have schools as well, yes?

Well, excuse me, if we don't learn about American extremist movements in German schools...   
Look, there's no such thing as "pro-life" over here, abortions are generally accepted and nobody is making a fuss about it. And the impression we have over here, is that it's an American right-wing Christian thing. Now, if you are an American and know better, either tell me about it, or if I'm right, then just stfu...
I bet you don't know about what's going on over here concerning public opinion or movements, so can your arrogance... 
  

I'm hardly being arrogant by belittling you for ignorance.
And, in fact, your own general arrogance - labeling contradictory or foreign views as "extremism" is hardly civil, and even less logical.
It's just not my duty to educate you. The burden of proof does not apply to extremely basic (conventional) knowledge - if you can't bother to understand the subject, don't try to have a conversation about. Etc, etc, etc.

lol, that's basically the definition of arrogance you gave there, but anyways..
If you choose not to have an abortion, because you believe in the whole "pro-life" crap, than that's your choice. If you want to force that decision on others and even make a fuss about a VG making a reference to that, then you're an extremist... pretty simple, nothing to do with arrogance.
And as I said, from what I know here in Germany (and what American TV shows seem to confirm), it's a Christian thing. If it's not, then provide some proof to support this claim. So far you've been unable to do so, so I guess I'm right.

[thegreateski]

You are generalizing Trooper.



Your avatar has blond hair.



You must have blond hair.



Blonds are dumb.



You are dumb.



see?

[Schroing]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

Do you know what the term "common knowledge" means?
Do you understand how it applies to debates and intellectualism in general? 
Germany does have schools as well, yes?

Well, excuse me, if we don't learn about American extremist movements in German schools...   
Look, there's no such thing as "pro-life" over here, abortions are generally accepted and nobody is making a fuss about it. And the impression we have over here, is that it's an American right-wing Christian thing. Now, if you are an American and know better, either tell me about it, or if I'm right, then just stfu...
I bet you don't know about what's going on over here concerning public opinion or movements, so can your arrogance... 
  

I'm hardly being arrogant by belittling you for ignorance.
And, in fact, your own general arrogance - labeling contradictory or foreign views as "extremism" is hardly civil, and even less logical.
It's just not my duty to educate you. The burden of proof does not apply to extremely basic (conventional) knowledge - if you can't bother to understand the subject, don't try to have a conversation about. Etc, etc, etc.

lol, that's basically the definition of arrogance you gave there, but anyways..
If you choose not to have an abortion, because you believe in the whole "pro-life" crap, than that's your choice. If you want to force that decision on others and even make a fuss about a VG making a reference to that, then you're an extremist... pretty simple, nothing to do with arrogance.
And as I said, from what I know here in Germany (and what American TV shows seem to confirm), it's a Christian thing. If it's not, then provide some proof to support this claim. So far you've been unable to do so, so I guess I'm right.

I think I'm starting to understand the problem here - you're a ****ing idiot.

[TheTrooper1138]

Schroing wrote...

I think I'm starting to understand the problem here - you're a ****ing idiot.

Coming from the guy who hasn't brought forward one valid argument so far. :innocent:


@thegreateski: elaborate on where I am generalizing please. 

[Schroing]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

I think I'm starting to understand the problem here - you're a ****ing idiot.

Coming from the guy who hasn't brought forward one valid argument so far. :innocent:

You haven't given me one valid reason to do so.

[TheTrooper1138]

Schroing wrote...

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

I think I'm starting to understand the problem here - you're a ****ing idiot.

Coming from the guy who hasn't brought forward one valid argument so far. :innocent:

You haven't given me one valid reason to do so.

I certainly was able to elaborate on my argument more than you with your one-sentence replies... so either bring some arguments to prove your point or stfu. I'm still waiting. If you prove you're right, I will even admit it, so far you haven't done so. As I said, the impression "we" have over here is that it's a right-wing Christian thing, since we don't know the issue as such. So if you as an American (assuming you are one) know better, then please share, otherwise... 

[Schroing]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

I think I'm starting to understand the problem here - you're a ****ing idiot.

Coming from the guy who hasn't brought forward one valid argument so far. :innocent:

You haven't given me one valid reason to do so.

I certainly was able to elaborate on my argument more than you with your one-sentence replies...

Quality, not quantity, please.

so either bring some arguments to prove your point or stfu. I'm still waiting. If you prove you're right, I will even admit it, so far you haven't done so. As I said, the impression "we" have over here is that it's a right-wing Christian thing, since we don't know the issue as such. So if you as an American (assuming you are one) know better, then please share, otherwise... 

-Idiot-.

[Little Paw]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Little Paw wrote...

To the OP:
Atheism solves a lot of issues for me that the original poster brings up.
She was saved by science, and medical fact.
Religion and/or philosophical pretense is a made up reality that has no bearing on this fact.
Fact, she was dead.
Fact, she is now alive.
That is all I need.
Man should make his own reality, rather than believe in a made up one.

So by making up one's own reality, you really mean, just accept an atheist view point and don't ask questions about life (or rather the meaning of it)? I believe in none of the established religions, but there's enough in this world to make me believe there's more to this than the materialistic side. 
And if you just accept Atheism as your new "religion", then that's just the same as believing in "God" without questioning that belief.

No by making up reality I mean religion is made up.
How do you surmise all of you say from me saying I am atheist? Atheist as a new religion? I never said that. That is quite contrdictory to what atheism is. Theists like to say atheism is just another belief but it is actually non-belief.
Beliving in science and fact is practical, not a belief "system".
Questions about life? Ever read any good existential books? You can question life without religion.
Atheists question life all the time.
Asimov, Ayn Rand, Douglas Adams, Dave Barry, to name a few, and the list goes on.
I simply stated that science and fact make me feel okay about Shep's death and subsequent being brough back to life. Atheism is the non-belief system that makes it so I do not need to contemplate any ethical, moral, or philisophical meaning to it.
Simple.
Your post is a bit of conjecture so feel free to "ask" me questions, but please do not assume what I am thinking.
I question life all the time, but in the scope of ME2 I played the character as accepting her new "life" as a gift of science, and some funding by a suspect organization. Simple as that.
I suppose there is the question of "did she see a birght light", which would make for an interesting diversion, but alas it was not in the game, nor is any human discussion of religion or belief system.
Game works well for an atheist actually. The world expands, is mainly based on science fact and fiction, and there is no hocus pocus, or theological premise for anything in the game world.
Danke.

Modifié par Little Paw, 20 mars 2010 - 02:40 .

[Little Paw]

Crap I just read the thread...I think I just explained myself to a troll.

Oh well...

[TheTrooper1138]

Little Paw wrote...

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Little Paw wrote...

To the OP:
Atheism solves a lot of issues for me that the original poster brings up.
She was saved by science, and medical fact.
Religion and/or philosophical pretense is a made up reality that has no bearing on this fact.
Fact, she was dead.
Fact, she is now alive.
That is all I need.
Man should make his own reality, rather than believe in a made up one.

So by making up one's own reality, you really mean, just accept an atheist view point and don't ask questions about life (or rather the meaning of it)? I believe in none of the established religions, but there's enough in this world to make me believe there's more to this than the materialistic side. 
And if you just accept Atheism as your new "religion", then that's just the same as believing in "God" without questioning that belief.

No by making up reality I mean religion is made up.
How do you surmise all of you say from me saying I am atheist? Atheist as a new religion? I never said that. That is quite contrdictory to what atheism is. Theists like to say atheism is just another belief but it is actually non-belief.
Beliving in science and fact is practical, not a belief "system".
Questions about life? Ever read any good existential books? You can question life without religion.
Atheists question life all the time.
Asimov, Ayn Rand, Douglas Adams, Dave Barry, to name a few, and the list goes on.
I simply stated that science and fact make me feel okay about Shep's death and subsequent being brough back to life. Atheism is the non-belief system that makes it so I do not need to contemplate any ethical, moral, or philisophical meaning to it.
Sinple...your post is pure conjecture and assumption.
Nothing I stated above leaves room for interpretation. Feel free to "ask" me questions, but please do not assume what I am thinking.
Danke.

"Religion and/or philosophical pretense is a made up reality that has no bearing on this fact."

By this you were making atheism a doctrine. "Fact" is relative, as enough philosophers already wrote (most famous one of course Plato). So if we do have a "soul" than the fact that Shepard was dead does indeed have a bearing on his/her being resurrected. IF Shep has a soul and it did and it was "released", when he/she died, then who is the resurrected Shepard really? Of course this is pretty esoteric, but still, as someone who spends a great deal of time thinking about these things (though my current reading, Nietzsche, would rather support the Nihilistic view point that there is no soul and therefore no conflict, I suppose) and therefore it bothers me.
And I don't have a problem if they come to a different conclusion from mine, but at least spend some thoughts on that and not just completely ignore the fact that Shepard was dead for about 2 years. It's just as if nothing happened and that's too little for such a big impact.
Also I didn't want to attack you there, sorry if you got the impression, but I have kinda made the experience that atheists tend to be pretty intolerant about other people's beliefs and that makes it rank for me up there with Christianity and others...  
In the end we all don't know what happens to us, when we die. And if the atheists are right, we will never know...  

Also, @Schroing: I won't reply to you anymore, unless you come up with some arguments. And maybe pro-life isn't all Christian, but Christians are definitely the majority of it and the part that gets really extreme about it...

[thegreateski]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

I think I'm starting to understand the problem here - you're a ****ing idiot.

@thegreateski: elaborate on where I am generalizing please. 

Very well.

You are assuming that all right wing christians are anti-abortion.

That's like saying that all left wing athiests are pro-abortion.

[Schroing]

And maybe pro-life isn't all Christian, but Christians are definitely the majority of it and the part that gets really extreme about it...

So I'm entirely correct.

[TheTrooper1138]

thegreateski wrote...

You are assuming that all right wing christians are anti-abortion.

That's like saying that all left wing athiests are pro-abortion.

depends on the definition of "right-wing" though... I mean the Pope even forbids the use of condoms, so I guess I'm not so far off... <_<

Schroing wrote...

So I'm entirely correct.

No, you're not. 

[Schroing]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

So I'm entirely correct.

No, you're not. 

...There's not many ways to interpret you saying that you agree with my actual point.

[LOLandStuff]

The answer is simple.

It's fiction. Deal with it!

[TheTrooper1138]

Schroing wrote...

...There's not many ways to interpret you saying that you agree with my actual point.

If by your original point you mean "Pro-life is hardly a right-wing Christian exclusive viewpoint.", then I would have to agree that it's not exclusive, but I would still say that it's mostly Christian and that the Christian part of it is the one that "cries the loudest"... 

[TheTrooper1138]

LOLandStuff wrote...

The answer is simple.
It's fiction. Deal with it!

I would, if they would have given us some fictional explanation. They didn't.

[Schroing]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

...There's not many ways to interpret you saying that you agree with my actual point.

If by your original point you mean "Pro-life is hardly a right-wing Christian exclusive viewpoint.", then I would have to agree that it's not exclusive, but I would still say that it's mostly Christian and that the Christian part of it is the one that "cries the loudest"... 

Cool.
...So I'm completely correct.

[TheTrooper1138]

Schroing wrote...

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

Schroing wrote...

...There's not many ways to interpret you saying that you agree with my actual point.

If by your original point you mean "Pro-life is hardly a right-wing Christian exclusive viewpoint.", then I would have to agree that it's not exclusive, but I would still say that it's mostly Christian and that the Christian part of it is the one that "cries the loudest"... 

Cool.
...So I'm completely correct.

Nope, because the 2nd part of that posting was:

"But there should be some sort of a fuss regardless, as an embryo is -clearly- a living entity on at the very least a cellular level."

you are entirely wrong there. It's a video game, regardless of your views (unless you were being ironic anyways), making a fuss over it would be retarded... maybe you should aply for a job at Fox News... 

Modifié par TheTrooper1138, 20 mars 2010 - 03:10 .

[LOLandStuff]

TheTrooper1138 wrote...

LOLandStuff wrote...

The answer is simple.
It's fiction. Deal with it!

I would, if they would have given us some fictional explanation. They didn't.

He's Shepard, Mass Effect's own Chuck Norris.