68 réponses à ce sujet

[SwiftSweeper]

Hi guys,

I have finished Redcliff and Circle quests so far, but I just seem to not be able to get into this game.  I thought that it will get better once I put more time into the game.   I like the story,the characters, and the setting, but I hate combat and constant micromanagment of my party equipment etc.  I played my share of RPGs in the past like FF titles, Lost Odyssey, Digital Devil Saga, Champions of Norrath, Baldur Gate: Dark Allience 1, Sacred 2, Oblivion, Morrowind, Fallout 3, and of course, ME I and II to name a few.  I loved ME1 and ME2 combat, and I enjoy combat in most RPGs from action RPGs to turn based JRPGs.  Morrowind and KOTOR were pretty much the only other games where I did not like combat.

I just can not get into this particular style of combat that Bioware uses in KOTOR and DA.  It is strange since I loved ME 2 and to the lesser degree, ME1 for their combat which shares some simularities with KOTOR and DA combat IMO(party based, cueing up and combinig abilities etc.).  Like I said earlier, I have the same problem with KOTOR because I tried KOTOR  twice, but I always gave up shortly after getting off the first planet in KOTOR.

I have heard people who prized DA and KOTOR for their combat.
Why do you guys like it? 
How do I make it more enjoyable for me?  

Does anyone feel the same way about KOTOR and DA combat?

BTW, I am playing as tank (shield and axe) on 360 on Normal.  My party include Wyenne, Morrigan, and Leliana.  I let the game auto-level all my party members since I feel that I already spend too much time in the menus for equipment etc.  At this point, I am thinking about switching to Casual and just quickly playing for the story, so I can sell it back to gamestop.  Granted, I might just sell it without finishing altogether.  I  already have pretty big backlog of games(Bioshock, FF13, Bordelands DLC etc), and DA is time consuming game. 

[Haexpane]

If you don't like it you dont like it. Mass Effect 2 is a cover shooter, not a RPG so it's not surprising that if that is your favorite, dice roll combat like KOTOR/DAO is not for you.



There is no way to make it more enjoyable for you.



Although I have no idea what you are talking about with "micromanaging gear"... I change gear on my toons maybe Once per hour if I find something nice.



Medium on consoles is already very easy, if you switch to casual your dog could beat the game blindfolded

[Sloth Of Doom]

Like Haex said, if you don't like it you don't like it.





This isn't some kiddie hack'n'slasher, which I see the majority of the "RPGs" you have played are. Sorry that you cant just mash the win button to get through it.



The combat systems of KOTOR and DA are nothing alike at all, what the hell are you talking about?



You auto-level your party because you spend too much time in menus? It really sounds like you have a poor attention span. You are sacrificing customization (which is a key feature of the game) for literally no reason. Do you also find that there is "too much talking"?



I really, really believe that you should research your games a bit before buying them. Unless, of course, you feel like you spend too much time in your browser already.

[wowpwnslol]

The OP admitted he likes JRPGs. That pretty much tells me all I need to know about his intelligence level.

[booke63]

Combat probably isn't the best aspect of the game though I like it. Plus it won't change much unlike the story and the char interaction. Odd though as BGII took more micro-management than DAO as I recall as "tactics" were useless in that game, yet that's on your list of playable games. I like micro-managing, but I do use the tactics in DAO for sure. I find that sword and board warriors and even 2 handers can be pretty effective on tactics alone. So that means I don't have to manage them very much at all. Rogues too except using stealth  and positioning them properly in battle are pretty necessary to maximize their effectiveness. That leaves mages which need extensive control to be effective--though healing can be effective via tactics.

All I can suggest is tailoring your party and using tactics effectively should cut back on the need for micro-managing. Still, your idea to go to the easiest mode might be most effective so you can get through for just the story. If you do that be sure to skip most or all the side quests and they are weak and don't do much to further the main story.

Modifié par booke63, 18 mars 2010 - 04:52 .

[Eurypterid]

No need to sling insults, unless you want a vacation from the boards for a while. The OP's trying to get some feedback to help him enjoy the game. If you've nothing to add to help him and just want to belittle him, don't bother posting. Savvy?

[Soilborn88]

I don't see why you don't like it. But everyone has their own tastes.

Personally I like the Neverwinter Nights feel, and the traditional style RPG atmosphere. You don't see any old school like RPGs much these days, most are falling along the lines of Mass Effect, or Elder Scroll types. Not that it's a BAD thing. I just like to see more of a traditional style RPG every once in a blue moon.

If you don't like the Combat, Item management, and tactical management in the game you might as well quit and never look back because you will never have fun.

I do have my criticisms however, the Combat animations and skill animations are very very 'blunt' and basic in my opinion, especially with 2-handers. If the combat system looked and felt more like KoTor -- oh boy this game would have gotten a lot more praise.

EDIT: You are also playing the 360 version, the PC version is superior I think. It just has better camera angles and a little more conviences here and there, if you have a good enough PC try that version instead.

Modifié par Soilborn88, 18 mars 2010 - 05:07 .

[Zanderat]

Soilborn88 wrote...

I don't see why you don't like it. But everyone has their own tastes.

Personally I like the Neverwinter Nights feel, and the traditional style RPG atmosphere. You don't see any old school like RPGs much these days, most are falling along the lines of Mass Effect, or Elder Scroll types. Not that it's a BAD thing. I just like to see more of a traditional style RPG every once in a blue moon.

If you don't like the Combat, Item management, and tactical management in the game you might as well quit and never look back because you will never have fun.

True enough.  For me, the game is rather simple, not nearly as complex as I was expecting. 
Then again, I am still waiting for Wizardry 9........  

Modifié par Zanderat, 18 mars 2010 - 05:07 .

[Zanderat]

Soilborn88 wrote...

I don't see why you don't like it. But everyone has their own tastes.

Personally I like the Neverwinter Nights feel, and the traditional style RPG atmosphere. You don't see any old school like RPGs much these days, most are falling along the lines of Mass Effect, or Elder Scroll types. Not that it's a BAD thing. I just like to see more of a traditional style RPG every once in a blue moon.

If you don't like the Combat, Item management, and tactical management in the game you might as well quit and never look back because you will never have fun.

True enough.  For me, the game is rather simple, not nearly as complex as I was expecting. 
Then again, I am still waiting for Wizardry 9........  

Modifié par Zanderat, 18 mars 2010 - 05:06 .

[Haexpane]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...
 

This isn't some kiddie hack'n'slasher, which I see the majority of the "RPGs" you have played are. Sorry that you cant just mash the win button to get through it.

 .

Wait a second, what makes hack and slash games "kiddie" again?  Diablo , BGDA, BGDA2 CoN, CRTA frown on this comment

[Mordaedil]

I personally wish for more NWN-ish games where you only play one character with lots of spells, but apparently this isn't the popular desire.



Just don't give me MotB where I have to manage 4 giant spellbooks and lists and then carry combat as well.

[AlanC9]

Looking at SwiftSweeper's list, yeah, this just isn't his game. That's a shame.

[Challseus]

wowpwnslol wrote...

The OP admitted he likes JRPGs. That pretty much tells me all I need to know about his intelligence level.

I like both genres. Does that just make me half stupid

[AlanC9]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

The combat systems of KOTOR and DA are nothing alike at all, what the hell are you talking about?

I disagreee. DA and KotOR are quite similar  in how you control the characters. KotOR is simpler, but it's the same kind of game. Games like The Witcher or ME are different because you personally control the attack actions rather than just ordering the character to perform them. I suppose Diablo falls into this category too, though I found the D1 demo so boring I never played the full game.

But as others have said, on Casual the OP can probably get through just via the tactics controls.

Edit: how does combat work in a typical JRPG, anyway? I remember being really annoyed by it -- annoyed enough to give up on the genre -- but I don't remember exactly why.

Modifié par AlanC9, 18 mars 2010 - 05:34 .

[Haexpane]

Mordaedil wrote...

I personally wish for more NWN-ish games where you only play one character with lots of spells, but apparently this isn't the popular desire.
 .

Well most Wrpgs these days are the "long cowboy" type which is why BG2 fans were so happy to have a "almost full" party back.

I'd still prefer 6 over 4 but 4 beats 2 from Jade Empire

[SwiftSweeper]

Haexpane wrote...

If you don't like it you dont like it. Mass Effect 2 is a cover shooter, not a RPG so it's not surprising that if that is your favorite, dice roll combat like KOTOR/DAO is not for you.

There is no way to make it more enjoyable for you.

Although I have no idea what you are talking about with "micromanaging gear"... I change gear on my toons maybe Once per hour if I find something nice.

Medium on consoles is already very easy, if you switch to casual your dog could beat the game blindfolded

ME2 is a RPG in my view.  Granted, it is definetly not as deep as DA in many aspects.  IMO, ME 1 is perfect balance between DA and ME2 in terms of depth.  I actually prefer ME1 to ME2 overall, but I feel that ME2 has superior combat to ME1 though.  Anyway, I do not want to get into argument whether or not ME2 is an RPG.  Let's just leave it.

You probably right that this partucular style of combat is just not for me.  I thought that may be, I am just doing something wrong and that is why I do not like it.  Hence, I want to know why some people like it.

Micromanaging gear issue comes around when I go to the store.   I onlly have 70 slots in backpack right now, and there are 7 party members to equip various gear on, so I have to buy and sell a lot of items usially   I geuss that it is not only the gear, but general amount of time that I spend in the menus.  For instance, it is hard to find new codex entries once list of entries goes off the screen.  It is strange because the game does highlight new quest's text but does not do the same for codex.  There are also talents and skills etc.  Initially, I leved up everyone manually, but now, I just let the game to auto level everyone.

I just want to know what you guys find enjoyable about the combat, so I might try different approach.  Right now, I just cue up and spam my party damage abilites to take down one foe at the time, and use frezee/pinning shoot//disorient etc. to keep other badies at bay.  If there are mages, I always go for them first.

[Sloth Of Doom]

SwiftSweeper wrote...

I just want to know what you guys find enjoyable about the combat, so I might try different approach.  Right now, I just cue up and spam my party damage abilites to take down one foe at the time, and use frezee/pinning shoot//disorient etc. to keep other badies at bay.  If there are mages, I always go for them first.

Try upping the difficulty to hard or nightmare so that spam tactics don't work.  The console versions of the game are extremely easy, but the -fun- of the game is finding a level where you have to think tactically instead of just spamming the same attacks.  No game is fun if you can just walk through it without being hurt, there should always be a sense of peril.

[Sloth Of Doom]

Haexpane wrote...

 "long cowboy"

Most awkward freudian slip typo ever.

[k9medusa]

What does these terms mean?

Wrpg

Jrpg

To help to understand a little better, what are NWN 1 and Diablo 2 in those terms ...(I like both for different reasons)

[k9medusa]

SwiftSweeper wrote...
 For instance, it is hard to find new codex entries once list of entries goes off the screen.  It is strange because the game does highlight new quest's text but does not do the same for codex.  There are also talents and skills etc.  Initially, I leved up everyone manually, but now, I just let the game to auto level everyone.

Codex are on the
Journal and on the PC they are highlighted  -- Giving of gifts took me a
while to figure out how, but it is easy for now -- It takes time to learn the
interface of any software package.  Later in the game, you can more back
packs, BTW

[Sloth Of Doom]

k9medusa wrote...

What does these terms mean?
Wrpg
Jrpg
To help to understand a little better, what are NWN 1 and Diablo 2 in those terms ...(I like both for different reasons)

Western and Japanese Role Playng Games.

They are often seperated because they tend to have very different styles and focuses

[Sloth Of Doom]

SwiftSweeper has an excellent point about the codexes, they have a terrible layout on PC and are even more cumbersome on the xbox. God forbid thy tell you the number you picked up, or do something crazy like list them in chronological order.

[SwiftSweeper]

k9medusa wrote...

SwiftSweeper wrote...
 For instance, it is hard to find new codex entries once list of entries goes off the screen.  It is strange because the game does highlight new quest's text but does not do the same for codex.  There are also talents and skills etc.  Initially, I leved up everyone manually, but now, I just let the game to auto level everyone.

Codex are on the
Journal and on the PC they are highlighted  -- Giving of gifts took me a
while to figure out how, but it is easy for now -- It takes time to learn the
interface of any software package.  Later in the game, you can more back
packs, BTW

Only titles are highlighted for Codex but not codex text itself.  This creates a problem once entries go off the screen.  Granted, this is a minor annoyence.  It is strange because new quests are actually highlighted in red/brown.

 I find it intersting that some resorted to flaming me for simply asking questions.  I apreciate people who actually took their time to answer my question though.

Modifié par SwiftSweeper, 18 mars 2010 - 06:30 .

[Sloth Of Doom]

I have yet to find anyone that thinks the current codex setup was a god idea. Except, I guess, some folks at bioware.

[AlanC9]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

SwiftSweeper has an excellent point about the codexes, they have a terrible layout on PC and are even more cumbersome on the xbox. God forbid thy tell you the number you picked up, or do something crazy like list them in chronological order.

What's wrong with the PC layout?