111 réponses à ce sujet

[Gethforceone]

Darthnemesis2 wrote...

Eternz wrote...



GDC panel from Bioware, picture says it all really. This post nullifies all other discussions! I've decided anyway.

Methinks same (dev) team, but could mean squad as well

Why would she say keep the same dev team in a list of things to keep in the game, that panel gave me some hope that they will keep the same squad mates.

[SomeKindaEnigma]

JeanLuc761 wrote...

Do I think we'll get more squadmates?  I honestly have no idea; nothing's come up to convince me in any direction with that.  But do we need more squadmates?  No.

I subscribe to this train of thought:  We have 15 very capable and wonderful squadmates as potential for Mass Effect 3.  Most if not all of them have spawned massive fan-bases (Tali especially) and people have grown to really care for them. 
Mass Effect 2 was centered on building the "brightest; the toughest; the deadliest allies we can find."  For Mass Effect 3 to get rid of them, then they're essentially doing three things:
1) Turning the suicide mission into a complete and utter gimmick when it comes to series continuity and choice impact.
2) Forcing the writers to come up with some contrived reason why "the best and the brightest" aren't good enough to join you in the final battle.
3) Pissing off tens of thousands (even hundreds of thousands) of fans.


No matter how you slice it, it's not a great decision IMO

couldn't have been said any better

[SomeKindaEnigma]

JeanLuc761 wrote...

Do I think we'll get more squadmates?  I honestly have no idea; nothing's come up to convince me in any direction with that.  But do we need more squadmates?  No.

I subscribe to this train of thought:  We have 15 very capable and wonderful squadmates as potential for Mass Effect 3.  Most if not all of them have spawned massive fan-bases (Tali especially) and people have grown to really care for them. 
Mass Effect 2 was centered on building the "brightest; the toughest; the deadliest allies we can find."  For Mass Effect 3 to get rid of them, then they're essentially doing three things:
1) Turning the suicide mission into a complete and utter gimmick when it comes to series continuity and choice impact.
2) Forcing the writers to come up with some contrived reason why "the best and the brightest" aren't good enough to join you in the final battle.
3) Pissing off tens of thousands (even hundreds of thousands) of fans.


No matter how you slice it, it's not a great decision IMO

couldn't have been said any better

[Terraneaux]

Sunnie22 wrote...
Samara:
Samara's oath to Shepard ends with the defeat of the Collectors. There is also a possibility that a showdown between Shepard and Samara will happen when she declares her oath fulfilled if Shepard made her do anything she normally would kill something for. Beware all you max renegades, she did warn you when she gave her oath.

Samara, however, specifically tells Shep that if she's ever needed, she will help out.  She basically gives the 'friends for ever' speech.  If she doesn't show up in ME3 I'm gonna have to slap the head writer for not paying attention to the previous game.

[Jackal904]

No. No new characters damnit. Enough recruiting people. We have enough squadmates. All your ME3 squadmates should be surviving ME2 squadmates and possibly squadmates from ME1 that weren't squadmates in ME2.

[sepir]

Not weighing into the actual discussion, but something to think about here...



Games currently aren't considered trilogies. People don't see Civilisation 4, Final Fantasy 13, Quake 3 etc. and think that looks good, I should get the ones before it so I know what is going on like they do for books and movies (please correct me where this is the case). Whilst people are seeing games like that, it is going to be very hard to make a true trilogy with static characters. To me, Bioware are pushing the boundaries, but I don't think that for something they have invested this much into they will want to go fully down that path. Hopefully in the future if they create a world this rich again and people have become more accepting of games as a continuation medium where you need to see the first to understand the second.



And secondly, they could go the cheap route for people that had everybody killed off and have you replace them with VI/EDI controlled battle mechs so you aren't tactically disadvantaged.

[Terraneaux]

Remember, though, the new teammates were a huge part of the ME2 marketing blitz. They might go for the 'all new team with more eye candy' route simply because EA will demand they do so to market it.

[Ray Joel Oh]

sepir wrote...

Not weighing into the actual discussion, but something to think about here...

Games currently aren't considered trilogies. People don't see Civilisation 4, Final Fantasy 13, Quake 3 etc. and think that looks good, I should get the ones before it so I know what is going on like they do for books and movies (please correct me where this is the case). Whilst people are seeing games like that, it is going to be very hard to make a true trilogy with static characters. To me, Bioware are pushing the boundaries, but I don't think that for something they have invested this much into they will want to go fully down that path. Hopefully in the future if they create a world this rich again and people have become more accepting of games as a continuation medium where you need to see the first to understand the second.

It's not unprecedented.  The recent Prince of Persia series was set up as a trilogy, with a fourth one starting a new story in the same universe.  The Metal Gear series has ended a complete story arc over four(ish) games, with the intention of continuing the story in the same universe with different characters.  Half Life is set up like a trilogy, with the third part broken up into three smaller parts.  Lots of games might introduce new universes, but more than a few stick to the same handful of characters for a single multi-game story arc.  When they finish Shepard's story, it's likely they'll continue developing the Mass Effect universe with a new protagonist at the helm.

Modifié par Ray Joel Oh, 19 mars 2010 - 05:40 .

[tertium organum]

There will be new squadmates and we'll all wonder what the heck Bioware is thinking dedicating a game to recruitment, only to have them be cameos in the next game. Of course, they had an out with it being a "suicide mission" but then most fans here are suffering from the delusion that if they lived then Bioware will write a story arc for each of them as squad members and not the much easier, one scene cameo. People will be raging in a year or so. Count on it.

[Ray Joel Oh]

tertium organum wrote...

There will be new squadmates and we'll all wonder what the heck Bioware is thinking dedicating a game to recruitment, only to have them be cameos in the next game. Of course, they had an out with it being a "suicide mission" but then most fans here are suffering from the delusion that if they lived then Bioware will write a story arc for each of them as squad members and not the much easier, one scene cameo. People will be raging in a year or so. Count on it.

I hope you're wrong, but who knows.  Still, I think they lead us on by saying that there would be consequences of being unfaithful to your LI from the first game in the third game.  That suggests that your LIs from the first game will play a role that's bigger than a cameo.  And considering Ashley/Kaiden are in the "could have died" category, hopefully the other "could have died" characters will have a shot at coming back as well.

Modifié par Ray Joel Oh, 19 mars 2010 - 06:47 .

[ObserverStatus]

It is worth considering how ME2 has an abstinence tracking mechanic. They probably intend to do something with it in ME3. Perhaps there will be a mission in which the player has to defend their ME2 LI from a very pissed off Ash.

[sepir]

Haven't played PoP or HL, but from what I remember from the first and second MGS besides being set in the same universe, with the same characters, it wasn't essential to play the first to play the second. It wasn't like picking up the second book of Lord of the Rings and thinking "nah, I don't need to read the first, this will be good enough." I think they are starting to push into it, but it's too risky for them to be first one that will make it so you need to start from the beginning for anything to make sense.

[Ray Joel Oh]

The story of the third Prince of Persia game really depends on you having played the first and second ones and the Half Life episodes depend on you playing Half Life 2. The fourth Metal Gear game is also made just for the fans of the previous games. Sure, they're all fun to pick up and just play, but they are very clearly written for people who already know all the characters and the story.



If the third game has good mechanics, it'll function well enough as a stand alone. But as far as its narrative is concerned, its primary function is to conclude a story.

[yummysoap]

JeanLuc761 wrote...

Do I think we'll get more squadmates?  I honestly have no idea; nothing's come up to convince me in any direction with that.  But do we need more squadmates?  No.

I subscribe to this train of thought:  We have 15 very capable and wonderful squadmates as potential for Mass Effect 3.  Most if not all of them have spawned massive fan-bases (Tali especially) and people have grown to really care for them. 
Mass Effect 2 was centered on building the "brightest; the toughest; the deadliest allies we can find."  For Mass Effect 3 to get rid of them, then they're essentially doing three things:
1) Turning the suicide mission into a complete and utter gimmick when it comes to series continuity and choice impact.
2) Forcing the writers to come up with some contrived reason why "the best and the brightest" aren't good enough to join you in the final battle.
3) Pissing off tens of thousands (even hundreds of thousands) of fans.


No matter how you slice it, it's not a great decision IMO

Basically said all that is needed. I do think there will be at least a couple newbies, though, to cut new players a bit of slack.

[mortons4ck]

I wouldn't mind 2-3 new squad characters, just to shake things up a bit. But they would have to be people that Shepard has had previous contact with (someone like Shiala or Kal'Reegar). To introduce an entirely new character seems problematic.

[Multifarious Algorithm]

mortons4ck wrote...

I wouldn't mind 2-3 new squad characters, just to shake things up a bit. But they would have to be people that Shepard has had previous contact with (someone like Shiala or Kal'Reegar). To introduce an entirely new character seems problematic.

Some new characters would be good. If they survived it'd be nice to have some previous people along as temporary squadmates like Jenkins in ME1 or Wilson in ME2. Kal'Reegar is the one I want most. But that's because I want to kill things with Adam Baldwin. And have him talk lovingly about his very favorite gun.

[adam_grif]

Spoilers:

























































Characters that could die in ME2 won't play major roles in ME3. We'll be lucky to see more than 3 characters returning, and you can bet your ass that 2/3 will be Tali and Garrus. If most of the crew died in ME2, you can't just play the game with your 2 surviving squadmates. You'll have to have more squadmates to fill the void, and if they're creating a bunch of new squadmates, it's unlikely they will have more than a couple return from the past game.

[Mudzr]

Wel I think we should. Some familiar faces maybe half the crew, and the rest of them would be new.
Why?
*New characters provides a fresh perspective and attitude to the story
*There are still species like the batarians, the raloi and unrevealed species that have great potential as squad members. Also, alot of fans want to have the opposite genders of extablished races like female turians and male quarians.
*14/15 of those squad members could be dead, and while you can only complete the game alive with 12/15 dead, those two squad mates could be anyone. Would bioware really let you play through mass effect 3 with only 3 or even 1 squad mate? I'm assuming they'll create at least two definate squad mates so they don't have to rewrite tons of dialoge every time there is a group meeting. Also you don't have to pick up about half the possible team members.
*Thane doesn't have much chance of surviving untill the next game
*Zaleed and Kasumi both had limited dialogue and were both DLC, so the chances are that even less players have them

I just hope that each character appears in ME3, but each leading their own force and aiding shepard in their own way. Maybe Tali is leading the quarians, Garrus the spectres, Legion the geth, Thane the assasins and hanar, Miranda and Jacob with cerebus, Ashley and Kaiden with the alliance, liara with asairi cammandoes, Mordin with the salarian army, etc. with a small portion of your previous squad mates being able to join with you.
When you finally attack the Reapers head on, you have an army behind you, all of whom you can trust, all leading people they can trust. Meaning you have your trusty batarian, female turian, male quarian and token humans and freinds riding you ship.

Of those that do return, it most probably will be:
*Legion, because he can easily be rebuilt/ replaced
*Mordin, because he, after Legion was a fan favourite
*Liara, because she is the only one that must be alive
*Garrus and Tali, because they are favourites and have been in the squad since the beginning

Modifié par Mudzr, 19 mars 2010 - 12:41 .

[apotheosic]

adam_grif wrote...

Spoilers:

Characters that could die in ME2 won't play major roles in ME3. We'll be lucky to see more than 3 characters returning, and you can bet your ass that 2/3 will be Tali and Garrus. If most of the crew died in ME2, you can't just play the game with your 2 surviving squadmates. You'll have to have more squadmates to fill the void, and if they're creating a bunch of new squadmates, it's unlikely they will have more than a couple return from the past game.

cough.

[Archereon]

Well they can justify dropping nearly the entire squad.



Zaed and Kasumi are DLC, so they're gone as soon as ME3 comes around.



Garrus could potentially end up a Spectre (if the council realizes that Udina and the Turian are idiots) and be sent on a separate mission from whatever Shep ends up leaving, so he's still doing something important.



Tali could become an Admiral in the Flotilla, regardless of whether she was exiled. If she was, put in a line about how the evidence exonerating Tali surfaced after some time and the Admirals revised their decision.



Samara could leave because of some odd justicar code related reason, while Mornith could just leave because she's done with you.



Mordin and Thane could die of old age and disease respectively between ME2 and ME3...



Very few people would mourn the loss of Jacob as a squaddie.



Miranda I could see staying seeing as you have to actually work to get her killed in the suicide mission.



Jack, regardless of whether or not you romance her, is at least somewhat (if paragon her) unstable, she might wander off...



Grunt might decide to go back to his homeworld to take advantage of...Those breeding requests...



So off hand, I can think of reasons to discard the entire ME2 squad. Face it, they're gone.

[IoCaster]

apotheosic wrote...



cough.

It's probably not a good idea to spam this pic as proof of anything. Considering the fact that it was a presentation at the Game Developers Conference and it most likely refers to the dev team. I'm sure that they would prefer that the team wouldn't be broken up and/or assigned to other projects like DA:O or TOR.  

[Daeion]

I'm sure there will be new squad mates in ME3 because Bioware feels it is part of the ME experience, heck I even read somewhere they were already working on new ones, but that was around release time so I can't remember where it was. I would prefer that there were no new squad mates because we have enough as it is and it's time to finalize their development. Some people will cry about the fact that they choose to kill everyone except the minimum to survive. To them I say cry more, if you killed them all then deal with the fact that your ruthless reputation is now working against you and the only people who will work for you are random redshirts.

[Daeion]

adam_grif wrote...

Spoilers:

Characters that could die in ME2 won't play major roles in ME3. We'll be lucky to see more than 3 characters returning, and you can bet your ass that 2/3 will be Tali and Garrus. If most of the crew died in ME2, you can't just play the game with your 2 surviving squadmates. You'll have to have more squadmates to fill the void, and if they're creating a bunch of new squadmates, it's unlikely they will have more than a couple return from the past game.

You're forgetting that you'll have at least 2, if not 3 characters returning from ME so you'd have a minimum of 4 squadmates, just need two random redshirts to fill in any holes and bam, there's your team.

[Archereon]

That chart, as said, is proof of nothing. Its gaming industry practice to break up dev teams (minus writers so long as there aren't any more favorable pitches (in both quality and price) from rivals) once a game goes gold, then pick and choose who to bring back based on a combination of cost and talent.



That's why only a third of ME1s team worked on ME2.

[Apollo Starflare]

I think (hope?) they will surprise people by finding a way to bring back a number of the ME2 squadies, mostly for reasons already posted in this thread. However I also agree that due to: a) the fact you can get most of your team killed, and it helps market the game for a variety of reasons, they will indeed have a bunch of newbies to recruit.

I do think they can make it work by just introducing a small number of new characters however. Say 3 new recruits to bring those who lost all but two squadmates upto 6 (ala ME). Then they can work in DLC characters as well...

If the dev team are brave in their decisions over who to include there is no reason they cannot 'punish' those players who lost that many people, it just means living upto the idea that our choices have consequences. Starting the final game with a smaller squad is a big consequence.



Plus, Bioware and critics often laud the replayability of the ME franchise (of Bioware games in general in fact), add this to the fact most players will have gotten through it first time with most of their squad intact and almost everyone will have a Shepard to import who had a number of people left alive.

For those few that don't there is always the default Shepard, which would no doubt be designed with a number of survivors in mind (similar to the way in which default Shep had non-romanced Ash as the default option).