16183 réponses à ce sujet

[KnightofPhoenix]

Kryyptehk wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

But they quoted the words "Good", "nasty" and "badass", which gave me the impression taht this is exactly what each icon means. I hope those who wrote this are the idiots here and not Bioware.
Because honestly, wtf is "badass" supposed to mean in a game that supposedel has deep dialogues?

I thought it meant more like; "Good"="Nice, passive, compliant", "Nasty"= "Sarcastic, mean, cold-hearted", "Badass"="-HAWKE PUNCH":lol:

It still sounds bad. I initially thought that we will have more than just 3 options. And certainly more subtle options than that.  

Sarcasm doesn't have to be nasty for instance. Well not my kind of sarcasm, but still

[Kryyptehk]

Subtlety? In my video game?



But seriously, I thought people were overreacting when they went on about DA2 going to the Bros, but I kinda agree now. Poor Dragon Age 2, we hardly knew ye.

[phaonica]

I would have interpreted the icons as "Olive Branch = non-confrontational", "Comedy Mask = silly", "Fist = confrontational".



Not only do I hope that we get more icons than that, but it would also be nice if there were more than one option that used the same icon... for example maybe you have two different olive branches to choose from with different actual dialog.



Admittedly, whenever I was in a conversation in Origins, I was most likely to think to myself "Someone just said something to me, I want to reply in a snarky manner, which dialog line is the snarky one."



However, when making a decision like "I side with Caridan" or "I side with Branka", I would really hope that both options have the same icon or no icon at all.

[Kryyptehk]

Yeah, I hope that it doesn't have an icon. Or a special icon for decision making, where neither are implied to be bad or good.

[KnightofPhoenix]

"Good choices" will be represented by a halo. "Bad choices" with horns. How nice.

[phaonica]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

"Good choices" will be represented by a halo. "Bad choices" with horns. How nice.

I hope not. Not after that Game Informer article about morality in the Dragon Age franchise. That article read more like someone who knew what they were talking about, and I'm more inclined to believe it than the IGN review.

[Master Shiori]

As soon as that IGN review was posted on DA2 forums we had MIke, David and Mary run in and say (in pc terms ofc) how that review was a complete screw up on the writers part.



I tried reading it until the "orcs and goblins" part, where I just gave up in disgust. If you're going to write a damn review about a game you played than at least have the courtesy to learn what those things you're killing are called.



The way that article was written makes me believe the author didn't really give a damn about the demo and just played it because he had to. The whole thing smells of "let's get it over and done with because I don't really care and want to move on to other stuff".

[KnightofPhoenix]

Good to know Shiori. IGN really screwed up that one.

[Kryyptehk]

Master Shiori wrote...

As soon as that IGN review was posted on DA2 forums we had MIke, David and Mary run in and say (in pc terms ofc) how that review was a complete screw up on the writers part.

I tried reading it until the "orcs and goblins" part, where I just gave up in disgust. If you're going to write a damn review about a game you played than at least have the courtesy to learn what those things you're killing are called.

The way that article was written makes me believe the author didn't really give a damn about the demo and just played it because he had to. The whole thing smells of "let's get it over and done with because I don't really care and want to move on to other stuff".

Yeah, I think that reviewer should be interviewing Call of Duty or something, instead of DA2. Or just quit. The latter would be preferrable.

[phaonica]

Kryyptehk wrote...

Master Shiori wrote...

As soon as that IGN review was posted on DA2 forums we had MIke, David and Mary run in and say (in pc terms ofc) how that review was a complete screw up on the writers part.

I tried reading it until the "orcs and goblins" part, where I just gave up in disgust. If you're going to write a damn review about a game you played than at least have the courtesy to learn what those things you're killing are called.

The way that article was written makes me believe the author didn't really give a damn about the demo and just played it because he had to. The whole thing smells of "let's get it over and done with because I don't really care and want to move on to other stuff".

Yeah, I think that reviewer should be interviewing Call of Duty or something, instead of DA2. Or just quit. The latter would be preferrable.

But as a representative of the Bro crowd, his/her opinion is valuable too!

After all, if they can't interpret the icons correctly, maybe they need to be clarified further.

yeah right

[Master Shiori]

The dialogue discussed in that article can actually be seen on one of the screenshots posted here in this topic.



Mike said he was personally presenting how the new dialogue wheel worked and thus has chosen a simple dialogue where Hawke only had 3 potential answers: friendly (or "good" as the IGN fool understood it...), funny remark (comedy mask) and agressive response (red fist, which IGN mistook for "evil").

The author of that article seems to have missed the point where Mike clearly said they only used 3 spots on the wheel on purpose and had about 3-4 more slots that were unused in this particular dialogue (one of which is ME's investigate option that opens about 5-6 more dialogue slots).



All this just goes to show that not only can any idiot write a review but you really don't need any special skills or level of intellect in order to get a job at IGN...

[Brockololly]

If you want a better preview of DA2, I'd recommend the Joystiq one I posted acouple pages back- it seems the writer there wasn't a lobotomized chimp unlike the IGN Bro.

As for the dialogue wheel and Icons, Gaider posted a bunch on that yesterday in this thread. Here are some of his responses to clear things up:

David Gaider wrote...

AntiChri5 wrote...
It has been confirmed there are more than three choices on the wheel.

Besides which, there were never more than six options in Origins.

That suggestion is absurd and you know it.

Incidentally, for those who bring up the three oft-mentioned tones indicated by the  icons I can safely say-- having been one of the people involved in the  writing-- that there were rarely more than three different tones in  Origins conversation options as well.

On those cases where you had more than three response options in Origins it was generally a case  of you either asking questions (as in the Investigate hub we have now)  or choosing actions. As has been already mentioned, we still have the  ability to express the exact same number of options here-- in fact, we  have more. In Origins we were limited to six responses which included both tones and questions.

Indeed, when we needed to have a lot of questions, we'd often have to go to a  seperate "investigate hub". My, weren't those grand?

"What did you want to know?"
Player asks a question, which is answered.
"Anything else you wanted to ask?"
Player declines.
"Now-- what did you want to do about that original thing I asked about?"

Let's not go back to that again, shall we?

Now we're allowed more responses: up to five options on the regular wheel and up to five more on the investigate wheel.

If you thought those six options in Origins allowed you more ways to  express yourself than were actually there, that's great-- I'll take that as a compliment to the writing team. We always try to accomodate the  different responses that a player might want to make. But other than the fact that your lines are spoken in VO (which some people don't like as a rule) and the fact that you have paraphrases instead of full sentences  to choose from (hopefully mitigated by the intent icons) there is functionally no difference between the two dialogue systems. We  are not limited to providing less options. Period. In fact, in exchange  for the two things I listed we also get access to some handy ways to  allow you to determine the way you express yourself better than Origins.

I get that you people haven't seen this yet, and for the moment your only point of comparison is Mass Effect, but Dragon Age is not Mass Effect and the writers who provided you those options you liked so much in Origins are the exact same writers here. Perhaps that's little  comfort until you do see evidence for yourself, and that's cool, but let's not go conjuring imaginary problems just yet.

David Gaider wrote...

fchopin wrote...
Can you post a diagram image of how the dialogue wheel works with arrows on the  directions ( back, forward) that are possible so we can define the possibilities, or is it not permitted?

I don't have a diagram to post, sorry, but you have six spokes on the wheel: NW, W, SW, SE, E, NE.

On the "regular" wheel you have the W spoke reserved for Investigate (if  there are any Investigates on that node). Selecting it flips you over to the "investigate" wheel, where you have the same number of spokes and E is reserved for Return-- which brings you back to the regular wheel. A  built-in investigate hub, if you will, without the need for awkward  dialogue transitions.

David Gaider wrote...

Brockololly wrote...
I was just thinking more along the lines of being able to clearly read all  the lines in DAO before choosing- meaning, there were some funny or  nasty responses you could see in the dialogue choices for Origins but  you were able to appreciate them even if you didn't choose them. With  the wheel, you won't have that ability to see what Hawke says exactly or does without committing to the choice.

Ah, I see. Yes, that is indeed true. If you just want to appreciate the full line you do indeed have to select the option.

But
I'm just curious about the icons- are there a lot of them? More  specifically, are they all fairly intuitive as to what they mean in the  context of the paraphrase? I know its been brought up before, but an  angry red fist isn't exactly clear if that means "I'm going to talk angrily!" or "WAAAH! I'm going to punch this old lady in the FACE!" Or  will I clearly know what the friendly snarky response is versus the jerk-face response given the icons and blurbs?

It wouldn't make much sense to have a whole lot of icons-- they have to be pretty distinctive from each other so you can intuit their meaning without a guide. As to your specific example, there is indeed an "I attack" icon separate from the "I'm aggressive" icon. The first time you see it, I imagine you'll tell the difference. I won't go more into the icons themselves, however, until we talk more about what they represent and how the tones affect the rest of the dialogue in the game.

I'm still not sure I like the icons as they seem like they could be vague- there are many different tones of sarcastic or angry, for instance. ANd I'm still wondering whether or not we'll have any Stat based dialogue choices, like Cunning, Persuade, Intimidate or any class Based choices, like maybe dialogue that only comes up for a mage, warrior or rogue...

Modifié par Brockololly, 25 juillet 2010 - 01:57 .

[Giggles_Manically]

Is the dialouge wheel going to be:

Six choices with only the icon to show what Hawke will say or

Six choices with the icon, and a paraphrase ala mass effect.



Here is a DRINKING game people, everytime the say amped up, vastly improved, or Sparta in conjunction with DA 2. Take a shot, should keep us happy until March.

[Herr Uhl]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Is the dialouge wheel going to be:
Six choices with only the icon to show what Hawke will say or
Six choices with the icon, and a paraphrase ala mass effect.

A paraphrase, but I hope that it will be more descriptive than the ME ones.

[Giggles_Manically]

Yah because saying NO to someone from a paraphrase came off like an F- U!!



I want a summary over a paraphrase.

[Kryyptehk]

I was thinking it would be a quick summary "Decline" with, say, an Olive Branch, so it would in reality be, "No thank you, I'd best be on my way. -end conversation." While a Mask option might be sarcastic, like, "Because you've been so much help up until now. No, I think I'll be going."



So, basically it would be summarizing what you are saying, along with how you say it. So you can say no without being angry or something.

[Master Shiori]

Just to add some info on the posibility of a toolset being released for pc version of DA2.



Mike Laidlaw said he cannot talk about the details yet, but Bioware will release more info as they get closer to the release date. My impression is that they will release a toolset again.

[Herr Uhl]

Master Shiori wrote...

Mike Laidlaw said he cannot talk about the details yet, but Bioware will release more info as they get closer to the release date. My impression is that they will release a toolset again.

Lets hope so.

[Herr Uhl]

 Form the gamespot preview. http://comic-con.gam...age-ii-hands-on

Switching over to the mage resulted in a more tactical style of combat along the lines of the first game. With the mage, we preferred pulling up that radial menu and finding the best spell to cast in a given situation. Our favorite quickly became inferno, which lets you rain fire on a radius of enemies as though you'd just called a mortar strike from the heavens. According the Laidlaw, they've worked to make sure the mage has more "wow" moments in combat like the weapon-based classes. To demonstrate, he showed a mage finishing off an Ogre by lifting him up into the air, surrounding him with a dark energy, and then exploding him into nothingness.

So, one of the mage finishers. Sounds weird.

And as to combat.

Overall, the combat didn't feel remarkably different from the first Dragon Age. It flowed a little more smoothly and moved at a quicker pace, but that was mostly because our talents and spells recharged quickly after using them. That could very easily have just been something BioWare tuned for this public demo--likely a lowered difficulty to help ease players back into the experience. After this admittedly brief demo, we're confident that BioWare knows what they're doing. This isn't going to be a hack-and-slash game.

I hope that they're right.

[Brockololly]

Hmmmm....does this bode ill for hearing Morrigan in DA2?
http://gameinformer....black-gow3.aspx

Apparently Claudia Black is doing VO work for Gears of War 3, which is coming out April 5, 2011. Should we glean anything from that regarding anything Morrigan related for DA2 or an expansion? We know BioWare is already doing VO work now for DA2 or has been for a while yet. Hmmmmm...

[MoSa09]

Brockololly wrote...

Hmmmm....does this bode ill for hearing Morrigan in DA2?
http://gameinformer....black-gow3.aspx

Apparently Claudia Black is doing VO work for Gears of War 3, which is coming out April 5, 2011. Should we glean anything from that regarding anything Morrigan related for DA2 or an expansion? We know BioWare is already doing VO work now for DA2 or has been for a while yet. Hmmmmm...

i said this before. At the moment, i'd rather just not her from her or just hear during an epilogue slide or during conversation than meeting and talking to her with Hawke. Just would just be too weird. So this would be good news to me

Modifié par MoSa09, 26 juillet 2010 - 09:20 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Herr Uhl wrote...

 Form the gamespot preview. http://comic-con.gam...age-ii-hands-on

Are the IGN previewers that idiotic?

I really hope comic con got it right, because that preview ressurected all my previously destroyed expectations.  

[ximena]

MoSa09 wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

Hmmmm....does this bode ill for hearing Morrigan in DA2?
http://gameinformer....black-gow3.aspx

Apparently Claudia Black is doing VO work for Gears of War 3, which is coming out April 5, 2011. Should we glean anything from that regarding anything Morrigan related for DA2 or an expansion? We know BioWare is already doing VO work now for DA2 or has been for a while yet. Hmmmmm...

i said this before. At the moment, i'D rather just not hesr from her or just hear during an epilogue slide or during conversation than meeting and talking to her with Hawke. Just would just be too weird. So this would be good news to me

I share the same sentiment.


Anyway, the Morrigan group is holding its first challenge. Maybe someone is interested in creating something.
morrigan-fans.deviantart.com/blog/33810372/

Modifié par ximena, 26 juillet 2010 - 02:18 .

[Brockololly]

ximena wrote...

MoSa09 wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

Hmmmm....does this bode ill for hearing Morrigan in DA2?
http://gameinformer....black-gow3.aspx

Apparently Claudia Black is doing VO work for Gears of War 3, which is coming out April 5, 2011. Should we glean anything from that regarding anything Morrigan related for DA2 or an expansion? We know BioWare is already doing VO work now for DA2 or has been for a while yet. Hmmmmm...

i said this before. At the moment, i'D rather just not hesr from her or just hear during an epilogue slide or during conversation than meeting and talking to her with Hawke. Just would just be too weird. So this would be good news to me

I share the same sentiment.


Anyway, the Morrigan group is holding its first challenge. Maybe someone is interested in creating something.
morrigan-fans.deviantart.com/blog/33810372/

I'd be fine with having more Morrigan on her own in DA2 or beyond, so long as the Warden gets a clue as to whats going on with her. If it ends tragically or bittersweet where they can truly never be together again, then just let my Warden say one last goodbye and maybe see his kid for the first and only time. If the end of Origins was the last my Cousland was ever going to see Morrigan, I'd have just preferred it that they not give you the option of going off to search for her if its a foregone conclusion he'd never find her.

I wouldn't mind seeing Morrigan again in DA2 or beyond, but in addition to getting closure with the Warden first, I'd like to see her personality slightly changed by her experiences with the Warden- mainly not having her romanceable for Hawke or having her bring up the Warden and their romance, sort of like Flemeth does, but maybe its a positive thing for her.

I don't know- I'm holding out hope that BioWare isn't so stupid that they'd just leave the Warden hanging like that. Gaider hinted at maybe picking up the Warden searching for Morrigan plot line and  I just think BioWare would be crazy not to do something substantial with that. Its easily the biggest loose end from Origins and I'd like to think that BioWare would know its easy money in their pocket if they pick up the Warden/Morrigan storyline again- romance or not.
------------------------
-----------------------

So, in the Joystiq preview for DA2, they drop this line at the end:

We don't yet know how Hawke's story will play out -- Laidlaw promised
that players would make decisions that show how "the Chantry's fallen to
pieces" and the world is brought to war.

This is really interesting to me- what could possibly cause the Chantry to fall to pieces in only 10 years time? What could upset the Chantry's strangle hold on most of Thedas? ..............Yeah, The Old God Baby.

Obviously not everyone made the OGB, but pure guessing makes me think that whatever the reason for the Chantry's weak position, its likely Flemeth and Morrigan likely are involved somehow. So, how would Morrigan fit in to all of this? And I guess "who" exactly are the players in this Thedas on the brink of war? Are we talking about an Exalted March of some kind, or a nation versus nation war?


Oh and I'd love to try my hand at making some Morrigan art, Ximena! Unfortunately, my artistic skills have atrophied since high school after doing nothing but science in undergrad and now grad school. I'll have it my task for the rest of the year to get my drawing skills back in shape! Sadly, the only thing I'd enter into the contest now would be a Morrigan stick figure drawing^_^

Modifié par Brockololly, 26 juillet 2010 - 02:57 .

[Stanley Woo]

Let's get it back on topic, please.