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THE Morrigan Discussion and Research Thread *Infested with Bugs Yet Again!*


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#6351
Brockololly

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Kryyptehk wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

My only real concern left for DA2 is the style of telling the story, and the voiced PC.

I am pretty sure we will never feel attached to Hawke.


Even if the story is fantastic and the voice is good, I don't think anyone will feel more attached to Hawke than their Warden. We may like him/her but we definitely wouldn't prefer Hawke.


I expect I'll only care about Hawke as much as I cared about Shepard- namely once I was done with the game, I really don't care what happens to Shep. BioWare could turn Shep into a 20 foot tall, mutant space hippo with jet powered sneakers wearing rainbow colored leather pants and I'd just shrug my shoulders.

Thats the problem with the voiced PC in my view- they're not my character, its just some guy. The reason I loved Origins and the silent PC is because your PC is as awesome or stupid as you're imagining him/her and you have the companions directly react to that. WIth a Shep or Hawke, you're just watching another character go about their business- but it doesn't feel like its your character. Maybe Hawke will be different- time will tell....

phaonica wrote...

On topic: With all this talk about Morrigan's looks, I was thinking. In the DA2 screenshots of Flemeth, her features look a lot more rounded and less angular (despite the more angluar art style to which the developers profess). I wonder if Morrigan showed up in DA2 if she'd look more like she did in the Sacred Ashes trailer. Posted Image


I wonder too- like I said earlier, I'm wondering what the rationale is in how they'll handle the "look" of people, places and things present in Origins that are now in DA2. Its hard to guess whether the Flemeth redesign is indicative of the kind of overhaul we can expect or if thats just Flemeth being a shapeshifter.

If they do redesign Morrigan, I'd guess they'll make her look more goth-witch like, paler skin, maybe a bit creepier. So yeah, probably more toward the creepy Sacred Ashes Morrigan......:sick:


Then you've got this interview with Zeschuk: http://www.videogame...eg_zeschuk.html

If I had the energy, I'd disect his  quotes.... but alas, that would take too long.After reading it though, I'll just raise a couple points.

I'm not crazy how much weight BioWare puts into reviews- as you see with the rubbish previews from IGN and so on after Comic Con, the gaming press isn't very ....intelligent. Sure there are some reviewers that are better than the rest, but most reviews for games now are rather woeful. So its disheartening to hear Zeschuk say that he views the big reviews to be indicative of how the overall "hardcore" market feels about a given game. And how basically the forum goers just scream and yell like slobbering trogolodytes and have nothing worthwhile to say. Again, nice generalization.

But this blurb gets me:

Q: That's all very well with constructive criticism, but what would you say to one of the "urgh!" people if they were sitting here
right now?

GZ:
I'd say, hey, they're entitled to their opinion, but also take a look at the final game when we're done. It's  pretty hard to get the full picture That's actually part of the way  we've been doing PR the last little while. We haven't specifically been  provoking our fans, but we've doing stuff to drive them a little bit up  the wall. If you look at the Mass Effect thing with Shepard being dead, or the Marilyn Manson thing [with Dragon Age]... this isn't in the same vein, but you come to expect the response. At the very least, you want  people to talk about you. We absolutely stand behind the stuff we're  doing with Dragon Age 2. The whole difference is 'played it' versus 'not played it'. That's the litmus test. It's like, "Hey, great. Hold the  comment, remember the game, then play it and make your decision at that  point." It's funny. On the one hand people don't like change, on the other hand they'll complain if it's all the same. There will be people  who say, "Oh, I like Dragon Age just the way it is! I want more of just  that!" And then when you give them that they'll say, "Why didn't you  make the graphics better?" It's this funny Catch-22, so we in a sense pre-empt them and push it in an innocent direction.


So, this explains BioWare's recent crappy marketing? Its crappy....on purpose? The whole "Oh you silly child! Don't judge the game based on how its being marketed! Wait and pay for the game before you levy any criticism- so then we can scoff at your crazy forum rants because we ALREADY HAVE YOUR MONEY."
I mean, the marketing should make me want to buy the game- DA2 info makes me want to never touch it. If you're throwing stuff out there in marketing- its fair game. I don't care for the darkspawn or much of the "hot rod samurai" art style thus far- gameplay isn't going to change that. Sometimes people do just want more of the same- or small iterative changes in sequels (BG2) versus wholesale shifts that make the sequel feel like a totally different gameplay experience (ME2)....

Modifié par Brockololly, 28 juillet 2010 - 11:52 .


#6352
phaonica

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"We haven't specifically been provoking our fans, but we've doing stuff to drive them a little bit up the wall."

At least they're admitting to yanking our chain now... I think that's an improvement?



"Hold the comment, remember the game, then play it and make your decision at that point."



Well I'll do that if you have a playable demo. Otherwise I have no choice but to listen to your crappy marketing strategy.

#6353
Giggles_Manically

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Look before I get to my fic (read it) I just have this to say.



The warden was ours because we made him/her. We put our voice into it, and slipped on a costume and took part in the greatest show on earth, that we directed and reacted to.



With Hawke, we get a pre-made Sparta knockoff, who we can only nudge in one way. Instead of playing an actor in the show, we get dumped in the audience of bros, cheering it on.



I dont care if my damn video game is cinematic! Its a sodding game! Not a bloody movie.

God I want to play a game, with myself as a hero, not watch a garbaled fantasy hero in the vein of Beowulf, or Leonidas rocking out to Manson.



No use getting grumpy since we "fans" dont matter to Bioware. If some jaded, and nutty reivewer on a powertrip holds more sway at Bioware, than fans who love their games, devote themselves to it, discuss and dissect it, then sadly I weep for Bioware that once stood as a temple to RPG's and is now becoming a Super-Walmart with an on site gun range and brothel.

#6354
Brockololly

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For reference here are the new horny Qunari:
Posted Image

Posted Image

I fear for how the new Morrigan will look.....:(

#6355
Herr Uhl

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Why the claws? Horns I can take, those were hinted at, but why the ****ing claws?



And give the man some armor, I knew that they usually don't wear plate, but this is ridiculous.

#6356
Kryyptehk

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Herr Uhl wrote...

Why the claws? Horns I can take, those were hinted at, but why the ****ing claws?

And give the man some armor, I knew that they usually don't wear plate, but this is ridiculous.


It think that is just the artist's style, you can kinda see the Qunari's thumb in the 3D pic and it looks normal.

#6357
Giggles_Manically

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Those who are amped up, need not armour, Herr Uhl.

-Rule 325 of the Big Bro Book of Bro.




#6358
Herr Uhl

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Kryyptehk wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Why the claws? Horns I can take, those were hinted at, but why the ****ing claws?

And give the man some armor, I knew that they usually don't wear plate, but this is ridiculous.


It think that is just the artist's style, you can kinda see the Qunari's thumb in the 3D pic and it looks normal.


Yes, but I wonder why the concept was made that way. I wonder if that is some ceremonial painting, one of the scholars maybe?

#6359
KnightofPhoenix

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I really hope this is painting. The Qunari are supposed to be bronze skinned.

#6360
Herr Uhl

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KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I really hope this is painting. The Qunari are supposed to be bronze skinned.


And how could you get skin with a pattern? I'm 99% sure that is paint.

#6361
KnightofPhoenix

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Herr Uhl wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I really hope this is painting. The Qunari are supposed to be bronze skinned.


And how could you get skin with a pattern? I'm 99% sure that is paint.


One of the colors is 99% sure to be paint.
The Qunari could be white skinned or red skinned and the other color is paint.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 29 juillet 2010 - 12:33 .


#6362
Herr Uhl

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KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I really hope this is painting. The Qunari are supposed to be bronze skinned.


And how could you get skin with a pattern? I'm 99% sure that is paint.


One of the colors is 99% paint.
The Qunari could be white skinned or red skinned and the other color is paint.


The red is paint at least, you can see the dribble. I think that the white is paint too though.

#6363
Giggles_Manically

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That almost looks like Aztec and Mayan body paint from textbooks I have.



Also this is just concept most likely and not the final product.(hopefully)

#6364
KnightofPhoenix

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Let's hope so.

#6365
Herr Uhl

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Giggles_Manically wrote...

That almost looks like Aztec and Mayan body paint from textbooks I have.

Also this is just concept most likely and not the final product.(hopefully)


They have Mayan architecture and Par Vollen has a similar climate to the amazons.

#6366
Giggles_Manically

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AH well I am buying StarCraft 2 on the weekend, and getting into some more stuff.



A new art style may not be bad either, since Shogun 2 is using the old wood block style to make cinematics.



The only Bioware game that so far hasent depressed me outright is TOR. Space Combat FTW.



Keep up the Morri love mah friends.

#6367
Brockololly

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If this was a new IP and the first game in a series all these "changes" would be fine. And if that horned, spiky Qunari is just a variation on the bronze skinned, hornless Sten type, that would be cool. But if all Qunari are supposed to look like the Kratos/Daedra/Hellboy thing we're seeing and we're supposed to ignore the fact that all the Qunari in Origins looked nothing like this, then thats a big nail in DA2's coffin.

This is supposed to be a "Sequel" to Origins. Now of course BioWare can do whatever they want. But when I think of a sequel, I think of it as building off of the foundation that was established in the original piece. A sequel implies a measure of continuity. I'm not seeing that at all here.

What I'm seeing is a reboot; a retcon of the DA universe established in Origins, both visually, presentation wise and possibly gameplay wise. This isn't the next chapter in the DA universe- from what we've seen thus far Dragon Age 2 is about as much of a sequel to Origins as it would be fair to call Christopher Nolan's The Dark Knight a "sequel" to Joel Schumacher's Batman and Robin

I understand they want to make the art more distinctive- but they're just trading in Lord of the RIngs for every other mish mashed modern fantasy visual trope out there- whether thats 300, Conan, He-Man, Hellboy....It just seems pointless and messes with any sense of visual continuity.

Its like the whole ME2 explanation of why we had ammo...errr.."heatsinks":  "Oh its not ammo! They're advanced Geth heatsink technology that you know, makes it so when you run out of them, you can't fire your gun anymore...even though you have unlimited ammo supposedly..."

Grrrrrr.....and just when I was maybe warming up to DA2....Morrigan is not amused....
Posted Image

#6368
Giggles_Manically

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They said only some Qunari look like this.



So all hope is not lost.

#6369
Brockololly

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So, I imagine any Morrigan reunion will go like this:

"Hey its Morrigan! You look a bit paler and more goth, but whatever!"
Posted Image

"Oh...I see your hair got a bit whiter...ok"
Posted Image

"Hmmm.. yeah, maybe raising the Old God Baby was a little rough on you..."
Posted Image


"Oh crap! I've been Gaider'd! MORRIGAN=FLEMETH! ZOMG!"
Posted Image


Apologies for the nightmare fuel. Thats just Morrigan's unique shape and Flemeth's unique shape mushed together...I need a break from DA, me thinks:wizard:
Here is some nice Morrigan to get the MorriFlem idea out of your head:
Posted Image

Modifié par Brockololly, 29 juillet 2010 - 03:39 .


#6370
Jacks Smirking Revenge

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I wouldn't rule out that nightmare coming true at least in a sense. I imagine BioWare changing her appearance to match the likeness of her mother's new appearance. I would enjoy her while you can.

#6371
Axekix

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Wow, those Qunari pics are... interesting.  I guess they are just completely retconning them then?

Brockololly wrote...

So, I imagine any Morrigan reunion will go like this:

:lol:

This is one of the few times I hope you're wrong.

#6372
Brockololly

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Axekix wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

So, I imagine any Morrigan reunion will go like this:

:lol:

This is one of the few times I hope you're wrong.


Oh I hope I'm wrong, I really, really do....=]

#6373
ximena

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Oh. God. Brock.



You just made me have the sudden urge to open Origins and play for hours to get that image out of my head. *fires up Photoshop instead and releases frustration there*

#6374
GardenSnake

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The Qunari explanation is as good as the heatsink chips one if you ask me. Oh ya, not all of them have horns, just all the ones that came to Fereldan at the time of Origins..... yes....

Not a fan of the Kratos look but I'm pretty sure the red is just paint. The DLC trailer got me excited. My Warden's back? Sign me up, damn you Bioware, damn you.

Just got to the part in the podcast when they said the main reason for taking away the customization was because of VO. Bioware is FIXING the voiceless pc problem from the first game? No faceless gameinformer people, just no. Go play KOTOR.

Love the amount of ass kissing they're doing too. "Just because you have to be human doesn't mean you have less choices *long awkward pause* you still have choices...."

I need a break from all this DA stuff. I'll assume the role of silent observer for a time.... before I nerdrage myself into oblivion.

Modifié par GardenSnake, 29 juillet 2010 - 05:14 .


#6375
phaonica

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GardenSnake wrote...

Not a fan of the Kratos look but I'm pretty sure the red is just paint. The DLC trailer got me excited. My Warden's back? Sign me up, damn you Bioware, damn you.


I feel the same way about this upcoming DLC. Despite all the warning signs, WANT Posted ImagePosted Image