16183 réponses à ce sujet

[ximena]

Brockololly wrote...

While us Morrigan romancing Warden fans may have enjoyed Witch Hunt for the most part, its not getting a favorable reception in BioWare's coveted  gaming press.

In fact, Witch Hunt is straight up getting TRASHED in reviews- albeit most of dubious quality.

IGN: 6.5/10
Gamespot: 5/10
Joystiq: "disappointing and flimsy finale to the Dragon Age Origins storyline"
Eurogamer: 6/10
SpawnKill: 1/10
BigDownload: Average
GameSnark: 2/5
ElderGeek: Don't Bother
GameBlurb: Pass on it
GameRant: 1.5/5

Basically the reviews criticize it for the recycled environments, short play time and crummy ending to Origins as a whole and the fact that unless you romanced Morrigan, you're left with more questions than answers. And I can't disagree with most of that- the DLC for DA in general has been disappointing. Even the Gamespot reviewer is the same guy that lavished praise on Origins, giving it a 9.5/10!

And BioWare clearly takes not of these reviews as if you look on BioWare's twitter its tooting its own horn about how IGN gave Shadow Broker a 9.5/10. Seriously, what the hell is wrong with DA's DLC? I really don't care about reviews but I'm just concerned that as far as funding goes, reviews matter. So if EA sees ME as the "better" franchise, they'll pump more $$$ into that while letting DA piddle away with tiny budgets and continue making subpar content.

I enjoyed Witch Hunt and will write up my complete thoughts tomorrow, but its sad to see it get such a poor reception, especially when I feel like it could have been so much more. I can't help but think that BioWare's over exuberant marketing of "ALL YOUR MORRIGAN QUESTIONS ANSWERED!" is in part to blame though too.

It's interesting to note that there were a number of negative reviews and reactions I received from deviantART regarding Witch Hunt. Plus I had a poll, and the one which leads is the "Should have been longer" option. xD

GardenSnake wrote...

EnchantedEyes1 wrote...

Maybe relax and have more babies?

Good idea, all that candy can't only be used for eating, some kinky stuff could come out of that ../../../images/forum/emoticons/wink.png Speaking of which, what would Morrigan look like in a bikini made out of candy cane bits? Ximena, get on it lol 

Mmm. Bikini... made out of candy cane bits? Which every witch 'mancing warden would be willing to chew out patiently? XD *adds that to THE LIST* Hmmmmmmm.....

And as for the babies, if Morrigan could get pregnant once with The Warden, who says she can't get pregnant once again? XD

[Bruddajakka]

And as for the babies, if Morrigan could get pregnant once with The Warden, who says she can't get pregnant once again? XD

Apparently doesn't even need a ritual to get it done either. Also answers the question of whether or not a child born of a Grey Warden is tainted or not.

[Maconbar]

Bruddajakka wrote...

The Sentinel Armor set goes really well with Morrigan's default robes. Said it before but I'll set it again. But the ending does make me feel a bit bad about Leliana seeing as how I was in a romance with both of them, and the Warden basically disappears without a word.

Potentially awkward if Leliana, Morrigan, and warden all return in DA3.

[ximena]

Bruddajakka wrote...

And as for the babies, if Morrigan could get pregnant once with The Warden, who says she can't get pregnant once again? XD

Apparently doesn't even need a ritual to get it done either. Also answers the question of whether or not a child born of a Grey Warden is tainted or not.

As far as I know, a child born from one grey warden parent would bear no tain as opposed to those born from two. But then two grey wardens having a child is considered impossible. Morrigan had to do the ritual to ensure the taint carries over to act like the beacon.

It also interesting to note that it would be easier for a male grey warden to have a child since female grey wardens would have a difficult time bearing the child.

[bl00dsh0t]

Ahh we are back in flemeth speculation mode Awesome, its been a while ^^



Flemeth being one of the old gods is still one of my favourite ones we discussed back in the group, I just love the idea of her being an ogb herself from the 4th or 3rd blight for some reason, allthough it doesnt quite make sense lore wise. IIRC the conobar story puts her age at around 600 years according to the wikia timeline so I think the stories making her unlikely to be an old god, first darkspawn or elven god. This is of course only assuming that she was "born" as one, not that she might have come into contact with any of the previously mentioned in the fade during her escape from / slaying of conobar.



Much is unclear about morrigans mother, we cant even be sure that she is morrigan biological mother at all. But then again morrigan does talk about her having had darker hair when she was younger, so it is still in the realm of the plausible I guess.



All this speculation is making my head hurt damn ;D Time to ingest a pizza!

[Bruddajakka]

Well for all we know the myths are just a story she put out as a way to spread her legend, and keep people from asking too many questions. Or asking questions but not the right questions.

[Maconbar]

Bruddajakka wrote...

Well for all we know the myths are just a story she put out as a way to spread her legend, and keep people from asking too many questions. Or asking questions but not the right questions.

Anyone else think that Flemeth is playing us?

[Bruddajakka]

Oh she's obviously playing us. Hell she probably was counting on us destroying her current body. Zev mentions in one of his banters that one of her daughters escaped to a marsh in Antiva or so the stories go.



She could have very well let it slip when she planned so she could have a spare in place should things not go properly with Morrigan.

[Master Shiori]

I guess we now know for certain what the Notes of Arl Foreshadow were refering to:



1) Lost countenance: Ferelden to Orlasian phrasebook



Orlasian Warden Commander in Awakening





2) Raising Spirits: Offsprings and the Fade



Children and Fade part of Awakening





3) Forest Fall: Truth and Legend in the Search for Arlathan



Reference to the elven survivors mentioned in Witch Hunt.

[Terra_Ex]

Master Shiori wrote...

Terra_Ex wrote...

KendallX23 wrote...
           or u could wait for the Bioware fix

I'm one of the testers and the beta version of the patch fixes everything nicely so just chill out and wait for the final patch. The cause and solution were exactly as I described earlier It also fixes the final auto-save after you make your decision.

Terra, once the final auto-save is made is ti possible to find out what it was that Morrigan left behind for the Wardens who didn't or couldn't follow her through the mirror?

Also, the final auto-save is made after you follow her through the mirror or she leaves alone, right?

It is not possible, you get a cutscene where the warden kneels down near two books and dog digs something up. The final save is made once you go through the mirror with her, stab her or she leaves. Once the final save completes you're taken to the credits screen. Oh and loading the final save returns you to the credits screen then the title screen.

Modifié par Terra_Ex, 10 septembre 2010 - 11:54 .

[DWSmiley]

Brockololly wrote...

I enjoyed Witch Hunt and will write up my complete thoughts tomorrow, but its sad to see it get such a poor reception, especially when I feel like it could have been so much more. I can't help but think that BioWare's over exuberant marketing of "ALL YOUR MORRIGAN QUESTIONS ANSWERED!" is in part to blame though too.

Definitely.  My warden romanced Morrigan but ended it.  So he was searching primarily for info on his child and her plans.  Instead, he gets a five minute conversation that provides almost no information and then the end credits are rolling.  I felt disappointed and deceived.

I've mellowed since and think it's a pretty good DLC on its own merits - and it's far better to have Morrigan and baby featured in DA3 than wrapped up in a little DLC.  But Bioware marketed this very poorly.  False advertising, really.

[Gennojo Ryuga]

I agree, their marketing and advertising was misleading. I think marketing and PR are not on the same page with the dev team, should have been advertised that your warden will finally get some form of closure with the Morrigan Chapter of your life regardless of your standing with her.

[soundchaser721]

They definitely messed up the marketing on it for sure, but the dlc did serve two purposes: It gave morrigan romancers the closure they wanted and also produced an ending so ambiguous that bioware could take it anywhere they wanted to. I was pretty disappointed that we didn't get any answers but I thought the ending was pretty good... I'm just anxious to see whats going to happen.

[Terra_Ex]

I see Gaider's on top form keeping his options open in the loose ends thread and Brock's there as the astute voice of morri fans everywhere I think I enjoy Gaider's forum posts and put-downs almost as much as his written works, it's very odd...

[Barbarossa2010]

Terra_Ex wrote...

I see Gaider's on top form keeping his options open in the loose ends thread and Brock's there as the astute voice of morri fans everywhere I think I enjoy Gaider's forum posts and put-downs almost as much as his written works, it's very odd...

Where at?  A particular thread?

[Terra_Ex]

http://social.biowar...1/index/4745947

Gaider's responses are peppered throughout the thread.

[GardenSnake]

I'd have to agree with the reviews that Brock linked, the part that the dlc was advertising was a few minutes long, gave no answers, and only really had an interesting ending if you romanced her. Don't get me wrong, all of us romanced her all the way through the game at least once, and the going through the mirror ending was the least we deserved after a screw you with the Origins ending, and little to no mention of her in Awakening. Plus all of those bugs, can't forget the bugs. But I mean the friendship ending left something to be desired if you ask me, it's probably because my Cousland came face to face with a schizophrenic Morrigan who forgot about that night in Denerim (a problem which will soon be fixed, with a post game save as well ), but the fact that I don't get any answers or even get to see what the gift is, adds to the disappointment. Everything other than that though, was great. The recycled environments had a story related reason behind them, and it was nice to revisit those places. The party was great, the banter was funny and Finn and Ariane were more intersting than anyone in Awakening. Plus those parts when speaking to Ariane about what your relationship with Morrigan at the beginning and at the part with the ring were amazing. But the Morri convo wasn't all that bad, her playing with the Dog, calling you a charmer etc were all parts that made me smile.

[Swoo]

Terra_Ex wrote...

http://social.biowar...1/index/4745947

Gaider's responses are peppered throughout the thread.

I've always been in the camp that Gaider's not the bastard many want to make him out to be but the arrogance is just astounding from both sides in that thread.

[Terra_Ex]

Swoo wrote...

Terra_Ex wrote...

http://social.biowar...1/index/4745947

Gaider's responses are peppered throughout the thread.

I've always been in the camp that Gaider's not the bastard many want to make him out to be but the arrogance is just astounding from both sides in that thread.

I find Gaider to be a comic genius, he has an inherent kind of humour in his way of speech I find. Like all the devs who post they are pretty accomodating to fan queries, which is never a bad thing. Anyway the thread degenerates into a mess a few pages in but there are some interesting Gaider quotes early on.

He has actually confirmed in that thread that we will find out how our wardens "vanished" after awakening (at *some* point in the future... Though I thought that WH's ending would be the canon for romancers (no point searching when you've already found her), everyone else went back to whatever their epilogue dictated - 'tis a bit of a mess.

Modifié par Terra_Ex, 10 septembre 2010 - 07:27 .

[Brockololly]

Terra_Ex wrote...

http://social.biowar...1/index/4745947

Gaider's responses are peppered throughout the thread.

Dear lord,  some of the responses in that thread is the reason why I hate the DA2 forums... the second someone tries to voice a concern or contrarian view on the direction DA2 is headed, they get swarmed and destroyed. Heaven forbid somebody desire to continue playing as the Warden because they liked that plotline....sheesh...

[Terra_Ex]

Brockololly wrote...

Terra_Ex wrote...

http://social.biowar...1/index/4745947

Gaider's responses are peppered throughout the thread.

Dear lord,  some of the responses in that thread is the reason why I hate the DA2 forums... the second someone tries to voice a concern or contrarian view on the direction DA2 is headed, they get swarmed and destroyed. Heaven forbid somebody desire to continue playing as the Warden because they liked that plotline....sheesh...

Well, it's one of the reasons I was unimpressed with the mass-modding of DA2 outside the DA2 boards. The facts of the matter are its often impossible to have anything approaching a logical discussion about *anything* there without it getting swamped with crap and insults. The DA:O boards a something of a refuge comparatively.

Before WH, I'd have found it trickier to get on board with DA2, but with that one ending, I can get on board and hope for that thread to be continued even if the warden isn't the protagonist. I'll tell you about some nice plot flags I found in the beta patch when the official thing goes live.

@Swoo - I've not seen your thoughts on the DLC, what did you think of it?

[Brockololly]

Terra_Ex wrote...

Swoo wrote...

Terra_Ex wrote...

http://social.biowar...1/index/4745947

Gaider's responses are peppered throughout the thread.

I've always been in the camp that Gaider's not the bastard many want to make him out to be but the arrogance is just astounding from both sides in that thread.

I find Gaider to be a comic genius, he has an inherent kind of humour in his way of speech I find. Like all the devs who post they are pretty accomodating to fan queries, which is never a bad thing. Anyway the thread degenerates into a mess a few pages in but there are some interesting Gaider quotes early on.

He has actually confirmed in that thread that we will find out how our wardens "vanished" after awakening (at *some* point in the future... Though I thought that WH's ending would be the canon for romancers (no point searching when you've already found her), everyone else went back to whatever their epilogue dictated - 'tis a bit of a mess.

Yeah, its just that some people on the internet are meatheads and can't infer tone or sarcasm very well- probably the same people who moaned about having to read lines of text in DAO and now love having paraphrased blurbs with emotional intent icons.

I'm curious what Gaider means by finding out about where the "vanished" Warden went- Witch Hunt works in that regard if your Warden followed Morrigan, but ....maybe thats a good sign that Warden may be back in the future? Yeah, probably a bit early to get on the hope train- best to wait at least until we've gone through DA2.

Skimming back through some of the PAX chats, Gaider also mentioned we'd find out about Maric and Fiona's child (Alistair?) as well as learning more about Flemeth and Maric's night together in the hut from the Stolen Throne....BioWare certainly has served up plenty of mysteries with DA, they need to start answering some of them...

[Brockololly]

Terra_Ex wrote...

Before WH, I'd have found it trickier to get on board with DA2, but with that one ending, I can get on board and hope for that thread to be continued even if the warden isn't the protagonist. I'll tell you about some nice plot flags I found in the beta patch when the official thing goes live.

OOOOHHH! Plot flags!

But I'd agree about DA2- the ending to Witch Hunt certainly gave some closure and I'm definitely ok story wise going on to DA2 and Hawke. That said, I've got my fair share of concerns about DA2 beyond the story, mainly that its a console port and BioWare isn't even denying that anymore, but at least story wise it seems ok. I especially liked how Mary Kirby described things in that aforementioned thread:

Mary Kirby wrote...

When we say that Dragon Age is about Thedas, we're talking about making history in Thedas. Think about real world history: A lot of it, at least a lot of what historians think is notable enough to write down and preserve for the  ages, consists of stories about specific people. Marco Polo. Attilla the Hun. Jonas Salk. Ferdinand Magellan. Gregor Mendel. Joan of Arc. Human  history doesn't make itself. Globes don't just get circumnavigated.  Polio doesn't just disappear. Armies don't just get bored and decide to  turn back. People do these things.

The entire story of our own  human history isn't "The Adventures of Marco Polo." But that doesn't  make him insignificant. Just the same, the entire story of the Dragon  Age isn't "The Adventures of the Warden" or even "The Adventures of  Hawke." They are both people who play critical roles in shaping history, and they have stories to explore.

Why do we include things like romances and friendships and pets if they don't change the fate of Thedas? Who's to say they don't? Maybe your Grey Warden was only motivated to end the Blight because he  or she loved Leliana. Maybe it mattered to Hawke who stood by him at the critical moment when everything happened. That's part of the story, just like it matters why Magellan sailed around the world, and how Gregor Mendel wound up studying peas in a monastery vegetable garden. The peas didn't change history, but they played their part in his story.

Modifié par Brockololly, 10 septembre 2010 - 07:44 .

[Terra_Ex]

Brockololly wrote...

I'm curious what Gaider means by finding out about where the "vanished" Warden went- Witch Hunt works in that regard if your Warden followed Morrigan, but ....maybe thats a good sign that Warden may be back in the future? Yeah, probably a bit early to get on the hope train- best to wait at least until we've gone through DA2.

Well he's not discounting the possibility, and the choices in WH are particularly relevant to the warden. She's not gonna be pissed at Hawke if the warden stabs her... But I'm just unsure on the timeline of the epilogues and which take precedence.

I know I read somewhere in an extendedd blurb for WH that Morrigan's trail went cold in Orlais (though the full version isn't in-game to my knowledge) so that implies that the DA:O & DA:A epilogues were not retconned... whilst potentially screwing up non romancers. Hmmm....

Brockololly wrote...
Skimming back through some of the PAX chats, Gaider also mentioned we'd find out about Maric and Fiona's child (Alistair?) as well as learning more about Flemeth and Maric's night together in the hut from the Stolen Throne....BioWare certainly has served up plenty of mysteries with DA, they need to start answering some of them...

Did he actually confirm that? I know it came up as a question, but I thought it was one where he smiled or said "maybe.."

[Terra_Ex]

Brockololly wrote...

But I'd agree about DA2- the ending to Witch Hunt certainly gave some closure and I'm definitely ok story wise going on to DA2 and Hawke. That said, I've got my fair share of concerns about DA2 beyond the story, mainly that its a console port and BioWare isn't even denying that anymore, but at least story wise it seems ok.

Did you listen to Gaider's description of the combat changes during PAX, that set things out a bit better in my mind.

Brockololly wrote...
I especially liked how Mary Kirby described things in that aforementioned thread:

Mary Kirby wrote...
When we say that Dragon Age is about Thedas, we're talking about making history in Thedas. Think about real world history: A lot of it, at least a lot of what historians think is notable enough to write down and preserve for the  ages, consists of stories about specific people. Marco Polo. Attilla the Hun. Jonas Salk. Ferdinand Magellan. Gregor Mendel. Joan of Arc. Human  history doesn't make itself. Globes don't just get circumnavigated.  Polio doesn't just disappear. Armies don't just get bored and decide to  turn back. People do these things.

The entire story of our own  human history isn't "The Adventures of Marco Polo." But that doesn't  make him insignificant. Just the same, the entire story of the Dragon  Age isn't "The Adventures of the Warden" or even "The Adventures of  Hawke." They are both people who play critical roles in shaping history, and they have stories to explore.

Why do we include things like romances and friendships and pets if they don't change the fate of Thedas? Who's to say they don't? Maybe your Grey Warden was only motivated to end the Blight because he  or she loved Leliana. Maybe it mattered to Hawke who stood by him at the critical moment when everything happened. That's part of the story, just like it matters why Magellan sailed around the world, and how Gregor Mendel wound up studying peas in a monastery vegetable garden. The peas didn't change history, but they played their part in his story.

Well, even though we mock the "It's all about Thedas" in this thread, its safe to say we get what it's about. The fear is that you start jumping to new protagonists when you're still invested in a particular plot arc. It's great that they have a master plan, if they can tie in and bring back old heroes in some capacity then that'd be fantastic. To be honest though - spiritual successor to BG implies direct continuation, which is where a lot of those expectations came from. BG wasn't amazing on its own, it was amazing because you took a single character through the series. Now, if they can manage to pull off stuff like bringing Morri back alongside a romancing warden (when appropriate) then I'd be sold even if the warden isn't the protagonist. There is potential in the model if they do it right.  Bah, I'll stop there.