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[Master Shiori]

Another Morrigan art piece.

Made by SmaiLika07 from DeviatART.

http://i42.photobuck.../Morrigan11.jpg

Modifié par Master Shiori, 24 avril 2010 - 07:56 .

[blademaster7]

I haven't decided what to do with my current playthrough. it's very early for that.

I'm still in Lothering.



Morrigan approves +10

[Master Shiori]

Haha!

Morrigan does indeed aprove.

However, you should have left him in his undies. All that equipment gone to waste...

[blademaster7]

I have a better idea...



Sten: Grrrr...

Alistair: HELP! Get me out of here.

[Terra_Ex]

Addai67 wrote...

Terra_Ex wrote...

-the newly restored "You have returned from the Wilds..." dialog will no longer trigger if Morrigan's character quest is marked as closed - prevents this from automatically occuring in savegames where the quest is already complete, such as a postgame save. (thanks to blademaster7 for noticing this one so quickly)

This is what I'm finding when I load a save where Morrigan's quest is active but not completed, and then go to kill Flemeth:

- Flemeth's body will not "open" to be looted, but when I go to the cabin it says that I used a key and I can get in and loot the Grimoire and Robes of Possession

-When I return to camp, Morrigan pops up, but she only has her regular dialogue screen (as if I had clicked on her to talk to her).  There aren't any unique scenes or dialogue choices.  There is the usual question about Flemeth being dead, however, so the quest has updated.

-I think she is supposed to switch to Love at that point?  However, she stays at 87 Adore.

Not sure if this is the right place to report stuff like this.  I'd be interested in what others are finding.

The Flemeth issue is normal, the key gets auto added to your inventory. Regarding Morrigan having normal dialogue - its almost definitely another mod in your override directory conflicting with my changes. if you;ve gettinig her "default" dialog options then its undoubtedly a
conflict with another mod.. If you're using ejoslin's ZDF did you remember to delete the morrigan_main files from the ZDF installation. Other mods may also make changes to the same files I have and likewise cause problems. Upon killing Flemeth or looting the grimoire one of two flags always gets set that fires the new conversation.

blademaster7 wrote...

I have a better idea...



Sten: Grrrr... [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]

Alistair:
HELP! Get me out of here.

lol,  fantastic 

Modifié par Terra_Ex, 24 avril 2010 - 11:05 .

[Terra_Ex]

blademaster7 wrote...
I'm just curious if I can trigger the ring in my epilogue with that flag. That is of course without going all the way.

I have a suspicion that I can get it when entering the final battle with the romane inactive.

Romance her all the way to love, break up with her when she asks(seems to me that you get the flag here) and then just accept to be friends. Do the ritual.... and at the gates she will confess her feelings and you get the epilogue.

That's what I figured out from the toolset anyway...

blademaster7 wrote...
Hmm... you know, with the method I described, you can romance Leliana and still get the ring mention.

Or even better. You can marry Anora, keep Leliana as your mistress and then leave Ferelden to go find Morrigan. Leli will accompany you btw.

I think it's possible without exploits. I wonder what your Awakening epilogue will say.

Hmm... I think I see what you're getting at now. Do you think that this is something that should be addressed then? I personally think that still_in_love was meant to be part of something bigger and more ambitious that was later scaled back. Like you say, with STILL_IN_LOVE set I think you're pretty much guaranteed to get the ring slide, even if you lower her approval to pure hatred and get her to leave...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
I have a somewhat different perspective. The same thing can be said of Loghain, where many details that Gaider mentions are also either cut or unmentionned. But that's what makes it interesting.

The game shouldn't really tell you what you should think about characters. It rather, imo, should push you to want to think about them more. At the risk of sounding like an elitist, I think most people who hate Morrigan and Loghain do so based on rudementary understanding of both characters (that's not to say all of them. I have seen those who oppose both Loghain and Morrigan by basing it upon rational arguments based on a comprehensive view of both characters. I avoid calling them "haters" because that would degrading to them).

But that's not necessarily bad. It forces the interested few to dig deeper and try to have a better understanding,
which is intellectually gratifying and satisfying (speaking of my own personal experience, especially vis a vis Loghain and I haven't even read the books).

So all in all, I personally don't mind that many hate Morrigan because of that scene, since I would say most of them
posess a very basic understanding of Morrigan as a character and they don't seem interested to actually think about it. So really, who cares? It's their loss really.

Also, as I have argued before, I think I am starting to like it the way it is (mostly, some improvements could
have been implemented). It's a test of faith and of how much your character thinks he knows / trusts / loves Morrigan. And the game does tell you (especially via the ring) that she does love you. So that's a
leap of faith at least partially rewarded. Partially, as it will depend on what's coming next.

Now, I both agree and disagree here. On the one hand, I am in total agreement with your comments regarding lack of understanding of said characters, and we can apply that to any character in the game. However, I've stated before I don't dislike the Dark Ritual, what I dislike is what it became in comparison with what was originally envisioned. Taking a look at the recent interviews with Gaider, and reading between the lines, I'd say the existing ritual is something of a hastily fashioned patchwork that serves its intended plot purpose, yet does little more. Aimo & Gaider's collaboration on the comic pretty much seals the deal for me, inferring that the creator isn't totally satisfied with the way it turned out.

I'm completely with you on most of your points though, if you play through the romance it's fairly simple to join the dots, if you take everything at face value you'll be left wanting, as you say it's their loss if they don't want to look past what's on the surface. That said, given Gaider's comments that the cut DR content was meant to add some additional context to the relationship between friendly & romantically involved wardens & morrigan, I just can't say that I'm happy with the way the scene turned out. I think if the DR scene was implemented as originally intended, it would've served as the feather in the cap of the whole Morrigan subplot to that point.  As you say though, we can't fully judge how the arc works as a whole until we see what happens next.

Modifié par Terra_Ex, 24 avril 2010 - 12:12 .

[blademaster7]

Terra_Ex wrote...
Hmm... I think I see what you're getting at now. Do you think that this is something that should be addressed then? I personally think that still_in_love was meant to be part of something bigger and more ambitious that was later scaled back. Like you say, with STILL_IN_LOVE set I think you're pretty much guaranteed to get the ring slide, even if you lower her approval to pure hatred and get her to leave...

If you get her to leave, her approval will reset and and romance flags will be cleared. She will have 2-3 different lines during the DR. If you agree to do the ritual she won't re-join the party.

As for the still in love flag, it seems to me that it works fine. Once her approval reaches 90+ any break up conversation from now on will mark that flag in your save(unless you break up harshly).

Morrigan already reached her crisis point if her approval got to love. She fell in love with the player and there is no going back. If you break up with her she'll feel better for a while, but she will confess her feelings later(at the gates).

The name of the flag is self explanatory I think...

[Terra_Ex]

*hates the still_in_love flag* Very well then, it can remain as is. Have you experienced the joy of flaming knives yet blademaster?

[blademaster7]

Terra_Ex wrote...

*hates the still_in_love flag* Very well then, it can remain as is. Have you experienced the joy of flaming knives yet blademaster?

Not yet.

I don't have a save(male PC - no romance) anywhere near that point. I might try it with my new char... I'm currently slaughtering mages in the tower... so I'm about to trigger it once I finish the treaty.

That is... IF I get out of the tower alive. I'm doing the stupidest playthrough you can imagine..... solo.

[webbedfeet]

...........I'm still marveling in the fact that Bioware delayed the game for half a year when the PC version was 'allegedly done' so they can polish it and make console versions, and they still couldn't find the time to make the story climax work right.



Keep up the good work, guys. I can't contribute, but I really appreciate what you've been doing.

[KnightofPhoenix]

blademaster7 wrote...

I haven't decided what to do with my current playthrough. it's very early for that.

I'm still in Lothering.



Morrigan approves +10

[Addai]

blademaster7 wrote...

Are you using any other mods?

I am using an Alistair romance mod (cmessaz's Combined Romance mod) and ejoslin's ZDF.  Could there be a Morrigan conflict in ZDF?

Approval needs to be 90+ to reach love.

Ah, ok.  But usually you get a big approval bump from Flemeth, and I didn't get that, either, since there was no opportunity to give her the grimoire (it disappeared from inventory).

[Terra_Ex]

Ack, a solo run eh blademaster, good luck with that Just so you know, flaming knives has a 50/50 chance of appearing if you're romancing her.
I'm uploading a new version shorty:

-Flemeth's key no longer auto-spawns in your inventory, you now get to loot it off the dragon's corpse.
-Lowered the persuasion check when lying to Morrigan about Flemeth's death (I mistakenly left it as VERY_HIGH requirement)

Other notes: if you leave the Wilds after killing Flemeth, but without picking up her key, when you return the door will be unlocked. I think the coders left this in as a safety measure, so I'll be leaving that as is.

Addai67 wrote...

blademaster7 wrote...

Are you using any other mods?

I am using an Alistair romance mod (cmessaz's Combined Romance mod) and ejoslin's ZDF.  Could there be a Morrigan conflict in ZDF?

Do you have a link to cmessaz's mod page, I'm not familiar with it. And ZDF does alter morrigan's files, ejoslin kindly updated her ZDF DA Nexus page with details of which files need to be deleted from her mod in order for my mod to work alongside hers. (My morrigan and cutscene files include her fixes.)

webbedfeet wrote...

...........I'm still marveling in the
fact that Bioware delayed the game for half a year when the PC version
was 'allegedly done' so they can polish it and make console versions,
and they still couldn't find the time to make the story climax work
right.

Keep up the good work, guys. I can't contribute, but I
really appreciate what you've been doing.

Indeed, it does raise an interesting question, though weren't the console versions outsourced to another studio?

Modifié par Terra_Ex, 24 avril 2010 - 02:17 .

[Brockololly]

@Terra_Ex: Hah- just got the flaming knives dialogue- great stuff. Question though: I don't know if this is an oversight in the toolset or anything but one little thing that bugged me when I was messing around with some of my saved games was when you get the Grimoire from Flemeth but do not kill her and then go back and lie about Flemeth to Morrigan.



I don't know if it would be possible, but do you think there should be a "(lie)" next to the dialogue choice "Flemeth is dead you're free." That always kind of annoyed me since you have the (lie) indication next to other choices like that in the game, but not this one. Just a little thing....

[Terra_Ex]

Brockololly wrote...

@Terra_Ex: Hah- just got the flaming knives dialogue- great stuff. Question though: I don't know if this is an oversight in the toolset or anything but one little thing that bugged me when I was messing around with some of my saved games was when you get the Grimoire from Flemeth but do not kill her and then go back and lie about Flemeth to Morrigan.

I don't know if it would be possible, but do you think there should be a "(lie)" next to the dialogue choice "Flemeth is dead you're free." That always kind of annoyed me since you have the (lie) indication next to other choices like that in the game, but not this one. Just a little thing....

I did consider putting it in (then probably forgot about it, lol), and in fact I may well do so, it was probably left out in error. It may even be a good idea to tie it in with the existing persuasion check... What do others think?

In fact, aren't there instances in the game where (Persuade) & (Lie) are both prefixed to a player response. I think both should be present for appropriate lines within that dialog.

Modifié par Terra_Ex, 24 avril 2010 - 02:55 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Morrigan pic time everybody!



While I prefer the in-game Morrigan, I think the Sacred Ashes Morrigan also looks good. The in-game Morrigan however looks more elegant and cunning. Trailer Morrigan looks badass and aggressive.

 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 24 avril 2010 - 02:55 .

[Addai]

Terra_Ex wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

blademaster7 wrote...

Are you using any other mods?

I am using an Alistair romance mod (cmessaz's Combined Romance mod) and ejoslin's ZDF.  Could there be a Morrigan conflict in ZDF?

Do you have a link to cmessaz's mod page, I'm not familiar with it. And ZDF does alter morrigan's files, ejoslin kindly updated her ZDF DA Nexus page with details of which files need to be deleted from her mod in order for my mod to work alongside hers. (My morrigan and cutscene files include her fixes.)

Cmessaz's mod is here, but it appears to be a ZDF conflict.  Thanks for the tip.

[Addai]

And while I'm here, I'll contribute a Morri screen or two.





I think she's beautiful and haven't seen any mod that I thought looked better than her vanilla-game appearance.

Modifié par Addai67, 24 avril 2010 - 03:35 .

[Count Viceroy]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Morrigan pic time everybody!



While I prefer the in-game Morrigan, I think the Sacred Ashes Morrigan also looks good. The in-game Morrigan however looks more elegant and cunning. Trailer Morrigan looks badass and aggressive.

 

I love morrigan, and maybe its just me, but i'm glad they didn't go with anything resembling her concept art. She looks retarded.

[soignee]

Master Shiori wrote...

Another Morrigan art piece.

Made by SmaiLika07 from DeviatART.

http://i42.photobuck.../Morrigan11.jpg

That's amazing, quoting it again as it's beautiful

[Addai]

ZDF adjustment made and it is working beautifully.  It made me cry, in fact.

I'm short on time now, but will post a few screens and play with it some more later.



"Release me"






"You miserable selfish bastard"





...and the kiss that follows




I was worried that Wynne was going to mess up the grimoire cutscene, because I got her Vessel of the Spirit event on the way to Flemeth's (I never use Wynne- why would you? :innocent:- so it hadn't triggered yet) and there is a party camp cutscene for that.  Wynne's explanation cutscene triggered first when I got back to camp after killing Flemeth, but Morri's triggered just after that.  When hers ended, I was back at Wynne, but no worries on that score.

Modifié par Addai67, 24 avril 2010 - 04:45 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Addai67 wrote...

"Release me"






"You miserable selfish bastard"





...and the kiss that follows

Good times. Good times.... if you will excuse me *goes to cry*

[soignee]

MORRIGAN WHY YOU BROKE MY HEART



*sobs quietly with Knight*

[Terra_Ex]

Addai67 wrote...

ZDF adjustment made and it is working beautifully.  It made me cry, in fact.

I'm short on time now, but will post a few screens and play with it some more later.


I was worried that Wynne was going to mess up the grimoire cutscene, because I got her Vessel of the Spirit event on the way to Flemeth's (I never use Wynne- why would you? :innocent:- so it hadn't triggered yet) and there is a party camp cutscene for that.  Wynne's explanation cutscene triggered first when I got back to camp after killing Flemeth, but Morri's triggered just after that.  When hers ended, I was back at Wynne, but no worries on that score.

Yeah, that happened to me too (since I'm using your save, lol). It's a fringe case scenario but it doesn't cause any problems so all's well. I might see if there is a better way to implement it though. Or maybe the warden just harbors a deep desire to be with Wynne...

Glad you got everything working and that you're enjoying it. Thanks again for your saves - they helped immeasurably in fixing this thing up 

Modifié par Terra_Ex, 24 avril 2010 - 05:06 .

[Shade of Wolf]

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

Shade of Wolf wrote...


Oh poor poor Morrigan...
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/8/index/385771
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/9/index/139657
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/47/index/324310
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/96/index/740053

I saw Blademaster post in one I think...random I know, just a familiar face lol... sort of.

Brace yourselves...
http://social.biowar...t_media_id=2161

OMG Shade ROFLMAO,

She looks like Marcus Fenix in GOW.

http://unrealitymag....08/11/fenix.jpg

Now that was funny.

Hey, you're actually right!!