16183 réponses à ce sujet

[Grendenhal]

I'm ashamed to say I romanced both Morrigan and Leliana -- I couldn't resist either. I was in active romances with both at the end. I got the "ring" epilogue as well as the "travels with Leliana" epilogue. I went straight to WH and was able to go through the portal. But I haven't done Awakenings yet -- don't know if playing through it would somehow mess up WH.

[Grendenhal]

Not sure I understand the end-game auto-save that takes you to camp.  First, it seems to occur before any discussion in the palace, so it won't take account of your decision to search for Morrigan.  Also, now that I've run the Morrigan mod, so long as her approval is 90 or below (she can still be in "love"), she'll still sleep with you in camp.  Gratifying, but it does sort of mess up the plot.

[TheBlackBaron]

Grendenhal wrote...

I'm ashamed to say I romanced both Morrigan and Leliana -- I couldn't resist either. I was in active romances with both at the end. I got the "ring" epilogue as well as the "travels with Leliana" epilogue. I went straight to WH and was able to go through the portal. But I haven't done Awakenings yet -- don't know if playing through it would somehow mess up WH.

Hey, I did the same thing. The banter is priceless and far too witty to pass up.

In any event, I would recommend doing Awakenings, then running through WH again. Do Golems of Amgarrak between them, if you feel like it. 

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 30 janvier 2011 - 05:27 .

[Master Shiori]

Grendenhal wrote...

Not sure I understand the end-game auto-save that takes you to camp.  First, it seems to occur before any discussion in the palace, so it won't take account of your decision to search for Morrigan.  Also, now that I've run the Morrigan mod, so long as her approval is 90 or below (she can still be in "love"), she'll still sleep with you in camp.  Gratifying, but it does sort of mess up the plot.

Considering that Awakening puts you in a role of Warden Commander of Vigil's Keep regardless of what you choose to do at post-coronation, I'd say your decisions at the end of Origins don't really matter.
Especially since any Warden who romanced Morrigan and retained the "in love" status with her until the end will get the appropriate epilogue slide in Awakening, regardless of what he told Alistair/Anora.

[Morrigans God son]

ERk314 wrote...

Here's what I did:

Romanced Morrigan and Leliana
Got ring
Broke up with Morrigan (forgot to reload after doing so to break up with Leliana, as I was getting the achievement for Leliana)
Gave Morrigan the mirror
Did DR
Didn't talk to Morrigan at Fort Drakon
Didn't get sorrow and regret at the end of Origins

Was unable to get a post-epilogue save

Imported to Awakening
Got the search for Morrigan epilogue

Imported to GoA

Imported to WH
Got acknowledgement that the DR was undertaken
Was told about my child (old god)
Couldn't follow her through the portal ("We were friends, once.")

All I wanted was to follow her through the portal.

Wait, wait, wait. Can Morrigan refuse you to enter the mirror with her?

[ximena]

Morrigans God son wrote...

ERk314 wrote...

Here's what I did:

Romanced Morrigan and Leliana
Got ring
Broke up with Morrigan (forgot to reload after doing so to break up with Leliana, as I was getting the achievement for Leliana)
Gave Morrigan the mirror
Did DR
Didn't talk to Morrigan at Fort Drakon
Didn't get sorrow and regret at the end of Origins

Was unable to get a post-epilogue save

Imported to Awakening
Got the search for Morrigan epilogue

Imported to GoA

Imported to WH
Got acknowledgement that the DR was undertaken
Was told about my child (old god)
Couldn't follow her through the portal ("We were friends, once.")

All I wanted was to follow her through the portal.

Wait, wait, wait. Can Morrigan refuse you to enter the mirror with her?

As far as I know, the game "Refuses" you to go with Morrigan through the portal if the love flag isn't triggered. So if Morrigan isn't "in love," you can't choose the go through the mirror choice because it's not available.

[Brockololly]

TheBlackBaron wrote...
Brock has waxed eloquently on what Witch Hunt, as a full-on expansion, could have been like. I agree, it would be a poor design choice to have the entire expansion focus on the romance, but the oft-quoted codex entry WH gives you at the beginning gives the sense of a much larger hunt going on, with various organizations all having their own motives for searching for Morrigan. 

Kind of like how LotSB was definitely partly there to appease angry Liara fans (I'm still waiting for my Ashley DLC by the way, Bioware), but even those Sheps that didn't romance her had reasons to go through the storyline. 

Yup, there are a million and one ways they could have expanded on the plot of Witch Hunt into something which all Wardens would be interested in, not unlike Shadow Broker and Liara or even how the codex entry for the Orlesian in Witch Hunt sets up things:



And in terms of even bringing the Warden back in the future, its the same way. I hate reading on the DA2 forums how its impossible to bring the Warden back. Obviously the plot would need the Wardens involved, but then you have people that go "OH, but my Warden ditched the Wardens and became a bronto rancher, living in seclusion with Leliana!" Thats what I don't get- nevermind that all the Wardens vanish, setting them on the same page, but you simply have the fact that you can't abandon being a Warden, as its in your damn blood. The easy solution (unless your Warden wants to die) is to have the Warden commander task you with something and the reward is to cure the Taint. That way it provides the "I hate Wardens!" type Wardens some incentive.

I just think that despite spending time as  a Warden PC in Origins and Awakening, we really know next to nothing on how the Wardens overall work or any of their secrets. Anderfels for DA3!

Grendenhal wrote...

I'm ashamed to say I romanced both  Morrigan and Leliana -- I couldn't resist either. I was in active  romances with both at the end. I got the "ring" epilogue as well as the "travels with Leliana" epilogue. I went straight to WH and was able to go through the portal. But I haven't done Awakenings yet -- don't know if playing through it would somehow mess up WH.

No, the banter between Leliana and Morrigan when you're sort of romancing both is priceless. Of course, I usually break it off with Leliana, which makes you feel like a jerk, but Morrigan>Leliana.

Grendenhal wrote...

Not sure I understand the end-game  auto-save that takes you to camp.  First, it seems to occur before any  discussion in the palace, so it won't take account of your decision to  search for Morrigan.  Also, now that I've run the Morrigan mod, so long  as her approval is 90 or below (she can still be in "love"), she'll  still sleep with you in camp.  Gratifying, but it does sort of mess up  the plot.

Its stupid- its just that way so they could have it so you could play DLC after finishing the game.  Even though the only DLC lthat works that way is Warden's Keep and Return to Ostagar.Thats another thing I'm not too keen on with DA2- from a recent interview, Laidlaw mentioned DA2 DLC will likely be sort of missing episodes from Hawke's adventures in the 10 year time span, not necessarily stuff that occurs chronologically after the end of DA2.

Master Shiori wrote...
Especially since any Warden who romanced Morrigan and retained the "in love" status with her until the end will get the appropriate epilogue slide in Awakening, regardless of what he told Alistair/Anora.

Is that the case though? I thought if you said you were staying behind at Denerim or were rebuilding the Wardens then that might affect the epilogue slide? Can't remember...

Modifié par Brockololly, 30 janvier 2011 - 04:17 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Let's also not forget the Dragon cultists that were there for some odd reason. Are they Morrigan's lackeys? Did they follow her here? Or do they intend to worship Dragon bones?

Also, I noticed that officially, WH starts out a year after Origins (or was it Awakening). But in the map, I think if you inspect Vigil's Keep, it says 2 and a half years after the events of Awakening.

I think it's pretty clear that it was conceived as an expansion but dropped at some point. Maybe poor sales from Awakening? What should have been done is try to merge Awakening with WH (the concept of Awakening can be linked to the OGB). Or drop Awakening completely and deal with Morrigan.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 janvier 2011 - 04:22 .

[Lord_Anthonior]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Let's also not forget the Dragon cultists that were there for some odd reason. Are they Morrigan's lackeys? Did they follow her here? Or do they intend to worship Dragon bones?

Also, I noticed that officially, WH starts out a year after Origins (or was it Awakening). But in the map, I think if you inspect Vigil's Keep, it says 2 and a half years after the events of Awakening.

I think it's pretty clear that it was conceived as an expansion but dropped at some point. Maybe poor sales from Awakening? What should have been done is try to merge Awakening with WH (the concept of Awakening can be linked to the OGB). Or drop Awakening completely and deal with Morrigan.

  Indeed we could theorize why the cultist were there? I'm willing to think that they were there because of the bones. To them the dragons are the most important meaningful creatures to learn from their power, secrets and blood, maybe they did saw Morrigan going inside (it's been a while since I play so I forgot the name of the building) and they just mind their business with the dragons...or Maybe Morrigan did talk with them and ask them to stall any visitor if possible or persuade them that anyone might be dangerous and to attack them.

If it is the the romanceable Warden...then I don't know, I think they are just there by coincidence and not by Morrigan's orders for she was waiting for him and if the Warden from Origins and in romance doesn't go with her, I think that her face before walking through the mirror is more of sadness than any evil or scorn feeling.

What I did heard since the beginning of WH was that has been a year but if there are dialogues that it has been longer than a year...then the notion that WH was meant to be an expansion would have been most excellent and they just didn't covered their tracks and left some evidence to ponder..."there is no such thing as a perfect crime" hahahaha.

Anderfels for DA3!!! I support that idea Brock, that would definitely opens a possibility for the Warden and it's just up to the writers to channel through the way to bring Morrigan back and her participation. Hopefully as the franchise moves with each game it will also offer the chance to see more of Thedas. (ideally with Morrigan and the Warden but I know...too soon to tell)

Brockololly wrote...
No, the banter between Leliana and Morrigan when you're sort of
romancing both is priceless. Of course, I usually break it off with
Leliana, which makes you feel like a jerk, but Morrigan>Leliana.[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/wizard.png[/smilie]

Hahaha I did the same thing and with the restoration patch we can even see Leliana taking the cat claws out hehehe, no disrespect to Leliana, she is a nice girl, good friend, useful archer and funny with her banters and cat fights but yeah...Morrigan>Leliana :happy:

So that's how it will possibly be regarding the DLC's for DA2? lost episodes during the 10 year span? I suppose that those episodes will not have any impact at the end since everything goes forward to become the champion wich Hawke already is. 

Anyway I will look forward to the DLC's and see wich ones to get, as for Origins the only one I didn't bought was Darkspawn Chronicles for I saw no reason in going "fringe" with a parallel universe without the warden, everything goes down in flames if the main character dies.

Damn, I have to trail back to previous pages because I do remember "Morrigan's omellete" but I don't remember how that comment came to be  though I think they were delicious.

[MKDAWUSS]

Brockololly wrote...

And in terms of even bringing the Warden back in the future, its the same way. I hate reading on the DA2 forums how its impossible to bring the Warden back. Obviously the plot would need the Wardens involved, but then you have people that go "OH, but my Warden ditched the Wardens and became a bronto rancher, living in seclusion with Leliana!" Thats what I don't get- nevermind that all the Wardens vanish, setting them on the same page, but you simply have the fact that you can't abandon being a Warden, as its in your damn blood. The easy solution (unless your Warden wants to die) is to have the Warden commander task you with something and the reward is to cure the Taint. That way it provides the "I hate Wardens!" type Wardens some incentive.

I just think that despite spending time as  a Warden PC in Origins and Awakening, we really know next to nothing on how the Wardens overall work or any of their secrets. Anderfels for DA3!

I think the closest one gets to overcoming the Taint (and delaying/evading the Calling) is with Avernus's experiments. Once again, all the variables are back into play - not everyone drank his concoction, not everyone let him live.

Also, didn't each post-Origins story shoehorn the Warden's path? I mean, each didn't care if your Warden decided to travel across Thedas, singing songs with Leliana, if your Warden went to Seheron with Sten and wound up adopting the Qun, or if your Warden decided to take up basket weaving. I mean, the joke here around GOA's release was that the Warden continued to delay his search for Morrigan FCOL.

Hopefully we can see more of the Wardens in DA3, given that the Warden spent essentially no time around the Grey Warden order itself, but if we do, there should be an option to do it as the Warden, as he has the strongest reasons to visit them. But then again, if DA2 is any indication, we may be phasing the Wardens out.

(And yes, I do think DA3 has gotten started, and is in its concept stage ATM)

[KnightofPhoenix]

Lord_Anthonior wrote...
Damn, I have to trail back to previous pages because I do remember "Morrigan's omellete" but I don't remember how that comment came to be  though I think they were delicious.

We came to the conclusion that it meant Morrigan's special area lol
Not sure how and why.

As for the Wardens showing up as an organization. I would like it if it involves the political implications vis a vis the First Warden's plans. Maybe even a Warden civil war between the more political minded wardens vs the conservatives.

But I am not sure that the Warden  is sufficiently linked with the wardens as an order to be involved. I really think that the Warden, especially one that follows Morrigan, transcends all this. Or alternatively becomes so irrelevent to all issues and disapears.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 janvier 2011 - 06:00 .

[Ace Attorney]

How is it possible to end the game having active romances with both Morrigan and Leliana? Anyone care to explain?
Is it possible to get the Epilogues needed for WH while romancing both?

Modifié par T3hAnubis, 30 janvier 2011 - 06:24 .

[Lord_Anthonior]

Lord_Anthonior wrote...
Damn, I have to trail back to previous pages because I do remember "Morrigan's omellete" but I don't remember how that comment came to be  though I think they were delicious.

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
We came to the conclusion that it meant Morrigan's special area lol
Not sure how and why.

That's why I was sure it was delicious!! but yeah, I don't remember how it started but the conclussion is what matters.

As for the Wardens showing up as an organization. I would like it if it involves the political implications vis a vis the First Warden's plans. Maybe even a Warden civil war between the more political minded wardens vs the conservatives.

But I am not sure that the Warden  is sufficiently linked with the wardens as an order to be involved. I really think that the Warden, especially one that follows Morrigan, transcends all this. Or alternatively becomes so irrelevent to all issues and disapears.

"vis a vis"  towards, in relation, accordance.... c'mon, don't deny that it was bound to be said. The matrix architect has the fault for making "vis a vis" prone into a joke, though it does goes with the sentence perfectly but the flashback was too good to let it pass.  Having said that...a warden's civil war....well...those folks at weisshaupt aren't as other wardens around thedas so is not entirely far fetched. The sapient darkspawn would be glad to see the wardens into a fight as they did with the mother vs the architect.

I doubt Morrigan would be interested or convinced to let the Warden go into that "pointless" fight OR she could help him making them both PC's and we are back with a game to play. Politcal unrest and dessidence within the ranks of an ancient order, creatures waiting for the inner brawl to strike in small riots, the warden returning, Morrigan appearing, the OGB also appearing and becoming a target of templars, chantry , cultist, darkspawn and even Flemeth if she is still alive.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Lord_Anthonior wrote...
I doubt Morrigan would be interested or convinced to let the Warden go into that "pointless" fight OR she could help him making them both PC's and we are back with a game to play. Politcal unrest and dessidence within the ranks of an ancient order, creatures waiting for the inner brawl to strike in small riots, the warden returning, Morrigan appearing, the OGB also appearing and becoming a target of templars, chantry , cultist, darkspawn and even Flemeth if she is still alive.

The Warden and Morrigan orchestrating a perfectly executed Xanatos Roulette, manipulating and backstabbing several factions and groups, before imposing their dominion on Thedas and bringing about the required "Change"!
It would be....perfect


BTW, what do you guys think of the epilogue slide that has Morrigan inflitrate the imperial court of Orlais? Obviously it was rendered irrelevent. But I still found it interesting that Morrigan would bother with wordly politics (and actually be good at it!). Do you think Orlais has any significance to her grand design, if she had one?

And yes I expected the Architect joke

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 janvier 2011 - 06:27 .

[Morrigans God son]

Wow. No Wonder Morrigan left Thedas then lol. A lot of people want her dead. I'm glad my warden went with her.

[Grendenhal]

T3hAnubis wrote...

How is it possible to end the game having active romances with both Morrigan and Leliana? Anyone care to explain?
Is it possible to get the Epilogues needed for WH while romancing both?

You have to be careful with the "jealousy" dialogues.  But each is only triggered once, so if you navigate them successfully, you won't be hampered with them again.  I've heard you can actually break up with a character so long as you do it gently then rekindle the romance -- that's one way.  But I've never tried it.  What I do is romance Morrigan first, then become warm to Leliana.  That will trigger Morrigan's jealousy dialogue, even though you haven't really started a romance with Leliana.  But Morrigan doesn't really require you to do anything other than declare your preference for her.  You don't have to actually break up with Leliana; Morrigan  just expects you to talk to Leliana and break it off.  Which, of course, you don't.  Similarly, when Leliana confronts you, choose the most vague, non-committal responses possible. 

That said, I really do feel like a jerk two-timing them.  I had always planned on keeping things at friendship with Leliana, until I realized that I would lose Morrigan forever and decided to hedge my bets.  Not really an excuse, but the sadness at the end is certainly mitigated by getting to travel with Leliana for a while.

[Grendenhal]

ximena wrote...

As far as I know, the game "Refuses" you to go with Morrigan through the portal if the love flag isn't triggered. So if Morrigan isn't "in love," you can't choose the go through the mirror choice because it's not available.

Morrigan doesn't have to be in "love" -- I was at friendship, albeit with 100 approval, at the end, but still got to go through the portal in WH.  This was before I used the Morrigan mod.  Pre-mod, I think she moved from love to friendship after the "about last night" conversation, although she may have done so automatically after the ritual.  I think you probably had to romance her to go through the portal; not sure whether you had to accept her ritual or not.  It certainly helps to keep the Morrigan ring, which she poignantly refers to in WH if you've kept it.

By the way, she also refers to the ring in DAO if you choose her to rescue you from Fort Drakon.  That was one of my favorite parts of the game:  I sent Morrigan and Leliana after me (they actually managed to get along).  And Morrigan's lame attempt to pose as a Chantry cleric was priceless.

[Jarlof Seoul]

[quote]Grendenhal wrote...

[quote]ximena wrote...

As far as I know, the game "Refuses" you to go with Morrigan through the portal if the love flag isn't triggered. So if Morrigan isn't "in love," you can't choose the go through the mirror choice because it's not available. [/quote]

Morrigan doesn't have to be in "love" -- I was at friendship, albeit with 100 approval, at the end, but still got to go through the portal in WH.  This was before I used the Morrigan mod.  Pre-mod, I think she moved from love to friendship after the "about last night" conversation, although she may have done so automatically after the ritual.  I think you probably had to romance her to go through the portal; not sure whether you had to accept her ritual or not.  It certainly helps to keep the Morrigan ring, which she poignantly refers to in WH if you've kept it.

By the way, she also refers to the ring in DAO if you choose her to rescue you from Fort Drakon.  That was one of my favorite parts of the game:  I sent Morrigan and Leliana after me (they actually managed to get along).  And Morrigan's lame attempt to pose as a Chantry cleric was priceless.[/quote

I did the same thing in my original DAO playthrough, with a Morri/Lelli rescue team. Most memorable experience!

[Brockololly]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
BTW, what do you guys think of the epilogue slide that has Morrigan inflitrate the imperial court of Orlais? Obviously it was rendered irrelevent. But I still found it interesting that Morrigan would bother with wordly politics (and actually be good at it!). Do you think Orlais has any significance to her grand design, if she had one?

Personally, I'm of the mind that either the mythical 2nd expansion pack or DA2 might have been set in Orlais originally. There are just so many hints pointing to Orlais.

As for why Morrigan was there? The only thing I can think of is something to do with the Urthemiel Plateau thats in western Orlais. As to why she'd insinuate herself in the Court? Good question. I just can't see her engaging in Orlesian politics, given her distaste for civilization's rules and society. I picture her as more of a Rasputin type advisor, maybe using Blood magic to influence the Queen?


Oh, and as an FYI, check out this thread regarding the February 1st mystery date. Seems it may be a demo for DA2.

Modifié par Brockololly, 31 janvier 2011 - 04:38 .

[MKDAWUSS]

Brockololly wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
BTW, what do you guys think of the epilogue slide that has Morrigan inflitrate the imperial court of Orlais? Obviously it was rendered irrelevent. But I still found it interesting that Morrigan would bother with wordly politics (and actually be good at it!). Do you think Orlais has any significance to her grand design, if she had one?

Personally, I'm of the mind that either the mythical 2nd expansion pack or DA2 might have been set in Orlais originally. There are just so many hints pointing to Orlais.

As for why Morrigan was there? The only thing I can think of is something to do with the Urthemiel Plateau thats in western Orlais. As to why she'd insinuate herself in the Court? Good question. I just can't see her engaging in Orlesian politics, given her distaste for civilization's rules and society. I picture her as more of a Rasputin type advisor, maybe using Blood magic to influence the Queen?


Oh, and as an FYI, check out this thread regarding the February 1st mystery date. Seems it may be a demo for DA2.

I was under the impression that she might have gone there to get a child, essentially making Morrigan having a child part of the canon storyline (considering that she ends up with one if the Warden sleeps with her under any situation). Why Orlais? I guess she would have been too easily found by people who might know her in Ferelden...

[KnightofPhoenix]

Doesn't explain why she would infiltrate the imperial court though.

[TheBlackBaron]

Brockololly wrote...
Oh, and as an FYI, check out this thread regarding the February 1st mystery date. Seems it may be a demo for DA2.

It's about damn time.

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Doesn't explain why she would infiltrate the imperial court though.

Maybe she figures it's her best chance to get access to a Grey Warden? If you wanna go with the "she's trying to get a child" theory. 

Although I'm not sure why she'd still be attempting that, since there's no Archdemon soul to grab. 

[Brockololly]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Doesn't explain why she would infiltrate the imperial court though.

Could be that maybe some aspect of her Master Plan or the big "Change" requires something in Orlais and her insinuating herself in the COurt might make what she has to do there in the future that much easier? Kind of thinking ahead maybe?

In any event, its not entirely clear that she didn't get up to something in Orlais between the end of Origins and Witch Hunt. Maybe she did go over there and came back?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Maybe she sought some ancient powerful artifact that belongs to the imperial family. She does seem to be looking for stuff in her quest for power, to prepare for what's coming ahead.

[Brockololly]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Maybe she sought some ancient powerful artifact that belongs to the imperial family. She does seem to be looking for stuff in her quest for power, to prepare for what's coming ahead.

Yeah, that could be it. Just as she sought the Dalish book by getting in the Dalish clan's good graces and then running off.


Haha- now I 'm picturing Morrigan either as an Indiana Jones style archeologist recovering lost artifacts or some catwoman style burglar stealing from Orlesian aristocracy.

Modifié par Brockololly, 31 janvier 2011 - 05:23 .