16183 réponses à ce sujet

[Deventh]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

But let's face it, if they keep the same engine, I doubt they will be able to replicate this perfection

If they ruin her pretty face i will never forgive them <_<

[MegaBadExample]

I'm going to play Origins again, instead of playing another playthrough on DA2.

I really hope they don't use the same engine and art style for DA3 now. I don't think BioWare could make a decent Morrigan pixel with what they're currently using. I'm so thankful, she didn't show up in DA2. It would of been horrible, no doubt. I was dreading it near the end though...*SPOILER*  I kept expecting Morrigan to walk out of Merrill's mirror.

DA2 isn't even in the same league as Origins...
Morrigan return in DA3? I hope so!

Modifié par MegaBadExample, 15 mars 2011 - 03:09 .

[Gennojo Ryuga]

Does any of the romance options even come close to how awesome and special the Morrigan romance was?

I heard most if not all the romances were lame and underwhelming in comparison.

[Xilizhra]

Anders and Merrill, easily. I know less about Isabela and Fenris.

[Gennojo Ryuga]

Also I am curious, chronologically when does witch hunt take place? Bioware can simply handwave when events happen to make the time line work.

[Deventh]

Gennojo Ryuga wrote...

Does any of the romance options even come close to how awesome and special the Morrigan romance was?

I heard most if not all the romances were lame and underwhelming in comparison.

Well i romanced Isabela only and they have things in common like the thing about Love.
Isabela don't want it, but in the end she will love you.

[MKDAWUSS]

Gennojo Ryuga wrote...

Does any of the romance options even come close to how awesome and special the Morrigan romance was?

I heard most if not all the romances were lame and underwhelming in comparison.

Not really, especially when given the context of a 7 year period.

[Brockololly]

Gennojo Ryuga wrote...

Does any of the romance options even come close to how awesome and special the Morrigan romance was?

I heard most if not all the romances were lame and underwhelming in comparison.

I wouldn't say so, only having romanced Isabela with my male Warrior Hawke. Maybe some of the other ones are better, but I don't think I'd want to romance Merrill- she seems like the best friend type, not the romance lets make kissy faces type.

I just really hated the heart icon for the romances in DA2- IMO, it kills any sense of achievement you might get in picking the right dialogue to get a romance going and its basically BioWare spoon feeding you the romance lines like you're an idiot and couldn't figure them out yourself so BioWare has to step in Cyrano de Bergerac style.

I mean, I liked in DAO picking certain dialogue and wondering how an NPC might react. WIth the heart icon its like you have to pick that any time it comes up.


And I'm pretty sure Gaider mentioned in the DA2 forums that while most companions had a similar amount of dialogue as Origins, thats with the exception of Alistair and Morrigan, who had more than either of the DA2 companions.

I think that maybe with the exception of Anders, none of the romances have a real integral role in the plot like Alistair and Morrigan and that lessens things with the DA2 romances a bit.

Gennojo Ryuga wrote...

Also I am curious, chronologically
when does witch hunt take place? Bioware can simply handwave when events
happen to make the time line work.

Nobody knows for sure- on the Witch Hunt web page, it says:

Nearly a year has passed since the Archdemon's death, and word has reached the Wardens that Morrigan has returned to Ferelden.

So that seems to put it at least one year post Origins. But in Witch Hunt when you look at the descriptions of Vigil's Keep and Denerim, it sounds like "several" years have passed since the Archdemon died or you defeated the Mother in Awakening.

So I'd guess WH takes place anywhere from maybe 1 year post Origins or up to maybe 3 years post Origins max.

[Mustang678]

I just made a post in registered DA2 forums about differences between how companions are presented in the two games. I'd appreciate anyone's thoughts or contributions as I see a lot of you here raising some good points http://social.biowar...5/index/6571989

[MKDAWUSS]

Brockololly wrote...

I just really hated the heart icon for the romances in DA2- IMO, it kills any sense of achievement you might get in picking the right dialogue to get a romance going and its basically BioWare spoon feeding you the romance lines like you're an idiot and couldn't figure them out yourself so BioWare has to step in Cyrano de Bergerac style.

I mean, I liked in DAO picking certain dialogue and wondering how an NPC might react. WIth the heart icon its like you have to pick that any time it comes up.

And in DAO any comment on an NPC's appearance immediately triggered a romantic attraction...

TBH, the icons were more helpful than the accompanying text. Did you want to sound peaceful, funny, or aggressive? There should have been subsets to each option, like the investigate choice.

[MoSa09]

Wow.

Here i was a taking a few months of DA/BW break, and i see this thread is till here and i missed a 100 pages. I can't catch up all 100 pages, so any Morrigan related revelations i missed, or interesting theories. DA 2 certainly missed out on the that, or sheding any light on Flemeth while we are at it.

[Swoo]

Brockololly wrote...

Gennojo Ryuga wrote...

Does any of the romance options even come close to how awesome and special the Morrigan romance was?

I heard most if not all the romances were lame and underwhelming in comparison.

I wouldn't say so, only having romanced Isabela with my male Warrior Hawke. Maybe some of the other ones are better, but I don't think I'd want to romance Merrill- she seems like the best friend type, not the romance lets make kissy faces type.

Merrill's was crap. I honestly have considered going back to the save before her and shooting down the romance, since my Act III is totally unplayable thanks to bugs (yay being locked in Castillion's warehouse!), and finishing it off with Isabela in the 'starring as your pseudo-half-arsed girlfriend, Pirate Chick!'.

But yeah, other than one little bit about just how much better Hightown is, and a two line codex entry, I see nothing that looks like it's changed or opened up via romance/ non-romance with her. I'm guessing that's DA2's romance system which truly is a make up your own bits between the (very empty) lines.

[MoSa09]

Swoo wrote...

Merrill's was crap. I honestly have considered going back to the save before her and shooting down the romance, since my Act III is totally unplayable thanks to bugs (yay being locked in Castillion's warehouse!), and finishing it off with Isabela in the 'starring as your pseudo-half-arsed girlfriend, Pirate Chick!'.

But yeah, other than one little bit about just how much better Hightown is, and a two line codex entry, I see nothing that looks like it's changed or opened up via romance/ non-romance with her. I'm guessing that's DA2's romance system which truly is a make up your own bits between the (very empty) lines.

i followed Merrill's romance all the way through and kinda liked it alone. I heard a lot about the bug, seems to happen to most people. Whats exactly happening if you have the bug, or not happening?

[Brockololly]

MoSa09 wrote...
i followed Merrill's romance all the way through and kinda liked it alone. I heard a lot about the bug, seems to happen to most people. Whats exactly happening if you have the bug, or not happening?

The bug that I had was that at the start of Act 3 you go to talk to her for the first time and you get what should be the last dialogue cutscene with her for that Act, after you've done her quest. So she's all emotional saying all this stuff when nothing has happened yet- so the game basically spoils her personal quest since you haven't even done it yet.

And I don't think you missed much MoSa- probably just more long winded rants on DA2 and the state of the gaming industry, with some Morrigan and Flemeth stuff sprinkled in.

[Swoo]

Brockololly wrote...

MoSa09 wrote...
i followed Merrill's romance all the way through and kinda liked it alone. I heard a lot about the bug, seems to happen to most people. Whats exactly happening if you have the bug, or not happening?

The bug that I had was that at the start of Act 3 you go to talk to her for the first time and you get what should be the last dialogue cutscene with her for that Act, after you've done her quest. So she's all emotional saying all this stuff when nothing has happened yet- so the game basically spoils her personal quest since you haven't even done it yet.

And I don't think you missed much MoSa- probably just more long winded rants on DA2 and the state of the gaming industry, with some Morrigan and Flemeth stuff sprinkled in.

That confused the hell out of me because it happened right after a time-jump, so I thought it happened off-stage, but newp...just another Act III bug.

Fenris doesn't seem to be firing any that I've seen so far either.

[TheBlackBaron]

Gennojo Ryuga wrote...

Does any of the romance options even come close to how awesome and special the Morrigan romance was?

I heard most if not all the romances were lame and underwhelming in comparison.

Merril's isn't bad, although it isn't anything special in of itself - most of what I like about her is still present when she's just a friend. Couldn't tell you much about the others, my Hawke flirted with Anders a bit and had a one night stand with Isabela, but she didn't go much further than that. The Act 3 bug is pretty terribad, though I can't say I didn't see it coming. 

To be honest, most of the companions I don't like any more or less than the bulk of the Origins crew. Isabela is funny, Merril is adorkable, Bethany is awesome from little you get with her, but nobody else really stands out too much (which is a shame in Ander's case). They just kind of sit there in the background, same as Oghren and Shale and such did for me back in Origins. 

Varric is an exception. I haven't decided yet, but he may yet manage to match Alistair. 

Anyhow...what's the verdict on Teagan's line about the Warden being in Denerim? My first instinct is "bug", naturally, but the plot summary from the import screen seems to correctly interpret that he went through the mirror with Morrigan. 

EDIT: Also on the bug front, does Fenris actually have quests, or is the issue that I'm not taking him anywhere? Nothing's fired for him since the beginning of Year Four. 

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 16 mars 2011 - 03:57 .

[Brockololly]

TheBlackBaron wrote...
Anyhow...what's the verdict on Teagan's line about the Warden being in Denerim? My first instinct is "bug", naturally, but the plot summary from the import screen seems to correctly interpret that he went through the mirror with Morrigan.

I don't know since apparently DA2 doesn't actually do anything with the DLC (Golems, WH) flags. SO if thats the case then I'd think its essentially a bug, as that contradicts the Awakening slide of the Warden vanishing and what Cassandra says at the end of DA2. Like I've said here and elsewhere, I can't imagine an Eluvian Warden just stopping back in Denerim to chat for a bit and then going off and disappearing again.

TheBlackBaron wrote...
EDIT: Also on the bug front, does Fenris actually have quests, or is the issue that I'm not taking him anywhere? Nothing's fired for him since the beginning of Year Four.

Fenris definitely has quests, although I'm not sure if in order to get them you need a certain level of friendship/rivalry?

[ejoslin]

Gennojo Ryuga wrote...

Does any of the romance options even come close to how awesome and special the Morrigan romance was?

I heard most if not all the romances were lame and underwhelming in comparison.

The romances are different.  I've only done Anders and Fenris, so maybe Isabela and Merrill are different, but at least the two I've done, they're far more damaged than the characters in Origins.  But the romances are done differently as well.  There are fewer dialogs, you can only talk to them at certain times, the approval system is very different.

There's not as much buildup in DA2 as there was in DAO, but DA2 is also a much shorter game.  Because of time skips there are some weird inconsistancies, but all in all, the romances in DA2 are excellent as well.  If anything, they may be a bit more emotionally engaging, but that could just be how damaged the LIs really are.  When I say emotionally engaging, that is not necessarily in a good-feeling type way.  Anders romance made me feel... without spoiling anything...  creeped out.  And I couldn't undo the path I was on after I wanted to get out.  I hated that feeling, but it was very intense anyway.  Fenris gives me all the squee and thensome, but David Gaider wrote him so I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

However, the female love interests may not have the same strong dynamic as the male ones do.  I don't know -- I doubt I'll do them any time soon.

Anyway, DA2 shouldn't be compared to DAO despite them having the same name.  Both are fabulous games, but both are very different.  I was prepared to hate DA2 -- but once I quit comparing it to DAO, I realized what a good game it really is.

Modifié par ejoslin, 16 mars 2011 - 05:18 .

[bl00dsh0t]

Fenris personal quest only triggers if you travel around with him in act 2, I managed to miss it on my second playthrough ;D Good old random encounter quests, or how i missed wynne and leliana's personal quests in origins becaues i didnt drag them around at the right approval level.... that is at least not the case this time, it seems to trigger no matter the friendship/rivalry.

Anyhow interesting to see that morrigan was in the game for 3 frames, now I am soiling myself about da3 though since laidlaw mentioned multiplayer as a possible inclusion in the future of the franchise on eurogamer ;D

And welcome back mosa ^^

[TheBlackBaron]

ejoslin wrote...

The romances are different.  I've only done Anders and Fenris, so maybe Isabela and Merrill are different, but at least the two I've done, they're far more damaged than the characters in Origins.  But the romances are done differently as well.  There are fewer dialogs, you can only talk to them at certain times, the approval system is very different.

There's not as much buildup in DA2 as there was in DAO, but DA2 is also a much shorter game.  Because of time skips there are some weird inconsistancies, but all in all, the romances in DA2 are excellent as well.  If anything, they may be a bit more emotionally engaging, but that could just be how damaged the LIs really are.  When I say emotionally engaging, that is not necessarily in a good-feeling type way.  Anders romance made me feel... without spoiling anything...  creeped out.  And I couldn't undo the path I was on after I wanted to get out.  I hated that feeling, but it was very intense anyway.  Fenris gives me all the squee and thensome, but David Gaider wrote him so I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

I don't personally find the time skips to be particularly inconsistent - if you can keep in mind the length of time that's passing, it does serve to make the romances have better natural progress than usually happens with Bioware RPGs. That's at least one aspect where they improved over DA:O. 

David G. wrote Fenris? Startin' to think I dodged a freaking bullet there. 

However, the female love interests may not have the same strong dynamic as the male ones do.  I don't know -- I doubt I'll do them any time soon.

For Merrill, things can get...dark, to say the least, but that's her main quest so I don't know if you can count that as being part of the romance. 

Anyway, DA2 shouldn't be compared to DAO despite them having the same name.  Both are fabulous games, but both are very different.  I was prepared to hate DA2 -- but once I quit comparing it to DAO, I realized what a good game it really is.

I think DA2 is a good game - maybe even very good, if I'm feeling generous - and a lot of the worst case scenarios I dreamed up did not come to pass. And, as I said above, there are parts where I feel it is a definite improvement over DA:O. It's just that there are at least an equal number of areas where I feel it regressed from it. 

In short, I could probably sum it up as "one step forward, two steps back". It's good, but not as good as its predecessor or the game it was trying to be (ME/ME2). 

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 16 mars 2011 - 06:05 .

[Deventh]

by http://yesspleasse.deviantart.com/

Modifié par Deventh, 16 mars 2011 - 06:14 .

[ejoslin]

TheBlackBaron wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

The romances are different.  I've only done Anders and Fenris, so maybe Isabela and Merrill are different, but at least the two I've done, they're far more damaged than the characters in Origins.  But the romances are done differently as well.  There are fewer dialogs, you can only talk to them at certain times, the approval system is very different.

There's not as much buildup in DA2 as there was in DAO, but DA2 is also a much shorter game.  Because of time skips there are some weird inconsistancies, but all in all, the romances in DA2 are excellent as well.  If anything, they may be a bit more emotionally engaging, but that could just be how damaged the LIs really are.  When I say emotionally engaging, that is not necessarily in a good-feeling type way.  Anders romance made me feel... without spoiling anything...  creeped out.  And I couldn't undo the path I was on after I wanted to get out.  I hated that feeling, but it was very intense anyway.  Fenris gives me all the squee and thensome, but David Gaider wrote him so I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

I don't personally find the time skips to be particularly inconsistent - if you can keep in mind the length of time that's passing, it does serve to make the romances have better natural progress than usually happens with Bioware RPGs. That's at least one aspect where they improved over DA:O. 

David G. wrote Fenris? Startin' to think I dodged a freaking bullet there. 

However, the female love interests may not have the same strong dynamic as the male ones do.  I don't know -- I doubt I'll do them any time soon.

For Merrill, things can get...dark, to say the least, but that's her main quest so I don't know if you can count that as being part of the romance. 

Anyway, DA2 shouldn't be compared to DAO despite them having the same name.  Both are fabulous games, but both are very different.  I was prepared to hate DA2 -- but once I quit comparing it to DAO, I realized what a good game it really is.

I think DA2 is a good game - maybe even very good, if I'm feeling generous - and a lot of the worst case scenarios I dreamed up did not come to pass. And, as I said above, there are parts where I feel it is a definite improvement over DA:O. It's just that there are at least an equal number of areas where I feel it regressed from it. 

In short, I could probably sum it up as "one step forward, two steps back". It's good, but not as good as its predecessor or the game it was trying to be (ME/ME2). 

The time skips DO present problems for both Fenris' and Anders' romances.  I can't say what without spoiling, but the three year gap makes zero sense in their relationships, and the events that happen after three years should have maybe happened in three months, year top (but that's really pushing it) for Fenris and maybe a day or two for Anders -- at least one part of Anders (actually, that event should have happened in Act 2).  I'll pm you if you want more details. I'm glad to hear that they don't for Merrill and for Isabela.

I do consider the main quest as part of the romance because, well, the LI's issues become yours to an extent.

One thing that I didn't think I'd like about DA2 which I love now is that you find out many more things about your companions through banters with each other instead of talking to them privately.  You still have some personal conversations with them, but you just learn so much about them running around with them.  Plus they're more talkative to quest givers and such.

Ah well.

Edit: **SPOILERS HERE WITH REGARDS TO THE MALE LIs**  If this doesn't gray out properly (it doesn't always) I'll erase.  These are major romance spoilers.

The problem with Anders is they agree to move in together, but you don't give him the key to the place until the beginning of act 3.  So you have you two in act 2 agreeing to live together, but it doesn't happen for three years.

The problem with Fenris is he has a serious issue with intimacy and runs out on Hawke, but to get back together with him, you must remain faithful.  That means that Fenris and Hawke are pining for each other for three years, without a relationship going on.  I rationalized it by thinking they got back together, but backed way off.  It still is just too long of a cooling off period.

Modifié par ejoslin, 16 mars 2011 - 07:15 .

[MoSa09]

Brockololly wrote...

The bug that I had was that at the start of Act 3 you go to talk to her for the first time and you get what should be the last dialogue cutscene with her for that Act, after you've done her quest. So she's all emotional saying all this stuff when nothing has happened yet- so the game basically spoils her personal quest since you haven't even done it yet.

never had that bug. Only had a party banter bug that the banter started somewhere in the middle, and then restarted at the beginning again. Weird but not game breaking

Brockololly wrote...

And I don't think you missed much MoSa- probably just more long winded rants on DA2 and the state of the gaming industry, with some Morrigan and Flemeth stuff sprinkled in.

Well, speaking of Flemeth, what a disappointment she was. Given she was the first face to be shown of DA 2 , i ecpected her to play a bigger role. Sure, BW never explicitly said that, but it certainly created a lot of assumptions and hopes. And then this. Well at least we know now that Morrigan is not her biological daughter. Not sure what that means, if that means anything at all. But desperates can't be picky i guess <_<

TheBlackBaron wrote...

EDIT: Also on the bug front, does
Fenris actually have quests, or is the issue that I'm not taking him
anywhere? Nothing's fired for him since the beginning of Year Four. 

He actually has a personal quest, or better said a few that keep being continued throughout the year. I believe you don't even need reputation with him, just talk to him every now and then. At least i did never take him anywhere, since i was the main dps, and still got his quest to the end.

ejoslin wrote...

However, the female love interests may
not have the same strong dynamic as the male ones do.  I don't know -- I
doubt I'll do them any time soon.

I actually happen to like the Merrill romance very much. She is very much like Tali, sweet and innocent, but it felt very good and rewarding to me.

bl00dsh0t wrote...

Fenris personal quest only triggers if
you travel around with him in act 2, I managed to miss it on my second
playthrough ;D Good old random encounter quests, or how i missed wynne
and leliana's personal quests in origins becaues i didnt drag them
around at the right approval level.... that is at least not the case
this time, it seems to trigger no matter the friendship/rivalry.

are you certain? Can't remember i ever had him in my team except for doing an already existing personal quest of his... Well, whatever

bl00dsh0t wrote...

Anyhow
interesting to see that morrigan was in the game for 3 frames,

WHAT? WHERE? HOW I missed that, tell me please

bl00dsh0t wrote...

now I am
soiling myself about da3 though since laidlaw mentioned multiplayer as a
possible inclusion in the future of the franchise on eurogamer ;D

multiplayer or online play? Multiplayer, each one controlling one party member is can be good. Online gaming, an DA mmo even...please god no!!!!

and having more players at the same time playing, i guess pause and play is history by then. Can't imagine playing with 3 people when every can pause as often and as long as they want.

bl00dsh0t wrote...

And welcome back mosa ^^

Thx

@ejoslin: Merrill is more or less the same. I believe that was done intentional, so the romance climax, despite its progress happens in act 3. A little cryptic, but i want to keep it spoiler free

Modifié par MoSa09, 16 mars 2011 - 10:46 .

[AuggyDoggysan]

Can someone provide a link to the video showing the "Dark Ritual Kiss" scene from the Terra_Ex's Morrigan Dialogue Restoration mod?