16183 réponses à ce sujet

[Addai]

Well that's why I'm not letting my Theirin fangirl do more than raise an eyebrow, yet. I'm wary of gimmicks. That, and because my interest level in Dragon Age in general is pretty low these days.

Since I'm here...  I haven't poked my nose in on the Morri thread in ages, so not sure if you have discussed this already.  I wonder what you think of Gaider's interview not long ago where he described the difficulties of carrying imports and being able to accommadate player choices with an ongoing story.  There was one part where from the contex it seemed like they were talking about the OGB, and he said they had a writer's meeting and when he asked the question on how to incorporate everything, there was long silence.  I have to say that, and the realization that they have no plans on doing anything with the Qunari in the next game (thus we are doomed to mage vs. templar for who knows how long)... both were pretty demoralizing.  The idea that they just threw the DR into the game without any long-range plan for how it was going to fit into the series, that doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in the storytelling.

Modifié par Addai67, 09 mars 2012 - 08:35 .

[Jarlof Seoul]

Addai67 wrote...

Well that's why I'm not letting my Theirin fangirl do more than raise an eyebrow, yet. I'm wary of gimmicks. That, and because my interest level in Dragon Age in general is pretty low these days.

Since I'm here...  I haven't poked my nose in on the Morri thread in ages, so not sure if you have discussed this already.  I wonder what you think of Gaider's interview not long ago where he described the difficulties of carrying imports and being able to accommadate player choices with an ongoing story.  There was one part where from the contex it seemed like they were talking about the OGB, and he said they had a writer's meeting and when he asked the question on how to incorporate everything, there was long silence.  I have to say that, and the realization that they have no plans on doing anything with the Qunari in the next game (thus we are doomed to mage vs. templar for who knows how long)... both were pretty demoralizing.  The idea that they just threw the DR into the game without any long-range plan for how it was going to fit into the series, that doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in the storytelling.

Indeed, that excellent discussion was covered. Nonetheless, you make a good point about how Dave Gaider's comments provide an precious albeit frightening glimpse into the development process in the BW inner sanctum. My glass half-full mind wants to say, "great, they are having the discussion about the DR--they haven't forgotten about it." My pessimist side on the other hand bemoans the diffusion of responsibility displayed by the slient reaction and the lack of any passionate artists besides the writers. I hate to think the developers as a collective, would not care at the end of the day to put the hardcore dark fantasy elements into DAIII. They edged back in the right direction with Legacy and the Corypheus/Golden city storyline. Anyway, I hope now as I did before I was pleasantly surprised with Witch Hunt. If Morr were to come back, I would hope there would be some development of the OGB plot. If I had to meet her as another character, indeed I would feel shackled in my reactions as opposed to acting like my Warden character. Such a thing would be more palatable based on the strength of a subsequent story. If only I could win the lottery and finance a Morrigan fan's dream DA sequel, with epic storyline on not just Templar's vs Mages but a second Qunari invasion a la Star Wars Yuuzhan Vong War. 

[Jarlof Seoul]

Addai67 wrote...

*peeks in*

Silent Grove spoilers



They do imply that Maric is alive and is a prisoner of the Crows. In the 2nd issue they break into a Crows prison and in the last panel, Alistair finds a man in a cell and says "KING MARIC?!" The old man (who does look like it could be Maric) says something like "it's too late, far too late." End comic. So, that could mean that the man you see is not actually Maric, for example the guy is saying "you're too late to save Maric," or it could be Maric who's in the cell and he's just being emo about something else.

I coudn't have summarized a better answer to Brock's question!

[Jarlof Seoul]

Believe it or not. I this post-TW2 and pre-DA3 dark age, I am fiddling with ME1. Its not DA but if its good I'll keep play and maybe get to ME2 and ME3 while awaiting more Morrigan related developments...

[Jarlof Seoul]

Speaking of ME1 is there any female romanceable character close to Morrigan caliber in that game?

[Addai]

Jarlof Seoul wrote...
My pessimist side on the other hand bemoans the diffusion of responsibility displayed by the slient reaction and the lack of any passionate artists besides the writers. I hate to think the developers as a collective, would not care at the end of the day to put the hardcore dark fantasy elements into DAIII.

That's a good summary of where I'm at, too.  I have very little confidence in Bioware as a developer.  Still some small faith in Gaider and Kirby's instincts, but it sounds like they get steamrolled by the design and corporate people and what gets spat out as an end product is the button-awesome fiasco that was almost everything post-DAO.

And, you're playing ME1?  If I have any advice to give on that franchise, it's try hard to like Liara.  She's the darling of the series.  There's no Morrigan except perhaps Jack, one of the ME2 romances, and that's a big "perhaps."  Also, you may or may not want to check out the fan reviews in the ME3 board.  You're likely to be spoilered just by the thread titles, but... it's brutal in there.  If you thought the DA2 board was bad...

Modifié par Addai67, 09 mars 2012 - 11:28 .

[Brockololly]

Addai67 wrote...
 I have to say that, and the realization that they have no plans on doing anything with the Qunari in the next game (thus we are doomed to mage vs. templar for who knows how long)... both were pretty demoralizing.  The idea that they just threw the DR into the game without any long-range plan for how it was going to fit into the series, that doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in the storytelling.

Yeah, I think I brought up that interview in the last couple of pages.

I just think that with DAO and DA2 things went like this: Brent Knowles and Dan Tudge left, putting Laidlaw and Darrah in charge. At that point, DAO was done and they had already started on Awakening and likely had significant plans or at least an outline of where they wanted to take the story.  DA2 started out as Dragon Age:Exodus, possibly even as a side story type expansion pack which at some point was greenlighted to be turned into a full game. This is when they killed off the supposed 2 years post release support for DA2, of which I'm guessing Witch Hunt was supposed to be part of one last expack involving the Warden.

Basically, I think BioWare and Gaider maybe did have some plan for future events going forward at some point, but DA2 screwed up those plans. And now they're on some level maybe trying to go back to what those plans were but not quite able to due to certain things being set in stone with DA2 (fixed protagonists, voiced PCs, abandoning the Warden and Origins too early).

But yeah, I am so sick of the Mages/Templars thing. It was awful in DA2 and Asunder was only slightly better in terms of having it a conflict I can care about.

Jarlof Seoul wrote...

Believe it or not. I this post-TW2  and pre-DA3 dark age, I am fiddling with ME1. Its not DA but if its good I'll keep play and maybe get to ME2 and ME3 while awaiting more  Morrigan related developments...

ME1 is a decent game with some nice moments. You should try Fallout: New Vegas too if you're looking for another RPG to play, if you haven't played it already.

Addai67 wrote...
That's a good summary of where I'm at,  too.  I have very little confidence in Bioware as a developer.  Still
some small faith in Gaider and Kirby's instincts, but it sounds like  they get steamrolled by the design and corporate people and what gets  spat out as an end product is the button-awesome fiasco that was almost  everything post-DAO.

Pretty much. I seem to recall Gaider saying flat out in one of the post DA2 interviews how the framed narrative idea, for instance, was completely Laidlaw's idea and really pushed that to get into the game. Especially with how BioWare keeps pushing the idea that they're all about making the best stories in games, they should give the writers a bit more weight in terms of overall design decisions in terms of trying to make the game a cohesive experience. I just question BioWare will ever be able to really get that together now that they seem dead set on EA's 2 year game cycle, with DA3 most likely releasing before March 2013.

Addai67 wrote...
And, you're playing ME1?  If I have any  advice to give on that franchise, it's try hard to like Liara.  She's  the darling of the series.  There's no Morrigan except perhaps Jack, one of the ME2 romances, and that's a big "perhaps."  Also, you may or may  not want to check out the fan reviews in the ME3 board.  You're likely  to be spoilered just by the thread titles, but... it's brutal in there.  If you thought the DA2 board was bad...

Hmmm... yeah. I"ve never been a big fan of most of the ME characters or romances really. I had my original Shepard romance Ash in ME1. Liara always seemed a bit touched in the head in ME1. In ME2, Miranda's romance was ok. I liked Jack's romance in ME2 and it seems Shep has a nice reunion with her in ME3 if you romanced her in ME2.

Modifié par Brockololly, 10 mars 2012 - 04:01 .

[Addai]

As much as I hated a lot of the design decisions in DA2, the straw that is breaking the back was not that but the questionable business model they are pushing. Manipulative, penny pinching, tone-deaf to fans' concerns. They don't seem to respect either their fans or what made them a success. They decided to make their space opera into a shooter (let's be honest, it always was, but the paper wrapping on that got torn off by ME2) and their fantasy franchise into a JRPG action game. It's staring us in the face with comments like "RPGs are increasingly irrelevant," but people don't want to believe it because it's Bioware.

So this is another reason why I am trying not to care about things like the comic. I don't want to care because I don't plan to buy another game from them unless they do a hard turn. ME3 signals they're still on the downward slide.

[Wulfram]

I think people don't want to believe it because there isn't really much of replacement. It's not like there are other companies coming out with games that are closer to the traditional Bioware RPG model.

[Jarlof Seoul]

Addai67 wrote...

Jarlof Seoul wrote...
My pessimist side on the other hand bemoans the diffusion of responsibility displayed by the slient reaction and the lack of any passionate artists besides the writers. I hate to think the developers as a collective, would not care at the end of the day to put the hardcore dark fantasy elements into DAIII.

That's a good summary of where I'm at, too.  I have very little confidence in Bioware as a developer.  Still some small faith in Gaider and Kirby's instincts, but it sounds like they get steamrolled by the design and corporate people and what gets spat out as an end product is the button-awesome fiasco that was almost everything post-DAO.

And, you're playing ME1?  If I have any advice to give on that franchise, it's try hard to like Liara.  She's the darling of the series.  There's no Morrigan except perhaps Jack, one of the ME2 romances, and that's a big "perhaps."  Also, you may or may not want to check out the fan reviews in the ME3 board.  You're likely to be spoilered just by the thread titles, but... it's brutal in there.  If you thought the DA2 board was bad...

Thanks for the advice on Liara. I know that at the very, very beginning of DAO I was torn between Lelianna and Morrigan, as the latter was a a bit of a beeotch, while the former seemed an interesting former nun turned roving rogue, but with a heart of gold. Soon after Lothering, I quickly warmed up to Morrrigan despite, and maybe  a bit because she was bad yet creaked a bit in the direction of potential goodness like Viconia in BGII. I never looked back since. Knowing Morrigan was the female romance character with the most "investment" plotwise due to the DR and then BW seemingly reluctant WH concession, I hate to pick a female romance in ME1 only for it to fizzle as would happen with a non-Morrigan romance option post DAO. Interestingly, in TW1 I chose Triss becuase she was cooler than Shani, although if I could have I would ahve stuck with Abigail the Witch whome I saved.

[Jarlof Seoul]

Brockololly wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
 I have to say that, and the realization that they have no plans on doing anything with the Qunari in the next game (thus we are doomed to mage vs. templar for who knows how long)... both were pretty demoralizing.  The idea that they just threw the DR into the game without any long-range plan for how it was going to fit into the series, that doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in the storytelling.

Yeah, I think I brought up that interview in the last couple of pages.

I just think that with DAO and DA2 things went like this: Brent Knowles and Dan Tudge left, putting Laidlaw and Darrah in charge. At that point, DAO was done and they had already started on Awakening and likely had significant plans or at least an outline of where they wanted to take the story.  DA2 started out as Dragon Age:Exodus, possibly even as a side story type expansion pack which at some point was greenlighted to be turned into a full game. This is when they killed off the supposed 2 years post release support for DA2, of which I'm guessing Witch Hunt was supposed to be part of one last expack involving the Warden.

Basically, I think BioWare and Gaider maybe did have some plan for future events going forward at some point, but DA2 screwed up those plans. And now they're on some level maybe trying to go back to what those plans were but not quite able to due to certain things being set in stone with DA2 (fixed protagonists, voiced PCs, abandoning the Warden and Origins too early).

But yeah, I am so sick of the Mages/Templars thing. It was awful in DA2 and Asunder was only slightly better in terms of having it a conflict I can care about.

Jarlof Seoul wrote...

Believe it or not. I this post-TW2  and pre-DA3 dark age, I am fiddling with ME1. Its not DA but if its good I'll keep play and maybe get to ME2 and ME3 while awaiting more  Morrigan related developments...

ME1 is a decent game with some nice moments. You should try Fallout: New Vegas too if you're looking for another RPG to play, if you haven't played it already.

Addai67 wrote...
That's a good summary of where I'm at,  too.  I have very little confidence in Bioware as a developer.  Still
some small faith in Gaider and Kirby's instincts, but it sounds like  they get steamrolled by the design and corporate people and what gets  spat out as an end product is the button-awesome fiasco that was almost  everything post-DAO.

Pretty much. I seem to recall Gaider saying flat out in one of the post DA2 interviews how the framed narrative idea, for instance, was completely Laidlaw's idea and really pushed that to get into the game. Especially with how BioWare keeps pushing the idea that they're all about making the best stories in games, they should give the writers a bit more weight in terms of overall design decisions in terms of trying to make the game a cohesive experience. I just question BioWare will ever be able to really get that together now that they seem dead set on EA's 2 year game cycle, with DA3 most likely releasing before March 2013.

Addai67 wrote...
And, you're playing ME1?  If I have any  advice to give on that franchise, it's try hard to like Liara.  She's  the darling of the series.  There's no Morrigan except perhaps Jack, one of the ME2 romances, and that's a big "perhaps."  Also, you may or may  not want to check out the fan reviews in the ME3 board.  You're likely  to be spoilered just by the thread titles, but... it's brutal in there.  If you thought the DA2 board was bad...

Hmmm... yeah. I"ve never been a big fan of most of the ME characters or romances really. I had my original Shepard romance Ash in ME1. Liara always seemed a bit touched in the head in ME1. In ME2, Miranda's romance was ok. I liked Jack's romance in ME2 and it seems Shep has a nice reunion with her in ME3 if you romanced her in ME2.

Thanks Brock. I'll keep it in mind. Maybe I can switch to Jack if I ever get to ME2 to make ME3 more --err-- rewarding . I'll take a look at Fallout LV. I'm always looking for a good RPG. DAO and TW series have spoled me as much as BG series and Ultima back in my younger days.

[Jarlof Seoul]

Addai67 wrote...

As much as I hated a lot of the design decisions in DA2, the straw that is breaking the back was not that but the questionable business model they are pushing. Manipulative, penny pinching, tone-deaf to fans' concerns. They don't seem to respect either their fans or what made them a success. They decided to make their space opera into a shooter (let's be honest, it always was, but the paper wrapping on that got torn off by ME2) and their fantasy franchise into a JRPG action game. It's staring us in the face with comments like "RPGs are increasingly irrelevant," but people don't want to believe it because it's Bioware.

So this is another reason why I am trying not to care about things like the comic. I don't want to care because I don't plan to buy another game from them unless they do a hard turn. ME3 signals they're still on the downward slide.

Sign of the times. Stay strong. Don't let the estalishment tell you what to like. I love my RPGs (imagine I said that like Dire Straits saying "I want my MTVEEEEE.." I am so thanful that at least in a Free Market, I can vote with my wallet. (The problem is the dumbing down of society--few enough appreciate a good story). RPGs: the ultimate escapism for your humble servant...

Modifié par Jarlof Seoul, 10 mars 2012 - 01:59 .

[Jarlof Seoul]

Wulfram wrote...

I think people don't want to believe it because there isn't really much of replacement. It's not like there are other companies coming out with games that are closer to the traditional Bioware RPG model.

Almost none: the Poles at CD Projekt sure score a couple of Grand Slams with Witcher 1 and Witcher 2.

Morrigan has BW's crowing character acheivement in the post Baldur's Gate era. Nothing as good since. 2009 seems so long ago.

Modifié par Jarlof Seoul, 10 mars 2012 - 02:01 .

[Wulfram]

Jarlof Seoul wrote...

Almost none: the Poles at CD Projekt sure score a couple of Grand Slams with Witcher 1 and Witcher 2.

The Witcher has a predefined protagonist and action based combat.  In terms of style of game, they're much closer to where Bioware are going than where they were.

(Plus I just plain didn't like Witcher 1)

[Jarlof Seoul]

Any new Morrigan art out there? Anybody? Anybody?...

[Lord_Anthonior]

Jarlof Seoul wrote...

Any new Morrigan art out there? Anybody? Anybody?...

I found this...wich I like because the use of light and also I would totally believe her using that spell in the deep roads...


by: SianOTAKU

[Jarlof Seoul]

Lord_Anthonior wrote...

Jarlof Seoul wrote...

Any new Morrigan art out there? Anybody? Anybody?...

I found this...wich I like because the use of light and also I would totally believe her using that spell in the deep roads...


by: SianOTAKU

Beautiful. I can see her using this spell as well. Thanks!

[Lazy Jer]

Just dropping in to say that Morrigan...great character. I especially love the fact that one of the few things that disturbs her is when Leliana wants to go shopping with her.

[Barbarossa2010]

Hi guys and gals, just thought I'd pop in and say that I thought the Dark Ritual sequence with Morrigan was one of the most contrived, out-of-character, choice pigeon-holing, "gotcha" moments in any video game I ever played...


***SPOILER ALERT****


...unitl I met Star Child in Mass Effect 3.



EDIT: Added spoiler tag.

Modifié par Barbarossa2010, 19 mars 2012 - 07:42 .

[Jarlof Seoul]

lol. hopefully I'll make it to ME3. That's about as close to Morrigan in the CRPG world at the moment...

[Barbarossa2010]

Don't get me wrong 98% of it is pure 24K gold Mass Effect fan service, then...well...you probably know the rest by now.

I'll just direct anyone to the forums if you haven't played it yet and really want to know.

I sure miss Morrigan though. Am actually thinking about firing up another playthrough for old times' sake before heading back to Skyrim and seeing what mods have emerged over the last couple of weeks.

[Brockololly]

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

Hi guys and gals, just thought I'd pop in and say that I thought the Dark Ritual sequence with Morrigan was one of the most contrived, out-of-character, choice pigeon-holing, "gotcha" moments in any video game I ever played...

The first thing I thought of when I got to the end of ME3 was that it was basically the Dark Ritual in terms of out of nowhere "Huh?" type reveals, except it was like the DR if you couldn't ask any questions. So in that respect, the DR scene looks like an absolute masterpiece compared to the end of ME3.

[Jarlof Seoul]

I might have to crank up DAO myself to take Morrigan out on a date. Slay some Darkspawn, followed up by a cozy fire at the Party Camp...

[Mr Plow]

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

Don't get me wrong 98% of it is pure 24K gold Mass Effect fan service, then...well...you probably know the rest by now.

I'll just direct anyone to the forums if you haven't played it yet and really want to know.

I sure miss Morrigan though. Am actually thinking about firing up another playthrough for old times' sake before heading back to Skyrim and seeing what mods have emerged over the last couple of weeks.

Sigh...ME3 and all that stuff has renewed my fondness for DAO - the last great RPG  they did 


Imagine DA3 may be like ME3 though 

Goodness knows what part Morrigan will play...probably a 2 minute cameo

Modifié par Mr Plow, 21 mars 2012 - 08:49 .

[ximena]

Spoilers from the Silent Grove #3

Another witch comes into the picture.



Hmmm. Morri's sister?