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[Addai]

Ok, I played out to the end and the epilogue felt very flat.  However, you do at least get some inkling of what's going on in that final convo, the one that prior to Terra_Ex's fix turned the romance off.  You get to ask Morrigan why she is leaving and it is obvious from her responses that she is deflecting and fighting off her feelings.  That allows my Warden to see that she does still love him, if not to give him any clue why she is doing what she's doing.  I can see why, prior to the fix, it was incredibly frustrating not to be able to have that conversation with her without turning the romance off.

All in all, it seems that you get the best responses both from the PC side and from Morrigan by a) refusing her the DR at first and going into the "then there is Alistair" talk, and having the final conversation.

The interaction with Alistair went off without a hitch.  He thought one of you was going to die, was confused why you didn't, and you got to tell him "Morrigan saved me."  I was pleased with that.  Odd that no one else commented on Morrigan being gone, but then not much happens at post-coronation anyway.  Uhh... I take it you can turn Leliana's romance on at post-coronation??  There was a line (I was afraid to pick it LOL) where you can say "do I get the girl?"

[Master Shiori]

Addai67 wrote...
  Uhh... I take it you can turn Leliana's romance on at post-coronation??  There was a line (I was afraid to pick it LOL) where you can say "do I get the girl?"

Yes, that turns on the romance with Leliana.
 
Never really understood why that line was there to begin with. Anyone who wanted to romane Leliana had probably already done so at that point.

[blademaster7]

It doesn't turn on the romance and it shouldn't be available to click. That's a bug.

The "does the hero get the girl" is supposed to be available if Leliana is in love according to the toolset. If she's not in love you still have that dialogue in the vanilla game, but as I said, it doesn't activate the romance and she will not remain with you if you choose it.

Loghain(if recruited) also questions you about how you survived. He says he finds it difficult to believe that Riordan deliberately misled you. He's a bit suspicious and wary of you but he doesn't push it. Much better reaction than Alistair IMO.

EDIT: Speaking of Alistair, I got no mention of him in my epilogue. Isn't he supposed to be a drunkard now?

Modifié par blademaster7, 01 mai 2010 - 08:55 .

[blademaster7]

The Archdemon battle was a joke btw. The bandits in Lothering gave me more trouble than that.


I don't know if I should play Awakening now... I'm way overpowered for that.

I'm thinking of starting a new game as a female 2-H warrior - Ser Cauthrien-like.

Modifié par blademaster7, 01 mai 2010 - 09:09 .

[Addai]

blademaster7 wrote...

It doesn't turn on the romance and it shouldn't be available to click. That's a bug.

The "does the hero get the girl" is supposed to be available if Leliana is in love according to the toolset. If she's not in love you still have that dialogue in the vanilla game, but as I said, it doesn't activate the romance and she will not remain with you if you choose it.

It's a very cruel line for a PC that romanced Morrigan.  

Loghain(if recruited) also questions you about how you survived. He says he finds it difficult to believe that Riordan deliberately misled you. He's a bit suspicious and wary of you but he doesn't push it. Much better reaction than Alistair IMO.

EDIT: Speaking of Alistair, I got no mention of him in my epilogue. Isn't he supposed to be a drunkard now?

If exiled, yes.  The one thing that felt off in the interaction with Alistair is that he was supposed to be my PC's friend, but rather than say something like "I know you cared for her, I'm sorry she's gone," he says "good riddance."  Hero of Ferelden Suckerpunches the King, film at 11.  At least he does say, if you tell him you intend to find Morrigan, that he understands.

Modifié par Addai67, 01 mai 2010 - 02:26 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

About the DR. Think of it this way. Maybe they thought it would be more of an act of faith if Morrigan switched back to her "icy" personality. It would make you think and doubt.

The fact that Morrigan was serious and less emotional about it made me take her very seriously. As I said before, any emotional attempts by Morrigan to win me over would have been interpretted as BS. Maybe because we think alike in many ways, but if I was in Morrigan's position, I would attempt to hide emotion as much as possible, only because I respect my loved one that I wouldn't use love as a instrument for convincing. 

That's Morrigan's position in my opinion. She loves and respects the PC in a way that she first doesnt' want to remind herself too much that she loves him and that she wouldn't want to use that love in an attempt to beg or gain sympathy. She isn't a bard. She might manipulate, but I don't think she likes to manipulate emotions, especially not the emotions of the person she loves. Otherwise, she would have said she loves you at the very beginning and it would have fooled you. But she only says that after the ritual.

What is broken perhaps is the small amount of questions the PC can ask yes. Or maybe the lack of emotions in those questions. But I never regarded the Pc's dialogue literraly. I just looked at the context and then imagined what would my PC say that is similar to this dialogue option. Because it would be weird if the PC can't say two sentences in a row.  

But in general, I am perfectly fine with the DR scene. It was already emotional for me and I am glad Morrigan didn't attempt to BS, because that's out of her character. But I don't know, just my opinion, probably because Morrigan and I think alike in many ways. 

blademaster7 wrote...
Loghain(if recruited) also questions you about how you survived. He says he finds it difficult to believe that Riordan deliberately misled you. He's a bit suspicious and wary of you but he doesn't push it. Much better reaction than Alistair IMO.

He also says that he will keep his thoughts to himself. In otherwords, he won't tell anyone.

[Hammer_Of_God]

Addai67 wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

A fascinating character Addai. Equally fascinating is how different players can make their characters, reacting to the same events.

Is it that different than what others have roleplayed?  *interested*

I've always played my HN warrior, Kai, as not only a bit of a player - but quite unintentionally much like Morri - someone who deep down was damn frightened of trully opening up and relying too much on others - the loss of those he loved only serving to exasperate that trait. Charismatic, tough and confident on the outside, but far more vulnerable than he'd be willing to let on within. 
Originally, when his romance with Morri started, he was in full support her initial notion that their daliance was little more than a fun fling, and even ended the romance when confronted by both women, to persue a liason with Leliana instead.
But thats where the truth of the matter finally hit home. It was only when in a relationship with Leliana that, not only did her constant gushing about maker & epic love seriously freak him out (especially since he didnt exactly return those feelings & nor was the white picket fence, big happy family type), but it also finally it dawned on him just how much Morrigan had unwittingly come to mean to him and how much he missed that which he'd pushed away.
In that sense, he & Morri were two peas in a pod, both in denial and running for the hills as soon as the prospect of love reared its daunting head.
Needless to say, when an opportunity arose to rekindle his romance with Morrigan, he didnt hesitate and promptly broke off his relationship with Leliana afterwards (remaining close friends with her never the less).

He went through with the DR of course - albeit reluctantly, unsure of the exact nature of Morrigan's suspicious motivations, and was devestated when Morri indeed left, opting to ultimately search for her in the end - like so may of our poor sods in this thread.
Driven by duty himself, he could understand that same driving force in Morrigan's actions, what he couldnt understand however, was why she refused to trust him with her motivations & why they had to part.
Having no designs on the throne himself, he was content to be made chancellor - still in a possition to oversee Ferelden's fate, whilst losing none of his much revered freedom.
When duty and his dedication to the Grey Wardens, as well as Ferelden & his closest friend, Allister his King, naturally calls, he's there in a flash, never shirking those responsibilities. Otherwise, restless at heart and forever a bit of a loner, wonderlust and the call of the unknown ever beckon, and he seldom settles in one place for overly long. Women come & go in his life, as always they did - nothing thats ever serious or long lived, merely a welcomed distraction for those long lonely nights he'd rather spend with fairer company, than those haunting memories of bittersweet days gone by.
But despite a seemingly full & exhilarating life, inside he is empty, almost numb - longing for the woman he lost, the only one he'd ever loved.
He has never given up hope that he will find her in the end.

I can only hope Bioware wont let him down in that belief.

So yeah, I guess despite some obvious simularities to all our Wardens, each has his own tale. Mine has gone on with his life to some extent, he certainly isnt coming to pieces over Morri's departure, but like all our Warden's, something will forever be missing in his life until he is reunited with Morrigan again.

[Shade of Wolf]

Well she could have just said 'Hey we might die tomorrow, wanna do it one last time?' and not bothered to tell me about the ritual, so at least she cares lolzerz.

[TheBlackBaron]

Addai67 wrote...

I don't think my Cousland will literally fall apart, either.  Not anytime soon, anyway.  It's more a case of how Maric is described in The Calling.  Outwardly he does (mostly) what is expected and needful, inwardly he's numb, a little resentful, and very lonely.

That's pretty much how its worked for me, except Aedan/Jayne was more than a little resentfull. I did some pretty dickish things in Awakening as a result, in ME terms shifting from being more Renegon to full-out Renegade. Still spared the Architect, since he's always looking for alternative options if they're better than the ones given up-front.

He's basically the most powerful man in Ferelden, despite both Alistair and Anora being on the throne, and prior to this whole mess he would have rather enjoyed that. Now he's just trying to get through what he has to do and resume the search.

[Master Shiori]

Morrigan does say "if you care about me then accept that this needs to be done".



I do agree that she was pretty straighforward with the Warden when it comes to DR. She didn't reveal the details but at least she let you know what would result from such a ritual and, to some extent, what she plans to do once the Archdemon is dead.



It would have been easier to accept the whole deal if Morrigan displayed more emotion at the prospect of having to leave the Warden (she does get distraught when you press her for details, but you only get the confirmation that her feelings for you are genuine), but the way the whole dialogue is handled you'd think the Warden didn't really care about her leaving with the child.



If the reason for such badly handled dialogue is that Bioware tried to avoid giving spoilers for future DA title then I can somewhat understand it. Otherwise, as it stands now, the way DR played out was a major disapointment.



If Bioware allows us to be reunited with Morrigan in the future and futher explores the whole god child storyline then her romance will be redeemed. Otherwise it'll go down as a most disapointning romance Bioware ever created.

[Addai]

Hammer_Of_God wrote...
Originally, when his romance with Morri started, he was in full support her initial notion that their daliance was little more than a fun fling, and even ended the romance when confronted by both women, to persue a liason with Leliana instead.

I played mine the same, as a bit of a player.  He finally gives his heart to one woman and is ready to give up everything in order to have a future with her (as he would have to do, she being an apostate)- and then she's gone and refuses him even the right to ask for that.

So yeah, I guess despite some obvious simularities to all our Wardens, each has his own tale. Mine has gone on with his life to some extent, he certainly isnt coming to pieces over Morri's departure, but like all our Warden's, something will forever be missing in his life until he is reunited with Morrigan again.

I wasn't sure what to do with my PC's boon, so he asked to memorialize the Wardens.  Doesn't really want anything for himself.  I figure he'll drift.  He could very well end up the wandering drunk that Alistair becomes if he's exiled, assuming future expansions don't allow our Wardens to find Morrigan.

[Barbarossa2010]

The problem with Morrigan is how she treats the romancing Warden at the Ritual. She treats you hardly any different than if you were absolutely opposed to her. A poorly written event in that respect and a real letdown after the effort.

The two lines that she gives a romancing Warden (that are hardly convincing) are only narrowly found in the dialogue path. My Warden sees no need to change his mind about her. The sad thing is I don't think it was necessarily Morrigan's character at all and she was the victim of the plot hammer as much as my Warden was.

The edited material says as much.

Modifié par Barbarossa2010, 01 mai 2010 - 10:21 .

[Barbarossa2010]

AwesomeEffect2 wrote...

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

My Warden has moved on.  He wants to trust her, but he just can't.  It would have been nice if the edited material didn't end up on the cutting room floor.  It would have made all the difference in the world.  In the vanilla game, Barbarossa simply cannot trust her, for the reasons I have stated more than once, not to mention in one playthrough he's interred in Weishaupt so it's pretty much beside the point.

Is there absolutely no way that you would forgive her or Bioware for the chilly act during the DR?
You gotta suspect that Gaider could have some good plans ahead.

Perhaps; but unfortunatedly my BS bar is pretty high at the moment and I can currently foresee no good reason for the DR to have played out as it did.  Unlike ME3, I won't buy DA2 until I've read the board results.  So, in a way I will give them a chance to redeem themselves.

[Barbarossa2010]

Brockololly wrote...

Barbarossa2010 wrote...
In Mass Effect I remember Liara making an attempt to comfort you after the Council stripped the Normandy from you.  Or did I read that one wrong?

Yeah that scene plays in ME1 with any love interest, not just Liara, but that sort of a scene would be nice to have more of. Scenes where the companions try to help out the PC instead of it always being the PC having to listen to everyone's problems.

You are correct of course. I should have said any LI.  But it would be nice for any of the companions to actually approach the PC sometime, as would be natural.

[blademaster7]

Heh.. I do like the term "Plot Hammer".

The fact that the lead writer himself admitted that he wanted 2 additional cut-scenes(friends and lovers) speaks volumes.

They were cutting corners during the latter stages of development. But there is still no excuse for plot related characters to act the way they do.

-Morrigan.... She basically gives the same speach regardless of approval. Friendship... love.... hate.... none of these are reflected.

-Warden.... The guy who is supposed to be the biggest badass in the country is suddenly with his back against the wall and doesn't have the option to ask what he wants to ask

-Alistair... The worst reaction IMO. Of course, I'm assuming he's your friend and Morrigan your lover. But no one would ever tell him about it, so whatever...

Modifié par blademaster7, 01 mai 2010 - 10:46 .

[Barbarossa2010]

blademaster7 wrote...

Heh.. I do like the term "Plot Hammer".

The fact that the lead writer himself admitted that he wanted 2 additional cut-scenes(friends and lovers) speaks volumes.

They were cutting corners during the latter stages of development. But there is still no excuse for plot related characters to act the way they do.

-Morrigan.... She basically gives the same speach regardless of approval. Friendship... love.... hate.... none of these are reflected.

-Warden.... The guy who is supposed to be the biggest badass in the country is suddenly with his back against the wall and doesn't have the option to ask what he wants to ask

And he/she is a Grey Warden lest we forget.  She wanted to attract the essence of something he was sworn to defeat AT ALL COST and was allowed to remian absolutely silent in a matter that...well...mattered. 

Now, I understand that some Warden characters may not have taken that oath seriously due to the compulsion of his/her enlistment into the Wardens, or that somehow love trumped Wardenly duty, but in the latter it was certainly not the case with Morrigan (irony intended), so why should a Warden be any different?

[RogueWriter3201]

blademaster7 wrote...

The Archdemon battle was a joke btw. The bandits in Lothering gave me more trouble than that.


I don't know if I should play Awakening now... I'm way overpowered for that.

I'm thinking of starting a new game as a female 2-H warrior - Ser Cauthrien-like.

This is a bit off topic, and I am sorry, but I just have to ask what your Level and Build is. It's clear you're a Rogue, and I think your tool-bar shows you went Assasion/Duelist, but what's your playstyle, combat method, etc? I've played three different classes and I've *never* had it easy with the Archdemon, even though my PC has had the best Armor, weapons, etc.

[blademaster7]

I was level 23 with a pure dexterity build.

I don't think armor makes a difference against the archdemon. His flames(which are spirit damage) will bypass your armor and kill you quickly.

As you can see, I had a Great Spirit Balm active. Sandal sells 2-3 of them right before the battle, so it's not really that hard to get. It greatly reduces the damage from his breath and makes the battle a lot easier. I was also attacking it from the side to avoid grab. Once he turns, run to the side again. ..You will get kicked every once in a while if your timing is off, but oh well. just use a health potion.

Modifié par blademaster7, 02 mai 2010 - 09:05 .

[Master Shiori]

Time for more Morrigan pics.

Modifié par Master Shiori, 02 mai 2010 - 11:23 .

[Brockololly]

One thing I hope that we see in DA2 are maybe some more unique outfits for the companions, like Morrigan's robes. It would be neat to have Morrigan be able to put the hood up on her robe too, at least that way she wouldn't have to deal with the damn goofy mage hats.

[fenderstrat6]

I hear ya Brock, I think she better wear a hood from now on,best for her to keep a low profile, in DA2 i think morrigan going to find more then just her lover trying to pick-up her trail , be it man or beast or flemeth , or all of the above , looking for her an child , she'll end up getting in trouble , then who do u think she is going to turn to , her broken hearted lover boy chump that's who .