397 réponses à ce sujet

[TJSolo]

RyuGuitarFreak wrote...

yoomazir wrote...

RyuGuitarFreak wrote...

No. But sure is a good way to find out what game the FANS liked most? Maybe the reviews? Or maybe go for sales? Or Metacritics user reviews? Now, put all of that together. Are you following me? EVERYTHING points out that ME2 is more sucessful than ME1. Maybe you're too blind to see.

Oh yes, like Bioshock 2 or Modern Warfare 2 right? both sequel, both having sold more than their predecessor and guess what? both of them are disapointments, just like ME2. These sequels sold well because they come from good games and people expected their sequels to be also good, yet they discover that what they loved have been butchered for the sake of sooner release and fast sales. 
I'll bet anything that if people actually knew what was in tehse sequel at least half of them would have passed.

oh and yes, I'm so blinded by these people with their 5 years old mentallity.

It is a disappointment FOR YOU. And some people. I'm telling you to look at the big picture. It sold better. I know some people who didn't play ME1 but was interested in ME2 and they liked it. Because it's more a shooter? WHOT THE HELL CARES? Games are about having fun, no matter the genre. But let's talk about quality. I made that poll as an example. It is like a versus thread. The majority of people voted ME2 as better. The majority of reviewers in their sites and magazines pointed that ME2 is an IMPROVEMENT from ME1. And some users who reviews. Some even say it's game of the year material already. What can you conclude about this?

Yeah, I am the one who has a 5 year old mentality.

And yes, I loved Mass Effect 1.

It did not sell better and the only numbers EA gave out were estimates based on shipped copies.
In store sells still show ME1 has sold more.
ME2 being a sequel sold faster initally but has slowed down.

There was talk about GOTY when ME1 came out aswell and depending on what mag you read it was GOTY

[Bryy_Miller]

JKoopman wrote...
Look people, the Firewalker pack isn't free. It's part of the Cerberus Network which is itself a $15 product, access to which is provided as part of the retail price of ME2. Let me say that again. ACCESS TO THE CERBERUS NETWORK IS PART OF THE PURCHASE AGREEMENT MADE BETWEEN  BIOWARE AND THE END USER. Saying that we shouldn't complain about ****ty DLC because "it's free" would be like buying a new car only to find that it has 4 flat tires and when you take it back to the dealership they tell you not to complain because "the tires were free with the purchase of the car."

Unless you're talking about the uber-collector's edition, then no. This is false. The Cerberus Network did not add on to the original price of the game. And even if it did, that is not the point. The point is that the content IS free. Unless you like complaining about getting entertainment through that TV you paid for (and please, don't start in with the BUT U HAVE TO PAY FOR CABLE strawman).

[Darth Drago]

JKoopman wrote...

I see people are still using the "It's free!" argument to defend disappointing DLC, as if that hasn't been refuted a dozen times over already.

Look people, the Firewalker pack isn't free. It's part of the Cerberus Network which is itself a $15 product, access to which is provided as part of the retail price of ME2. Let me say that again. ACCESS TO THE CERBERUS NETWORK IS PART OF THE PURCHASE AGREEMENT MADE BETWEEN BIOWARE AND THE END USER. Saying that we shouldn't complain about ****ty DLC because "it's free" would be like buying a new car only to find that it has 4 flat tires and when you take it back to the dealership they tell you not to complain because "the tires were free with the purchase of the car."

Furthermore, people who bought ME2 used (or who have multiple accounts/gamertags) actually have to spend $15 out of pocket for access to the Network. So any way you look at it, the content provided through the Cerberus Network has real monetary value and we're not out of line for expecting quality from that content.

-I should have seen that one coming a mile away on the one game for multiple systems, accounts and gamer tags. My 2 nephews each have a X-Box 360. When you put it all together like that the Cerberus Network is a total waste of money and nothing but a money grubbing scam from EA/BioWare (more EA I’m sure) to get more money out of the gaming community. Instead of trying to fight the used game industry they should focus on making real high end quality games instead of the mass market mediocre ones we see all the time.

But yea, the whole “Its free!” argument is getting old. Like I’ve said before in here or another similar topic, just because its free doesn’t mean we should get shovelware game like content.

[SithLordExarKun]

Bioware should learn from Bethesda in terms of DLC.

[Jalem001]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

Bioware should learn from Bethesda in terms of DLC.

I think most game companies could learn from Bethesda.

Knights of the Nine and all of the Fallout 3 DLC except for Mothership Zeta (With Point Lookout being, by far, the best) are all great examples of how DLC should be done.

[hex23]

Gorn Kregore wrote...

Always has been. "we gonna show off our physics engine LoL" tbh games like HL2 wouldn't be as popular as they are today without mods.

"HL2" was megahyped before it came out, is one of the best reviewed games of all time, and sold close to 9 million copies. If you think mods had anything to do with the success of "HL2"....you have no idea what you're talking about. That's as polite as I can put it.

Modifié par hex23, 21 mars 2010 - 03:06 .

[Darth Drago]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

Bioware should learn from Bethesda in terms of DLC.

-And game design or game mechanics. I find it hard to believe that they are the only ones who can program NPC’s to have their own lives including walking patterns, sleeping, eating and dialog with other NPC’s. Heaven forbid that the crew on the Normandy shold ever move in the entire game. They know how make an immersive game that makes you feel your in that game rather than just playing a game. The only thing they are missing really is a romance subplot.
 

[Bryy_Miller]

Having the entire crew of the Normandy working would take up so much memory.

[TJSolo]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

Having the entire crew of the Normandy working would take up so much memory.

Yes that is how these things called computer games work.
Thank you for the obvious statement.

[Bryy_Miller]

TJSolo wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

Having the entire crew of the Normandy working would take up so much memory.

Yes that is how these things called computer games work.
Thank you for the obvious statement.

I'm just stating the difference between Beth's system in relation to what they were talking about.

[Grand_Commander13]

hex23 wrote..."HL2" was megahyped before it came out, is one of the best reviewed games of all time, and sold close to 9 million copies. If you think mods had anything to do with the success of "HL2"....you have no idea what you're talking about. That's as polite as I can put it.

Oh man was it hyped.  It wouldn't have bought it if it weren't for CS:S, but I was looking forward to the main game too.  Not enough to avoid cancelling my pre-order in disgust when their digital download pricing model was revealed (it didn't help that the Gamestop employee had outright lied to me about the release date), but enough.

It's funny: I got HL2 because I wanted CS:S, now I value it more for the ability to play Insurgency...

I would like to bring up though, a complaint from the second page, that the Hammerhead missions will be shallow while the Mako missions were deep.  So, in reply to that: oh come off it.  The side missions in ME2 are just as deep as ME1's ever were (that is to say, not all that very deep), and the fact that the ones that come packaged with the core game don't force you to endure mountainous terrain before you clear out this random nest of bad guys doesn't hurt the quest at all.

[TJSolo]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

TJSolo wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

Having the entire crew of the Normandy working would take up so much memory.

Yes that is how these things called computer games work.
Thank you for the obvious statement.

I'm just stating the difference between Beth's system in relation to what they were talking about.

Showing how much memory the crew takes up now as opposed to if they moved around, whould be showing the relative difference.

While just saying it will take more memory to have a moving crew is just plain obvious.

[hex23]

TJSolo wrote...

It did not sell better and the only numbers EA gave out were estimates based on shipped copies.
In store sells still show ME1 has sold more.
ME2 being a sequel sold faster initally but has slowed down.

There was talk about GOTY when ME1 came out aswell and depending on what mag you read it was GOTY

Incorrect. As of the 7th week "ME2" has sold approximately 350k more copies than "ME1". Also "ME1" came out a month before Christmas, the time of year games sell the best. "ME2" came out a month after Christmas, a time games typically don't sell very well.

To put it into perspective, "ME2" shipped 2 million units in the slowest time of year for games, and sold 75% of that in 7 weeks.

And if we're comparing GOTY status "ME2" is receiving far more praise than "ME1" ever did.

Modifié par hex23, 21 mars 2010 - 03:29 .

[Masticetobbacco]

meh

free DLC is better than $15 DLC

[TJSolo]

hex23 wrote...

TJSolo wrote...

It did not sell better and the only numbers EA gave out were estimates based on shipped copies.
In store sells still show ME1 has sold more.
ME2 being a sequel sold faster initally but has slowed down.

There was talk about GOTY when ME1 came out aswell and depending on what mag you read it was GOTY

Incorrect. As of the 7th week "ME2" has sold approximately 350k more copies than "ME1". Also "ME1" came out a month before Christmas, the time of year games sell the best. "ME2" came out a month after Christmas, a time games typically don't sell very well.

To put it into perspective, "ME2" shipped 2 million units in the slowest time of year for games, and sold 75% of that in 7 weeks.

And if we're comparing GOTY status "ME2" is receiving far more praise than "ME1" ever did.

Keep hope alive! Maybe it will one of the few sequels that can out sell its predecessor within the same gaming generation.
You would have to link me to your hindsight or jaded vision. GOTY talk is still GOTY talk, you and your "more praise" denotes your small viewing window or poor memory.

[AnathamaDye]

Really?  This is it?  Why do I feel like I remember someone saying it would be an hour long....blah, at least it's free.  Also I'm looking forward to the Kasumi DLC, I love the cutscenes in Mass Effect 2 ♥

[JKoopman]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

JKoopman wrote...
Look people, the Firewalker pack isn't free. It's part of the Cerberus Network which is itself a $15 product, access to which is provided as part of the retail price of ME2. Let me say that again. ACCESS TO THE CERBERUS NETWORK IS PART OF THE PURCHASE AGREEMENT MADE BETWEEN  BIOWARE AND THE END USER. Saying that we shouldn't complain about ****ty DLC because "it's free" would be like buying a new car only to find that it has 4 flat tires and when you take it back to the dealership they tell you not to complain because "the tires were free with the purchase of the car."

Unless you're talking about the uber-collector's edition, then no. This is false. The Cerberus Network did not add on to the original price of the game. And even if it did, that is not the point. The point is that the content IS free. Unless you like complaining about getting entertainment through that TV you paid for (and please, don't start in with the BUT U HAVE TO PAY FOR CABLE strawman).

You seem to have completely missed the point. The Cerberus Network was part of the purchase. It's access was included with the purchase agreement. That means I payed for it. The fact that BioWare is agreeing to include access to the Network at no charge for purchasers of full retail copies of ME2 does not absolve it of it's value; especially when, again, there are people who HAVE paid the full $15 price for it's access.

To use the sandwich analogy that was being thrown around perviously, imagine if one diner was charging $4 for a sandwich and it's competitor was charging $5 but advertised a free cup of coffee valued at $3 with every purchase. You take them up on their offer only to find that the coffee is 2 days old and the waitress pissed in the coffee pot. The fact that it was "free" does nothing to change the fact that a) you still paid for it and it was a raw deal.

If you still can't see where I'm coming from there, then you and I are just going to have to agree that we have differing perspectives.

Modifié par JKoopman, 21 mars 2010 - 04:26 .

[TJSolo]

I have never seen that burger analogy and I never want to see it again. Wow

[CaptainZaysh]

Darth Drago wrote...

-And game design or game mechanics. I find it hard to believe that they are the only ones who can program NPC’s to have their own lives including walking patterns, sleeping, eating and dialog with other NPC’s. Heaven forbid that the crew on the Normandy shold ever move in the entire game. They know how make an immersive game that makes you feel your in that game rather than just playing a game. The only thing they are missing really is a romance subplot.
 

That's probably a design decision, to avoid the annoyance of going to the main battery to talk to Garrus and finding out he's not there.

[phordicus]

this is just a teaser. there's every reason they continued working on it in furtherance of a major hammerhead mission pack later on. people get to (quite literally) test drive it and give feedback so that the paid DLC down the road is already tweaked according to what we want.

[thedoncarnage]

Jalem001 wrote...

SithLordExarKun wrote...

Bioware should learn from Bethesda in terms of DLC.

I think most game companies could learn from Bethesda.

Knights of the Nine and all of the Fallout 3 DLC except for Mothership Zeta (With Point Lookout being, by far, the best) are all great examples of how DLC should be done.

QFT man, QFT.

Oddly enough the appearance pack doesn't bother me much. I'm all for little DLC tidbits here and there. I'm even willing to pay. But if Bioware is going to release something "major" like the Hammerhead they shouldn't half-ass it.

The fact that Bioware has spent many months on the Hammerhead and all they can show for it is a bunch of 3 minute missions is just sad, and frankly insulting. To contrast, all of Fallout 3's DLC was at least an hour long each and Bethesda released a major DLC pack every month for what, 5 months?

Honestly I think the difference between Bioware and Bethesda comes down to the fact that Bethesda is an independent company and Bioware isn't. Bethesda's managers get to do whatever they want, but Bioware needs to be spoonfed guidance and funding by a bunch of EA stuffed suits.

All EA cares about is bottom dollar. Case in point: Reviews for Command and Conquer 4 show that once again, EA has decided to "streamline" a game. Just like how they stripped RPG features from Mass Effect, now they are stripping RTS from C&C4. What's left is a dumbed-down shell of a game that revolves around unit rushes and little strategy, similar to how Ensemble butchered Halo Wars.

IGN rated C&C4 a 7.4. That's insanely bad considering how much IGN inflates scores to begin with.

Modifié par thedoncarnage, 21 mars 2010 - 05:00 .

[RyuGuitarFreak]

exxxed wrote...

RyuGuitarFreak wrote...

It is a disappointment FOR YOU. And some people. I'm telling you to look at the big picture. It sold better. I know some people who didn't play ME1 but was interested in ME2 and they liked it. Because it's more a shooter? WHOT THE HELL CARES? Games are about having fun, no matter the genre. But let's talk about quality. I made that poll as an example. It is like a versus thread. The majority of people voted ME2 as better. The majority of reviewers in their sites and magazines pointed that ME2 is an IMPROVEMENT from ME1. And some users who reviews. Some even say it's game of the year material already. What can you conclude about this?

Yeah, I am the one who has a 5 year old mentality.

And yes, I loved Mass Effect 1.

 And what's it to you that it sold better? Are you making any profit from this? Or are you justifying the fact that you like the game because it's more popular?

Next i'll quote myself from another thread:

 " Ok but you have to actually ask yourself how many of the people who voted started the series with ME 2 and then bought ME 1, and how many of them are "Shooter only, RPG boring" players, plus brig in to this equation the number of people who didn't play Mass Effect 1 on the PC where all the features (Mako handling, inventory tedious, squad commands, power wheel etc.) were improved (yea we on the PC got an pretty good inventory with sections for each kind of item and etc.), i think this pretty much sums up all the people who liked ME 2 better, and believe me most of the new fans were attracted to this franchise with nr. 2 because of it's action part and not the RPG, exactly in contrary with the first one where most of the people who bought the game came from an overall great KoTOR experience expecting more of the same, which they got , now the fanbase was divided because half of them expected an improved Mass Effect 1 experience and were disappointed, and the other half which includes new players and people who wanted this to become more "streamlined" got what they wanted, an action game with an engaging story period."  

 The reviewers stated that it's better... you can't have your own opinion or what? And most reviews i've seen or heard sound like brown-nosers, or totally biased. 
 Come to think about it, the same reviewers said that the first is a great innovation to the genre and it brought a more fleshed out combat system, now the combat system has taken over the franchise it seems "ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL".

 I'm not holding against anyone who likes the sequel better than the first, but there really are some valid complaints about it, just like it was with the first, people who didn't like it complained and the ones who did stayed silent, now it's exactly the other way around!
 
 
Take care!

First of all, thank you for being polite. But we weren't discussing tastes or which game was better. It was about ME2 being more sucessful than ME1. My arguments were the ones discussed previously: sales, reviews reception, users reception. That's why I think that ME2 is more sucessful than ME1. But enough of this for me, this discussion is off-topic and has gotten too much space.

[Kronner]

Darth Drago wrote...

SithLordExarKun wrote...

Bioware should learn from Bethesda in terms of DLC.

-And game design or game mechanics. I find it hard to believe that they are the only ones who can program NPC’s to have their own lives including walking patterns, sleeping, eating and dialog with other NPC’s. Heaven forbid that the crew on the Normandy shold ever move in the entire game. They know how make an immersive game that makes you feel your in that game rather than just playing a game. The only thing they are missing really is a romance subplot.
 

Piranha Bytes are good in this too (Gothic 1, 2, Addon for 2nd, 3, Risen)..

[yoomazir]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

Just ignore that social reject, he obviously doesn't like anyone whose taste is different from his and i bet you if the poll showed more people liking ME1 than ME2 he would use it to his advantage rather than argue against it.

wow dude, are you for real? calling people social reject? you got some serious issues pal . Honestly, the more I read your posts and the more I see you are the sort of person who ends up insulting people just because they don't have the same views as you. Well, it's good to know that, now I see  that it was always useless talking to you.
Cheers mate, enjoy your sad life.

Modifié par yoomazir, 21 mars 2010 - 01:48 .