293 réponses à ce sujet

[Darth_Ultima]

Piracy is bad for games, plain and simple. If you already have something in your possession are you going to pay for it? Probably not. If you don't pay for something then developers don't make as much money. That leads to badly made or rushed games and overpriced titles or DLC not to mention the fact that the PC market is being choked to death by piracy and copyright protection. Who wins? In the end nobody.

[worksa8]

It wouldn't be so bad if Bioware cared enough to listen to the consumer...

Then again, no game developers really do.

[Synnworld]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Piracy hurts everyone involved with gaming. When everyone resorts to piracy, no one will make any more games. It really is that simple.

That said, given the subject matter, I'm guessing this thread will be locked before the end of the day.

I'm sorry but this is plain bull, because everyone will not resort to piracy, and every game maker will not stop making games. Majority will just jump to the extreme measures that I heard those behind Assassin creed 2 are doing to the pc version.

[the_one_54321]

Synnworld wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
Piracy hurts everyone involved with gaming. When everyone resorts to piracy, no one will make any more games. It really is that simple.

That said, given the subject matter, I'm guessing this thread will be locked before the end of the day.

I'm sorry but this is plain bull, because everyone will not resort to piracy, and every game maker will not stop making games. Majority will just jump to the extreme measures that I heard those behind Assassin creed 2 are doing to the pc version.

I appologize. Thank you for such an excellent explanation of why piracy doesn't hurt everyone involved with gaming. /sarcasm

[JaegerBane]

Ryzaki wrote...

...Piracy is not stealing. Good grief.



Its copyright infringement. Still illegal but it is not the same thing as stealing.

No I don't condone piracy. (Frankly you are better off just waiting and reading other people (mostly on gaming sites) reviews of the game and drawing your own opinion. But its not stealing and never will be. If you have a collection of books and someone steals it you no longer have that collection of books. If someone pirates that collection the original collection of books are perfectly safe and you still have them.

Also: Youtube videos are good when it comes to this kind of thing.

And the old borrowing your friend's games too. Sadly that's all my broke self is stuck with. 

I suppose if we adopt a retard-level simplistic view of stealing then I guess the above diagram makes sense.

But the simple fact is, piracy is the theft of intellectual property. It's silly to try and rationalise as 'not stealing' because IP still costs to either develop or acquire.

[Ryzaki]

outlaworacle wrote...

Well, you're kinda splitting hairs there, Ryzaki. You are enjoying full use of a product without the developer's seeing a cent. You're stealing from the company, they didn't make it so you could play it for free. They made it so you could buy it.

It's a slippery slope, logically. Technically the same could be leveled against loaning someone a game or buying a game used. But that's STILL not the same thought process as "i want to play this game but, y'know... **** paying for it." That is what makes it stealing.

Its STILL copyright infrigement. That's not fsplitting hairs that's the truth. Its like the difference between someone punching you in the face and stabbing you in the eye before robbing you blind. Both of those actions count as assault but one is arguably a lot worse than the other. Also: Theft removes the original. Piracy does not. They are not the same thing and its not splitting hairs to say so.

...you're not stealing from the company. *sighs* You're making a copy of their game and usually giving it away for free. There's a reason in many courts copyright infrigment and theft are not the same thing. You may think its theft but its not. Theft would be breaking into the BioWare headquaters and stealing one of their computers with all the game data on it, copyright infringment would be making a copy of said game data.

Do you not see the difference?

JaegerBane wrote...



I suppose if we adopt a
retard-level simplistic view of stealing then I guess the above diagram
makes sense.

But the simple fact is, piracy is the theft of
intellectual property. It's silly to try and rationalise as 'not
stealing' because IP still costs to either develop or acquire.

And
that is exactly why there's a whole nother term for it! Conviently
called: Copyright infringment! [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/wizard.png[/smilie]

http://www.theregist...heft_and_other/

Modifié par Ryzaki, 21 mars 2010 - 12:56 .

[the_one_54321]

Ryzaki wrote...
Do you not see the difference?

This is pointless semantics. Sometimes semantics can serve a purpose. This time they do not. The difference is irrelevant to the outcome.

[Synnworld]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Synnworld wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
Piracy hurts everyone involved with gaming. When everyone resorts to piracy, no one will make any more games. It really is that simple.

That said, given the subject matter, I'm guessing this thread will be locked before the end of the day.

I'm sorry but this is plain bull, because everyone will not resort to piracy, and every game maker will not stop making games. Majority will just jump to the extreme measures that I heard those behind Assassin creed 2 are doing to the pc version.

I appologize. Thank you for such an excellent explanation of why piracy doesn't hurt everyone involved with gaming. /sarcasm

Hey I call Bull**** as I see it, the fact pc gaming has survived so long should prove enough that piracy won't stop corperations from making game, and loyal fans from buying them. Plus, it is a bit easier to get away with mature themes on pc games now a days then it is with console ones.

[worksa8]

Piracy is wrong, but it isn't really theft. It's wrong in the same manner, but because it's not as risky and more people do it- they see it as a lesser law infringement. In all honesty, he is right, piracy can save you from disappointment. That doesn't make it okay though, and there are better ways to go about it.

[JaegerBane]

Ryzaki wrote...
...you're not stealing from the company. *sighs* You're making a copy of their game and usually giving it away for free. There's a reason in many courts copyright infrigment and theft are not the same thing. You may think its theft but its not. Theft would be breaking into the BioWare headquaters and stealing one of their computers with all the game data on it, copyright infringment would be making a copy of said game data.

Do you not see the difference?

*sigh*

If you honestly think theft requires a physical item, you have a lot to learn of the world.

Claiming that legal cases tend to go down different paths is a bit like saying manslaughter isn't killing because it isn't murder.

Copyright infringement is a form of theft. Just in the same way burglary and benefit fraud are forms of theft. Theft is a basic crime that is defined entirely by acquiring something that is not yours without payment.

By your logic, identity theft can't exist. Someone's identity is not tangible item that can be stuffed into a bag of swag.

Modifié par JaegerBane, 21 mars 2010 - 12:59 .

[Ryzaki]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...
Do you not see the difference?

This is pointless semantics. Sometimes semantics can serve a purpose. This time they do not. The difference is irrelevant to the outcome.

Never said it wasn't. But to say copyright infrignment is theft is just invalid. It may lead to the same result. (and this is not even proven) but they are not the same thing. Its like beating someone to death with a baseball bat vs shooting them in the head with them dying as a result. Same result different actions.

*shrugs* You lot want to insist that copyright infrigment is theft. Okay. So people who legally bought the game and use a no-cd exe stole the game. People who use mods that don't work of the game's provided tools are also thieves. Good to know.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 21 mars 2010 - 01:00 .

[miltos33]

In before it's locked. Developers are still motivated to make good games because they have to think about competition and their reputation. How many times people were driven away from a certain developer because they were dissapointed with the quality of one of their games? I am sure it's happened to each one of us at least once or twice. And there is a much greater supply of video games to meet the demand these days and therefore much higher competition.

[Bullets McDeath]

Ryzaki, seriously. I understand what you are saying. I'm aware of the mechanics of software piracy and that you are not actually removing a physical copy that could have been sold and stuffing it in your hoodie and running out of Gamestop.



It still amounts to theft, in the grander scheme of things, because you should not have the ability to play something you didn't pay for. If you want to play a game, you should buy it. If you bought it without playing it, you're depriving the developer in question of the money they should be owed for you playing the product they spent time working on. Know what I'm sayin', g?

[Ryzaki]

outlaworacle wrote...

Ryzaki, seriously. I understand what you are saying. I'm aware of the mechanics of software piracy and that you are not actually removing a physical copy that could have been sold and stuffing it in your hoodie and running out of Gamestop.

It still amounts to theft, in the grander scheme of things, because you should not have the ability to play something you didn't pay for. If you want to play a game, you should buy it. If you bought it without playing it, you're depriving the developer in question of the money they should be owed for you playing the product they spent time working on. Know what I'm sayin', g?

...did you listen to anything I never said otherwise. I already said that it was unethical. But saying it and theft are the same thing is simply not valid.

So yes I understand what you're saying.

Also Identity theft is form theft yes it is. It can also ruin people's lives far more than piracy ever will.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 21 mars 2010 - 01:05 .

[Snugglepus]

miltos33 wrote...

In before it's locked. Developers are still motivated to make good games because they have to think about competition and their reputation. How many times people were driven away from a certain developer because they were dissapointed with the quality of one of their games? I am sure it's happened to each one of us at least once or twice. And there is a much greater supply of video games to meet the demand these days and therefore much higher competition.

Name at least one who plays same field of RPGs as Bioware does, and, for example, same field of MMOs that Blizzard does? They have no competition and and will gladly exploit this situation since their fans will pay anyway.

[Freezingfire]

Synnworld wrote...

Jenocide wrote...

.. piracy isn't good for games.
piracy is one of the main reason most company's don't make games for the PC.

Assassin creed 2 for pc.

And such measures are going to tilt other people to pirate away. It really doesn't work to focus a game on pirates, like AC2 or C&C4.

[Frank the Running Bugzepel]

Rrrrr... pirates it seems be here!



I think this link explains the reason why pirates are wrong

[JaegerBane]

Ryzaki wrote...


*shrugs* You lot want to insist that copyright infrigment is theft. Okay. So people who legally bought the game and use a no-cd exe stole the game. People who use mods that don't work of the game's provided tools are also thieves. Good to know.

Ryzaki, you've missed the point. People who are using a no-cd.exe are violating the EULA. They aren't commiting copyright infringement as they're not copying anything.

I'm not really sure why you're having such a hard time understanding the concept of theft of intellectual property. It's not like it's a difficult concept to grasp.

[Mlai00]

If this whole thread sprouted up because of Awakening... then it's pointless whining because Awakening is a great game. It's not DAO, and I don't like how expansions are trying to be the same price as normal games nowadays. But, that doesn't make Awakening some sort of consumer fraud that you must resort to piracy in order to "avenge."



Copyright infringement?

Copyright infringement!

[hexaligned]

And even then it's about distribution, and even then you have to be able to prove intent, which is trickier than it may sound since simply having digital info stored on a hard drive is in no way illegal. Basically it's in no way enforcable, certainly not on a global scale. Once in awhile you will get a website hoster that pulls some neo conservative judge and gets boned, most of them get off in appeals though, depending on country.



It's never going to go away, and unless some Orwellian laws get passed overturning both right to privacy, and freedom of information, it never will. Companys like EA have made the mistake of trying to fight it, instead of adopting business models that will work with the reality of the situation.

[Ryzaki]

JaegerBane wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...


*shrugs* You lot want to insist that copyright infrigment is theft. Okay. So people who legally bought the game and use a no-cd exe stole the game. People who use mods that don't work of the game's provided tools are also thieves. Good to know.

Ryzaki, you've missed the point. People who are using a no-cd.exe are violating the EULA. They aren't commiting copyright infringement as they're not copying anything.

I'm not really sure why you're having such a hard time understanding the concept of theft of intellectual property. It's not like it's a difficult concept to grasp.

Whatever. Its theft. You win. Happy? 

Apparently the Supreme Court is wrong in face of your intelligence.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 21 mars 2010 - 01:09 .

[JaegerBane]

Ryzaki wrote...

outlaworacle wrote...

Ryzaki, seriously. I understand what you are saying. I'm aware of the mechanics of software piracy and that you are not actually removing a physical copy that could have been sold and stuffing it in your hoodie and running out of Gamestop.

It still amounts to theft, in the grander scheme of things, because you should not have the ability to play something you didn't pay for. If you want to play a game, you should buy it. If you bought it without playing it, you're depriving the developer in question of the money they should be owed for you playing the product they spent time working on. Know what I'm sayin', g?

...did you listen to anything I never said otherwise. I already said that it was unethical. But saying it and theft are the same thing is simply not valid.

So yes I understand what you're saying.

Until you can actually explain how something like Identity Theft fits with this ludicrous notion of yours, I'm afraid it's your argument that isn't valid. Theft doesn't require a physical item since not all possessions are physical items.

[Bullets McDeath]

I... god, ****ing whatever. Obviously, you see my point but somehow it's not sinking in all the way. The company loses what should have been a sale when someone pirates their game. Call it whatever gets you to sleep at night. A rose by any other name, is still stealing ****.

Modifié par outlaworacle, 21 mars 2010 - 01:07 .

[thegreateski]

Piracy is "renting" games from a store without paying or intending to give it back.





also known as stealing.