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[Efesell]

Don't the Awakening epilogues have the same ol' "But their tale is far from over yadda yadda' as Origins?

[ejoslin]

Efesell wrote...

Don't the Awakening epilogues have the same ol' "But their tale is far from over yadda yadda' as Origins?

No.

Edit: In some they disappear, in some there are only rumors about what happened to them.

Modifié par ejoslin, 21 mars 2010 - 03:22 .

[rob123971]

I don't wanna continue with my PC....I want new origins, possibly Qunari...or Chasind:O....ahh the ideas that come to mind=]

Modifié par rob123971, 21 mars 2010 - 03:23 .

[SDNcN]

Leifa wrote...

It appears that you didn't read the books; for, if you had, you would know that the sleeping Old Gods that remain could be awakened at any moment. And no, the killing of an Archdemon cannot be accomplished by anyone else than a Grey Warden.

I did read the books.
They don't need to be killed by the Grey Warden of Origins, just a Warden.
So is there anything left for the PC to accomplish that can't be done by someone else?

On the other hand, the Architect has learned of Morrigan's child, which has the soul an old God and the blood of a Grey Warden. After she gave birth, he approached her and told that since her child has Grey warden blood and the essence of an Old God, he could use that child to lead the darkspawns and bring peace to his people.

Gaider stated in another thread that the child of a Grey Warden does not gain the Warden's taint at birth.

Flemeth wants Morrigan. Her true plan was much deeper than we thought – in fact, what she wants is to inhabit the body of Morrigan’s child. Why? What do darkspawns look for, what is their obsession, why do they spend centuries digging? To find and follow an Old God – Flemeth wants that power over them and she’s an abomination capable of attaching itself to it’s very soul.

Morrigan runs back to you for help. There are two possible scenarios.

If you killed the Architect, she now needs protection from Flemeth.
If you let the Architect live, the Architect signs you up to fight Flemeth.

She asked you to kill Flemeth to buy time to learn the spells from her grimorie. She doesn't need you any more. Sorry.

So DA:O 2 could be an end of all blights by protecting Morrigan’s child who, if he/she turns out to be a good-hearted person, would bring peace to the Darspawns. Of course, that child may turn out to be not-so-nice, in which case, hello DA:O 3… But that story is to be told at another time.

Of course completely ignoring that some people didn't kill Flemeth for Morrigan or didn't undergo the Dark Ritual to save them or Alistar/Loghain.

Modifié par SDNcN, 21 mars 2010 - 03:28 .

[Efesell]

ejoslin wrote...

Efesell wrote...

Don't the Awakening epilogues have the same ol' "But their tale is far from over yadda yadda' as Origins?

No.

Edit: In some they disappear, in some there are only rumors about what happened to them.

"A few years later, the Warden vanishes. Nobody knows why, but "neither does anyone think her tale is complete..."

[Cancermeat]

Everybody thinks BG2 was Bioware's crown jewel, and that game ignored a lot of player decesions from 1 ( i know im not the first person to that is, haha)

[Efesell]

That was fun because of how often I got to ask "Didn't I kill you?"

[Cancermeat]

Yeah....i liked doing that.

[Nyaore]

Efesell wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Efesell wrote...

Don't the Awakening epilogues have the same ol' "But their tale is far from over yadda yadda' as Origins?

No.

Edit: In some they disappear, in some there are only rumors about what happened to them.

"A few years later, the Warden vanishes. Nobody knows why, but "neither does anyone think her tale is complete..."

From a literary perspective, that kind of ending can mean a number of things and could have been done for an equal amount of reasons. Maybe they didn't want to completely close the book on what happened to our Warden's despite shuttling them to the side in that same breath to make room for the next protaganist.. Maybe it's a lead in to another expansion. Maybe it alludes to something akin to what happens with the heroes of the Elderscrolls Series where they either disappear from the world stage or move off to distant lands to deal with some new threat. All so that the character does not seriously interfer with the established lore of the series should the next game take place afterwards. (It's hard to write in the accomplisments of flexible player created characters, and often it's best to remove them from the story entirely with such plot devices to help prevent the writers from adding onto their roles after the fact.)
All in all, I wouldn't read too much into it.

Modifié par Nyaore, 21 mars 2010 - 03:41 .

[Vicious]

Cancermeat wrote...

Everybody thinks BG2 was Bioware's crown jewel, and that game ignored a lot of player decesions from 1 ( i know im not the first person to that is, haha)

Bioware's fanbase is incredibly spoiled IMO. I mean really they popularized the whole 'YOUR CHOICES CARRY OVER FROM GAME TO GAME" bit, and now EVERYONE wants it for ALL their games. It's a f--ing joke.

That said, I hope they let the Warden go. I want to see all the spoiled fans cry on the forums about how they'll never see Alistair/Leliana again. I left out Zevran cuz he's actually awesome.

[kaimanaMM]

I agree with the OP, excellent points made all around.

Dragon Age is a franchise and it was never promised to be a continuing story of one particular character like Mass Effect.  I would love to see other places / settings / plots within the world itself, but with both Origins and for me personally, further with Awakening, I felt that this was closure on this particular character and story.

I wouldn't mind playing as my Warden again, I'm pretty darn attached to her, but it wouldn't be the same.  When the time comes, I'll be ready to move on to a new character with a new adventure in the Dragon Age world.

[Leifa]

SDNcN wrote...

I did read the books.
They don't need to be killed by the Grey Warden of Origins, just a Warden.
So is there anything left for the PC to accomplish that can't be done by someone else?

Protect Morrigan, if you like my idea.

Gaider stated in another thread that the child of a Grey Warden does not gain the Warden's taint at birth.

Ah, but Morrigan's ritual changed that - Flemeth is old and wise, remember, and she has tought her daughter well.

She asked you to kill Flemeth to buy time to learn the spells from her grimorie. She doesn't need you any more. Sorry.

That's what you think. In fact, Flemeth does not need Morrigan at all. She's an abomination; it's not because she can't possess Morrigan that she can't possess another mage and then kill Morrigan. Morrigan does still need protection.

Of course completely ignoring that some people didn't kill Flemeth for Morrigan or didn't undergo the Dark Ritual to save them or Alistar/Loghain.

If you didn't kill Flemeth, the Architect told her.

As for the ritual, Morrigan would never abandon her goal just because you refused her deal. You don't know much about her if you think that. Morrigan is not easily dettered. She's a survivor. She made the deal with Riordan. But poor Riordan died while falling.

Now ususally the essence would go in the GW, and kill him. But now, as per Morrigan's ritual, it goes into the GW, kills him/her, and carries on to the child.

Why don't we work together here instead and make it possible to have a follow up? Would it be so terrible, if  we could make it work? 
 
Just saying...



EDIT: Something i forgot

Modifié par Leifa, 21 mars 2010 - 04:00 .

[Malkavianqueen]

I completely agree! I want the chance to play some different characters in different locations! Keeping your Warden into DA2 would just be too restrictive, I think. I'd like to explore Thedas from different points of view than we got in Origins. l*nods*



...Like a Dalish Keeper...*mumbles*

[ejoslin]

Efesell wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Efesell wrote...

Don't the Awakening epilogues have the same ol' "But their tale is far from over yadda yadda' as Origins?

No.

Edit: In some they disappear, in some there are only rumors about what happened to them.

"A few years later, the Warden vanishes. Nobody knows why, but "neither does anyone think her tale is complete..."

That's not the only epilogue card.  If you romanced Zevran in Origins you get this card.

Modifié par ejoslin, 21 mars 2010 - 04:05 .

[BanksHector]

Ya. I went looking for Morrigan in mine.

Modifié par BanksHector, 21 mars 2010 - 04:08 .

[Efesell]

ejoslin wrote...

Efesell wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Efesell wrote...

Don't the Awakening epilogues have the same ol' "But their tale is far from over yadda yadda' as Origins?

No.

Edit: In some they disappear, in some there are only rumors about what happened to them.

"A few years later, the Warden vanishes. Nobody knows why, but "neither does anyone think her tale is complete..."

That's not the only epilogue card.  If you romanced Zevran in Origins you get this card.

Well I just meant it as an example that it was still being left pretty open.

Of course it could all mean absolutely nothing.

[Sarah1281]

She made the deal with Riordan. But poor Riordan died while falling.

She said that she didn't think Riordan could be convinced and even if he could, he'd been tainted for too long. Sure she COULD be lying, but if the PC is in a relationship with Alistair wouldn't giving her shot to convince someone who ISN'T the love of her life to sleep with Morrigan make her more likely to agree?

Now ususally the essence would go in the GW, and kill him. But now, as per Morrigan's ritual, it goes into the GW, kills him/her, and carries on to the child.

If the soul goe into the GW, it destroys the soul. Period. If the ritual was performed the PC is always the one to kill the Archdemon even if Alistair or Loghain did the ritual so therefor if the ritual was performed at all it would not kill the Warden offing the Archdemon and in an US game (or an AS or LS one) the ritual was not performed.

...Like a Dalish Keeper...*mumbles*

That would most likely require eithera really old and retired PC or an entire clan massacred. Either that or you are a horrible keeper who has no problem abandoing a clan that depends on you to go chasing darkspawn. A keeper-in-training maybe.

[Nobody Important]

BanksHector wrote...

Ya. I went looking for Morrigan in mine.

Same thing happened in mine my character ended up in Orlais searching for Morrigan.


I see no reason why they can't let us transfer over our character. Just do a quick origin explaining how you got there. If they make it take place in another country you would only need to transfer over a couple choices like god child or not and romances and thats it. Nothing else. People in this new country wouldn't care about who is ruling in Fereldan and whatever. They would also be able to include new origins for those who didn't transfer over so you could include both. Its a win win situation for everyone.

Modifié par Nobody Important, 21 mars 2010 - 04:24 .

[SDNcN]

First of all, your character is a Grey Warden. Wether they work only against the darkspawn or not, your character is bound to the order and must do whatever it is needed for the order/world. There is a chance the wardens get problems with another nation and enter war, or more things related to the archtect and the darkspawn themselves. Either way, there are several ways to continue the story with your character relating him/her to the order. 

In Origins you can choose not to continue being an active member of the Wardens and in Awakening your character leaves them for parts unknown.

Grey Wardens at odds with another country is a good plot point, I started another thread about how Awakening alluded to the First Warden being interested in establishing Amaranthine type situations across Thedas.
But it isn't something that absolutely must be experienced by the Warden from Origins.

But, the setting does set up a looming disaster. The last 2 blights. Repetitive or not, there are two blights to go and many bizarre things around its origin and factors that could speed up the process/slow it down. 

The Architect caused the last blight, he could possibly be dead, and if he lives the epilogue says people were expecting him to cause another, but it didn't happen.

And another thing that makes your character special enough to appear again, your character has been one of the few people who engaged an Archdemon in over 400 years. Your character may be the only Warden in centuries to have a noble title or similar position. If that doesn't mean something to you, i'm pretty sure the Grey Wardens think differently (As the treasury woman says in the awakening).

Being special enough to have another full length adventure and needing another full length adventure are two seperate things.

.

I think it is more important to people to see their companions in the game again, as it gives a sense of reality. I don't think it is that important to the playerbase to -have them in your party- just for the sake of having them. Of course the only exception to that is the romance option.

Continuity can be preserved though importing your character's decisions into future games, not just by importing your character.

I don't know about you, but just by seeing Wyne again in the awakening i was jumping like a little girl in bliss. It was a shame her part was small, but the fact she was there and she knew my character (even if it was bloody cold) was a great feeling. Seeing companions again give you a sense of acomplishment as well.

It actually made me consider killing her. Go Liberitarian Mages!

The PC could care about whatever happens in another country for several reasons, connections to their old companions, political reasons, more darkspawn or simply the standing of the Grey Warden order.

For example, if they say: A great evil rises in Tevinter. Part of the playerbase would be like "omg i have to go there, Wyne and Shale are there!" And the ones that simply disliked those two characters could care about Tevinter because the lore is interesting, because of all the secrets, the blood magic and a land free of the chantry.

And they could also care because a warden in that place did someting
really wrong or was pleaded guilty for something he/she has not done.
Or because the kingdom made a treaty with Ferelden and the King/Queen
asked the warden for help, so tevinter would see that Ferelden would
indeed be an ally.

there are always reasons why a character would
care about a different place, even if they are not directly connected
as we were to Ferelden. People don't have to live and die in the same
place they were born, they can travel, they can live somewhere else and
create bonds that are even stronger. The same can happen in the game and
not feel awkard.

But can't that be accomplished by establishing a new character from Tevinter and having Shale and Wynne appear there according to your import file?

And to be fair, would you really want to start from level 1 again, sweating to kill an revnant when your gear sucks, you don't have access to all these awesome abilities and sweet spell combos? Speaking for myself, i would cry if i started a character without onslaught now because i simply love that ability. I would like to meet more powerful enemies for sure, but not lose the abilities and gear i got.

Yes I would.
I like character progression and seeing my character go from shooting small arcane bolts at wisps to fighting dragons in full plate as an arcane mage.

Modifié par SDNcN, 21 mars 2010 - 04:31 .

[Leifa]

Sarah1281 wrote...

She made the deal with Riordan. But poor Riordan died while falling.

She said that she didn't think Riordan could be convinced and even if he could, he'd been tainted for too long. Sure she COULD be lying, but if the PC is in a relationship with Alistair wouldn't giving her shot to convince someone who ISN'T the love of her life to sleep with Morrigan make her more likely to agree?

Now ususally the essence would go in the GW, and kill him. But now, as per Morrigan's ritual, it goes into the GW, kills him/her, and carries on to the child.

If the soul goe into the GW, it destroys the soul. Period. If the ritual was performed the PC is always the one to kill the Archdemon even if Alistair or Loghain did the ritual so therefor if the ritual was performed at all it would not kill the Warden offing the Archdemon and in an US game (or an AS or LS one) the ritual was not performed.

Í'm sorry, but you didn't get some of what I've said; the main idea being around the fact that you can pretty much twist the story any way you want. Magic and rituals can allow that. It's like a box of chocolate, no one knows what they're gonna get, except the mage.

And look, I came up with these ideas after 5 minutes of thinking -- if I can do that, BioWare can do much better in the end. My main point being, it's entirely possible to make a following.

[Ferelden Templar]

This is Bioware's story to tell... not ours. We're just along for the ride. I just want the best story told.



The one request I would make is to have some of our actions have an effect on succeeding games - not really gameplay-wise - more for story. I would like to see the Silver Order and some returning characters. Wynne put a smile to my face in Awakenings. I don't mind if it's your Warden from DAO or otherwise.

[Sarah1281]

Í'm sorry, but you didn't get some of what I've said; the main idea being around the fact that you can pretty much twist the story any way you want. Magic and rituals can allow that. It's like a box of chocolate, no one knows what they're gonna get, except the mage.

Well sure you can twist the story around but at the end of the day dead warden = no ritual.

[Cancermeat]

I would like to some other type of character in the dragon age universe at some point like a member of the legion of the dead.

[Leifa]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Í'm sorry, but you didn't get some of what I've said; the main idea being around the fact that you can pretty much twist the story any way you want. Magic and rituals can allow that. It's like a box of chocolate, no one knows what they're gonna get, except the mage.

Well sure you can twist the story around but at the end of the day dead warden = no ritual.

When you are a writer, you can shape things any way you want, like saying that Archdemon blood, that was preserved for centuries (that's a feat of itself), mixed with fresh darkspawn blood and who knows what else, prepared by mages, will either kill you, or make you a grey warden.

And you can make that Grey Wardens are doomed to their terrible end.

But (and that but is important, so please indulge me), in "The Calling", one Grey Warden mysteriously finds herself cured from the corrupting effects of the taint.

That, many would have said, doesn't make sense, and yet there it is. Why? Because the writer decided it was so. And as Ferelden Templar said, it is certainly not our story to tell. All I was doing was pointing out that it "could" be done.

Edit: century/centuries

Modifié par Leifa, 21 mars 2010 - 04:58 .

[Raiil]

I would like an option to import a character, or create a new one. I believe the endings are limited enough that most options could be brought in, but being able to make a new character could come with their own benefits.