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[Xandurpein]

This may be off topic, but the fact that every ending to Awakening contains the information that the character disappears after a few years, strongly suggests that if the story of the character continues it will somehow be reset. Presumably the character will be induced or forced to abandon everything and start over somewhere else.

[MelRedux]

Ceridraen wrote...

I haven't heard of any HNF who married Alistair (as King) in Origins, who then ended up with the 'they go off together' epilogue in Awakening. Has anyone gotten that?

I got that ending.  At the end of DA:O, I go the ending where I was the princess-consort, and the people of Fereleden loved to see how much their king adored his new bride, or something like that.

But then In DA:A, Alistair was king, and in the begining calls me his love, and that he'd rather have me in court and all that.  I got the ending where the two of us disappeared together....like we were never king and queen at all.  I'm confused!

[errant_knight]

Xandurpein wrote...

This may be off topic, but the fact that every ending to Awakening contains the information that the character disappears after a few years, strongly suggests that if the story of the character continues it will somehow be reset. Presumably the character will be induced or forced to abandon everything and start over somewhere else.

That's what makes this so strange and interesting. It implies that if a PC in a romance with Alistair  isn't married to him, he'll be with her, but if he is, he won't. That seems fairly inexplicable.

Mel_Redux wrote...

Ceridraen wrote...

I haven't heard of any HNF who married Alistair (as King) in Origins, who then ended up with the 'they go off together' epilogue in Awakening. Has anyone gotten that?

I got that ending.  At the end of DA:O, I go the ending where I was the princess-consort, and the people of Fereleden loved to see how much their king adored his new bride, or something like that.

But then In DA:A, Alistair was king, and in the begining calls me his love, and that he'd rather have me in court and all that.  I got the ending where the two of us disappeared together....like we were never king and queen at all.  I'm confused!

I think you're the only person that's gotten the 'disappearing together' ending who was married to Alistair.

Modifié par errant_knight, 26 mars 2010 - 03:55 .

[Addai]

errant_knight wrote...

That's what makes this so strange and interesting. It implies that if a PC in a romance with Alistair  isn't married to him, he'll be with her, but if he is, he won't. That seems fairly inexplicable.

The only reason I can think why this would be is if there is an heir, something not possible in most mistress scenarios where the femWarden is likely a mage or elf.

[errant_knight]

Addai67 wrote...

errant_knight wrote...

That's what makes this so strange and interesting. It implies that if a PC in a romance with Alistair  isn't married to him, he'll be with her, but if he is, he won't. That seems fairly inexplicable.

The only reason I can think why this would be is if there is an heir, something not possible in most mistress scenarios where the femWarden is likely a mage or elf.

Now that's an interesting thought, but we know that two wardens can't conceive without miraculous intervention of some kind, so I have my doubts. It doesn't seem accidental that all possible rulers lead to a scenario where an heir is, at best, wildly unlikely. Also, while I see Alistair as a 'hands on' kind of Dad, I think he'd leave the baby in the care of a nanny (or maybe Auntie Wynne if his queen disappeared, or was faced with a situation that required her to leave. I just don't see him staying behind.

[MelRedux]

errant_knight wrote...


I think you're the only person that's gotten the 'disappearing together' ending who was married to Alistair.

I'm beginning to think taht too, and honestly I think its a mistake....the ending with us both going off together makes it seem like we aren't King and Queen at all.  But everything else up to that point made it seem so. 

Ah, who knows?!

[SurelyForth]

My boyfriend's MHN who married Anora got pretty much the same ending as my Queen Cousland (only I don't think Anora was quite as happy to see him as Alistair was to see my PC) and then got the secondary disappearance card. Maybe, since Anora wouldn't diappear with the King Cousland, the game generates the cards based on a different check than the non-King/Queen cards? From those who entered into a political marriage with Alistair, we know that his "romantic" dialogue is generated because you married him and not because you ended Origins in a relationship with him. The epilogues might have a similarly arbitrary system.

[Ceridraen]

I wonder if it's a glitch in that they're counting the mistress/king scenario the same as warden/warden/Anora Queen situation. Meaning, if he's king, Alistair isn't supposed to disappear. That would make sense. Otherwise, it really doesn't.



Since they made such a big deal about 2 wardens not having babies (though I'm sure it's not 'impossible,' just 'highly unlikely') - I doubt it involves children. (My mage fully intends to use her herbalism for a good cause, & there WILL be pointy eared babies at some point, given the suspicion that Alistair himself is half-elf.)



The other way the epilogue read to me is - throw everything in the pot & let the player pick. I either ended up running off mysteriously with him, never to be seen again, or 'some say we were seen every day, all over the place, at court.' So basically - pick what you want, thanks to the iffy 'some say' part.



It seems kind of unfair to the Queen Couslands, though. In essence, I think it's a software hiccup that went against the HNF who marries.

[SurelyForth]

Ceridraen wrote...

I wonder if it's a glitch in that they're counting the mistress/king scenario the same as warden/warden/Anora Queen situation. Meaning, if he's king, Alistair isn't supposed to disappear. That would make sense. Otherwise, it really doesn't.

Since they made such a big deal about 2 wardens not having babies (though I'm sure it's not 'impossible,' just 'highly unlikely') - I doubt it involves children. (My mage fully intends to use her herbalism for a good cause, & there WILL be pointy eared babies at some point, given the suspicion that Alistair himself is half-elf.)

The other way the epilogue read to me is - throw everything in the pot & let the player pick. I either ended up running off mysteriously with him, never to be seen again, or 'some say we were seen every day, all over the place, at court.' So basically - pick what you want, thanks to the iffy 'some say' part.

It seems kind of unfair to the Queen Couslands, though. In essence, I think it's a software hiccup that went against the HNF who marries.

In Origins King Alistair will follow his mistress (with his Queen, too, if that's what she tells him she's doing) to the Wardens the same as non-king Alistair will and that makes as much sense as him leaving with his mistress when she disappears (but not with his Queen).

Modifié par SurelyForth, 26 mars 2010 - 04:36 .

[Ceridraen]

You wouldn't have to breed out the human gene, really. Just get a 3/4 elf-human, & you'd start to get elven features (as well as human) - assuming this just means the 'elvenness' is a recessive gene.

I suppose we're trying to make sense of something that maybe didn't have that much sense to begin with.  There are several places that don't fit. (Nathaniel has 2 paternal grandfathers, something like that, Alistair's father either 'died before his mother,' who died when he was born, or he met Maric at least once, with Cailan.  So maybe, as in the speculation about Anders (Wynne's son, Alistair's brother) - there's not as much there as we imagine.  Rats!

Modifié par Ceridraen, 26 mars 2010 - 04:38 .

[Addai]

Ceridraen wrote...
Since they made such a big deal about 2 wardens not having babies (though I'm sure it's not 'impossible,' just 'highly unlikely') - I doubt it involves children. (My mage fully intends to use her herbalism for a good cause, & there WILL be pointy eared babies at some point, given the suspicion that Alistair himself is half-elf.)

Such a child could never inherit, however.  I could see Alistair and my Warden Queen agreeing that one of them stay behind in order to secure a transition to their heir, no matter how they ended up with one (by magical or other shady means).  I don't think this is a likely scenario, it's just the only thing that makes sense out of comparing the two epilogue screens.

Modifié par Addai67, 26 mars 2010 - 04:38 .

[Ceridraen]

There's also the question of the taint. If 2 human wardens have a baby, would that baby possibly be born as warden? Super-warden!



And true, I keep forgetting the 'heir' part. I can't make myself care about the fate of a monarchy.



We're probably debating something that was really just a typo or an edit slip.

[SurelyForth]

Ceridraen wrote...

You wouldn't have to breed out the human gene, really. Just get a 3/4 elf-human, & you'd start to get elven features (as well as human) - assuming this just means the 'elvenness' is a recessive gene.

It's more than recessive. Otherwise, there would be a a chance of half-elves having pointy ears and, according to the lore, there isn't. Elf genes don't "blend", rather they adapt to whatever other genetic code is present and become virtually indistinguishable from human or dwarf genetic code.

[M-Taylor]

Mel_Redux wrote...

Ceridraen wrote...

I haven't heard of any HNF who married Alistair (as King) in Origins, who then ended up with the 'they go off together' epilogue in Awakening. Has anyone gotten that?

I got that ending.  At the end of DA:O, I go the ending where I was the princess-consort, and the people of Fereleden loved to see how much their king adored his new bride, or something like that.

But then In DA:A, Alistair was king, and in the begining calls me his love, and that he'd rather have me in court and all that.  I got the ending where the two of us disappeared together....like we were never king and queen at all.  I'm confused!

I've had something like that. I think my character's been the most buggy thing I've EVER experienced. Every bug that could occure has occured. /sigh.

At the end of the Origins, I picked 'a Title and Riches, please' option, and he said 'Well, that could be arranged. You are now Teryn of Gwena(or something like that) as well as.. being, you know, Queen.', so I didn't frick anything up at the Landsmeet, then the epiloge said the same thing as yours, the whole nation welcomed me as Queen and was happy to see how much Alistair adored me. Then, in the very last section of the epiloge, it said 'Alistair never left his loves side, much to Queen Anora's annoyence'. How annoyed I was.. I just sort of edited it out in my own mind, and thought she would be annoyed 'cause she was sent to a Tower, possibly awaiting an exceuction (if my character had a say in it, anyway. Alistair would of probably let her out.. >.>)

Then at the start of Awakening, Alistair called me dear wife and such. And towards the end of the conversation, he mentioned his wife Queen Anora. I was like.. oh god, rage. How dare he commit bygamy with me. >.>

Alas, at the end epiloge of Awakening, It said I went on my own. So, the one bug I might of wanted, Alistair joining me, did not occure. Then again, could be a nice story.. I could be exiled by Queen Anora or something. /sigh. /trying to be optimistic. >_>

Modifié par M-Taylor, 26 mars 2010 - 04:45 .

[Ceridraen]

SurelyForth wrote...


It's more than recessive. Otherwise, there would be a a chance of half-elves having pointy ears and, according to the lore, there isn't. Elf genes don't "blend", rather they adapt to whatever other genetic code is present and become virtually indistinguishable from human or dwarf genetic code.

Well, that sucks.  I guess that means no elf would have any human (or whatever) blood beside elven.  I had thought that's what diminished them from their immortality & 'greater power' period.  So this would mean - being near humans is somewhat like being near an animal to which you have an allergy. 

[SurelyForth]

M-Taylor wrote...

I've had something like that. I think my character's been the most buggy thing I've EVER experienced. Every bug that could occure has occured. /sigh.

At the end of the Origins, I picked 'a Title and Riches, please' option, and he said 'Well, that could be arranged. You are now Teryn of Gwena(or something like that) as well as.. being, you know, Queen.', so I didn't frick anything up at the Landsmeet, then the epiloge said the same thing as yours, the whole nation welcomed me as Queen and was happy to see how much Alistair adored me. Then, in the very last section of the epiloge, it said 'Alistair never left his loves side, much to Queen Anora's annoyence'. How annoyed I was.. I just sort of edited it out in my own mind, and thought she would be annoyed 'cause she was sent to a Tower, possibly awaiting an exceuction (if my character had a say in it, anyway. Alistair would of probably let her out.. >.>)

Then at the start of Awakening, Alistair called me dear wife and such. And towards the end of the conversation, he mentioned his wife Queen Anora. I was like.. oh god, rage. How dare he commit bygamy with me. >.>

Alas, at the end epiloge of Awakening, It said I went on my own. So, the one bug I might of wanted, Alistair joining me, did not occure. Then again, could be a nice story.. I could be exiled by Queen Anora or something. /sigh. /trying to be optimistic. >_>

That's almost funny in its screwed-upness. My characters have gotten the disapproval from an imprisoned Queen Anora during Origins, but no mention of her in Awakening.

My least favorite glitch with Awakening has been this: My boyfriend spared Loghain and fed him to the Archdemon. Lo and behold, Loghain is alive in Awakening! This trick does not work for an Alistair who sacrifices himself, btw.

Ceridraen wrote...
Well, that sucks.  I guess that means no elf would have any human (or whatever) blood beside elven.  I had thought that's what diminished them from their immortality & 'greater power' period.  So this would mean - being near humans is somewhat like being near an animal to which you have an allergy. 

See, I think that over several generations you could get to the point where there is an elf who is just a little bit human, but it would take awhile. This is one of the reasons alienages exist, to keep elf/human relationships to a minimum since once an elf marries a human and begins breeding with them, that's another elven blood-line effectively ended.

Modifié par SurelyForth, 26 mars 2010 - 04:54 .

[Ceridraen]

re: ending glitches,

I finally got a dialogue-fix mod for that.  There's so much wrong at the end that it wrecks the experience entirely.  I ended up with Leliana breaking up with me inexplicably, Alistair mad that I was supposedly having an affair with Zevran, too, and a few other weird things. I got the mod, went to an earlier save, & everything was fine.  It seems to me that this is the kind of thing an official patch might fix, but modding it is.

Modifié par Ceridraen, 26 mars 2010 - 04:51 .

[Addai]

Ceridraen wrote...

There's also the question of the taint. If 2 human wardens have a baby, would that baby possibly be born as warden? Super-warden!

According to The Calling, GW babies are born without the taint.  In Morrigan's case, her ritual obviously involved appropriating the taint and not just the Warden's swimmers.

And true, I keep forgetting the 'heir' part. I can't make myself care about the fate of a monarchy.

I see it as also caring about Alistair's birthright and not just the throne.  Even my elven characters want to see his heirs on the throne.

We're probably debating something that was really just a typo or an edit slip.

Possibly.  I just would like to give the devs more credit than to think that no one noticed the wording difference or cared, or realized that players would care.  Then again, over at Team Zevran, modders discovered that there was an entire dialogue sequence at the gates for when your PC is in love with Zevran that no one had ever seen, and that the ending we all got was meant to be what Zevran says to a friend.  So perhaps my faith is misplaced!

[SurelyForth]

Addai67 wrote...
Possibly.  I just would like to give the devs more credit than to think that no one noticed the wording difference or cared, or realized that players would care.  Then again, over at Team Zevran, modders discovered that there was an entire dialogue sequence at the gates for when your PC is in love with Zevran that no one had ever seen, and that the ending we all got was meant to be what Zevran says to a friend.  So perhaps my faith is misplaced!

Seeing how very little in Awakening lined up with the endings most had for Origins, I think the devs are less concerned with ensuring what we get is explicable. Zev's dialogue at the gates is an egregious example of this, but Alistair almost never recognizing he's not king is an even better example.

[Addai]

Ceridraen wrote...

Well, that sucks.  I guess that means no elf would have any human (or whatever) blood beside elven.  I had thought that's what diminished them from their immortality & 'greater power' period.  So this would mean - being near humans is somewhat like being near an animal to which you have an allergy. 

Heh.  This is what makes an elf-human pairing so controversial from an elven perspective.  You're not just "collaborating with the enemy," you're contributing to the decline of the elven race in a literal sense.  Then again, it's also what makes it romantic in its own way.  It's you and him against the world, both the elven and human worlds.  So, much as I love the elf lore in the game, I still say more power to Soris and his passel of kids with his human wife.

In the case of Alistair and the PC warden, you already have died to your former life and there's small chance of you contributing to the gene pool anyway.

[Lara Denton]

SurelyForth wrote...

Ceridraen wrote...

I wonder if it's a glitch in that they're counting the mistress/king scenario the same as warden/warden/Anora Queen situation. Meaning, if he's king, Alistair isn't supposed to disappear. That would make sense. Otherwise, it really doesn't.

Since they made such a big deal about 2 wardens not having babies (though I'm sure it's not 'impossible,' just 'highly unlikely') - I doubt it involves children. (My mage fully intends to use her herbalism for a good cause, & there WILL be pointy eared babies at some point, given the suspicion that Alistair himself is half-elf.)

The other way the epilogue read to me is - throw everything in the pot & let the player pick. I either ended up running off mysteriously with him, never to be seen again, or 'some say we were seen every day, all over the place, at court.' So basically - pick what you want, thanks to the iffy 'some say' part.

It seems kind of unfair to the Queen Couslands, though. In essence, I think it's a software hiccup that went against the HNF who marries.

In Origins King Alistair will follow his mistress (with his Queen, too, if that's what she tells him she's doing) to the Wardens the same as non-king Alistair will and that makes as much sense as him leaving with his mistress when she disappears (but not with his Queen).

I think the epilogue for Origins has been changed since Awakening. I got one where it says that "despite Alistair's objections, Elissa eventually left Denerim to help rebuild the GW, and swore she would return to her love's side soon". I don't remember ever getting this slide before.

[Ceridraen]

I noticed a few changes in the Origins end slides, too. Maybe at some point, they'll pop by & clarify if we're missing something in these Awakening slides, or if they're a mistake, or what. That would be nice.

[Addai]

Oh reaaally?? That was sneaky! Now I'm curious about my own slides.

[Ceridraen]

Come to think of it, my mistress-elf & warden/warden elf didn't get that 'left to rebuild the GWs' slide. Just the wife. Maybe there IS a reason that the Queen leaves alone, but I can't imagine what it might be.

[Lara Denton]

Ceridraen wrote...

Come to think of it, my mistress-elf & warden/warden elf didn't get that 'left to rebuild the GWs' slide. Just the wife. Maybe there IS a reason that the Queen leaves alone, but I can't imagine what it might be.

I got a new epilogue for my elven mage after Awakening. It says: "Kaelyn remained in Denerim with her love for a time. Eventually, she left to help rebuild the GW, but swore she would return to Alistair's side soon." - that is with Alistair king by himself and the mage as a lover.